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Post by Deleted on Dec 9, 2019 2:03:20 GMT
I can't abide the tank/guitar scene either. I thought it was excessive and embarrassing. It also came at a point where I was continuing to sour on the new series, a slow process begun during Series 6, with a brief reprieve in 8. Others may feel that it's awesome for the sheer absurdity of it all, but to me it typifies one of the biggest issues I have with the revival - going way, way too far with things, especially the "look at us, aren't we quirky" crap. If I remember correctly, my husband and I just kind of looked at each other and sighed.I like Peter Capaldi, I don't like Steven Moffat's foibles in anything more than single doses, I think. This seemed to me like they were trying to backpedal from the rougher-edged "I'm not your boyfriend" doctor to something closer to 10/11's wackiness to appeal to the fangirls or something. Yes yes, and yes again. The wife and I rolled our eyes while sighing.
...but then I'm a bit of curmudgeon at times...
There was too much random this, that, then the other thing. I'm not putting it clearly, but then I've had insomnia 3 out of the last 4 nights so I'm having trouble thinking anywhere near straight. I love more straight sci-fi (Inferno), or philosophical/meditative mixed with action (Genesis), or clever with a bit of action but the whole thing makes sense (Aquitaine ; The Time of Angels/Flesh and Stone), super-clever (Blink), pure historicals (The Marian Conspiracy; The Romans), or sort of historicals (The Time Meddler).
I think this can generally be summarized as: I like the show when it takes itself seriously, but I don't mind humor. It has to be done right, though. I loved S5 overall. Some episodes maybe not, but overall I was extremely exited for S6. ButS6-9 it got choppy. There are some episodes I like/love, but there's a lot of cringing for me. S10 was quite an improvement, but S11 finally felt like it's all back on track: individual stories for their own sake.
However, BF has the highest win rate for me at this point and not by a little.
I suppose it's time to rewatch S10
I'm honestly in the same camp and I think I can say why, personally, thanks to The Man from UNCLE. It's first season is this great mix of severity and frivolity. All its concepts are taken seriously, but without necessarily having their characters be grim about it. The second season's a bit more tongue in cheek, but it falls into that same pattern. Then, we come to the third season where it fell victim to following another series's aesthetics and it really hurt the show. They went full comedy, full wacky parody, and it never quite recovered. It got one more season where they tried to reverse it -- cut in half -- but it was cancelled very shortly after that. Of those two last seasons, the third is impossible to watch for how vaudevillian it gets. The fourth is better, but they went so hard into removing all the humour that it's actually rather stifling. It became severe. Almost airless with severity. There's a flippancy to the character's banter that became part of who they were and with that gone... so was a large chunk of the team's appeal. I suspect the lesson there is I like characters with humour (and I think it's important that they get an opportunity to smile, even if only once), but not settings with humour. The setting should take itself seriously (see City of Death).
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Post by tuigirl on Dec 9, 2019 7:17:27 GMT
Yes yes, and yes again. The wife and I rolled our eyes while sighing.
...but then I'm a bit of curmudgeon at times...
There was too much random this, that, then the other thing. I'm not putting it clearly, but then I've had insomnia 3 out of the last 4 nights so I'm having trouble thinking anywhere near straight. I love more straight sci-fi (Inferno), or philosophical/meditative mixed with action (Genesis), or clever with a bit of action but the whole thing makes sense (Aquitaine ; The Time of Angels/Flesh and Stone), super-clever (Blink), pure historicals (The Marian Conspiracy; The Romans), or sort of historicals (The Time Meddler).
I think this can generally be summarized as: I like the show when it takes itself seriously, but I don't mind humor. It has to be done right, though. I loved S5 overall. Some episodes maybe not, but overall I was extremely exited for S6. ButS6-9 it got choppy. There are some episodes I like/love, but there's a lot of cringing for me. S10 was quite an improvement, but S11 finally felt like it's all back on track: individual stories for their own sake.
However, BF has the highest win rate for me at this point and not by a little.
I suppose it's time to rewatch S10
I'm honestly in the same camp and I think I can say why, personally, thanks to The Man from UNCLE. It's first season is this great mix of severity and frivolity. All its concepts are taken seriously, but without necessarily having their characters be grim about it. The second season's a bit more tongue in cheek, but it falls into that same pattern. Then, we come to the third season where it fell victim to following another series's aesthetics and it really hurt the show. They went full comedy, full wacky parody, and it never quite recovered. It got one more season where they tried to reverse it -- cut in half -- but it was cancelled very shortly after that. Of those two last seasons, the third is impossible to watch for how vaudevillian it gets. The fourth is better, but they went so hard into removing all the humour that it's actually rather stifling. It became severe. Almost airless with severity. There's a flippancy to the character's banter that became part of who they were and with that gone... so was a large chunk of the team's appeal. I suspect the lesson there is I like characters with humour (and I think it's important that they get an opportunity to smile, even if only once), but not settings with humour. The setting should take itself seriously (see City of Death). Hmm. Yes, I understand that reasoning. Same with the Xfiles- in the beginning we have a nice mix of humour and taking itself too serious. In the later seasons, I sometimes became a parody of itself and we get more and more over the top comedy episodes. Plus completely over the top taking itself too serious.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 9, 2019 8:41:53 GMT
I'm honestly in the same camp and I think I can say why, personally, thanks to The Man from UNCLE. It's first season is this great mix of severity and frivolity. All its concepts are taken seriously, but without necessarily having their characters be grim about it. The second season's a bit more tongue in cheek, but it falls into that same pattern. Then, we come to the third season where it fell victim to following another series's aesthetics and it really hurt the show. They went full comedy, full wacky parody, and it never quite recovered. It got one more season where they tried to reverse it -- cut in half -- but it was cancelled very shortly after that. Of those two last seasons, the third is impossible to watch for how vaudevillian it gets. The fourth is better, but they went so hard into removing all the humour that it's actually rather stifling. It became severe. Almost airless with severity. There's a flippancy to the character's banter that became part of who they were and with that gone... so was a large chunk of the team's appeal. I suspect the lesson there is I like characters with humour (and I think it's important that they get an opportunity to smile, even if only once), but not settings with humour. The setting should take itself seriously (see City of Death). Hmm. Yes, I understand that reasoning. Same with the Xfiles- in the beginning we have a nice mix of humour and taking itself too serious. In the later seasons, I sometimes became a parody of itself and we get more and more over the top comedy episodes. Plus completely over the top taking itself too serious.
Right, because characters are not one thing or the other. Not necessarily too serious, but serious enough to warrant the circumstances. People don't tend to laugh their way through life-or-death circumstances unless they know they're going to die. And, particularly in the context of Doctor Who, there are circumstances where a frivolous response can have serious consequences (Hex's oath of "Oh, my God!" gets him quite savagely beaten and nearly hanged in The Settling). So, there's a balance. I'm from the school that thinks good historical tourism is blending in and doing your research. Find the clothes, learn the etiquette, don't get your head cut off. We're not invulnerable just because we know the future, seers and oracles have been killed for less. However... It's also a school that, funnily enough, has the First Doctor playing silly buggers in King Richard's court to get the chamberlain and the tailor agreeing that nothing was ever stolen (and it would look very bad for anyone to admit that it was): Bear in mind, this is the same story that has a father make Barbara promise to kill his daughter and then herself if they're captured by the villain's men. She genuinely considers going through with it. These two are not mutually exclusive to one another, but greater weight is given to the drama and the political intrigue than trickery over clothes. It's nice, it adds believability, but its carefully balanced not to overwhelm what are otherwise quite serious circumstances -- the risk of being thrown out of the court. That's the skill, I think. Have the mix of emotions, have the occassional bit of humour, but make people believe the weight and gravity of the story.
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Post by timegirl on Dec 10, 2019 1:50:55 GMT
Today I rewatched Time Heist, which is basically 12 trying to give Clara a far more exciting date night than her at the moment unknown (to 12) boyfriend (Danny)😀It’s a fun episode that should have been a two parter🤔😊 Keeley Hawes is very effective at being a villain. I have to say I would love it though if Keeley pulled a Colin Baker or Peter Capaldi and came back and played either the Doctor or the Master😀 12 gets so many good moments, just a few: “Basically the eyebrows mean I’m in charge” “ Beat that for a Date”
I love the way 12’s idea of impressing Clara is staging a whole bank heist/rescue mission 😀I think some of the looks he gives her adorable, you can really tell how much he loves her 😊 Does anyone else think that the teller is unintentionally kind of unitenionally kind of cute? Even though they have abilities similar to Dementors in Harry Potter, I kind of want give them a hug 🤗 I am glad they had a happy ending at the end😊 Revisiting 12’s era has made me appreciate him even more than the first time round! I think 12 now ties with 10 for my favorite Doctor!😃
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Post by tuigirl on Dec 10, 2019 17:40:11 GMT
Today I rewatched Time Heist, which is basically 12 trying to give Clara a far more exciting date night than her at the moment unknown (to 12) boyfriend (Danny)😀It’s a fun episode that should have been a two parter🤔😊 Keeley Hawes is very effective at being a villain. I have to say I would love it though if Keeley pulled a Colin Baker or Peter Capaldi and came back and played either the Doctor or the Master😀 12 gets so many good moments, just a few: “Basically the eyebrows mean I’m in charge” “ Beat that for a Date” I love the way 12’s idea of impressing Clara is staging a whole bank heist/rescue mission 😀I think some of the looks he gives her adorable, you can really tell how much he loves her 😊 Does anyone else think that the teller is unintentionally kind of unitenionally kind of cute? Even though they have abilities similar to Dementors in Harry Potter, I kind of want give them a hug 🤗 I am glad they had a happy ending at the end😊 Revisiting 12’s era has made me appreciate him even more than the first time round! I think 12 now ties with 10 for my favorite Doctor!😃 Having met Ross Mullan (who plays the Teller and a lot of the other Who monsters and also the white walker in GoT), I am a bit biased. Concerning the cuteness. The man is extremely nice and cute and very kind to his fans. I had a chance to chat with him for 25mins because there was nobody else in the queue and we had a nice chat- he even told me that he worked for a musical company beforehand and they did tours around mainland Europe and they even visited my hometown once (which he remembered because it has a silly name).
Plus, I am like Hagrid and have a thing for monsters.
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Post by timegirl on Dec 12, 2019 21:45:57 GMT
Just rewatched “Deep Breath” , such an amazing introduction to 12! I have to say I love the amount of introspection in 12’s era and this no exception! The way they explore his difficult regeneration and how hard Clara takes it. I know the argument that since Clara met some of the Doctor’s previous incarnations before 11 she should not take his regeneration into 12 so harshly, but knowing about something and experiencing are two very different things. Clara and 12 are both scared of his change in this, you really do feel his pain at his identity crisis in this!
I also think that there is a good parallel between him and the half face man, with them both constantly changing themselves. The story reminds me a lot of the Tom Baker era sort of a cross between his introductory episode, Robot mixed with the grim Victorian aesthetic of Talons of Weng Chiang! The Paternoster gang are good in this too! I think I enjoy them best in small doses, but I do especially love Madam Vastra’s veil speech.
Which leads me on to the infamous “I’m not your boyfriend” scene, it strikes me as odd how this scene gets misinterpreted to mean that 12 does not love Clara, or that he is a parental figure to her. When he follows it up with “ I never said it was your mistake” and then when 11 calls and he says that he thinks it’s her boyfriend calling her, you can really tell how self defeatist and insecure he is at this moment. He clearly does still love her like crazy he just is terrified that she will reject him due to no longer wearing the mask of a dashing young man! The scene with 12 saying that sometimes he feels like she doesn’t see him and her giving him that awkward hug is beautiful and heartbreaking 😢 I realize Deep Breath is a marmite episode but for me, I love every second of it!
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Post by timegirl on Dec 14, 2019 4:32:49 GMT
Just rewatched Into the Dalek, I forgot how memorable this one is! For starters, it has “Don’t be lasagna”😄 But kidding aside, it has the start of “ Am I a good man” which works well in this episode contrasting with Rusty the Dalek. I feel like this is almost a companion piece to “Dalek” with them both having a lone dangerous but sympathetic Dalek that faces off against the Doctor. I forgot Danny Pink’s introduction is in this episode. Even though I much prefer Clara with 12, I do think Danny has some genuinely heartbreaking moments, like in this episode where one of his students ask him if he killed anyone and he is crying 😢 I think there is a good parallel between him and 12 with them both being former soldiers filled with guilt. The set pieces in this are gorgeous, especially the scene where they all go through the Dalek eyestalk! You really do feel like 12, Clara and the rest are inside a Dalek! I also love the scene when 12 gets inside Rusty’s head and tries to show him the wonders of the universe but then also sees his hatred of Daleks. I really love rewatching episodes from 12’s era😊 I feel like his era doesn’t get appreciated enough, for a Doctor with such a spectacular character arch!
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Post by whiskeybrewer on Dec 14, 2019 13:23:51 GMT
Just rewatched Into the Dalek, I forgot how memorable this one is! For starters, it has “Don’t be lasagna”😄 But kidding aside, it has the start of “ Am I a good man” which works well in this episode contrasting with Rusty the Dalek. I feel like this is almost a companion piece to “Dalek” with them both having a lone dangerous but sympathetic Dalek that faces off against the Doctor. I forgot Danny Pink’s introduction is in this episode. Even though I much prefer Clara with 12, I do think Danny has some genuinely heartbreaking moments, like in this episode where one of his students ask him if he killed anyone and he is crying 😢 I think there is a good parallel between him and 12 with them both being former soldiers filled with guilt. The set pieces in this are gorgeous, especially the scene where they all go through the Dalek eyestalk! You really do feel like 12, Clara and the rest are inside a Dalek! I also love the scene when 12 gets inside Rusty’s head and tries to show him the wonders of the universe but then also sees his hatred of Daleks. I really love rewatching episodes from 12’s era😊 I feel like his era doesn’t get appreciated enough, for a Doctor with such a spectacular character arch! I'm trying to remember if he ever did name or do anything for that Female soldier
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Post by timegirl on Dec 16, 2019 17:56:56 GMT
Just rewatched Fires of Pompeii, an amazing episode with not one but two of my favorite Doctors, 10 and 12 (well the inspiration for 12’s face anyways)😀and also Amy Pond😄 Brilliant emotional episode that explores the Doctor’s willingness( or lack there of) to save people during fixed points in time. I love the scenes with 10 and Donna spending time with Caecilius and his family😊 Peter is wonderfully sympathetic and quirky as Caecilius, and rewatching this episode it’s heartwarming to see the Doctor’s inspiration for 12’s face😀😢 10 and Donna are amazing as always! I think this episode is a good example of how despite her loud mouth, Donna is one of the most caring companions of the Doctor! It’s kind of odd seeing Karen Gillan play a side character in this, sometimes I find myself imagining it’s Amy incognito 🤔😄 The villains in this are quite camp! I recognized another familiar face in Lucius as the creepy taxi driver from A Study in Pink, the first episode of Sherlock 🙂 Does anyone else think that the Pyrovile in this and Morax in Witchfinders are very similar? I wonder if their planets are twins?🤔
On a side note, once big finish signs Peter, they need to do a story where 12 reunites with Caecilius and his family and they have a heart to heart(s) together😊with 12 telling Caecilius how he got his face from him 😢❤️❤️and then maybe they stop an alien threat in Rome together 😀 possibly involving 12 and Caecilius having to pretend to be each other 😄
On another side note is it weird that I kind of want David Tennant and Peter Capaldi to do a road trip movie where they play father and son on their way to a sci-fi convention?!🚙🤔They would be bicker and tease each other and be very Scottish🏴😃😄 Peter would constantly bring up embarrassing moments from David’s childhood😄Oh and they would visit an eccentric great uncle who loves to play the spoons played by Sylvester McCoy 🥄and then Peter would play the guitar with him and David would sing🥄🎸🎤 Tell me that wouldn’t be an amazing movie?!
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Post by timegirl on Dec 21, 2019 15:25:27 GMT
Most recently I have rewatched, Kill the Moon and the Girl Who Died. It’s kind of strange watching series 8 prickly moody 12, and then series 9 easier going rockstar 12, he really did change a lot between series! He definitely had the most character development of any modern era ( at least) Doctor! Kill the Moon is kind of frustrating, on one hand it has interesting concepts like the moon being basically a dragon’s egg🐉 as well as that amazing and heartbreaking break up scene at the end in the TARDIS 😢 But the other you have very frustrating bickering scenes with Clara, Courtney, and the astronaut 😒 I appreciate what they were going for I just think they could have made it slightly less frustrating to watch🤔 Not a perfect episode but not one without merit.
The Girl who Died, is an interesting one🤔😀 I love how much 12 and Clara’s romance plays into this one, and how they really feel like a real life couple ❤️❤️ You can really feel how fiercely 12 and Clara love each other between the spinning hug, the face touch, and the duty of care line😊 I lake the Viking village and Odin as well 😀There is a lot of good comedy with 12 training the Vikings😄 Even though I don’t love Ashildr (Me), I will admit she does have kind of a fascinating story arch! All in all a decent episod!
On a side note, I watched both of these late at night because I could not fall asleep, and both of them did relax me for bed☺️😴 I think Peter Capaldi must have a very soothing voice😊 Sometimes I wish he had a YouTube channel where he reads bedtime stories to restless whovians😄😊
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Post by timegirl on Dec 22, 2019 15:07:39 GMT
I had another late night Doctor Who rewatch this time of The Woman Who Lived. I think it’s a bit of a mixed bag of an episode. I generally like the scenes where 12 goes about robbing with Me as the Nightmare (but then again I love any scenes 12 is in😊). I have mixed feelings Me (Ashildr) in some scenes she is compelling, like when she is talking about her personal tragedies, but in others I don’t quite by her acting🤔 I do love the 17th century setting, and all the fabulous houses and costumes ( even though I don’t particularly like Me, I will admit her both her Nightmare costume and her red dress are fabulous!)It’s strange having Rufus Hound play a different role in Doctor Who, I kind of found myself thinking that perhaps he was really the Meddling Monk incognito🤔😄 I loved Sam Swift especially the ridiculous jokey hang scene 🤣 I will admit parts of this episode did feel slightly Blackaddery😀 I think it is telling though that my favorite moment did not come until the end when 12 and Clara share that hug in the TARDIS, that scene just melts my heart! ❤️❤️
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Post by polly on Dec 23, 2019 20:28:55 GMT
Robot - Took a small break after Planet of the Spiders, we're but back into it now. Tom is immediately engaging, but this story is pretty bland, actually. And then there's the infamous King Kong section with Sarah Jane and the giant robot....
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Post by Deleted on Dec 24, 2019 11:10:56 GMT
The Runaway Bride was just in Watch. This era of Who looks so cheap.
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melkur
Chancellery Guard
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Post by melkur on Dec 25, 2019 19:11:11 GMT
Continuing on with a little 'tradition' of mine, this morning I watched 'The Edge Of Destruction' whilst helping to get everything ready and, now that my parents are dropping my grandmother off, am watching a bit of 'The Macra Terror' (though I don't know if I'm going to finish it this evening)..
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Post by timegirl on Dec 26, 2019 21:25:26 GMT
Showing my boyfriend Last Christmas because I am trying to introduce him to more Doctor Who😊and this is one of my top Christmas Who specials and I can’t resist rewatching 12th Doctor episodes 😉(yes I know I just rewatched this one a couple of weeks ago but but its just that good!)😊🎄
Just finished watching and am happy to report that my boyfriend loved the complex plot twists and Nick Frost as Santa 😀but on the other hand he had issues with the age difference of 12 and Clara😕 in fact he kind of wished Clara stayed an old woman at the end when her and 12 went back traveling in the TARDIS🤔👵🏻I think he might change his mind if he gets more context to 12 and Clara’s relationship 🤔
To each their own, glad my boyfriend liked most aspects anyways 🙂🤷🏻♀️ Although this reinforces my feeling that when Peter does big finish there should be a sequel to this set around New Years where 12, as a of New Years resolution to his second chance with Clara, decides to make himself younger but then Clara misses the old 12 and is desperate to have him back as his old self🤔😉
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Post by polly on Dec 27, 2019 21:12:30 GMT
The Ark in Space - Now this is how I like my Fourth Doctor. It's a much better demonstration of what the series is going to be like under the new regime than Robot was. For my money, it's the best story since Inferno. And first-timer Mr Polly is very interested by the parallels with Alien and other SF films.
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Post by mark687 on Dec 28, 2019 21:32:35 GMT
Robot
(45 Years on it still stands up)
Resolution
( The pacing/style of the Ryan and the Dad resolution, though necessary , wrecks the final act of what's arguably the best use of a Dalek on TV since since 2005's Dalek)
Regards
mark687
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Post by Deleted on Dec 29, 2019 10:59:01 GMT
Terror of the Vervoids: Special Edition
Quite enjoyable and, in its own way, quite transformative, as well. How we edit our television series has come a long way since the early days. Mainly due to technology. What was a deeply intensive process in 1968 became simpler in 1986 and is now in 2019 as easy as a keyboard shortcut on your home computer. It's allowed us faster, smarter cuts for smoother, wiser storytelling experiences. I was expecting Vervoids's Special Edition would be a straightforward cut of the trial scenes, but it's actually rather more intensive than that. Sharp, is the word.
Outside of some marvellous cutaways to the Hyperion III (with CGI and modelwork melded beautifully together), there's been a concentrated effort to focus the story's main points and sharpen some of the dialogue. Material is trimmed as much as it's added. The Doctor and Mel arrive in the midst of what's now a clearly established manhunt for the comms officer's attacker. Hallett leads each beat of the early story until the two unexpected arrivals take over halfway. It's all carefully measured to produce the maximum impact. The story itself holds together extremely well without the obfuscation of the Trial.
The only thing that's really missing -- alas, due to a lack of original footage -- is a more concrete confirmation for the comms officer, Edwardes's, death. Credit to the edit, it makes a very strong case for Laskey, overzealously protecting the Vervoids against outside attack, but I have to wonder if an experienced agronomist would have used such a trap. Something that produces such a massive discharge of light. Enough to wake the Vervoids. Did she miscalculate the explosive? Now, that's a possibility. An expert in scientific agriculture isn't necessarily one in shaped demolitions. The implication is very much there and the consequences kept hidden in the Isolation Room would point that direction. As would the Vervoids's reaction when she attempts to speak to them in the hold ("All animal kind is our enemy, Professor. Even you."). It would tie up all the loose ends...
I think this is probably the best version of this story I've seen to date. Makes you look at the story in an entirely new way.
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Post by barnabaslives on Dec 29, 2019 19:00:34 GMT
I watched The Doctor's Daughter through Forest of the Dead. Poor Martha sort of got the short stick in The Doctor's Daughter but still fantastic to have an episode with Martha and Donna, not to mention Jenny. I was going to leave it at The Unicorn and the Wasp but who can resist River Song turning up, so I gladly carried on.
Maybe the upside of it having been so long since I sat down to watch any TV is that I get a different perspective on these New Series episodes that I did the first time I watched them, hot on the heels of binge-watching the entire OS, which must make the differences between the old nd new seem more stark. Just jumping into the NS here it seemed more harmonious with the OS than ever before.
Tropes and possible over-enthusiasm for CGI facial displacement stood out a bit as ever, but did a lot less than ever before to dampen my enjoyment of what are truly some great episodes here. I already knew they were great episodes, but it's nice to have that come into focus so well.
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Post by Hieronymus on Dec 31, 2019 2:09:26 GMT
The Macra Terror (animated). The pacing is better than most stories of the Troughton era, and some of the themes are surprisingly current. There is nothing wrong with the video. Everything is fine. There are no Macra.
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