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Post by TimPendragon on Oct 4, 2018 5:55:53 GMT
I'm slowly trying to get my NuWhovian boyfriend acclimated to the classic show. He has a general awareness, of course, but hasn't seen much beyond the first part of The Unearthly Child, and (just a couple of days ago) Genesis of the Daleks. My DVD collection of classic Who is somewhat limited, and given the current lack of free streaming, I'm trying to think of Big Finish releases that could serve as a good introduction for each Doctor. He loves audio dramas and audiobooks in general, and has enough of a mental image of each Doctor that he wouldn't have a hard time picturing which one was which while listening. Though, his experience with the classic series is very limited, so he basically has them in his mind like this:
First Doctor = "Grumpy Gramps" Second Doctor = "Moe" Third Doctor = "Ruffles" Fourth Doctor = "Curls and Scarf" Fifth Doctor = "Celery" Sixth Doctor = "Technicolor Nightmare Coat" Seventh Doctor = "Radagast with the umbrella" Eighth Doctor = "Victorian gentleman"
As far as classic companions go, he knows Sarah Jane well (thanks to the modern stuff), and K-9. He understands who Susan is, and knows about Ace beating up Daleks with a bat. That's about it. From the new series, there's very little he doesn't at least like, but Donna and Ten is his favorite era by far, I think.
So with all that in mind, if you had to pick one or two Big Finish stories as introductory stories for each Doctor, geared towards someone who mostly has experience with the 21st century show, what would they be? I'm thinking The Marian Conspiracy, possibly for Six, but other than that, I'm sort of at a loss. Main Range, Companion Chronicles, Short Trips, specials, adaptations, BBC audiobooks, whatever. If I don't have them already, I can buy them, or borrow them from the library, more easily and affordably than I can get him to watch the classic show right now.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 4, 2018 6:52:51 GMT
2nd-The Mouthless Dead
3rd-Tyrants of Logic
4th-The Final Phase(just the Doctors Speech to the Daleks about changing their tiny little minds-love it)
5th-Zaltys
6th-Spectre of Lanyon Moor
7th-Magic Mousetrap or House of Blue Fire
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Post by Deleted on Oct 4, 2018 6:59:44 GMT
Farewell, Great Macedon from the Lost Stories or The Doctor's Tale from the Early Adventures for Grumpy Gramps, I reckon. They're both very indicative of their eras and very well-written.
Don't think I can really speak for the Second Doctor... The Rosemariners or maybe The Jigsaw War?
The Third Doctor Adventures: Volume 4 has an exceptional Cyber-story in The Tyrants of Logic that's convinced me to pay closer attention to the recast volumes.
The Philip Hinchcliffe Presents boxsets you cannot go wrong with for the Fourth Doctor and Leela in their element.
The Eye of the Scorpion is a great introduction to a wiser Five, younger Peri and new companion, Erimem.
The Marian Conspiracy for ol' Sixie and Evelyn, rebuilding what his era represents from the ground up in seven stories.
I really like what's going on in A Thousand Tiny Wings, but I'm not sure if you'd need Colditz to clarify it. In any case, The Harvest is a nice introduction to the world of the Seventh Doctor, Ace and their newest friend, Hex.
And Storm Warning for the very start of the Eighth Doctor's adventures with Alan Barnes fleshing out the bones of the TVM interpretation in just four episodes.
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Post by TimPendragon on Oct 4, 2018 8:49:39 GMT
2nd-The Mouthless Dead 3rd-Tyrants of Logic 4th-The Final Phase(just the Doctors Speech to the Daleks about changing their tiny little minds-love it) 5th-Zaltys 6th-Spectre of Lanyon Moor 7th-Magic Mousetrap or House of Blue Fire Of those, I've only heard Lanyon Moor and Magic Mousetrap so far, so I'll have to reserve judgment on the others 'til I give them a listen. Farewell, Great Macedon from the Lost Stories or The Doctor's Tale from the Early Adventures for Grumpy Gramps, I reckon. They're both very indicative of their eras and very well-written. Don't think I can really speak for the Second Doctor... The Rosemariners or maybe The Jigsaw War? The Third Doctor Adventures: Volume 4 has an exceptional Cyber-story in The Tyrants of Logic that's convinced me to pay closer attention to the recast volumes. The Philip Hinchcliffe Presents boxsets you cannot go wrong with for the Fourth Doctor and Leela in their element. The Eye of the Scorpion is a great introduction to a wiser Five, younger Peri and new companion, Erimem. The Marian Conspiracy for ol' Sixie and Evelyn, rebuilding what his era represents from the ground up in seven stories. I really like what's going on in A Thousand Tiny Wings, but I'm not sure if you'd need Colditz to clarify it. In any case, The Harvest is a nice introduction to the world of the Seventh Doctor, Ace and their newest friend, Hex. And Storm Warning for the very start of the Eighth Doctor's adventures with Alan Barnes fleshing out the bones of the TVM interpretation in just four episodes. is coming up on my listening agenda very soon anyway, as so many people list it as one of the best First Doctor stories, full stop. If it really captures the era well, without being as padded as say The Daleks, fantastic. I just haven't heard very much of the Second Doctor myself, either. Is there a really good one with Jamie? And on the TV side, how's The Web of Fear as an intro to Traughton? It's the only one of his classic serials I can get a hold of easily. I'll have to give the 3DAs a listen soon, as I haven't heard any Third Doctor audio yet at all. I'm hoping I can get Damian to watch Spearhead from Space soon, since I do have that one (and The Three Doctors), but after that, I'm at a loss. I think he'd like the story of Inferno, but it's too long and padded to hold his attention all the way through. If I had The Time Warrior, I'd go for that one after Spearhead. For audios, I just haven't a clue yet. I have the old BBC radio dramas JP did, but haven't heard them. Part of me doesn't want to, partially for fear of disappointment, partially so there's still something "new" with Pertwee out there for me. I'll give the Hinchcliffe sets a listen soon. I'm still very early on in my first listen of the 4DAs, so don't have a ton of experience with him on audio either. I should also put The Foe from the Future in the queue, I guess, since that's supposed to be good. Damian knows Sarah Jane but has no real knowledge of Leela at all. She's one of my favorites, so I really want him to get a good story with her soon. With Five, Six, Seven and Eight... All good suggestions, but I'm not sure about throwing too many non-TV companions at him, apart from Evelyn, because Six is really at his best with her. I'm tempted to start him on Five with Spare Parts, but I don't know. Six is definitely The Marian Conspiracy, for Evelyn's sake. Seven, is a hard one for me. I want him to love Seven and Ace as much as I do, so The Harvest, while a great jumping on point continuity wise, might not be the best overall impression of those two. I really want him to see Remembrance, Battlefield and Fenric, but I only have the first of those. On that note, what is Sylvester's best performance in all of Big Finish? Coldtiz is great, I think, but requires too much familiarity for it to really have any impact. With Eight, you're definitely right. I just don't think there is a better place to start than with Storm Warning and Charley. Some of her episodes can be safely skipped, but I think overall, he'll like that combo. |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 4, 2018 9:41:41 GMT
Macedon is coming up on my listening agenda very soon anyway, as so many people list it as one of the best First Doctor stories, full stop. If it really captures the era well, without being as padded as say The Daleks, fantastic. I just haven't heard very much of the Second Doctor myself, either. Is there a really good one with Jamie? And on the TV side, how's The Web of Fear as an intro to Traughton? It's the only one of his classic serials I can get a hold of easily. I'll have to give the 3DAs a listen soon, as I haven't heard any Third Doctor audio yet at all. I'm hoping I can get Damian to watch Spearhead from Space soon, since I do have that one (and The Three Doctors), but after that, I'm at a loss. I think he'd like the story of Inferno, but it's too long and padded to hold his attention all the way through. If I had The Time Warrior, I'd go for that one after Spearhead. For audios, I just haven't a clue yet. I have the old BBC radio dramas JP did, but haven't heard them. Part of me doesn't want to, partially for fear of disappointment, partially so there's still something "new" with Pertwee out there for me. I'll give the Hinchcliffe sets a listen soon. I'm still very early on in my first listen of the 4DAs, so don't have a ton of experience with him on audio either. I should also put The Foe from the Future in the queue, I guess, since that's supposed to be good. Damian knows Sarah Jane but has no real knowledge of Leela at all. She's one of my favorites, so I really want him to get a good story with her soon. With Five, Six, Seven and Eight... All good suggestions, but I'm not sure about throwing too many non-TV companions at him, apart from Evelyn, because Six is really at his best with her. I'm tempted to start him on Five with Spare Parts, but I don't know. Six is definitely The Marian Conspiracy, for Evelyn's sake. Seven, is a hard one for me. I want him to love Seven and Ace as much as I do, so The Harvest, while a great jumping on point continuity wise, might not be the best overall impression of those two. I really want him to see Remembrance, Battlefield and Fenric, but I only have the first of those. On that note, what is Sylvester's best performance in all of Big Finish? Coldtiz is great, I think, but requires too much familiarity for it to really have any impact. With Eight, you're definitely right. I just don't think there is a better place to start than with Storm Warning and Charley. Some of her episodes can be safely skipped, but I think overall, he'll like that combo. Our very own John Dorney plays what might be one of the best renditions of Alexander the Great I've listened to. I won't say anymore, though, for spoilers. It's one of my favourite releases to come out of Big Finish for the writing and performances. Ohh, that's a good question... The Jigsaw War is great for Jamie, a Companion Chronicle and puzzle box all in one. It does some very interesting things with the format. For television, I'd say The Web of Fear will do wonders. It's got a terrific sense of atmosphere with the Intelligence casting its web through the Underground. I think there was a thread on the forum ages ago about good entry-level stories and the one that popped up the most often for the Third Doctor was Terror of the Autons. The Doctor's actively involved (with an ever-endearing Jo) and the level of activity in it is great for newcomers wary about older stories being a bit slower paced. It really gives its all. I know what you mean about those old BBC Radio audios. I've heard of them, but I don't think I've ever listened to them. They've just kind of slipped beneath my radar over the years. Outside of The Tyrants of Logic, I have very fond memories of BF's The Scorchies. That was really fun. Spare Parts is another good release for Five, particularly if you've just recently shown him Genesis of the Daleks. It's on the Big Finish page as one of their stories for newcomers and there's just so much powerful imagery in there. It paints a really vivid picture of Mondas in decline and how such a thing as the Cybermen could come about. Sylvester's best performance, hmm... I'm trying not to think of anything too continuity-heavy... Maybe The Fires of Vulcan? I'm quite partial to Valhalla (with a pre-Missy Michelle Gomez as pseudo-companion), but that's also without Ace... Oh, wait -- if you've got Remembrance, The Assassination Games would make a perfect introduction. Seven, Ace and Countermeasures all in one, without being a direct sequel. Thanks. I hope you guys have fun.  |
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Post by tuigirl on Oct 4, 2018 10:06:41 GMT
Hmmm...
since I myself have started out with Big Finish only a couple of years ago and only just get into Classic Who on TV, I could let you know with what I started.
1st Doctor- nothing yet
2nd Doctor- got the first box set, which is okay, especially the first story is great.
3rd Doctor- I first listened to Katy Mannings Companion Chronicles because I adore her. But only just recently I listened to the 4th Volume of the 3rd Doctor box sets and it was amazing. Tyrants of Logic is really very, very good. So that is definitely recommended.
4th Doctor- the first audio I heard was the Night of the Vashta Nerada on the New Monsters box set. LOVE that story. Really creepy.
In general I can recommend the Classic Doctors, New Monsters box sets, I really enjoyed the stories on there and they give a good impression of most of the Classic Doctors.
5th Doctor- the first I listened to was "The Kingmaker" and I loved it. Great dark comedy. Followed by "Spare Parts", which is more of a psychological horror type story.
6th Doctor- I started out with "The one Doctor" and "The Wormery" (both more or less comedy) and immediately fell in love. Since then, I just adore Colin Baker.
7th Doctor- I first heard him on the 1st New Adventures Bernice Summerfield box set and he drove me mad. That is the reason I avoided him for so long (the first story is a comedy and has the Doctor drugged and out of character... I can see that Sylvester McCoy REALLY enjoyed playing a stoned Doctor, but man did it grate in my nerves!). So better avoid that one as example of the 7th Doctor.
I then started out with the Hex stories, the Harvest, Life 34... and I really started to like them. So that would be a better way to start.
8th Doctor- Storm Warning. Best intro ever. Followed by Seasons of Fear, which is my favorite 8 and Charley story.
And if your NuWho Friend just needs a great intro into audio-
I especially liked the 11th Doctor Chronicles box set and would reommend it to any NuWho fan. I enjoyed it more than the 10th Doctor sets and found the stories better and more interesting. But that might just be me since I am not the biggest fan of the 10th Doctor.
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Post by number13 on Oct 4, 2018 11:19:26 GMT
Farewell, Great Macedon from the Lost Stories or The Doctor's Tale from the Early Adventures for Grumpy Gramps, I reckon. They're both very indicative of their eras and very well-written. Don't think I can really speak for the Second Doctor... The Rosemariners or maybe The Jigsaw War? The Third Doctor Adventures: Volume 4 has an exceptional Cyber-story in The Tyrants of Logic that's convinced me to pay closer attention to the recast volumes. The Philip Hinchcliffe Presents boxsets you cannot go wrong with for the Fourth Doctor and Leela in their element. The Eye of the Scorpion is a great introduction to a wiser Five, younger Peri and new companion, Erimem. The Marian Conspiracy for ol' Sixie and Evelyn, rebuilding what his era represents from the ground up in seven stories. I really like what's going on in A Thousand Tiny Wings, but I'm not sure if you'd need Colditz to clarify it. In any case, The Harvest is a nice introduction to the world of the Seventh Doctor, Ace and their newest friend, Hex. And Storm Warning for the very start of the Eighth Doctor's adventures with Alan Barnes fleshing out the bones of the TVM interpretation in just four episodes. I like all these suggestions wolfie! Great stories every one and yes, having heard it recently, 'The Harvest' is an excellent entry point for the Seventh Doctor.
For the Second Doctor, definitely get 'Lords of the Red Planet' - it could only be Patrick Troughton playing the Doctor as described, and it's the Ice Warriors! And Jamie, creag an tuire!
For the Third Doctor, I'd go for the 3DAs Vol 3 I think. A cracking Nick Briggs Dalek story that's 100% authentic to the TV era and a really excellent and very original yet very authentic UNIT story from Andrew Smith who clearly also holds the era in high regard and gets the tone of "Jon" and Katy just right.
For the Fourth Doctor, PHP vol 1 or the Fourth Doctor boxset are easily the best imo but they aren't cheap at normal prices! From the 4DAs range, 'Wrath of the Iceni' and 'Return of the Rocket Men/Death Match' are excellent with Leela. And K9! And a very special guest villain in the later pair...
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ljwilson
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It's tangerine....not orange
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Post by ljwilson on Oct 4, 2018 11:33:04 GMT
1st - Bounty of Ceres
2nd - The Forsaken
3rd - The Hidden Realm
4th - Wave of Destruction
5th - Creatures of Beauty
6th - Spectre of Lanyon Moor
7th - Night Thoughts
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Post by Deleted on Oct 4, 2018 12:42:49 GMT
I like a nice list ...
1st Doctor - The Dalek Occupation of Winter 2nd Doctor - The Queen of Time (I would have gone for Lords of the Red Planet, but it's a bit long)
3rd Doctor - The Rise of the New Humans
4th Doctor - The Skin of the Sleek/The Thief Who Stole Time 5th Doctor - Loups Garoux 6th Doctor - The Guardians of Prophecy 7th Doctor - Enemy of the Daleks 8th Doctor - Other Lives.
Not all these stories are necessarily the best of their eras, but work well as introductory stories, in my view. Also, I haven't had time to read this whole thread, so I might have included some stories that have previously been ruled out. Lunch-breaks are never long enough!
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Post by Digi on Oct 5, 2018 22:32:06 GMT
The EDAs were really designed to be introductory, and Sheridan Smith is a joy to listen to from the word go, so that’s probably a safe bet for McGann. And as an added bonus, they’re 45-60 minutes apiece, so if you’re looking to invite a TV viewer to audio, that’s a much more digestible size than asking them to do two hours for a single story.
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Post by tuigirl on Oct 5, 2018 23:08:39 GMT
The EDAs were really designed to be introductory, and Sheridan Smith is a joy to listen to from the word go, so that’s probably a safe bet for McGann. And as an added bonus, they’re 45-60 minutes apiece, so if you’re looking to invite a TV viewer to audio, that’s a much more digestible size than asking them to do two hours for a single story. Hmm... well, not sure... I also stated Big Finish recently and the EDAs were recommended to me... but somehow, I never got into Lucie and while I like "Human Resources" as a great story, I could not get into any of the other stories of series 1 and so far have not started series 2. For some reason I prefer Charley over Lucie... so I would recommend maybe both Storm Warning and the first of the EDAs as a tester... luckily, both are available for free in Spotify (even with a free account).
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Post by TimPendragon on Oct 6, 2018 5:46:13 GMT
Thanks for all the suggestions, everyone. I'm about halfway through Farewell, Great Macedon, and while I'm enjoying it, I don't think Damian's in the right headspace for it yet. I'd want to find a more sci-fi 1st Doctor story for him, it'd be easier to draw him in with that than a pure historical, I think. I'll give the other First Doctor suggestions here a listen, hopefully one will fit the bill. If not, I might just start him with the Oliver Harper Companion Chronicle trilogy. And I need to give all the Two and Three suggestions a listen, as well. Regarding the EDAs, my opinion of them is not too far off from tuigirl's. I'm almost halfway through series 3, and of the 20 or so I've heard, I've only liked 6 ( Human Resources definitely among them). Apart from not getting into Lucie most of the time, I don't think Eight's all that likeable in them, himself. And Blood of the Daleks, to me, is really boring, bland and generic, with kinda manky acting, so that's not where I'd want to start anyone on McGann. If I just want to throw him a random Eight story rather than Storm Warning, Other Lives is certainly a fantastic suggestion. Loups-Garoux is a really good suggestion for Five. I was trying to think of what early one really grabbed me, and that was it. Might be better to start him off there than with Spare Parts, give him a good one, but not starting with one of the absolute best, so there's something to build to. It's really hard for me narrowing down a Seven story to start with. Part of it is there's just so much ground to cover, so many different "eras" and "approaches" to that particular Doctor. And while I love the Hex stories, I was really already very invested in 7 and Ace long before I heard The Harvest, and I don't think I would've liked Seven or Ace as much if that was my first exposure to them. The Fires of Vulcan is a great suggestion for Seven in general, but I'm hesitant because it's so similar to The Fires of Pompeii (in subject and overall plot, if not in tone). It's a brilliant one for Mel, though. For Six, if you were going to pick one TV story to show someone, which would it be? Vengeance on Varos? Mark of the Rani? The Two Doctors? There's slim pickings for greatness, I know. As for audios, I think I am leaning towards Spectre of Lanyon Moor more than The Marian Conspiracy. Damian's not into history much, unlike me, and though Evelyn is introduced in Conspiracy, I think he'd gravitate towards Spectre more, plus the Brig is there. On the other hand, what do you think of The Juggernauts as an intro to Six? It's a really good one for Mel, at least, and Davros also provides some familiarity. He wouldn't have to know much if anything about the Mechanoids before hand, even less than say, knowing about The Invasion is necessary to understand Original Sin. Speaking of novels, what about audiobooks? How's The Witch Hunters as a good intro to the First Doctor? Is there a good audiobook for Two or Three? Other ideas? Something where there's that extra layer of description that a novel reading provides might help him get to know the more "obscure" Doctors more easily. Please keep the suggestions coming, they're very helpful, and much appreciated. |
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Post by constonks on Oct 6, 2018 6:24:36 GMT
Two that haven't been mentioned:
For #6, Criss-Cross. Bit historical, bit sci-fi, intro to a great companion, solid twists and turns and a whole lot of fun.
And of course for #2 - while the Forsaken was mentioned above - you can't go wrong with any of the Polly, Ben & Jamie EA stories. They're all very well balanced between narration & full-cast. All four are good, but if you want something spacey-futurey I'd go with The Yes Men or The Outliers.
Oh also The Witch Hunters is one my favourite First Doctor stories of all - Lyons gets the characters of Susan, Ian, Barbara and the First Doctor spot on while doing interesting things with them along the way. The audiobooks might be a bit long as an intro, but if it's texture you're looking for, Witch Hunters has it in spades. (Not sure who narrates that one, though, or the quality of the audio itself, as I read the book.)
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Post by Deleted on Oct 6, 2018 6:54:07 GMT
The Witch Hunters is a fantastic read/listen (David Collings does the audiobook), but I'm sure it'd appeal under these circumstances, it's another historical story similar to Farewell, Great Macedon (the only sci-fi element is Susan's telepathy). How about The Sontarans? It's a great showing of the First Doctor, Steven and Sara in a very unique period of the show's history. (It even nicely and preemptively addresses problems that I still have with Twice Upon a Time's depiction of him.)
I can highly recommend Wheel of Ice's audiobook for the Second Doctor as David Troughton narrates the story. Very nice story with a very nice performance.
I saw The Juggernauts recommended on the "New to Big Finish?" page and had a re-listen the other day. It's very good, authored by one of the writers for I, Davros, so there's a ferocity to the story that really keeps it moving. The Sixth Doctor is nicely charming and very most in his gleaming twilight years -- content and in his element -- but I have to give it to this story for selling me on Mel as a character. She has one of her strongest moments here, one which echoes across all her other appearances.
For Sixie on television... The most commonly watched serials from the fan-edits I've done have been The Two Doctors with Vengeance on Varos coming in not too far behind it.
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Post by tuigirl on Oct 6, 2018 7:37:18 GMT
Well, if you are looking for a random 8th Doctor story, you cannot go wrong with Seasons of Fear. My favorite. It is exciting, well written, funny and easy to follow, partly because the Doctor is also the narrator. Plus the banter between Charley and the Doctor is pure gold. "Do they have orgies?" -"Charlotte Pollard!!!" -"I went to an orgy once. I didn't stay."
I myself was not too enthused about Other Lifes to be honest...
As for Six TV stories... my favorites are the Two Doctors and Mindwarp. But both might not be the best starting points. The Two Doctors suffers from a complete non-sensical script and that is off-putting for many people (plus it has that infamous scene where the Doctor murders one of the villains in a glorious close-up and then quibs about it). I love it because you can see how much the actors enjoy themselves and the positive energy is just infectious.
So maybe go with Vengeance on Varos, because that at least has a good story.
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