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Post by number13 on Jan 23, 2020 10:02:47 GMT
Concerning the discussion about Doctor Who an violence. I am really not very happy with the hypocritical approach to the Doctor's approach to weapons, as demonstrated in this episode. I agree that there always has been violence, and some serials, like Resurrection of the Daleks I found pretty hard to watch. I think back at the day, it had more deaths than movies like Rambo? I think I prefer Sixie's approach to violence and weapons. He is not shy of picking up a weapon (or a jar of poison) and doing the deed himself to protect himself, his companions and whoever it is he is protecting that episode. This is honest and relatable and makes sense. In this Tesla episode, however, small hand guns are forbidden, while a huge electrical cannon is build which may or may not destroy a whole ship full of sentient creatures. I just cannot grasp the reasoning behind this. For me, this is a real dissonance and at the worst very hypocritical. I assumed (i.e. I made up to explain the glaringly obvious contradiction you mentioned ) the Doctor knew the ship had a shield strong enough to withstand one lightning bolt, but they would get the message and run for it before a second one could strike. They didn't know the Doctor isn't allowed to kill anything now by her mysterious superiors. (The ones from Cardiff, not Gallifrey. )
Seriously though, I think the level of 'reality' has something to do with it. Anything which could be imitated or seem 'real' is out. Huge lightning generators are OK because it's fantasy on the day-to-day real world level - they don't turn up in TV news bulletins.
And I also prefer the classic series Doctors' attitude: peace by peaceful means whenever possible, otherwise - whatever it takes to do the job.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 23, 2020 13:34:41 GMT
Concerning the discussion about Doctor Who an violence. I am really not very happy with the hypocritical approach to the Doctor's approach to weapons, as demonstrated in this episode. I agree that there always has been violence, and some serials, like Resurrection of the Daleks I found pretty hard to watch. I think back at the day, it had more deaths than movies like Rambo? I think I prefer Sixie's approach to violence and weapons. He is not shy of picking up a weapon (or a jar of poison) and doing the deed himself to protect himself, his companions and whoever it is he is protecting that episode. This is honest and relatable and makes sense. In this Tesla episode, however, small hand guns are forbidden, while a huge electrical cannon is build which may or may not destroy a whole ship full of sentient creatures. I just cannot grasp the reasoning behind this. For me, this is a real dissonance and at the worst very hypocritical. I assumed (i.e. I made up to explain the glaringly obvious contradiction you mentioned ) the Doctor knew the ship had a shield strong enough to withstand one lightning bolt, but they would get the message and run for it before a second one could strike. They didn't know the Doctor isn't allowed to kill anything now by her mysterious superiors. (The ones from Cardiff, not Gallifrey. ) Seriously though, I think the level of 'reality' has something to do with it. Anything which could be imitated or seem 'real' is out. Huge lightning generators are OK because it's fantasy on the day-to-day real world level - they don't turn up in TV news bulletins.
And I also prefer the classic series Doctors' attitude: peace by peaceful means whenever possible, otherwise - whatever it takes to do the job.
Yeah... I've a feeling it does stem from the same ethos. For the purposes of family television, it's okay to destroy humanoid figures (robots or aliens with purple blood) because that buffer of fantasy is dehumanising. Remove that filter -- with, say, a hunting Androgum outside a hacienda -- and the whole attitude suddenly shifts. It's same reflex poked by the masked policemen in Terror of the Autons and much more viciously in the aforementioned Resurrection (where there is little-to-no filter for the London scenes). Unfortunately, the yes-no contradiction is a recurring problem that turns up from time-to-time within the show itself. Some series/incarnations are much more up front about it than others. I really enjoyed the Twelfth Doctor's conversation with Bill in Thin Ice for its decision to play the paradox straight . It was very frank about the, well... the inherent brutality of such choices and how the Doctor rationalises it: Another very good one comes from a New Adventure, Transit, after Kadiatu's shot someone: Which I think points to another thing to consider. We often champion stories with characters that leap off the screen with lives of their own. Their actions affecting the story in meaningful ways. Not everyone is going to believe as the Doctor does and is going to take precautions based on their own views (e.g. the Brigadier in The Silurians). Moreover, what is intended and what occurs may not necessarily line up. Characters can also make mistakes.
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Post by whiskeybrewer on Jan 23, 2020 14:49:26 GMT
Which I think points to another thing to consider. We often champion stories with characters that leap off the screen with lives of their own. Their actions affecting the story in meaningful ways. Not everyone is going to believe as the Doctor does and is going to take precautions based on their own views (e.g. the Brigadier in The Silurians). Moreover, what is intended and what occurs may not necessarily line up. Characters can also make mistakes. I so want that to be used during the TV Series. Imagine Jodie saying it.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 23, 2020 18:59:01 GMT
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Post by elkawho on Jan 24, 2020 3:48:30 GMT
Has anyone seen last years film The Current War? Set a few decades before this but Edison and Tesla are both in it (portrayed by Benedict Cumberbatch and Nicholas Hoult respectively) while George Westinhouse, Edison's big rival in the earlier years is played by the great Michael Shannon. Quite an interesting cast - I've not seen it myself but it's on YT streaming for a few quid so I think I'll check it out. That was one of the films I really wanted to see last year but just never seemed to remember it when I was looking for something to watch. I'll have to remedy that.
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Post by Timelord007 on Jan 24, 2020 8:05:33 GMT
I see there's usual toxic comments on videos via You Tube hating the episode well generally hating the show full stop.
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Post by nucleusofswarm on Jan 24, 2020 10:41:08 GMT
I see there's usual toxic comments on videos via You Tube hating the episode well generally hating the show full stop. One of the big downsides of the internet age we live is people hanging onto stuff they don't like. Criticism is one thing, but after a while, people must realize it's not productive to be sticks in the mud.
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Post by nucleusofswarm on Jan 24, 2020 10:43:09 GMT
I did notice: 13 really had it in for Queen Skithra for this episode. It was a little Mean Girls-y: every scene they were in together, she was constantly mocking and deriding her. 13 is usually snippy with the villains, but this week she really went after Queen Skithra.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 24, 2020 11:42:47 GMT
I see there's usual toxic comments on videos via You Tube hating the episode well generally hating the show full stop. I've had to discipline myself to ignore these people. There's one YouTube channel in which the host actually appears to apologise for not finding this latest episode ' that bad.' This obsession for certain fans to tear down the show utterly baffles me. The thing is, the comments made about this series are exactly the same comments that have been made about previous series since the show came back, only with the name of the showrunner changed. In the latest DWM, Chris Chibnall professes not to be on social media, so the only people these online keyboard thumpers are preaching to are themselves.
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Post by tuigirl on Jan 24, 2020 17:22:20 GMT
I see there's usual toxic comments on videos via You Tube hating the episode well generally hating the show full stop. One of the big downsides of the internet age we live is people hanging onto stuff they don't like. Criticism is one thing, but after a while, people must realize it's not productive to be sticks in the mud. I think it has become a new form of hobby: hating things online. And these people seem to spur each other on, it is like a vicious cycle. It is not only TV shows, movies and games, it is also politics. And some Youtubers only exist because they keep feeding all the trolls they have created.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 24, 2020 17:40:34 GMT
One of the big downsides of the internet age we live is people hanging onto stuff they don't like. Criticism is one thing, but after a while, people must realize it's not productive to be sticks in the mud. I think it has become a new form of hobby: hating things online. And these people seem to spur each other on, it is like a vicious cycle. It is not only TV shows, movies and games, it is also politics. And some Youtubers only exist because they keep feeding all the trolls they have created. "This latest episode was almost as bad as the last series." "IKR, and the last series was nearly as bad as the McCoy years, which I hated." "I hated the McCoy years AND the Colin Baker years." "I hated everything JNT produced. He destroyed my childhood, and that of my friends." "Doctor Who has been rubbish ever since Philip Hinchcliffe left." "I think Doctor Who jumped the shark when it went into colour." "Big Finish isn't canon either. I prefer the comic strips, and they're rubbish." "Don't get me started on Big Finish."
And so it goes on. Before you know it, there's a whole crew of (the same) fans who turn their quick 10-word review of the latest episode into a hate-fest of Doctor Who in general.
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Post by tuigirl on Jan 24, 2020 17:43:43 GMT
I think it has become a new form of hobby: hating things online. And these people seem to spur each other on, it is like a vicious cycle. It is not only TV shows, movies and games, it is also politics. And some Youtubers only exist because they keep feeding all the trolls they have created. "This latest episode was almost as bad as the last series." "IKR, and the last series was nearly as bad as the McCoy years, which I hated." "I hated the McCoy years AND the Colin Baker years." "I hated everything JNT produced. He destroyed my childhood, and that of my friends." "Doctor Who has been rubbish ever since Philip Hinchcliffe left." "I think Doctor Who jumped the shark when it went into colour." "Big Finish isn't canon either. I prefer the comic strips, and they're rubbish." "Don't get me started on Big Finish."
And so it goes on. Before you know it, there's a whole crew of (the same) fans who turn their quick 10-word review of the latest episode into a hate-fest of Doctor Who in general.
There is a reason I stay away from toxic forums and youtube channels and avoid the comments in social media posts.
Because I actually have a life.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 24, 2020 17:48:54 GMT
I think it has become a new form of hobby: hating things online. And these people seem to spur each other on, it is like a vicious cycle. It is not only TV shows, movies and games, it is also politics. And some Youtubers only exist because they keep feeding all the trolls they have created. "This latest episode was almost as bad as the last series." "IKR, and the last series was nearly as bad as the McCoy years, which I hated." "I hated the McCoy years AND the Colin Baker years." "I hated everything JNT produced. He destroyed my childhood, and that of my friends." "Doctor Who has been rubbish ever since Philip Hinchcliffe left." "I think Doctor Who jumped the shark when it went into colour." "Big Finish isn't canon either. I prefer the comic strips, and they're rubbish." "Don't get me started on Big Finish."
And so it goes on. Before you know it, there's a whole crew of (the same) fans who turn their quick 10-word review of the latest episode into a hate-fest of Doctor Who in general.
I should have put a warning at the beginning of my post! I used to frequent 'that other forum' - the scars cut deep.
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shutupbanks
Castellan
There’s a horror movie called Alien? That’s really offensive. No wonder everyone keeps invading you.
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Post by shutupbanks on Jan 25, 2020 14:03:29 GMT
I did notice: 13 really had it in for Queen Skithra for this episode. It was a little Mean Girls-y: every scene they were in together, she was constantly mocking and deriding her. 13 is usually snippy with the villains, but this week she really went after Queen Skithra. To be fair, the queen’s agents had left a trail of bodies behind them in Edison’s lab and she was also quite happy to kidnap people for no reason other than she was to lazy to sort things out for herself. I don’t believe the Doctor has ever tolerated that sort of laziness in people who are happy to shoot first and - literally - ask questions later.
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Post by anothermanicmondas on Jan 25, 2020 20:37:35 GMT
I was bothered by the Doctor repeatedly referring to Silurians as alien while the word has a number of meanings the obvious one (from another planet) applies to the Doctor not to Silurians
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Post by nucleusofswarm on Jan 25, 2020 23:43:47 GMT
I was bothered by the Doctor repeatedly referring to Silurians as alien while the word has a number of meanings the obvious one (from another planet) applies to the Doctor not to Silurians When MrTARDISreviews did his recent review, he gave an explanation that I can live with: it was just short-hand for Tesla and the others to know the gun's not contemporary, as opposed to having 13 explain, on top of everything else in that scene, who the Silurians/Eocenes were.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 25, 2020 23:55:13 GMT
I was bothered by the Doctor repeatedly referring to Silurians as alien while the word has a number of meanings the obvious one (from another planet) applies to the Doctor not to Silurians When MrTARDISreviews did his recent review, he gave an explanation that I can live with: it was just short-hand for Tesla and the others to know the gun's not contemporary, as opposed to having 13 explain, on top of everything else in that scene, who the Silurians/Eocenes were. Yes, while I think it may have been a bit of a silly flub by a first time writer for the show at least it can be written off as "alien to this situation". Explaining the actual origin of the weapon and therefore the Silurians would have added extra clunky exposition in a scene with plenty of it already.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 2, 2020 3:24:17 GMT
Has anyone seen last years film The Current War? Set a few decades before this but Edison and Tesla are both in it (portrayed by Benedict Cumberbatch and Nicholas Hoult respectively) while George Westinhouse, Edison's big rival in the earlier years is played by the great Michael Shannon. Quite an interesting cast - I've not seen it myself but it's on YT streaming for a few quid so I think I'll check it out. That was one of the films I really wanted to see last year but just never seemed to remember it when I was looking for something to watch. I'll have to remedy that. It was solid enough but very dry. It never had that spark (pun not intentional) I'd want from a film about this fascinating era. Still performances were good (even if Cumberbatch is still doing that Hugh Laurie accent!) - it's more an Edison vs Westinghouse film than much about Tesla though who plays a smaller role so I couldn't say it'd be for people wanting more Tesla on screen. Still, a few beats from the Who ep were covered. The worst thing in the movie was giving Tom Holland, who seems like he isn't yet shaving IRL, bit mutton chop sideburns! HOWEVER, opening at Sundance this month...is...TESLA, starring Ethan Hawke as, well, Tesla and my man Kyle McLachlan as Thomas Edison. Jim Gaffigan will be Westinghouse in some very offbeat casting. It's directed by Michael Almereyda who has worked with Hawke a lot and usually makes pretty good indies. This should be more like it. Plus any Twin Peaks fan who can't see the obvious fun in Kyle playing a man who was a pioneer of eee-lec-tri-city....you need to rewatch Season 3!
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Post by nucleusofswarm on Feb 18, 2020 10:03:02 GMT
28 days figure is 5.8 million. A bit of a dissapointment - seems like Judoon didn't help all that much in giving a last spike, but it is keeping to S11's average catchup of around 1.7m.
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