Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 2, 2016 7:59:36 GMT
Too me it's about value for money; the DVD is extortionately expensive for two episodes and two poor quality recons. Fortunately I have an alternative - I bought theissing episode from BBC store for 1.89 so I can watch it online and I can burn my own DVD from the other versions I've got of the different episodes. it is a sad way for the range to end.
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Post by dalekbuster523finish on Jan 2, 2016 10:28:00 GMT
If you honestly think they shouldn't have released the DVD and we'd always be missing an episode then you're not a Doctor Who fan, you're just an entitled moaner. Plenty of people - including on the forum - were peeved at this release but to advocate just shelving the missing ep instead? Wow.. Does having a missing episode mean so little to you that you'd say they shouldn't have bothered releasing it? We've got more classic series Who on DVD this year than last. But please, tell us again why it would be better to have less. Oh, please. Don't start with the 'Not a true fan' nonsense. Not everybody is happy with any old rubbish. If we're going into 'a true fan' territory, a true Doctor Who fan would surely want to see the best quality release rather than something rushed out just because a lot of people demanded it when it wasn't ready for release. I think it's great when missing episodes are found but I do believe they should be presented properly and money should be spent on their release. But if you're happy with any old ***** then there's no point arguing with you.
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Post by dalekbuster523finish on Jan 2, 2016 10:31:08 GMT
Sorry but I don't think it is selfish to expect a quality product from the BBC. What's the point in releasing something half-arsed? It's not benefitting anybody but those with piles of money to spend on inferior products. If they weren't prepared to spend the money, then they may as well have not bothered. All it has done is damaged the brand; yes, only minor damage but still damage. Anybody buying this for their first classic series DVD is not going to be impressed. This is what I'd have done if I were the BBC: 1. Listened to the demand. 2. Hire an animation company to do it regardless of expense. 3. If animation is expensive, justify the cost by broadcasting it on BBC4. 4. Release the DVD in-time for Christmas (complete with The Magician's Apprentice/The Witch's Familiar as a special feature to make it appealing to casual viewers buying for their new series fan kids also) to get back some of the money it has cost to release a proper high standard DVD. One. This did no damage. Because no one is going, "I'll get Underwater Menace as my first classic series dvd." It's in black and white and not the unearthly child. Fans mat be annoyed, but fans aren't seeing any classic who releases anytime soon. Two. Your plan is terrible. At any point you say "regardless the expense," means you got no clue how anything works outside your own fan wants. Add that, your "release with the two starter episodes" idea has now moved this from being the Underwater Menace to "New Series release that features this other thing casual fans don't care about." So people who want underwater menace now pay a premium for animation, and even more for new series episodes, which they'll pay for again when they buy the series set. So, yeah...your plan is a great idea, market it to people who don't want it, and annot the people who do. You'd fit right in at the BBC. 1. How do you know that? Anyone new to the classic series may have been curious with it containing a missing episode. 2. I think releasing The Underwater Menace with what sounds like poorly put together reconstructions is a bigger way to annoy fans than adding two recent new series episodes to get New Who-only fans interested in a classic series release, especially if in this scenario it justified animation for The Underwater Menace.
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Post by dalekbuster523finish on Jan 2, 2016 10:32:40 GMT
Too me it's about value for money; the DVD is extortionately expensive for two episodes and two poor quality recons. Exactly. For £13.99, I'd expect top quality animation considering £13.99 is usually the cost for a 3D Bluray.
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Post by randomjc on Jan 2, 2016 14:23:42 GMT
One. This did no damage. Because no one is going, "I'll get Underwater Menace as my first classic series dvd." It's in black and white and not the unearthly child. Fans mat be annoyed, but fans aren't seeing any classic who releases anytime soon. Two. Your plan is terrible. At any point you say "regardless the expense," means you got no clue how anything works outside your own fan wants. Add that, your "release with the two starter episodes" idea has now moved this from being the Underwater Menace to "New Series release that features this other thing casual fans don't care about." So people who want underwater menace now pay a premium for animation, and even more for new series episodes, which they'll pay for again when they buy the series set. So, yeah...your plan is a great idea, market it to people who don't want it, and annot the people who do. You'd fit right in at the BBC. 1. How do you know that? Anyone new to the classic series may have been curious with it containing a missing episode. 2. I think releasing The Underwater Menace with what sounds like poorly put together reconstructions is a bigger way to annoy fans than adding two recent new series episodes to get New Who-only fans interested in a classic series release, especially if in this scenario it justified animation for The Underwater Menace. 1. I find most anyone interested in the Classic Series will A.) Purchase the Begining, The Unearthly Child, or B.) Purchase a Classic episode they heard about, from seeing on the many reairings that channels do, or C.) Any random COLOR episode. People are more likely to randomly purchase any COLOR episode over any B&W. 2. The problem here is, that doesn't justify the animation, the cost does. You're paying 10 extra for the animation. Right now, It's going for 25 on Amazon. (I am basing this on prices I see in America). Add another 10 dollars for animation costs, that's 35. Then add another 20 dollars for those two episodes. That's 55 dollars. I could by Trial of a Timelord for less than that. Even if we don't pay that extra for animation (And that's a big if, that the BBC thinks they recoup there costs with just releasing on BBC4 or whatever. That's 45 dollars. That is half the price that series 9 is listed at. So, back to what we have before. Either people who are enticed by the new series episodes don't care about the Underwater Menace (Which now becomes an extra, Akin the Galaxy 4 episode on The Aztecs, that the people who wanted New Series Episodes don't want) and they'll over pay for those episodes because of the animation. Or People who want Underwater Menace now have to pay a lot more money for something they are going to be buying again anyway. Since you're the one going on about "People with money to burn" you certainly love strategies that mean people like you, and me, have to pay more money for duplicate content.
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Post by kimalysong on Jan 2, 2016 14:42:05 GMT
I will be buying this eventually because I've collected all the other 2nd Doctor DVDs with extras. The extras are what I care about most.
And actually while this release could have been better at least they put more effort into it then they did with Enemy & Web. Now those releases are disappointing.
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Post by dalekbuster523finish on Jan 2, 2016 18:30:07 GMT
1. How do you know that? Anyone new to the classic series may have been curious with it containing a missing episode. 2. I think releasing The Underwater Menace with what sounds like poorly put together reconstructions is a bigger way to annoy fans than adding two recent new series episodes to get New Who-only fans interested in a classic series release, especially if in this scenario it justified animation for The Underwater Menace. 1. I find most anyone interested in the Classic Series will A.) Purchase the Begining, The Unearthly Child, or B.) Purchase a Classic episode they heard about, from seeing on the many reairings that channels do, or C.) Any random COLOR episode. People are more likely to randomly purchase any COLOR episode over any B&W. 2. The problem here is, that doesn't justify the animation, the cost does. You're paying 10 extra for the animation. Right now, It's going for 25 on Amazon. (I am basing this on prices I see in America). Add another 10 dollars for animation costs, that's 35. Then add another 20 dollars for those two episodes. That's 55 dollars. I could by Trial of a Timelord for less than that. Even if we don't pay that extra for animation (And that's a big if, that the BBC thinks they recoup there costs with just releasing on BBC4 or whatever. That's 45 dollars. That is half the price that series 9 is listed at. So, back to what we have before. Either people who are enticed by the new series episodes don't care about the Underwater Menace (Which now becomes an extra, Akin the Galaxy 4 episode on The Aztecs, that the people who wanted New Series Episodes don't want) and they'll over pay for those episodes because of the animation. Or People who want Underwater Menace now have to pay a lot more money for something they are going to be buying again anyway. Since you're the one going on about "People with money to burn" you certainly love strategies that mean people like you, and me, have to pay more money for duplicate content. We wouldn't necessarily have to pay more money though. The other animated releases when released were around the same price as The Underwater Menace (in fact, they may have been a few pounds cheaper). The BBC are over-charging for a sub-standard release; £12.99 should be the price for a DVD with the missing episodes animated, not two found episodes and two poor reconstruction 'efforts'.
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Post by dalekbuster523finish on Jan 2, 2016 18:31:29 GMT
I will be buying this eventually because I've collected all the other 2nd Doctor DVDs with extras. The extras are what I care about most. And actually while this release could have been better at least they put more effort into it then they did with Enemy & Web. Now those releases are disappointing. You mean The Web of Fear, which had a much better reconstruction than what the recons on the Underwater Menace disc sound like? I think a lot more effort was put into The Web of Fear.
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Post by randomjc on Jan 2, 2016 18:35:41 GMT
1. I find most anyone interested in the Classic Series will A.) Purchase the Begining, The Unearthly Child, or B.) Purchase a Classic episode they heard about, from seeing on the many reairings that channels do, or C.) Any random COLOR episode. People are more likely to randomly purchase any COLOR episode over any B&W. 2. The problem here is, that doesn't justify the animation, the cost does. You're paying 10 extra for the animation. Right now, It's going for 25 on Amazon. (I am basing this on prices I see in America). Add another 10 dollars for animation costs, that's 35. Then add another 20 dollars for those two episodes. That's 55 dollars. I could by Trial of a Timelord for less than that. Even if we don't pay that extra for animation (And that's a big if, that the BBC thinks they recoup there costs with just releasing on BBC4 or whatever. That's 45 dollars. That is half the price that series 9 is listed at. So, back to what we have before. Either people who are enticed by the new series episodes don't care about the Underwater Menace (Which now becomes an extra, Akin the Galaxy 4 episode on The Aztecs, that the people who wanted New Series Episodes don't want) and they'll over pay for those episodes because of the animation. Or People who want Underwater Menace now have to pay a lot more money for something they are going to be buying again anyway. Since you're the one going on about "People with money to burn" you certainly love strategies that mean people like you, and me, have to pay more money for duplicate content. We wouldn't necessarily have to pay more money though. The other animated releases when released were around the same price as The Underwater Menace (in fact, they may have been a few pounds cheaper). The BBC are over-charging for a sub-standard release; £12.99 should be the price for a DVD with the missing episodes animated, not two found episodes and two poor reconstruction 'efforts'. If you put two new series episodes in with the release, yes we would pay more money. And the reason no animation was done, was because both Reign of Terror and The Invasion preformed badly. So badly infact, The Invasion is one of handful of DVDS in the US that went out of print. The BBC LOST money with those releases, so we won't see any animated reconstructions with that price.
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Post by randomjc on Jan 2, 2016 18:37:35 GMT
I will be buying this eventually because I've collected all the other 2nd Doctor DVDs with extras. The extras are what I care about most. And actually while this release could have been better at least they put more effort into it then they did with Enemy & Web. Now those releases are disappointing. You mean The Web of Fear, which had a much better reconstruction than what the recons on the Underwater Menace disc sound like? I think a lot more effort was put into The Web of Fear. nope. Web of Fear is an overpriced release, no special features. And how about you judge the recons when you see them instead of other people's words?
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Post by dalekbuster523finish on Jan 2, 2016 19:30:24 GMT
We wouldn't necessarily have to pay more money though. The other animated releases when released were around the same price as The Underwater Menace (in fact, they may have been a few pounds cheaper). The BBC are over-charging for a sub-standard release; £12.99 should be the price for a DVD with the missing episodes animated, not two found episodes and two poor reconstruction 'efforts'. If you put two new series episodes in with the release, yes we would pay more money. And the reason no animation was done, was because both Reign of Terror and The Invasion preformed badly. So badly infact, The Invasion is one of handful of DVDS in the US that went out of print. The BBC LOST money with those releases, so we won't see any animated reconstructions with that price. Because they didn't promote them enough. Had The Invasion (for example) been promoted during the credits of a Doctor Who episode as a 'special animated reconstruction' they would have no doubt got more sales at least over here in the UK.
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Post by dalekbuster523finish on Jan 2, 2016 19:33:16 GMT
You mean The Web of Fear, which had a much better reconstruction than what the recons on the Underwater Menace disc sound like? I think a lot more effort was put into The Web of Fear. nope. Web of Fear is an overpriced release Not if you bought it on iTunes. At least they'd put some effort into the reconstruction. I may not have seen the Underwater Menace ones but there's enough evidence to suggest the reviews are right about them and personally I refuse to spend my money on a terrible product without the care and attention it deserved.
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Post by randomjc on Jan 2, 2016 21:58:31 GMT
If you put two new series episodes in with the release, yes we would pay more money. And the reason no animation was done, was because both Reign of Terror and The Invasion preformed badly. So badly infact, The Invasion is one of handful of DVDS in the US that went out of print. The BBC LOST money with those releases, so we won't see any animated reconstructions with that price. Because they didn't promote them enough. Had The Invasion (for example) been promoted during the credits of a Doctor Who episode as a 'special animated reconstruction' they would have no doubt got more sales at least over here in the UK. well, Im pretty sure it's still in print in the UK. But I'm tired of this. I sleep now.
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bobod
Chancellery Guard
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Post by bobod on Jan 6, 2016 11:18:08 GMT
It's around £14 on Amazon now but out of sheer principle i won't be purchasing this, it's simply been rush released because of fan demand Remind me not to ask you to do something in a 'rush' - four years this release took!
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Post by Timelord007 on Jan 6, 2016 16:20:08 GMT
It's around £14 on Amazon now but out of sheer principle i won't be purchasing this, it's simply been rush released because of fan demand Remind me not to ask you to do something in a 'rush' - four years this release took! 4 years & thats the best they could do.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 6, 2016 16:48:00 GMT
We still got a commentary with Michael Troughton, Anneke Wills, Frazer Hines, Catherine Howe, Brian Hogson and Quentin Mann. Oh, and that commentary also features PATRICK TROUGHTON speaking in archive audio along with Innes Lloyd and Julia Smith. That's pretty awesome. We got a documentary on the story - featuring newly shot Fish People scenes. It features all of the above PLUS Rob Shearman and is narrated by Peter Davison. That's pretty awesome. We got part two of the tour of BBC TV centre with the Davison S20 Tardis Crew taking us round the historic place, a real treasure now it's gone. That's pretty awesome. Oh, and - and I really can't believe people seem to think this is a small-matter - we got a remastered LOST episode of Doctor Who that has never been released anywhere in any format officially. That's SERIOUSLY awesome. Yeah, I prefer animation to recons and make no mistake - the recons on this release are quite bad. They need a lot more text and should really have used linking narrations like the lost soundtracks but hey...the Loose Cannon recon took me 0.66 seconds to find in Google. I'd watch that or listen to the soundtrack before watching the DVD version but guess what? I'd do the same for the cutdown recons of Marco Polo and Galaxy 4 that we've had too. Not enough people are judging this release on what it is but what it isn't. Surely as Doctor Who fans to get the actual missing episode is the key feature here? Number one with a bullet. The thousands of people who signed the petition to get the DVD released seemed to think so. I certainly do. The rest is gravy - and it tastes a lot better than some people would have you believe.
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Post by dalekbuster523finish on Jan 6, 2016 17:03:15 GMT
Remind me not to ask you to do something in a 'rush' - four years this release took! 4 years & thats the best they could do. Well exactly. It was only released because of fan pressure - the very thing that caused it to be rushed.
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Post by dalekbuster523finish on Jan 6, 2016 17:04:07 GMT
We still got a commentary with Michael Troughton, Anneke Wills, Frazer Hines, Catherine Howe, Brian Hogson and Quentin Mann. Oh, and that commentary also features PATRICK TROUGHTON speaking in archive audio along with Innes Lloyd and Julia Smith. That's pretty awesome. We got a documentary on the story - featuring newly shot Fish People scenes. It features all of the above PLUS Rob Shearman and is narrated by Peter Davison. That's pretty awesome. We got part two of the tour of BBC TV centre with the Davison S20 Tardis Crew taking us round the historic place, a real treasure now it's gone. That's pretty awesome. Oh, and - and I really can't believe people seem to think this is a small-matter - we got a remastered LOST episode of Doctor Who that has never been released anywhere in any format officially. That's SERIOUSLY awesome. All of which was done when it was planned to be of the high standard we expect from classic series releases.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Jan 6, 2016 17:36:08 GMT
Well, I've got mine and I'm happy. If a newly discovered lost episode, two new documentaries and a commentary that even features Pat Troughton is meaningless or worthless to others, that's their perogative. In the meantime I have, for the first time, a truly complete collection of my favourite show on the shelf to dig into for years to come I think I'll email Philip Morris and say "Don't bother looking for more eps, if it doesn't come with the right special features, no-one cares".
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Post by dalekbuster523finish on Jan 6, 2016 19:01:51 GMT
I think Phil Morris should use anything he finds as a bargaining device in future - either the BBC agree to release it on DVD to the proper standard (special features, animation if episode/s are missing) or they don't get the episodes.
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