|
Post by Tim Bradley on Jan 5, 2016 10:43:07 GMT
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Likes:
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 6, 2016 22:02:12 GMT
Hello everyone! Here's Professor Bernice Summerfield's (Benny to her friends) timeline' attached to this thread. View AttachmentPlease feel free to comment and discuss. Thanks. Tim. Just been looking at this and it's masterful as ever. The placement of Just War and Birthright twice each in the timeline is accurate of course, but it really jars and I wondered how people rationalise it in their own head-canon?
|
|
|
Post by Tim Bradley on Jan 7, 2016 7:23:46 GMT
Hello everyone! Here's Professor Bernice Summerfield's (Benny to her friends) timeline' attached to this thread. Please feel free to comment and discuss. Thanks. Tim. Just been looking at this and it's masterful as ever. The placement of Just War and Birthright twice each in the timeline is accurate of course, but it really jars and I wondered how people rationalise it in their own head-canon? This is something that's hard to avoid. I'm afraid I can't answer this, as I've not read the books or heard the audios of these two stories. But then there were two 'Shadas' and that was sort-of explained by the inclusion of 'The Five Doctors', so who knows. Maybe Benny was scooped by the Time Scoop and had to re-experience those two adventures again in order to see that they are completed and done. Tim.
|
|
|
Post by constonks on Jan 8, 2016 0:43:20 GMT
Birthright came only two books before a bunch of stories that dealt with alternate timelines and temporal shenanigans, but Just War is a little harder to rationalise based solely on the facts given. I'm afraid those two fall into my "Know a bit about it but have yet to read it" category though. Both are on my shelf, though, so I should have an opinion eventually.
Until then I offer this explanation:
Time travel???
|
|
|
Post by Tim Bradley on Mar 30, 2016 14:47:48 GMT
Hello everyone! I've now updated Benny's timeline thread by having it as a page view instead of a PDF view for users to see. Enjoy! Tim.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Likes:
|
Post by Deleted on Mar 31, 2016 20:41:47 GMT
Hello everyone! Here's Professor Bernice Summerfield's (Benny to her friends) timeline' attached to this thread. Please feel free to comment and discuss. Thanks. Tim. Just been looking at this and it's masterful as ever. The placement of Just War and Birthright twice each in the timeline is accurate of course, but it really jars and I wondered how people rationalise it in their own head-canon? *taps nose* The audios actually offer their own explanation in an ongoing arc that runs all the way through until Year Zero. Apparently, Brax has been tweaking Benny's timeline while she's not been looking. I shan't say why because it's a major spoiler for Resurrecting the Past and Escaping the Future.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Likes:
|
Post by Deleted on Jul 3, 2016 7:20:42 GMT
According to discussion on another forum, Big Bang Generation goes between New adventures 1 and 2. i haven't heard it myself yet, but there's a direct reference to Benny last seeing the Doctor on Skaro, and she is in the middle of preparations for a wedding, which is referred to in the second boxset as having happened recently. Personally I'd be tempted to put Worlds of Big finish in the same gap, just because it was released between those two sets.
|
|
|
Post by mrfuggleboppins on Jul 3, 2016 9:32:44 GMT
According to discussion on another forum, Big Bang Generation goes between New adventures 1 and 2. i haven't heard it myself yet, but there's a direct reference to Benny last seeing the Doctor on Skaro, and she is in the middle of preparations for a wedding, which is referred to in the second boxset as having happened recently. Personally I'd be tempted to put Worlds of Big finish in the same gap, just because it was released between those two sets. Yeah I've read the book and was going to mention the exact same thing.
|
|
|
Post by Tim Bradley on Jul 4, 2016 11:26:13 GMT
According to discussion on another forum, Big Bang Generation goes between New adventures 1 and 2. i haven't heard it myself yet, but there's a direct reference to Benny last seeing the Doctor on Skaro, and she is in the middle of preparations for a wedding, which is referred to in the second boxset as having happened recently. Personally I'd be tempted to put Worlds of Big finish in the same gap, just because it was released between those two sets. Yeah I've read the book and was going to mention the exact same thing. Thanks guys. I've amended Benny's timeline by putting 'Big Bang Generation' and the two 'Worlds of Big Finish' stories in between the first two New Adventures box sets.
Thus I've shortened the sections to 23 instead of 26.
Hope this helps.
Tim.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Likes:
|
Post by Deleted on Aug 31, 2016 10:41:51 GMT
I'm working my way through the Benny stuff and some of the sequencing seems to be out in season 6. So far I've got The Goddess Quandary, which mentions something about Miss Jones at the end which definitely places it before Parallel Lives, and Parallel lives finishes with a reference to Wolsey the cat which places it before Something Changed. Goddess Quandary also appears to have a framing commentary which comes after all the above
|
|
|
Post by omega on Aug 31, 2016 11:16:18 GMT
Anyone pick up on any clues as to when The Unbound Universe takes place for Benny? All I've got is that she's teaching when the Doctor abducts her and she says she has family and responsibilities, which is a pretty wide area. No names are mentioned, so it's probably some time after Missing Persons and Big Bang Generation.
|
|
|
Post by Ela on Aug 31, 2016 23:12:34 GMT
If it's the Unbound Universe, does it really fit into a real universe time line?
But I'm guessing it would fit in after the most recent box sets.
|
|
|
Post by Digi on Sept 1, 2016 2:02:39 GMT
Well this is Benny's personal timeline, right? So being in an alternate universe doesn't really matter--it's still what happens 'next' from her POV.
I feel like her personal timeline (at least as far as her POV goes) is fairly straightforward. The only place (for me) that you need to do any heavy lifting is her early stories with Seven. Otherwise, pretty simple IMO:
With Seven 1. Love and War 2. The Highest Science 3. Theatre of War 4. All-Consuming Fire 5. Shadow of the Scourge 6. Dark Flame 7. Criminal Code 8. Original Sin
Solo Adventures: - The single-disc BF range in release order + Benny's Story sometime in Series 10
Solo Boxes: 1: Epoch 2: Road Trip 3. Legion - Many Happy Returns 4. New Frontiers 5. Missing Persons
New Adventures: 1. Volume 1 - Worlds of Big Finish appearances 2. Volume 2 3. Volume 3
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Likes:
|
Post by Deleted on Sept 1, 2016 2:47:31 GMT
That looks about right. The only real struggle from an audio standpoint is that her first season of adventures are acknowledged as separate instances to their original source material, so Benny experienced Just War with the Seventh Doctor, but she also experienced Just War with Jason. The exact cause of the divergence is brought up towards the end of her original run before Big Finish transferred over to the boxsets, but it's all very spoileriffic. Suffice to say that after what happened in Escaping the Future, I'd say that anything goes for Benny in terms of alternate universes. It could very well be our Benny Summerfield turning up the latest boxset, I'd be kind of surprised if it wasn't.
|
|
|
Post by Ela on Sept 1, 2016 6:31:47 GMT
Well this is Benny's personal timeline, right? So being in an alternate universe doesn't really matter--it's still what happens 'next' from her POV. Well yes it's her personal timeline. But I thought the Unbound universe is not considered to be canon.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Likes:
|
Post by Deleted on Sept 1, 2016 8:16:24 GMT
Well this is Benny's personal timeline, right? So being in an alternate universe doesn't really matter--it's still what happens 'next' from her POV. Well yes it's her personal timeline. But I thought the Unbound universe is not considered to be canon. Sort of... Things don't seem to overlap for the most part, but old Sixy briefly refers to crossing over and meeting up with what sounds like the Warner!Doctor and Sympathy!Brigadier in The 100 Days of the Doctor. Considering that the Doctor Who universe is such a place where all things are possible -- including a Peanuts-style universe where the Doctor confesses to the Rani about how feels like a failure (as seen in The Glorious Dead) -- I'd say that they exist as one of the many, many alternatives that have cropped up throughout time and space. I'll try to expand on the idea in a way that makes sense... Space-time is kind of like an iceberg, there's all this extra buzz and energy submerged beneath the sea which we don't get to witness unless there's been some great catastrophe or accident (see Inferno or Blood Heat). If you believe in quantum, everything you see in the Unbound universe exists as an alternative to two states we never knew existed (e.g. the Third Doctor is both Pertwee and Warner) collapsing into one absolute (Third is Pertwee) or another (Third is Warner). These alternate Doctors missed out on being part of canon as we understand them due to a quirk of fate, but nevertheless still exist as closer to home alternate iterations in other universes. While our Third Doctor played by Jon Pertwee is spending his time convalescing in an English hospital bed sometime in the 1970s or 1980s, another version of this third incarnation played by David Warner arrives in a 1990s Hong Kong pub being run by an old acquaintance from his last run in with the Cybermen. The titular Axis in The Axis of Insanity seems to operate on this principle as the way the Fifth Doctor tries to explain it, the whole hyperstructure exists as a means of making sure that apocryphal tales didn't contaminate the main timeline. So I guess following that logic, they exist outside of canon as fans like us understand it, but the stories we see as non-canon still nevertheless exist to Doctors living, breathing and thriving in official stories as murky, unseen shadows lurking just beneath the water. Occasionally we see an overlap like in The New Adventures of Bernice Summerfield, but for the most part, each continuum largely keeps to itself.
|
|
|
Post by Digi on Sept 1, 2016 11:52:16 GMT
Well this is Benny's personal timeline, right? So being in an alternate universe doesn't really matter--it's still what happens 'next' from her POV. Well yes it's her personal timeline. But I thought the Unbound universe is not considered to be canon. Oh, I see. So what's happened here is that I completely misunderstood the thrust of your question Well then! This gets much simpler! Yes, you're right; if you're looking at the 'real' universe from an objective time view of A to B to C to D, Volume 3 'doesn't happen,' so to speak, as nearly the entire set takes place in the Unbound universe. It's only experienced from the POV of our 'real' version of Benny. For anyone who hasn't heard Volume 3: the first couple minutes of the first episode establish that David Warner's Doctor is indeed part of the canon...but he's an alternative version, hailing from an alternative universe. So happily continue to ignore Unbound if you like, as it has no bearing on the primary universe. Or continue to enjoy it, as it's now established as 'real' and not just throwaway stories!
|
|
|
Post by Ela on Sept 1, 2016 16:53:46 GMT
Well yes it's her personal timeline. But I thought the Unbound universe is not considered to be canon. Oh, I see. So what's happened here is that I completely misunderstood the thrust of your question Well then! This gets much simpler! Yes, you're right; if you're looking at the 'real' universe from an objective time view of A to B to C to D, Volume 3 'doesn't happen,' so to speak, as nearly the entire set takes place in the Unbound universe. It's only experienced from the POV of our 'real' version of Benny. For anyone who hasn't heard Volume 3: the first couple minutes of the first episode establish that David Warner's Doctor is indeed part of the canon...but he's an alternative version, hailing from an alternative universe. So happily continue to ignore Unbound if you like, as it has no bearing on the primary universe. Or continue to enjoy it, as it's now established as 'real' and not just throwaway stories! Really, you think those first minutes establish that David Warner's Doctor is part of the canon? Because {Spoiler}he crosses over into Benny's universe to grab her from a lecture and pull her into his universe?
|
|
|
Post by Digi on Sept 1, 2016 18:57:52 GMT
I absolutely do. I don't believe for a second that BF would create an alternate universe David Warner Doctor--which they have already done in more than one past release--simply to turn around and say 'we know it's the same actor and he's also the Doctor and we're also calling this release 'The UNBOUND Universe,' but they're not the same Doctor.' For whatever my 2¢ are worth, I think that would be absurd beyond belief. Besides, isn't there also a part in this set where the Doctor's memories are 'swirling' and we hear bits and pieces from previous Warner/Doctor releases? (I smell a re-listen already )
|
|
|
Post by Ela on Sept 1, 2016 20:54:05 GMT
I absolutely do. I don't believe for a second that BF would create an alternate universe David Warner Doctor--which they have already done in more than one past release--simply to turn around and say 'we know it's the same actor and he's also the Doctor and we're also calling this release 'The UNBOUND Universe,' but they're not the same Doctor.' For whatever my 2¢ are worth, I think that would be absurd beyond belief. Besides, isn't there also a part in this set where the Doctor's memories are 'swirling' and we hear bits and pieces from previous Warner/Doctor releases? (I smell a re-listen already ) See your thinking is backwards from mine. I would think they're all the same Doctor and that none of them are in the canonical universe.
|
|