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Post by Deleted on Jan 27, 2016 5:32:44 GMT
Hey everyone,
It's 1987. Colin Baker sadly is no longer Doctor Who. You are in charge of heralding Doctor Who for the one last chance saloon. What would you do differently? How would you handle Time and The Rani? (While I think JNT got it right, Sylvester's casting is open for debate)
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Post by seeley on Jan 27, 2016 5:34:43 GMT
For extra "fun," keep in mind that Eric Saward's stormy departure has alienated a number of writers...
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Post by Deleted on Jan 27, 2016 5:38:08 GMT
For extra "fun," keep in mind that Eric Saward's stormy departure has alienated a number of writers... I didn't actually know that, thanks.
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Post by Sir Wearer of Hats on Jan 27, 2016 5:55:21 GMT
Is only make a few cosmetic changes: Telling Richard Briers to calm the hell down or get the hell off set. Get rid of the whatshisname becoming an alien bit in Delta and the Bananamen, and ditch the comedy Americans. Maybe have the Master rather than the Rani. Dim the lighting in Dragonfire on the Dragon. Ask "is that really a cliffhanger"? About episode one of Dragonfire. Maybe make it the Doctor hiding from the Dragon, and then starting to slip. Maybe have Mel stay to look after the little girl the Dragon saves.
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Post by omega on Jan 27, 2016 6:17:23 GMT
Ask "is that really a cliffhanger"? About episode one of Dragonfire. Maybe make it the Doctor hiding from the Dragon, and then starting to slip. It's supposed to be that the Doctor is trying to reach a ledge, but couldn't quite get there (why he was hanging by the umbrella). This obviously wasn't very well realised on screen. It becomes a bit clearer later in episode two, when Ace and Mel use Ace's rope ladder to descend.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 27, 2016 6:29:59 GMT
I think they were probably in a bind, being told to go light and comic by the BBC when actually I would have wanted it to become more grown up
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Post by Sir Wearer of Hats on Jan 27, 2016 7:46:01 GMT
Ask "is that really a cliffhanger"? About episode one of Dragonfire. Maybe make it the Doctor hiding from the Dragon, and then starting to slip. It's supposed to be that the Doctor is trying to reach a ledge, but couldn't quite get there (why he was hanging by the umbrella). This obviously wasn't very well realised on screen. It becomes a bit clearer later in episode two, when Ace and Mel use Ace's rope ladder to descend. Well, exactly, it's poorly executed. add an element of incipient danger (and, you know, have the dragon in EP 1) and you explain it, the pay off (Glitz just ambling up and pulling him down) still works.
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Post by Timelord007 on Jan 27, 2016 8:26:45 GMT
Prayed to Jesus for a miracle, obviously John Nathan Turner didn't.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 27, 2016 9:06:00 GMT
Get rid of Delta and the Bannerman. Wipe the scripts off the face of the Earth. Everything else can stay, no matter how bad they were.
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dorney
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Post by dorney on Jan 27, 2016 9:28:24 GMT
It's supposed to be that the Doctor is trying to reach a ledge, but couldn't quite get there (why he was hanging by the umbrella). This obviously wasn't very well realised on screen. It becomes a bit clearer later in episode two, when Ace and Mel use Ace's rope ladder to descend. Well, exactly, it's poorly executed. add an element of incipient danger (and, you know, have the dragon in EP 1) and you explain it, the pay off (Glitz just ambling up and pulling him down) still works. the dragon is in episode one isn't it? At the same time as McCoy dangling it's menacing Mel and Ace, isn't it? Double cliffhanger unless I'm misremembering.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 27, 2016 9:33:22 GMT
Let's see... It's 1987, the budget is tiny and the roster of writers has been sizeably diminished. However, the era is now a clean slate with only a newly furnished companion introduced into the role nary five episodes ago. Hmm...
I think I'd keep Sylvester in the role and play to his desire to emulate William Hartnell by giving a greyer, albeit more compassionate side to his incarnation of the Doctor. I'd have liked to keep on with the umbrella season format that Trial of a Time Lord attempted with the framing story removed. That way, the ongoing arc will be a reward for fans, but not a necessity for casual viewers. The tone of the series would also have placed a greater emphasis on adult themes and concepts in an effort to drag the series from its present position as a show that supposedly talks down to its audience. The "question mark" motif would also have been junked in favour of a costume that the Seventh Doctor would have slowly over the course of the story constructed out of muted clothing to form his current attire. His panama hat would have been sitting somewhat inexplicably on the time rotor in the console room at the end of 'Part Four', a gift from the TARDIS and a subtle symbol to the audience that this new incarnation is fully formed and raring for adventure.
Time and Change
Starting from the first production slot, I'd have probably junked Time and the Rani from the get-go though and gone with a previously rejected script. The Space Whale would seem appropriate given that it was a dispute between Saward and Mills that prevented it from being produced. Pat Mills's comics seem to have a very high reputation in fandom and the problems appear to be largely cosmetic, so the script is touched up by Andrew Cartmel to incorporate a Seventh Doctor that while not amnesiac was still in the cooldown period of his regeneration and therefore prone to certain physiological eccentricities. For instance, he is able through intense concentration to "tear" a static charge through the air using his fingertips and loose bodily cohesion when distracted, allowing him to phase through walls. He will loose these abilities as his body returns to normal, but it's an interesting twist on the post-regenerative trauma and something perhaps a bit more palatable following The Twin Dilemma. Melanie Bush would have also been given the opportunity to shine by reprogramming the Orkas's organ treatment systems to cannibalise itself while the Doctor was fed into the processing unit. I'd have tried to pounce on Graeme Harper before he transferred to Star Cops, so he would direct both this opening story and the following tale.
Four episodes of Song of a Space Whale.
Build High for Happiness
There's nothing too wrong with Paradise Towers as is except perhaps that it didn't have enough story to work with. I'm tempted to say truncate it down to a two parter with the darker atmosphere and you're pretty much set, but actually I'd probably ask P.J. Hammond to collaborate by introducing his Paradise Five script into the mix. Have Mel working at Paradise Towers when it's full of people, while the Doctor has been thrown into an Escape from New York style nightmare like we'd have seen in the original story; separated from her by a temporal storm that has split the TARDIS in twain. The damage is so severe that the emergency systems we saw in Terminus kick in and the timeship becomes amalgamated into the architecture and it's up to him to find where the two points merge and how Paradise Towers became so ruinous. I've always loved the idea of the Doctor walking into Paradise Towers and completely taking over the gang culture as some kind of benevolent crime lord, so that happens here. Unlike the season's opener, this story ends on a bittersweet note -- in order for Kroagnon to be destroyed everyone from Mel's time must die, but with his defeat in the ruined aftermath there is hope that some form of cohesive society can emerge from the ashes. The Doctor and Mel decide to stay for a while, both mournful and hopeful of a better tomorrow.
Four episodes of Paradise Towers.
Fight or Flight
I'd have enjoyed seeing Claws of the Klathi from the comic strip adapted for the screen, so that goes here with the addition of Mel. The TARDIS materialises in the smoggy streets of Victorian London, near the home of gentleman scientist Nathaniel Derridge. Someone has been breaking into scientists' homes and stealing invaluable equipment, and when the Doctor learns that scorched bodies have been found near the docks, he decides to investigate with Derridge's help. They find an alien spaceship lying in the riverbed; it and its robot guardian are hidden from view by the smog. When they return to Derridge's home, they are greeted by a policeman with a strange story; Caval, the reptile boy from a nearby freak show, was caught stealing from a street vendor, and when he was knocked unconscious in the ensuing struggle his body began to glow. The Doctor realises that Caval is an alien in a healing coma, and when Caval recovers, he explains that his friends the Klathi have had him stealing equipment so they can repair their ship and escape from the Earth. But when Caval describes the ship's crystalline power source, the Doctor realises that it will kill thousands of people when the Klathi re-energise it. He, Caval and Derridge rush to the Great Exhibition, where the ruthless Klathi intend to use Osler's crystal fountain to energise the power unit; the Doctor stops them and saves the visitors to the Exhibition, but the Klathi escape, still intending to take off even though the launch of the ship will destroy London. The Doctor, Caval and Derridge pursue them back to the ship, where Caval finally acknowledges the Klathi's evil, and orders his robot Batella to stop them. Batella, confused by the conflicting instructions he has been given, stumbles into the ship and explodes, killing the Klathi. Caval returns to the freak show, which is now the only home he knows. The story is directed by Andrew Morgan.
Two episodes of Claws of the Klathi.
Absolute Zero
At this stage in the game, I think Svartos deserves a better aesthetic than the Krypton cave look it ultimately got, so we get Fiona Cumming in to direct with a lighting set-up closer to Enlightenment. Given the extra episode, I would have put Glitz up against another party seeking the dragon's treasure -- the space pirate Razorback whom he replaced from the original scripts. That way we get a bit of tension to this Indiana Jones-style tale with the Doctor and Glitz threatened at knife point in the frozen hinterlands outside of Iceworld by the brigand. They continue on with their quest braving a series of natural and unnatural hazards (including a minefield, a murderous sentry robot, deadly flora, ancient booby traps, an avalanche, a cracked lake) while Mel and the Doctor's new companion Ace get to know each other better. Iceworld itself is less like an overlit shopping centre and more akin to a smuggler's cove where hustlers, entrepreneurs and wanderers gather to procure items that are otherwise unattainable on the open market. Unlike the original story, the Dragon is not destroyed but instead hijacks the TARDIS while the Doctor, Mel and Ace are still inside leading to an open-ended season ending cliffhanger as the machine (still fixed to the console) shuts down, scrambling the navigation systems to the point where it becomes impossible to tell where they've landed. The credits cut in just as the Doctor opens the TARDIS scanner window to whatever lies outside.
Four episodes of Dragonfire.
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Post by constonks on Jan 27, 2016 12:48:30 GMT
Time and the Rani is really the only one of that season that I don't like. The others all have problems but the Rani episode is the only one I would call capital-B Bad.
I like the idea of replacing it with the Space Whale, but the Nightmare Game might have been a gripping story if done in Late Eighties Who style and with Michael Gough and a recently regenerated Sylvester McCoy.
Perhaps the actual regeneration could be tweaked too, with the Doctor being off-screen for the first couple minutes and when Mel finds him, he has been killed and regenerated off-camera. The novelisation could handle the Colin parts.
(I'd like to say I'd stick up for Colin and make sure he got the final season he wanted, allowing a regeneration alongside Ace in Episode 3 of Dragonfire, but I'm sure if that had been an option for JNT, he would have fought for it.)
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Post by Deleted on Jan 27, 2016 16:12:34 GMT
Problem is, Time And The Rani was 100%. By the time Cartmel came in it was the only thing on the table even thugh he hated it so you'd still need to use it...with that in mine, I'd drop the regeneration and just start with the new Doctor. Be bold - the public knew Colin was sacked, they don't need a man in a wig.
Of the people that auditioned, yeah, Sylv was probably the right choice though I would have been bold and gone for Ken Campbell.
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Post by ulyssessarcher on Jan 27, 2016 21:04:06 GMT
It's easy to look back and say what should have been,
I think a forced regeneration story was needed and should have rewritten the Nightmare Fair, with the Toymaker forcing the doctor to regenerate, and the doctor finding out what happened to him as the story goes along.
Then a small rewrite for Time and the rani to start the story, and I think it would have worked.
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Post by Timelord007 on Jan 28, 2016 8:43:10 GMT
It's easy to look back and say what should have been, I think a forced regeneration story was needed and should have rewritten the Nightmare Fair, with the Toymaker forcing the doctor to regenerate, and the doctor finding out what happened to him as the story goes along. Then a small rewrite for Time and the rani to start the story, and I think it would have worked. Love that idea & yes i think that would've worked extremely well.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 29, 2016 14:32:48 GMT
I was sorry to see Colin Baker go, but it was good to see Doctor Who at last breaking free of the continuity-enslaved formula of the last few years. Bringing in Sylvester and a script-editor who actually wrote to the strengths of his new leading man made a world of difference to the show. In Series 24, the 'Cartmel era' hadn't reached its peak, but the signs were there - and the fact that things were heading in a new direction at all made the show seem fresher in its final years. I firmly believe that had Doctor Who been scheduled better (Ie: not opposite the most popular show on television - Coronation Street was attracting 18 million viewers at that time) and promoted AT ALL by the BBC, it would have been popular enough with the general public to remain as a fixture past 1989.
Anyway - series 24 kicks off with Time and The Rani, which looks good, has a stunning cast, an interesting new Doctor and a story that is virtually incomprehensible.
Paradise Towers is a dark story with the production values, and directorial decisions, of a juevenile's show. Probably this is because the production team were still under the shadow of Micael Grade's comments that not enough youngsters were being attracted to the programme.
Delta and the Bannermen is a story that actually deals with the weighty concepts of inter-species relationships and breeding. Again this is brought to screen with bright colours, a fast pace and some eccentric performances. No problem with that - it's great fun.
Dragonfire. As is often the case in classic Doctor Who, this suffers from lack of budget. Stylistically, it is a traditional story, but done with Andrew Cartmel's flair for the fantastical and eccentric.
I liked series 24 at the time, and like it now.Given the percieved constraints put on the show at the time, I'm not sure how things could have been better handled.
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Post by doctorkernow on Mar 17, 2016 15:47:31 GMT
Hello again... Season 24? Well now. Firstly, I was so pleased that the interminable Trial was over. I felt really sorry for Colin Baker and surprised that Dr. Who actually got a season 24. Secondly, my version of 24 was in black & white. Having now seen most of it in colour, I can see what all fuss was about! That poor green baby in Delta, there's probably a pale-green twenty-something out there somewhere.
I'm going to wrestle with the stories as broadcast. I agree that a regeneration without Colin made no sense. So start with Sylvester in the TARDIS in costume with dark brown jacket minus question mark jumper. He wants to investigate the reason the Rani was stealing brain fluid from Earth...
So our first story is Sleep No More. (Just kidding!) Nightmare of the Rani... Sorry must finish fencing before nightfall more later, if you can bear it!
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Post by dalekbuster523finish on Mar 18, 2016 12:24:08 GMT
Skip the regeneration and just start with Sylvester McCoy as already being the Doctor. Have Mel scream less and give her more dialogue that shows her intelligence in programming computers Bonnie Langford to be kept on beyond Dragonfire for more continuity (having her leave after only four stories with the 7th Doctor was a little daft. At least give her one or two more.) Have the Rani trick the 7th Doctor with a perception filter instead of dressing as Mel with a season of her travelling with a Doctor unaware that she is actually the Rani and the real Mel is trapped somewhere on Lakertya (The Rani still takes on Mel's appearance, only through a perception filter, we still see the real Mel in Time And The Rani but we don't know which is Mel and which is the Rani - revealed in Dragonfire that the Doctor mistakenly set off from Lakertya with the wrong one and returns with Ace to pick up the right Mel).
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Post by iank on Apr 6, 2016 0:48:59 GMT
I think they did the best they could given the ridiculous conditions (JNT being dragged back to a show he thought he'd left at literally the 11th hour, with no scripts, script editor or lead actor). As others have noted, the only one I really don't like is Time and the Rani, and that was a result of that desperation - JNT, in lieu of a script editor, turning to writers he at least knew were reliable and could hand in a workable script in the time necessary.
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