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Post by thelonecenturion on Jul 29, 2021 7:56:15 GMT
To be honest, I'm in the camp that likes Clara as a companion, and her and Twelve's arc is resolved so neatly on-screen that she's one of the few people I wouldn't mind not coming to BF. In fact, Twelve's era in general was, in my opinion, so brilliant on-screen that I'd treat any BF with him as a bonus, rather than something I actively want to happen like, for example, the Eleventh Doctor, Amy and Rory Adventures.
My point is I wouldn't be disappointed if these twoenever did BF, but I'd be really excited if they did.
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Post by tuigirl on Jul 29, 2021 8:02:37 GMT
I disagree, the subtext is there in the text and there is an enormous audience of people like me who adore the romance and have whole blogs, fanart, fanfics, and YouTube edits paying tribute to 12 and Clara’s love. Also Stephen Moffat, Jenna Coleman and Peter Capaldi are all in support of it being romantic. It would be an enormous waste of potential to water down or ignore that subtext which is so essential to their relationship and such a catalyst for storytelling potential. There are other perfectly good entirely platonic Doctor/companion relationships, let 12 and Clara have their romance I say! I would honestly rather them not even have any 12 and Clara BF stories than have it be ruined by taking the romance out! At the risk of being pedantic and pouring cold water on this, people (I mean all of us) need to realise they tend to gravitate towards 'bubbles' of opinion, and cluster around people with similar views who then reinforce each other. Try sitting with a bunch of football fans on a bus before or after a match and you soon start to believe there's only one view of reality. It's a very human condition, one we all get prone to in a sort of group-think. Bubbles tend to reinforce prior assumptions — look at the people on social media who tend to follow each other and get very surprised by election results as 'nobody I know was going to vote for XXXXX, how can they win?' People are very bad at understanding big numbers. Being in amongst 100 people all roughly agreeing on something, doesn't mean the rest of the world agrees! As to your post, enormous audience is very likely to be an exaggeration (I would go so far as to say impossible — what's your definition of enormous?). Doctor Who itself doesn't have an enormous audience, so why would the splinter who are devoted to this theory be enormous? It all reminds me of the '70s and '80s when fans decided there was a romantic / sexual relationship between Kirk and Spock. It became 'true' for them. TV shows leave lots open to the audience to interpret. Stories get told and retold over the years and continually change (I'm thinking King Arthur here). Everyone is entitled to their views on the show, but I'd like to suggest this particular topic has had more than enough air time and it might be time to move on. Whether or not Capaldi does or doesn't do Doctor Who for Big Finish, with or without Coleman (and I think Matt Lucas is far more likely to come to audio), and then whether or not they do or don't do certain stories shouldn't be a vindication of anybody's existence. It's all nice to have! There's a lot of ideas all fans would 'like' to happen, but at the end of the day most of us don't write the stories! Why not decompose your central idea into it's essence and tell a new story your way and not confined to the Doctor Who Universe? For all the 'fanfic becomes real' examples people can give, there are 1,000s that haven't. Of course I'm writing this from the perspective of believing others on the forum apart from me have become bored with the continual recycling of this topic. I may be badly out of step, in which case my bad, and I'll go back in my box! Hmmm... even if Timegirl is going to kill me, I tend to agree what you are writing here. As Timegirl and I have discussed before, I am in the camp that is not in favor of romantic relationships of Doctor/ companion. But that is my personal taste and I am happy for other people to have other ideas. This is what keeps fandom alive and sparks great discussions.
I also know that there is quite a few people in my camp of opinion. However, of course I have no idea how big the followers are for each idea, and maybe there is a much bigger camp of "I do not care either way".
Who knows.
But in my honest opinion, when Capaldi (I am pretty sure he will come on board, see above) comes to BF, there will be neutral stories without much romance. Mainly because I do not have much hope for Jenna coming, and secondly, this is just what BF does and how I have get to know the authors. Of course, things could change with changing authors.... Also, the question is, how much of the BF audience is made up of old farts like me and how much is young, talented, enthusiastic, reach-for the sky Timegirls?
Anyways, my 2 cent. Hope we are not dragging you down, Timegirl. I just try to be honest and realistic, this is nothing personal.
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Post by xlozdob on Jul 29, 2021 8:43:29 GMT
But there definitely are a lot of cannons in it! (On a more serious note, I think she means that it's there in officially sanctioned text, which is the closest you can get, I guess.) Sanctioned text? But is it explicit on screen? Text as in work. It's not as explicit as, for example, Rose or Martha, and it depends on your stance on how much you value authorial intent and on your personal interpretation of the subtext, but that doesn't mean that it cannot be extracted from the text itself, and further developed. God knows Big Finish have done more with less than that.
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Post by xlozdob on Jul 29, 2021 8:52:42 GMT
Tbh, personally, I'm in the camp of "the Doctor cannot (or won't) have proper romantic relationships with anyone other than the Master and River", but I do see the 12/Clara (just as 13/Yaz, although the power dynamics in that one are even more complicated) relationship as the closest it could be between the Doctor and a human companion. But I love the tragedy of it. Especially in 12/Clara's case. It's something that cannot be, but neither wants to admit it. It's a slow burn (rather than the quick-burning infatuation of 11/Clara) that certainly turns more towards the platonic at the end, as they realise it.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 29, 2021 10:15:46 GMT
I disagree, the subtext is there in the text and there is an enormous audience of people like me who adore the romance and have whole blogs, fanart, fanfics, and YouTube edits paying tribute to 12 and Clara’s love. Also Stephen Moffat, Jenna Coleman and Peter Capaldi are all in support of it being romantic. It would be an enormous waste of potential to water down or ignore that subtext which is so essential to their relationship and such a catalyst for storytelling potential. There are other perfectly good entirely platonic Doctor/companion relationships, let 12 and Clara have their romance I say! I would honestly rather them not even have any 12 and Clara BF stories than have it be ruined by taking the romance out! At the risk of being pedantic and pouring cold water on this, people (I mean all of us) need to realise they tend to gravitate towards 'bubbles' of opinion, and cluster around people with similar views who then reinforce each other. Try sitting with a bunch of football fans on a bus before or after a match and you soon start to believe there's only one view of reality. It's a very human condition, one we all get prone to in a sort of group-think. Bubbles tend to reinforce prior assumptions — look at the people on social media who tend to follow each other and get very surprised by election results as 'nobody I know was going to vote for XXXXX, how can they win?' People are very bad at understanding big numbers. Being in amongst 100 people all roughly agreeing on something, doesn't mean the rest of the world agrees! As to your post, enormous audience is very likely to be an exaggeration (I would go so far as to say impossible — what's your definition of enormous?). Doctor Who itself doesn't have an enormous audience, so why would the splinter who are devoted to this theory be enormous? It all reminds me of the '70s and '80s when fans decided there was a romantic / sexual relationship between Kirk and Spock. It became 'true' for them. TV shows leave lots open to the audience to interpret. Stories get told and retold over the years and continually change (I'm thinking King Arthur here). Everyone is entitled to their views on the show, but I'd like to suggest this particular topic has had more than enough air time and it might be time to move on. Whether or not Capaldi does or doesn't do Doctor Who for Big Finish, with or without Coleman (and I think Matt Lucas is far more likely to come to audio), and then whether or not they do or don't do certain stories shouldn't be a vindication of anybody's existence. It's all nice to have! There's a lot of ideas all fans would 'like' to happen, but at the end of the day most of us don't write the stories! Why not decompose your central idea into it's essence and tell a new story your way and not confined to the Doctor Who Universe? For all the 'fanfic becomes real' examples people can give, there are 1,000s that haven't. Of course I'm writing this from the perspective of believing others on the forum apart from me have become bored with the continual recycling of this topic. I may be badly out of step, in which case my bad, and I'll go back in my box! Very well put. It's also, and I've discussed this with Timegirl before, a bit of a misnomer to use "romantic" in only the loving sense. The interview that I saw Moffat and Capaldi give which did indeed use the phrase was in the context of "the romance of adventure" - which is very much Clara's arc in Series 9 which leads her to Face The Raven through letting the "romance" lead to hubris. It didn't come across to me at all that they meant any kind of sexual desire. It was used in the "romantic" sense you'd describe King Arthur's Knights or Horatio Hornblower.
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Post by timegirl on Jul 29, 2021 10:28:36 GMT
I disagree, the subtext is there in the text and there is an enormous audience of people like me who adore the romance and have whole blogs, fanart, fanfics, and YouTube edits paying tribute to 12 and Clara’s love. Also Stephen Moffat, Jenna Coleman and Peter Capaldi are all in support of it being romantic. It would be an enormous waste of potential to water down or ignore that subtext which is so essential to their relationship and such a catalyst for storytelling potential. There are other perfectly good entirely platonic Doctor/companion relationships, let 12 and Clara have their romance I say! I would honestly rather them not even have any 12 and Clara BF stories than have it be ruined by taking the romance out! At the risk of being pedantic and pouring cold water on this, people (I mean all of us) need to realise they tend to gravitate towards 'bubbles' of opinion, and cluster around people with similar views who then reinforce each other. Try sitting with a bunch of football fans on a bus before or after a match and you soon start to believe there's only one view of reality. It's a very human condition, one we all get prone to in a sort of group-think. Bubbles tend to reinforce prior assumptions — look at the people on social media who tend to follow each other and get very surprised by election results as 'nobody I know was going to vote for XXXXX, how can they win?' People are very bad at understanding big numbers. Being in amongst 100 people all roughly agreeing on something, doesn't mean the rest of the world agrees! As to your post, enormous audience is very likely to be an exaggeration (I would go so far as to say impossible — what's your definition of enormous?). Doctor Who itself doesn't have an enormous audience, so why would the splinter who are devoted to this theory be enormous? It all reminds me of the '70s and '80s when fans decided there was a romantic / sexual relationship between Kirk and Spock. It became 'true' for them. TV shows leave lots open to the audience to interpret. Stories get told and retold over the years and continually change (I'm thinking King Arthur here). Everyone is entitled to their views on the show, but I'd like to suggest this particular topic has had more than enough air time and it might be time to move on. Whether or not Capaldi does or doesn't do Doctor Who for Big Finish, with or without Coleman (and I think Matt Lucas is far more likely to come to audio), and then whether or not they do or don't do certain stories shouldn't be a vindication of anybody's existence. It's all nice to have! There's a lot of ideas all fans would 'like' to happen, but at the end of the day most of us don't write the stories! Why not decompose your central idea into it's essence and tell a new story your way and not confined to the Doctor Who Universe? For all the 'fanfic becomes real' examples people can give, there are 1,000s that haven't. Of course I'm writing this from the perspective of believing others on the forum apart from me have become bored with the continual recycling of this topic. I may be badly out of step, in which case my bad, and I'll go back in my box! I disagree entirely and I know what I believe in and what would make a good story. I refuse to stop enjoying what I enjoy and I believe in my heart that 12 and Clara’s romance is worth exploring. If not everyone likes that that’s okay. To be honest your post hurt my feelings a bit.
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Post by johnhurtdoctor on Jul 29, 2021 10:59:26 GMT
At the risk of being pedantic and pouring cold water on this, people (I mean all of us) need to realise they tend to gravitate towards 'bubbles' of opinion, and cluster around people with similar views who then reinforce each other. Try sitting with a bunch of football fans on a bus before or after a match and you soon start to believe there's only one view of reality. It's a very human condition, one we all get prone to in a sort of group-think. Bubbles tend to reinforce prior assumptions — look at the people on social media who tend to follow each other and get very surprised by election results as 'nobody I know was going to vote for XXXXX, how can they win?' People are very bad at understanding big numbers. Being in amongst 100 people all roughly agreeing on something, doesn't mean the rest of the world agrees! As to your post, enormous audience is very likely to be an exaggeration (I would go so far as to say impossible — what's your definition of enormous?). Doctor Who itself doesn't have an enormous audience, so why would the splinter who are devoted to this theory be enormous? It all reminds me of the '70s and '80s when fans decided there was a romantic / sexual relationship between Kirk and Spock. It became 'true' for them. TV shows leave lots open to the audience to interpret. Stories get told and retold over the years and continually change (I'm thinking King Arthur here). Everyone is entitled to their views on the show, but I'd like to suggest this particular topic has had more than enough air time and it might be time to move on. Whether or not Capaldi does or doesn't do Doctor Who for Big Finish, with or without Coleman (and I think Matt Lucas is far more likely to come to audio), and then whether or not they do or don't do certain stories shouldn't be a vindication of anybody's existence. It's all nice to have! There's a lot of ideas all fans would 'like' to happen, but at the end of the day most of us don't write the stories! Why not decompose your central idea into it's essence and tell a new story your way and not confined to the Doctor Who Universe? For all the 'fanfic becomes real' examples people can give, there are 1,000s that haven't. Of course I'm writing this from the perspective of believing others on the forum apart from me have become bored with the continual recycling of this topic. I may be badly out of step, in which case my bad, and I'll go back in my box! I disagree entirely and I know what I believe in and what would make a good story. I refuse to stop enjoying what I enjoy and I believe in my heart that 12 and Clara’s romance is worth exploring. If not everyone likes that that’s okay. To be honest your post hurt my feelings a bit. As I said in response to his post we don't have to look at every thread here & can choose what we want to read about or interact with. However, although the 12/Clara relationship is very important to you & your love of the show I can understand how some may find it slightly off-putting when this is the focus of all your posts here across numerous threads. I don't think anyone is or should be saying that you cannot enjoy what you enjoy or trying to hurt your feelings but maybe focus these imaginative & well thought out ideas into a single thread you create dedicated to 12/Clara? It would be a good single repository for all your ideas & others to contribute.
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Post by sherlock on Jul 29, 2021 11:06:22 GMT
Anyway... getting back to “obscure Big Finish”, seems there’s been some Thunderbirds recording -
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Post by grinch on Jul 29, 2021 11:09:14 GMT
Anyway... getting back to “obscure Big Finish”, seems there’s been some Thunderbirds recording - You know, it actually wouldn’t surprise me if the Thunderbirds range ended up rivalling some of the more popular Doctor Who ranges in terms of sales.
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Post by timegirl on Jul 29, 2021 11:16:33 GMT
I disagree entirely and I know what I believe in and what would make a good story. I refuse to stop enjoying what I enjoy and I believe in my heart that 12 and Clara’s romance is worth exploring. If not everyone likes that that’s okay. To be honest your post hurt my feelings a bit. As I said in response to his post we don't have to look at every thread here & can choose what we want to read about or interact with. However, although the 12/Clara relationship is very important to you & your love of the show I can understand how some may find it slightly off-putting when this is the focus of all your posts here across numerous threads. I don't think anyone is or should be saying that you cannot enjoy what you enjoy or trying to hurt your feelings but maybe focus these imaginative & well thought out ideas into a single thread you create dedicated to 12/Clara? It would be a good single repository for all your ideas & others to contribute. It’s not my only focus, it only came up here, because we were talking about the Capaldi big finish possibility and I mentioned that I would love to write for him at BF one day and happened to mention that I would want to focus on his music and the 12 Clara romance. That’s all and then it spiraled. I have my threads where I talk about them it just came up here because of the Capaldi saying “Audio drama is dreary.”
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Post by Deleted on Jul 29, 2021 11:20:10 GMT
As I said in response to his post we don't have to look at every thread here & can choose what we want to read about or interact with. However, although the 12/Clara relationship is very important to you & your love of the show I can understand how some may find it slightly off-putting when this is the focus of all your posts here across numerous threads. I don't think anyone is or should be saying that you cannot enjoy what you enjoy or trying to hurt your feelings but maybe focus these imaginative & well thought out ideas into a single thread you create dedicated to 12/Clara? It would be a good single repository for all your ideas & others to contribute. It’s not my only focus, it only came up here, because we were talking about the Capaldi big finish possibility and I mentioned that I would love to write for him at BF one day and happened to mention that I would want to focus on his music and the 12 Clara romance. That’s all and then it spiraled. I have my threads where I talk about them it just came up here because of the Capaldi saying “Audio drama is dreary.” There is a fan-fic and writer's section that might be a useful place for your creative ideas.
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Post by barnabaslives on Jul 29, 2021 12:36:38 GMT
But in my honest opinion, when Capaldi (I am pretty sure he will come on board, see above) comes to BF, there will be neutral stories without much romance. Mainly because I do not have much hope for Jenna coming, and secondly, this is just what BF does and how I have get to know the authors. Of course, things could change with changing authors.... Also, the question is, how much of the BF audience is made up of old farts like me and how much is young, talented, enthusiastic, reach-for the sky Timegirls? I think it's a very interesting question what Big Finish will do with the Twelfth Doctor. I think of them as wanting to play things close to the cuff with the TV show at least starting out with things, but what cuff is that? I think that's the thing is that there is now a generation of people who've experienced the New Series without necessarily having the sense of limitation that Old Series fans have, and there may well be many of them who see romance as an integral part of the New Series. I mean, even Martha asking Ten "Are we going to you-know now?" I'd still keel over if Peri said that to Sixie! There's a very different dynamic with the New Series in that way. Just how many are clamoring for Big Finish to keep an element of romance in there I have no idea but especially with Big Finish's more recent focus on the New Series, it could be more than were clamoring to see River meet Bennie and things like that. I could see one story per set maybe wanting to keep that flame lit in being true to TV. The thing is that I think that element is really there and its not just Timegirl, there are people putting up lovely video montages of magic moments from the show because they see it and they can pinpoint right when and where it's showing through. I worry they're going be seen as desperately seeking validation of their personal perspectives or something when I think the show has already validated them. If they're looking for any validation, it seems like they might be looking for it from the larger fan community - not that theirs is the only way to see it or the best way to see it, but probably just that they're not just imagining it out of wishful thinking, that there really were some pretty saucy lines and scenes in the scripts. (Kirk never said to Spock "I'm not your boyfriend", I don't think)? I mean, I apparently blotted it out of my memory earlier due to some kind of trauma, but I could swear that's Clara snogging the Doctor's face right off all the way from 3:07 to 3:13 in this montage www.youtube.com/watch?v=HmaSxI_BO-o That's almost kind of odd I forgot that considering I still remember when Amy tried to snog his face off. (That one I'm still morally indignant about what with her marrying Rory that week and everything). Anyway, I don't know where they got it, but this Whoffauldi crowd has loads of video evidence like that, all beautifully compiled. Don't ask 'em where they get their crazy ideas from because like I say, I think it was from Steven Moffat, and before that I think it was Russell T. Davies, and they have documented this. I have to say, though, the view from their camp really is lovely, and at least over at that camp I feel like I'm basing my opinion on things that actually happened in the show. Can you believe that for ages I actually thought Capaldi's next line after "I'm not your boyfriend" was "I'm not your chauffeur either"? lol. I was recently shocked to find out what it really was (catcalls and sniggering from audience). If I can sort of speak for myself about it now, yeah - I know some people might be weary of the subject (sorry) and I'm not really meaning to make a big deal about it, it's just a bit of a reality check still. I mean, I know it's Doctor Who but she did just suck his face like a vacuum cleaner there, right? I wasn't hallucinating? Please tell me I wasn't hallucinating, because obviously I have an urgent appointment I need to make if no one else saw that. Apologies if I'm a bit prone to the subject also because the I think the Twelfth Doctor is rapidly becoming my favorite New Series Doctor so I have sort of a new-found enthusiasm I probably need to curb. I think it was that it was Ten who made the first big impression on me, but I'd been catching up with re-runs and when I started actually watching again it was Twelve that I was looking forward to seeing every week, which kind of makes him "my" New Series Doctor in the very same manner that the Fourth Doctor is "my" Old Series Doctor, and that is really trying to catch up with me now.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 29, 2021 13:06:32 GMT
But in my honest opinion, when Capaldi (I am pretty sure he will come on board, see above) comes to BF, there will be neutral stories without much romance. Mainly because I do not have much hope for Jenna coming, and secondly, this is just what BF does and how I have get to know the authors. Of course, things could change with changing authors.... Also, the question is, how much of the BF audience is made up of old farts like me and how much is young, talented, enthusiastic, reach-for the sky Timegirls? I think it's a very interesting question what Big Finish will do with the Twelfth Doctor. I think of them as wanting to play things close to the cuff with the TV show at least starting out with things, but what cuff is that? I think that's the thing is that there is now a generation of people who've experienced the New Series without necessarily having the sense of limitation that Old Series fans have, and there may well be many of them who see romance as an integral part of the New Series. I mean, even Martha asking Ten "Are we going to you-know now?" I'd still keel over if Peri said that to Sixie! There's a very different dynamic with the New Series in that way. Just how many are clamoring for Big Finish to keep an element of romance in there I have no idea but especially with Big Finish's more recent focus on the New Series, it could be more than were clamoring to see River meet Bennie and things like that. I could see one story per set maybe wanting to keep that flame lit in being true to TV. The thing is that I think that element is really there and its not just Timegirl, there are people putting up lovely video montages of magic moments from the show because they see it and they can pinpoint right when and where it's showing through. I worry they're going be seen as desperately seeking validation of their personal perspectives or something when I think the show has already validated them. If they're looking for any validation, it seems like they might be looking for it from the larger fan community - not that theirs is the only way to see it or the best way to see it, but probably just that they're not just imagining it out of wishful thinking, that there really were some pretty saucy lines and scenes in the scripts. (Kirk never said to Spock "I'm not your boyfriend", I don't think)? I mean, I apparently blotted it out of my memory earlier due to some kind of trauma, but I could swear that's Clara snogging the Doctor's face right off all the way from 3:07 to 3:13 in this montage www.youtube.com/watch?v=HmaSxI_BO-o That's almost kind of odd I forgot that considering I still remember when Amy tried to snog his face off. (That one I'm still morally indignant about what with her marrying Rory that week and everything). Anyway, I don't know where they got it, but this Whoffauldi crowd has loads of video evidence like that, all beautifully compiled. Don't ask 'em where they get their crazy ideas from because like I say, I think it was from Steven Moffat, and before that I think it was Russell T. Davies, and they have documented this. I have to say, though, the view from their camp really is lovely, and at least over at that camp I feel like I'm basing my opinion on things that actually happened in the show. Can you believe that for ages I actually thought Capaldi's next line after "I'm not your boyfriend" was "I'm not your chauffeur either"? lol. I was recently shocked to find out what it really was (catcalls and sniggering from audience). If I can sort of speak for myself about it now, yeah - I know some people might be weary of the subject (sorry) and I'm not really meaning to make a big deal about it, it's just a bit of a reality check still. I mean, I know it's Doctor Who but she did just suck his face like a vacuum cleaner there, right? I wasn't hallucinating? Please tell me I wasn't hallucinating, because obviously I have an urgent appointment I need to make if no one else saw that. Apologies if I'm a bit prone to the subject also because the I think the Twelfth Doctor is rapidly becoming my favorite New Series Doctor so I have sort of a new-found enthusiasm I probably need to curb. I think it was that it was Ten who made the first big impression on me, but I'd been catching up with re-runs and when I started actually watching again it was Twelve that I was looking forward to seeing every week, which kind of makes him "my" New Series Doctor in the very same manner that the Fourth Doctor is "my" Old Series Doctor, and that is really trying to catch up with me now. Yeah, she did indeed kiss Matt's face off there. But surely the "I'm not your boyfriend" from Capaldi's first ep, including the "I never said it was your mistake" is doing it's best to tell us that was very much their relationship before the regen and it'll be different now. Indeed, Capaldi is happy when he thinks that Clara has fallen for a fellow school teacher who looks like Matt. I mean his whole arc towards the end with Clara, the "duty of care" is one of love - absolutely - but guardianship and paternal protection. I don't think it's any coincidence that was immediately followed with a River episode where the relationship being overtly flirtatious and sexy was back again. It's quite a contrast.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 29, 2021 13:15:48 GMT
As I said in response to his post we don't have to look at every thread here & can choose what we want to read about or interact with. However, although the 12/Clara relationship is very important to you & your love of the show I can understand how some may find it slightly off-putting when this is the focus of all your posts here across numerous threads. I don't think anyone is or should be saying that you cannot enjoy what you enjoy or trying to hurt your feelings but maybe focus these imaginative & well thought out ideas into a single thread you create dedicated to 12/Clara? It would be a good single repository for all your ideas & others to contribute. It’s not my only focus, it only came up here, because we were talking about the Capaldi big finish possibility and I mentioned that I would love to write for him at BF one day and happened to mention that I would want to focus on his music and the 12 Clara romance. That’s all and then it spiraled. I have my threads where I talk about them it just came up here because of the Capaldi saying “Audio drama is dreary.” Oh, and don't ever think anyone dislikes you because they disagree with your opinions. You're one of the lovliest people here. If we disagree, it's a discussion, not a lecture - your opinion is as valid as mine or anyone elses.
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Tony Jones
Chancellery Guard
Professor Chronotis
Still rockin' along!
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Post by Tony Jones on Jul 29, 2021 13:19:23 GMT
[This was meant to be in reply to a johnhurtdoctor comment, but I seem to have made a mistake, which I'll blame on Proboards, as user error is, of course, impossible!] Sadly this thread is labelled as 'obscure Big Finish news' and most of these are way off topic. I'm also well aware of the ignore facility; as an admin I do have a tendency to wander round the forum to see what's going on (eg getting involved in the recent moderator decision to spin-off the Worlds of Gerry Anderson sub-board. This rather conflicts with the idea of ignoring threads, many of which I do from their titles. In fact I don't seem to be able to ignore threads as I get a moderator's menu when I look at actions!
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Post by timegirl on Jul 29, 2021 13:21:56 GMT
It’s not my only focus, it only came up here, because we were talking about the Capaldi big finish possibility and I mentioned that I would love to write for him at BF one day and happened to mention that I would want to focus on his music and the 12 Clara romance. That’s all and then it spiraled. I have my threads where I talk about them it just came up here because of the Capaldi saying “Audio drama is dreary.” Oh, and don't ever think anyone dislikes you because they disagree with your opinions. You're one of the lovliest people here. If we disagree, it's a discussion, not a lecture - your opinion is as valid as mine or anyone elses. Aww thanks 😊
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Post by timegirl on Jul 29, 2021 13:22:51 GMT
I think it's a very interesting question what Big Finish will do with the Twelfth Doctor. I think of them as wanting to play things close to the cuff with the TV show at least starting out with things, but what cuff is that? I think that's the thing is that there is now a generation of people who've experienced the New Series without necessarily having the sense of limitation that Old Series fans have, and there may well be many of them who see romance as an integral part of the New Series. I mean, even Martha asking Ten "Are we going to you-know now?" I'd still keel over if Peri said that to Sixie! There's a very different dynamic with the New Series in that way. Just how many are clamoring for Big Finish to keep an element of romance in there I have no idea but especially with Big Finish's more recent focus on the New Series, it could be more than were clamoring to see River meet Bennie and things like that. I could see one story per set maybe wanting to keep that flame lit in being true to TV. The thing is that I think that element is really there and its not just Timegirl, there are people putting up lovely video montages of magic moments from the show because they see it and they can pinpoint right when and where it's showing through. I worry they're going be seen as desperately seeking validation of their personal perspectives or something when I think the show has already validated them. If they're looking for any validation, it seems like they might be looking for it from the larger fan community - not that theirs is the only way to see it or the best way to see it, but probably just that they're not just imagining it out of wishful thinking, that there really were some pretty saucy lines and scenes in the scripts. (Kirk never said to Spock "I'm not your boyfriend", I don't think)? I mean, I apparently blotted it out of my memory earlier due to some kind of trauma, but I could swear that's Clara snogging the Doctor's face right off all the way from 3:07 to 3:13 in this montage www.youtube.com/watch?v=HmaSxI_BO-o That's almost kind of odd I forgot that considering I still remember when Amy tried to snog his face off. (That one I'm still morally indignant about what with her marrying Rory that week and everything). Anyway, I don't know where they got it, but this Whoffauldi crowd has loads of video evidence like that, all beautifully compiled. Don't ask 'em where they get their crazy ideas from because like I say, I think it was from Steven Moffat, and before that I think it was Russell T. Davies, and they have documented this. I have to say, though, the view from their camp really is lovely, and at least over at that camp I feel like I'm basing my opinion on things that actually happened in the show. Can you believe that for ages I actually thought Capaldi's next line after "I'm not your boyfriend" was "I'm not your chauffeur either"? lol. I was recently shocked to find out what it really was (catcalls and sniggering from audience). If I can sort of speak for myself about it now, yeah - I know some people might be weary of the subject (sorry) and I'm not really meaning to make a big deal about it, it's just a bit of a reality check still. I mean, I know it's Doctor Who but she did just suck his face like a vacuum cleaner there, right? I wasn't hallucinating? Please tell me I wasn't hallucinating, because obviously I have an urgent appointment I need to make if no one else saw that. Apologies if I'm a bit prone to the subject also because the I think the Twelfth Doctor is rapidly becoming my favorite New Series Doctor so I have sort of a new-found enthusiasm I probably need to curb. I think it was that it was Ten who made the first big impression on me, but I'd been catching up with re-runs and when I started actually watching again it was Twelve that I was looking forward to seeing every week, which kind of makes him "my" New Series Doctor in the very same manner that the Fourth Doctor is "my" Old Series Doctor, and that is really trying to catch up with me now. Yeah, she did indeed kiss Matt's face off there. But surely the "I'm not your boyfriend" from Capaldi's first ep, including the "I never said it was your mistake" is doing it's best to tell us that was very much their relationship before the regen and it'll be different now. Indeed, Capaldi is happy when he thinks that Clara has fallen for a fellow school teacher who looks like Matt. I mean his whole arc towards the end with Clara, the "duty of care" is one of love - absolutely - but guardianship and paternal protection. I don't think it's any coincidence that was immediately followed with a River episode where the relationship being overtly flirtatious and sexy was back again. It's quite a contrast. Interesting point I disagree but you are entitled to your opinions 🤔🙂 There were plenty of times 12 was flirty with Clara though, I think it was more his romantic love for Clara was understated partly because he felt he wasn’t allowed to express his feelings fully in an older body. I don’t see anything parental at all about 12 and Clara’s relationship because they were each other’s equals. But like I said different strokes for different folks😉
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Post by Digi on Jul 29, 2021 15:26:25 GMT
Mod stuff:
Hey guys, we've strayed pretty far off-topic for the thread at this point. If anyone wants to start up a separate thread to continue this tangent you're more than welcome to do so, but we'd appreciate if the comments and conversation in here could circle back to its usual 'BF news and rumours from not-official-BF-marketing sources' direction.
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Post by timegirl on Jul 29, 2021 16:10:46 GMT
Mod stuff: Hey guys, we've strayed pretty far off-topic for the thread at this point. If anyone wants to start up a separate thread to continue this tangent you're more than welcome to do so, but we'd appreciate if the comments and conversation in here could circle back to its usual 'BF news and rumours from not-official-BF-marketing sources' direction. That’s fine no worries 🙂
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Post by shallacatop on Aug 1, 2021 9:03:57 GMT
Do we know if there’s a volume two of The Tenth Doctor Chronicles coming? There’s an article covering volume two of The Eleventh Doctor Chronicles in the latest Vortex with an interesting comment from Doris V Sutherland, who was given the choice of writing for Ten or Eleven. Presumably Big Finish wanted Doris for a specific range, i.e. Chronicles, rather than giving her carte blanche.
Presumably something to sit on whilst the influx of David Tennant material quietens down.
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