|
Post by mark687 on Dec 15, 2016 10:02:32 GMT
Just a Note on the What's New Page that Cold Fusion CDs wont be dispatched till After the 1st week of January 2017 www.bigfinish.com/whats_newRegards mark687
|
|
aztec
Chancellery Guard
Likes: 2,849
|
Post by aztec on Dec 15, 2016 13:26:18 GMT
I haven't read any of the Virgin books (though I've got the audio adaption and Love an War and have pre-ordered Cold Fusion) but as I understand it, the novels they've adapted haven't necessarily been in chronological order, just wondering whether they've kept in any of the arc stuff from the novels or specifically made the adaptions more stand alone?
|
|
|
Post by mark687 on Dec 15, 2016 13:44:03 GMT
I haven't read any of the Virgin books (though I've got the audio adaption and Love an War and have pre-ordered Cold Fusion) but as I understand it, the novels they've adapted haven't necessarily been in chronological order, just wondering whether they've kept in any of the arc stuff from the novels or specifically made the adaptions more stand alone? So far the 7th Doc adaptions have been treated as new productions there have no references to previous unadapt novels
Regards
mark687
|
|
|
Post by fitzoliverj on Dec 15, 2016 20:22:12 GMT
I haven't read any of the Virgin books (though I've got the audio adaption and Love an War and have pre-ordered Cold Fusion) but as I understand it, the novels they've adapted haven't necessarily been in chronological order, just wondering whether they've kept in any of the arc stuff from the novels or specifically made the adaptions more stand alone? The Psi Powers arc didn't feature in every novel during its time, and I can't recall "Cold Fusion" having any involvement. (It takes place before "The Death of Art" but was published afterwards, which made the stuff in "The Death of Art" about Chris trying to impersonate the fifth Doctor a bit confusing).
|
|
|
Post by Star Platinum on Dec 15, 2016 22:36:44 GMT
Just finished it, wasn't quite as action packed as I thought it would be.
The bunch of references at the end through me a bit, wasn't expecting that one in particular.
I'll have to give it another listen in a few weeks.
|
|
|
Post by barnabaslives on Dec 16, 2016 2:40:34 GMT
Beggin' yuir pardon, but I feel compelled to point out that Hedera helix is the Latin binomial of English Ivy, not Poison Ivy. Just thought I'd mention it since in real life, confusing the two can sometimes be painful. :-)
Now I must get back to the story... So far it's awesome and Matthew Waterhouse sounds better than ever.
|
|
|
Post by velvetrevolv3r6 on Dec 16, 2016 11:52:09 GMT
Just finished this myself.. I see what you mean by THAT reference! Good grief! overall it's a pretty solid story but since I haven't read many of the new adventures the majority of the references to them went straight over my head unfortunately.
|
|
|
Post by CookieMaster on Dec 16, 2016 17:16:02 GMT
I really quite enjoyed that, can't really fault it for anything. I had completely forgotten it was a 6 parter, so was pleasantly surprised when part 5 fired up. As i said in the 'Original Sin' thread, i hope this isn't the last we hear of Chris and Roz, they really are a great pair of companions.
|
|
|
Post by TinDogPodcast on Dec 16, 2016 18:12:00 GMT
Chrisk and rOz. .. take on torchwood...
I'd love that
|
|
|
Post by newt5996 on Dec 17, 2016 19:03:38 GMT
In Part Three right now.
1. Patience is great 2. Matthew Waterhouse is great 3. Chris and Roz are great 4. Looooooommmmmms!
|
|
|
Post by mrperson on Dec 17, 2016 19:51:44 GMT
Excellent, but as someone who has not read any books (I stick to audio and TV):
1. It seemed like it should have been a big deal that Patience was the Doctor's Wife (or at least, that's what I thought I heard in memories during the first contact), but it didn't seem to really go anywhere. She might as well have been anyone. One would think that he'd have more of a reaction, too, unless her appearance is all tied up in other NA books I don't know about.
2. I suppose I shouldn't mention Lungbarrow, but it sounded like this was based on Lungbarrow being part of the Who universe (do all the books so cross-reference? Or do they pick and choose what other stories are "canon" within-book, on a book by book basis?). I could do without looms and "the other", but whatever, it was a very brief thing that didn't end up mattering.
2a. RE: "The other". It's a similar issue with the New Series in the beginning for me. I do not think the character need or should be any further built up in that fashion. It was all "fire and ice", lonely God, etc, for the first half of the reboot. The hints that the Doctor is something vaguely resembling a clone of some other mythical Time Lord on par with Rassilon or Omega bother me as well. I vastly prefer him as initially evolved: a brilliant miscreant who cannot abide a lifetime twiddling his thumbs who happens to be a bit of an adrenaline junkie. Someone who makes mistakes, even big ones that get lots of people killed, but tries to do the right thing and generally succeeds.
I would like them to bring Roz and Chris into McCoy's MR episodes.
|
|
|
Post by Zagreus on Dec 17, 2016 20:36:44 GMT
The Doctor wasn't really a clone of The Other, the implication was more that he was the other, and this was just his third or so regeneration cycle. The idea was that after the curse that rendered the Time Lords sterile, The Other was the one who came up with regeneration, and bioenginered it, via these big engines known as Looms that knit Time Lords new bodies when they die. Due to Rassilon being an utter bastard, he and The Other had a falling out, and, with little other options, The Other threw himself into the Looms and is occasionally reborn as a new Time Lord with his memories tucked away in the back of their head. So The Doctor is like the second time The Other has been recycled into a new Time Lord (the previous cycle consisting of the Morbius Doctors, natch).
It was all very fanjodrelly and high concept and was designed to restore a sense of mystery to The Doctor's character and explain just why he knew so much about all the ancient mysteries and secrets of his people.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Likes:
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 17, 2016 21:06:51 GMT
a lot of feminist DW fans feel that the Looms were invented by male authors purely so the Doctor didn't have to be "born of woman" and that this misogyny was eagerly embraced by nineties fanboys.
|
|
|
Post by fingersmash on Dec 17, 2016 21:29:37 GMT
a lot of feminist DW fans feel that the Looms were invented by male authors purely so the Doctor didn't have to be "born of woman" and that this misogyny was eagerly embraced by nineties fanboys. I feel like you'd have to be in the caveman times to reasonably feel that level of misogyny. That statement feels more like a misandrist slander than a mysogynistic truth. But hey, that's just me.
|
|
|
Post by levi3o4 on Dec 17, 2016 21:57:08 GMT
a lot of feminist DW fans feel that the Looms were invented by male authors purely so the Doctor didn't have to be "born of woman" and that this misogyny was eagerly embraced by nineties fanboys. I feel like you'd have to be in the caveman times to reasonably feel that level of misogyny. That statement feels more like a misandrist slander than a mysogynistic truth. But hey, that's just me. I do hope the Doctor Who Fandom doesn't frequently get mired in concepts such as "misandrist slander" - seems largely antithetical to what the show is about, and is quite frankly a backwards alternative to engaging with an unexpected argument. Also - so wait, how did the {Spoiler}Day of the Doctor and Loom references work? how in-depth do they get? Are there continuity shake-ups on the horizon?!?
|
|
|
Post by seeley on Dec 18, 2016 2:55:46 GMT
a lot of feminist DW fans feel that the Looms were invented by male authors purely so the Doctor didn't have to be "born of woman" and that this misogyny was eagerly embraced by nineties fanboys. I believe they were actually invented to explain the paucity of female Timelords, and the patriarchal nature of their society, in the Classic Series, something which was conspicuous to viewers as far back as The Deadly Assassin. Hence the Pythia's curse of sterility , which seeded a long-abiding resentment of women among the Timelords. Come to think of it, it was implied that the Doctor wasn't actually Loom-born, having jumped in in order to become a Timelord or extend his lifespan or somesuch.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Likes:
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 18, 2016 4:20:20 GMT
a lot of feminist DW fans feel that the Looms were invented by male authors purely so the Doctor didn't have to be "born of woman" and that this misogyny was eagerly embraced by nineties fanboys. I believe they were actually invented to explain the paucity of female Timelords, and the patriarchal nature of their society, in the Classic Series, something which was conspicuous to viewers as far back as The Deadly Assassin. Hence the Pythia's curse of sterility, which seeded a long-abiding resentment of women among the Timelords. Come to think of it, it was implied that the Doctor wasn't actually Loom-born, having jumped in in order to become a Timelord or extend his lifespan or somesuch. Hence the cruel nickname "Wormhole" given to him by his cousins, he was the only one loomed with a bellybutton. He can remember being loomed, something that his tutor, Badger, deemed an impossibility and remembers having a mother and father in a society where such a thing was a rarity, so there was a lot more going on than people tend to take away from it. Lungbarrow does the great thing of answering your questions in a pleasant, concise manner and then throwing a whole new bag of them at you. Who was the Other? Was he human or Gallifreyan? Was the Doctor's birth interfered with so that he had parents? Did we meet one of them in The Room with No Doors? What's happening to Gallifrey? Will the Time Lords be able to shake their millennia of sterile thinking? a lot of feminist DW fans feel that the Looms were invented by male authors purely so the Doctor didn't have to be "born of woman" and that this misogyny was eagerly embraced by nineties fanboys. Seems a rather glib generalisation on their part to me, have they read the book? There was a lot of division surrounding the looms, irrespective of gender and still is. They only have to look at this forum. Another important point to remember is that before the TV Movie, the Doctor was very much an asexual character with no interest in that aspect of life. From my understanding of it, it was a way of further fleshing out Time Lord society by showing what social customs the Doctor was still holding onto. It was the epitome of typical Victorian thinking where the whole concept of sex was viewed as a grotesque necessity and something to shy away from. Given that at the end of that novel the pact with the Sisterhood of Karn renders that curse moot, I really don't see what the fuss about it is. Personally, I think it's a marvellous bit of worldbuilding. The New Adventures excelled at creating alien environments -- just look at Transit which is about a sentient mass transit system, Parasite which dealt with the seashell-like Artifact or Sky Pirates which is just outright bonkers -- this is precisely in keeping with the range's grandiose method of thinking. Broad, beautiful and devastatingly clever little additions that make the Doctor Who universe all that more alien. And outside of veiled references in Neverland and other stories, Cold Fusion is the first Big Finish story to freely acknowledge the houses, looms and cousins. To me, that's one hell of a Christmas present.
|
|
|
Post by mark687 on Dec 19, 2016 16:54:57 GMT
|
|
|
Post by elkawho on Dec 20, 2016 22:27:59 GMT
I'll start off saying that I haven't read this. Even so (or because of it), I adored this story. I listened to it twice to make sure that I didn't miss anything, and loved it even more the second time. I couldn't imagine how they were going to use all of those characters and not short-change any of them, but they found a way. I really dislike Tegan on TV, more so than Adric by a long shot, but I love what they have done with her at BF. And she shines in this story, even with her harping on about Heathrow at the beginning. The Doctors were both great, and very much true to each of their natures. I love the bantering between them at the end, as I'm sure we all do. "Does my voice sound older than it should?" Ha ha ha ha!
I felt that this was the best story so far in terms of characterization for Chris and Roz, which surprised me because I liked them a lot in Original Sin. I love Chris trying to be Bruce Jovanka. Just the fact that the Doctor gave him that name to use is really funny. Add the bad accent and coloquialisms, and listen to the fun.
As for the looms, I have never read Lungbarrow. I don't really understand the looms (although the comments from this thread have helped) or all of the Gallifreyan mythology that has come from that book. But it didn't keep me from enjoying this story. (Although I agree with an above post. If Patience is supposed to be The Doctor's wife, shouldn't it have been a bigger deal in the story?)
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Likes:
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 21, 2016 2:31:49 GMT
(Although I agree with an above post. If Patience is supposed to be The Doctor's wife, shouldn't it have been a bigger deal in the story?) This is a problem which happened with the adaptation of Nightshade too. There were criticisms that the Doctor's character was too morose, but it makes sense if you've followed what happened recently with the Timewyrm books. Cold Fusion was originally published as a novel in December 1996, whereas Lungbarrow was later released in March 1997. Her presence largely relies upon information and background that was put front and centre in Time's Crucible, building off of Pythia's Curse and the dawn of Rassilon's Age of Reason in preparation for that final Seventh Doctor novel. Despite appearances to the contrary, you're actually dropping right into the middle of a myth arc that you haven't seen the whole of yet. It's like Roz's intimation about Unitatus belonging to a secret order that she, Chris and the Doctor have been trying to stop throughout history -- that's actually a reference to the Brotherhood arc that was going on in the New Adventures at the time. It's a credit to Lance Parkin's writing that the loss of context actually doesn't matter that much. It still makes for a really awesome story.
|
|