Deleted
Deleted Member
Likes:
|
Post by Deleted on Feb 3, 2020 2:10:02 GMT
I thought that one was a bit out of character, personally. Also, 'The Black Hole'. I love the story but I don't think they always get the Monk right in the script - his actions are too violent. Of course I'm looking back to the Butterworth Monk and every incarnation will be different, but the fundamentals shouldn't change imo. Now they seem to be trying to make him into a 'greedy businessman' type, which is OK but I thought his original motivation of trying to change history to 'improve' things in the wider sense (and cash in on the results, of course!) was much better. To me 'The Time Meddler' is still the perfect Monk story: help England, save many lives and prevent years of oppression by stopping the invasions of 1066, who could object to that? And collect rich rewards from grateful King Harold! Ruin the timelines of course, but hey that's his m.o. and I'm sure he thought it would all work out in Time... if not he could give history another tweak and then... A total menace to history, always on the make and bound to cause disaster, but not evil.
My favourite BF Monk story is easily John Dorney's 'Divorced, Beheaded, Regenerated' in Missy. It's glorious, riotous fun and he's terrified when they meet - as he should be; he's a pain in the temporal posterior, she's a killer - or maybe not, depends on her mood...
I love how reasonable that sounds from the Monk's perspective. There's nothing to object to there. After all, it all seems perfectly aboveboard. Downright noble, actually. Then, you remember how he intended to do it -- by luring the Vikings into a trap and blowing them all away with an atomic cannon. Atomic, in the nuclear sense, going by sixies lingo: That's where I think the antagonistic element of him lies. He's not overtly destructive, not a villain in the capital 'V' sense. His whole schtick is essentially that of an extremely poor tourist. Someone who shouts over the tour guide that they learnt about the museum's exhibition differently. If he actually took any measure of responsibility for his actions... He probably wouldn't even be opposed to the Doctor. But then, ho-hum, where's the fun in that?
|
|
|
Post by number13 on Feb 4, 2020 21:43:02 GMT
Also, 'The Black Hole'. I love the story but I don't think they always get the Monk right in the script - his actions are too violent. Of course I'm looking back to the Butterworth Monk and every incarnation will be different, but the fundamentals shouldn't change imo. Now they seem to be trying to make him into a 'greedy businessman' type, which is OK but I thought his original motivation of trying to change history to 'improve' things in the wider sense (and cash in on the results, of course!) was much better. To me 'The Time Meddler' is still the perfect Monk story: help England, save many lives and prevent years of oppression by stopping the invasions of 1066, who could object to that? And collect rich rewards from grateful King Harold! Ruin the timelines of course, but hey that's his m.o. and I'm sure he thought it would all work out in Time... if not he could give history another tweak and then... A total menace to history, always on the make and bound to cause disaster, but not evil.
My favourite BF Monk story is easily John Dorney's 'Divorced, Beheaded, Regenerated' in Missy. It's glorious, riotous fun and he's terrified when they meet - as he should be; he's a pain in the temporal posterior, she's a killer - or maybe not, depends on her mood...
I love how reasonable that sounds from the Monk's perspective. There's nothing to object to there. After all, it all seems perfectly aboveboard. Downright noble, actually. Then, you remember how he intended to do it -- by luring the Vikings into a trap and blowing them all away with an atomic cannon. Atomic, in the nuclear sense, going by sixies lingo: That's where I think the antagonistic element of him lies. He's not overtly destructive, not a villain in the capital 'V' sense. His whole schtick is essentially that of an extremely poor tourist. Someone who shouts over the tour guide that they learnt about the museum's exhibition differently. If he actually took any measure of responsibility for his actions... He probably wouldn't even be opposed to the Doctor. But then, ho-hum, where's the fun in that? 'Talk to him? Tell a Viking king to stop invading places and killing people? Ho-ho not on your life Doctor - and more to the point, not on mine. Tell you what, you go and have your little chat with him - ha-ha -and I'll be sure to give your remains a decent burial. All of them.'
(His face twitching nervously, the Monk edges towards the altar...)
|
|
|
Post by grinch on Feb 4, 2020 21:48:55 GMT
I love how reasonable that sounds from the Monk's perspective. There's nothing to object to there. After all, it all seems perfectly aboveboard. Downright noble, actually. Then, you remember how he intended to do it -- by luring the Vikings into a trap and blowing them all away with an atomic cannon. Atomic, in the nuclear sense, going by sixies lingo: That's where I think the antagonistic element of him lies. He's not overtly destructive, not a villain in the capital 'V' sense. His whole schtick is essentially that of an extremely poor tourist. Someone who shouts over the tour guide that they learnt about the museum's exhibition differently. If he actually took any measure of responsibility for his actions... He probably wouldn't even be opposed to the Doctor. But then, ho-hum, where's the fun in that? 'Talk to him? Tell a Viking king to stop invading places and killing people? Ho-ho not on your life Doctor - and more to the point, not on mine. Tell you what, you go and have your little chat with him - ha-ha -and I'll be sure to give your remains a decent burial. All of them.'
(His face twitching nervously, the Monk edges towards the altar...) It’s great that I could actually picture Peter Butterworth saying those lines.
|
|
|
Post by number13 on Feb 4, 2020 22:24:35 GMT
'Talk to him? Tell a Viking king to stop invading places and killing people? Ho-ho not on your life Doctor - and more to the point, not on mine. Tell you what, you go and have your little chat with him - ha-ha -and I'll be sure to give your remains a decent burial. All of them.'
(His face twitching nervously, the Monk edges towards the altar...) It’s great that I could actually picture Peter Butterworth saying those lines. Thank you! I tried to imagine him standing there, looking shifty in his habit, with William Hartnell giving him a very stern look...
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Likes:
|
Post by Deleted on Feb 5, 2020 1:48:10 GMT
I love how reasonable that sounds from the Monk's perspective. There's nothing to object to there. After all, it all seems perfectly aboveboard. Downright noble, actually. Then, you remember how he intended to do it -- by luring the Vikings into a trap and blowing them all away with an atomic cannon. Atomic, in the nuclear sense, going by sixies lingo: That's where I think the antagonistic element of him lies. He's not overtly destructive, not a villain in the capital 'V' sense. His whole schtick is essentially that of an extremely poor tourist. Someone who shouts over the tour guide that they learnt about the museum's exhibition differently. If he actually took any measure of responsibility for his actions... He probably wouldn't even be opposed to the Doctor. But then, ho-hum, where's the fun in that? 'Talk to him? Tell a Viking king to stop invading places and killing people? Ho-ho not on your life Doctor - and more to the point, not on mine. Tell you what, you go and have your little chat with him - ha-ha -and I'll be sure to give your remains a decent burial. All of them.'
(His face twitching nervously, the Monk edges towards the altar...) You see the dilemma. That's one of the Doctor's skills, I think. His ability to strut around the courts of kings and lords, and singularly fail to get his head cut off. He's far more interesting alive. In fact, one of my favourite ever moments comes from The Doctor's Tale. Trickster 'magicks'. A sleight of hand with superstition. Driving away the wicked archbishop with a show of misrule and chaos. Just a show, of course. Take a modern day projector to the woods and the Vikings could be warded away from the village by the All-Father. Might even be able to trick them into believing the Monk's Loki. *taps lip thoughtfully*
|
|
|
Post by mark687 on Feb 6, 2020 15:22:51 GMT
More Subterfuge Details
Regards
mark687
|
|
|
Post by slithe on Feb 15, 2020 12:55:42 GMT
With the publicity and the DWM interview, I have high hopes for Subterfuge. I hope this is just as good as it sounds!
I do think BF need to make up their mind with the MR and release the details/what is happening next. Whilst I like the idea of not giving too much away (if that is the case), this either needs to be articulated or the changes confirmed. Change is always risky, but if it is managed well, then it will be fine. The radio silence, to a certain extent, just suggests apathy.
|
|
lidar2
Castellan
You know, now that you mention it, I actually do rather like Attack of the Cybermen ...
Likes: 5,811
Member is Online
|
Post by lidar2 on Feb 15, 2020 20:02:10 GMT
With the publicity and the DWM interview, I have high hopes for Subterfuge. I hope this is just as good as it sounds! I do think BF need to make up their mind with the MR and release the details/what is happening next. Whilst I like the idea of not giving too much away (if that is the case), this either needs to be articulated or the changes confirmed. Change is always risky, but if it is managed well, then it will be fine. The radio silence, to a certain extent, just suggests apathy. We've seen it before. BF make a bad situation worse or - the way this is shaping up - an ok situation bad, by their policy of radio silence.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Likes:
|
Post by Deleted on Feb 15, 2020 21:54:55 GMT
Change is always risky, but if it is managed well, then it will be fine. The radio silence, to a certain extent, just suggests apathy. "If it is managed well" being the operative words! Previous experience has taught most of us that handling negative news is not something BF usually excel at. I think they should just announce their intentions with regard to the MR going forward and get it over with, or stop dropping hints about a format change. It's almost like their attitude is, if we say the MR is changing enough times it'll make everything alright...
|
|
|
Post by Audio Watchdog on Feb 15, 2020 22:11:45 GMT
Change is always risky, but if it is managed well, then it will be fine. The radio silence, to a certain extent, just suggests apathy. "If it is managed well" being the operative words! Previous experience has taught most of us that handling negative news is not something BF usually excel at. I think they should just announce their intentions with regard to the MR going forward and get it over with, or stop dropping hints about a format change. It's almost like their attitude is, if we say the MR is changing enough times it'll make everything alright... I get the abundance of caution. Their entire company is founded around the Main Range and the business model of subscriptions helping finance the range. I also get it is a changing market and if they want to grow their business they need to look at everything and make hard choices. They need to factor in health & availability of a lot of actors. They need to look at the long term viability of paying fees to the BBC for producing Doctor Who audios when in a few years they might not have as many Doctors recording for them. So many things a small company like Big Finish has to consider. All that said, this cryptic way of teasing it out does them no favors.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Likes:
|
Post by Deleted on Feb 15, 2020 22:22:07 GMT
It'll be interesting to see what the plan is. When people say the MR is the backbone of BF, that's not just some romantic notion as it's how we old fans got our stories years before boxsets. It's the financials too. We can (or could) sub YEARS in advance and pay accordingly. Money in the bank for BF without having to reveal anything or announce one thing. We were buying blind, especially those of us who bought the wonderful supersub. Now that money was guaranteed, almost like a rolling direct debit. In the boxset model that aspect kinda goes and you're left with having to come up with something to sell your audience on every time you make an announcement of a new set. There's something like the subscriptions in the bundles but most ranges don't have those for more than a couple of releases. So that money for the boxsets, I think, is a harder get for BF than the MR subs. Yet they know the numbers internally and clearly think something needs tweaking. It may not be anywhere near as radical as we think.
|
|
|
Post by Audio Watchdog on Feb 15, 2020 22:28:04 GMT
Yet they know the numbers internally and clearly think something needs tweaking. It may not be anywhere near as radical as we think. This is very true.
|
|
lidar2
Castellan
You know, now that you mention it, I actually do rather like Attack of the Cybermen ...
Likes: 5,811
Member is Online
|
Post by lidar2 on Feb 16, 2020 9:23:10 GMT
Change is always risky, but if it is managed well, then it will be fine. The radio silence, to a certain extent, just suggests apathy. Previous experience has taught most of us that handling negative news is not something BF usually excel at. True, but changes to the MR are not, or at least need not be, negative news.
|
|
lidar2
Castellan
You know, now that you mention it, I actually do rather like Attack of the Cybermen ...
Likes: 5,811
Member is Online
|
Post by lidar2 on Feb 16, 2020 9:26:21 GMT
Yet they know the numbers internally and clearly think something needs tweaking. It may not be anywhere near as radical as we think. This is very true. The behind the scenes split into 3 separate production teams has already happened. I think all that remains to be done will be more of a superficial rebranding than anything else, combined with Dr specific bundle/subscription options
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Likes:
|
Post by Deleted on Feb 16, 2020 13:18:26 GMT
changes to the MR are not, or at least need not be, negative news. People who don't like change could consider anything that diverges from the status quo as bad news!!!
|
|
|
Post by Audio Watchdog on Feb 16, 2020 13:30:38 GMT
changes to the MR are not, or at least need not be, negative news. People who don't like change could consider anything that diverges from the status quo as bad news!!! Change is the only true reality my friend.
|
|
|
Post by fingersmash on Feb 16, 2020 22:02:46 GMT
My theory is that everything will be formatted like Tom's series. 2 boxes per Doctor per year with 4 to 8 stories total for each Doctor with a Multi-Doctor or an extra solo Doctor box slid in at some point in the year.
|
|
|
Post by themeddlingmonk on Feb 16, 2020 22:11:48 GMT
My theory is that everything will be formatted like Tom's series. 2 boxes per Doctor per year with 4 to 8 stories total for each Doctor with a Multi-Doctor or an extra solo Doctor box slid in at some point in the year. Yeah, I also suspect that this will be the case.
|
|
|
Post by Digi on Feb 16, 2020 22:13:34 GMT
With the publicity and the DWM interview, I have high hopes for Subterfuge. I hope this is just as good as it sounds! I do think BF need to make up their mind with the MR and release the details/what is happening next. Whilst I like the idea of not giving too much away (if that is the case), this either needs to be articulated or the changes confirmed. Change is always risky, but if it is managed well, then it will be fine. The radio silence, to a certain extent, just suggests apathy. Agreed...not least because my current MR subscription concludes next month, and I don't want to buy too far ahead if the structure is going to change!
|
|
|
Post by Audio Watchdog on Feb 16, 2020 22:52:13 GMT
With the publicity and the DWM interview, I have high hopes for Subterfuge. I hope this is just as good as it sounds! I do think BF need to make up their mind with the MR and release the details/what is happening next. Whilst I like the idea of not giving too much away (if that is the case), this either needs to be articulated or the changes confirmed. Change is always risky, but if it is managed well, then it will be fine. The radio silence, to a certain extent, just suggests apathy. Agreed...not least because my current MR subscription concludes next month, and I don't want to buy too far ahead if the structure is going to change! You can only subscribe through March of 2021. So nothing holding you back for at least a six month sub.
|
|