Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 17, 2020 19:45:35 GMT
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Post by sherlock on Jul 1, 2020 9:07:26 GMT
At midnight last night the deadline for any extension to the transition period passed.
The UK will be leaving the single market and customs union on 31st December-Deal or no deal.
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Post by johnhurtdoctor on Jul 1, 2020 9:39:57 GMT
At midnight last night the deadline for any extension to the transition period passed. The UK will be leaving the single market and customs union on 31st December-Deal or no deal. RIP UK
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Post by sherlock on Sept 6, 2020 20:33:08 GMT
So you all remember that great, ‘oven ready’ deal? Yeah the government’s changed its mind on that.
Oh and there’s been the usual sabre-rattling no deal rhetoric from the government, but that’s nothing new.
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lidar2
Castellan
You know, now that you mention it, I actually do rather like Attack of the Cybermen ...
Likes: 5,811
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Post by lidar2 on Sept 7, 2020 11:25:27 GMT
So you all remember that great, ‘oven ready’ deal? Yeah the government’s changed its mind on that. Oh and there’s been the usual sabre-rattling no deal rhetoric from the government, but that’s nothing new. I think this tactic is straight out of the Dominic Cummings playbook - announce what you're doing, stick to your guns and give 2 fingers to anyone who doesn't like it, and the spineless cretins will either back down or be left impotently on the sidelines. To be fair, in some ways it has worked well for him so far - lies plastered to the side of a bus in the referendum, expelling the 21 rebel Tory MPs, breaking lockdown rules, getting Sajid Javid sacked, etc. David Cameron had the measure of him - "career psychopath". I think Cummings is up to his usual tricks and believes this will force the EU to cave. Sooner or later he will come a cropper if he carries on like this. For the sake of the country, I hope it is sooner.
On the other hand, given all they have to lose from a no-deal brexit, perhaps this is all just laying the groundwork to spin a British capitulation as a negotiating triumph for Boris - that was after all the tactic that was so electorally successful for them in 2019.
In 2017 UK exports to the EU were 48% of all UK goods exported, whereas EU exports of goods to the UK was 6.2% of all EU goods exported. www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-46612362 It's very clear where the power lies in the EU-UK relationship and it's not in London. So on balance I think this just a bluff intended to spook Brussels that the UK really might be mad enough to go for no-deal in the hope of getting more concessions, with the added bonus of looking tough so the UK's subsequent capitulation is easier to spin against Farage.
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lidar2
Castellan
You know, now that you mention it, I actually do rather like Attack of the Cybermen ...
Likes: 5,811
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Post by lidar2 on Sept 7, 2020 13:56:24 GMT
Good line from German MEP Bernd Lange today: "The British illusion of sovereignty will lead to the greatest loss of sovereignty in British history."
Excellent summary of Brexit.
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Post by johnhurtdoctor on Sept 8, 2020 10:50:57 GMT
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Post by sherlock on Sept 8, 2020 12:20:13 GMT
Erm...so the government’s proposals are breaking international law, but somehow in a way that’s ok?
That’s a new one.
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Post by johnhurtdoctor on Sept 8, 2020 12:26:17 GMT
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Post by johnhurtdoctor on Sept 10, 2020 12:09:21 GMT
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lidar2
Castellan
You know, now that you mention it, I actually do rather like Attack of the Cybermen ...
Likes: 5,811
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Post by lidar2 on Sept 10, 2020 15:51:06 GMT
So the EU is taking us to court.
Brexit was always going to collide with reality sooner or later - must admit I thought it would be after 1st January.
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Post by sherlock on Sept 11, 2020 17:22:53 GMT
Well that renders the negotiations a bit moot.
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Post by number13 on Sept 11, 2020 23:15:36 GMT
Well that renders the negotiations a bit moot. So if I've got this right...
The Government now objects to some part of the WA which would apply to NI only in the event of No Deal. The Government aims to pass legislation that would give it the power to break that part of the WA, in the event of No Deal. The Government still wants to negotiate a deal and the E.U. still wants to negotiate too. If there is a deal, the power to break the WA could not be used because the part of the WA it would apply to would never come into force.
But the E.U. Parliament objects to the Government taking the power to break the the WA in the event of No Deal and says if the legislation is passed, it won't ratify any trade deal. So even if a deal is negotiated with the E.U. their Parliament would ensure there would still be No Deal and the Government could then use the power it has taken to break the WA.
I must be missing something or is this as nuts as I think it is? Leaving aside the moral/legal/political principle of not breaking an agreement already signed, why raise the prospect now when a deal may still be possible? This seems like the circular argument over the 'Backstop', all over again.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 12, 2020 9:29:39 GMT
Well that renders the negotiations a bit moot. So if I've got this right...
The Government now objects to some part of the WA which would apply to NI only in the event of No Deal. The Government aims to pass legislation that would give it the power to break that part of the WA, in the event of No Deal. The Government still wants to negotiate a deal and the E.U. still wants to negotiate too. If there is a deal, the power to break the WA could not be used because the part of the WA it would apply to would never come into force.
But the E.U. Parliament objects to the Government taking the power to break the the WA in the event of No Deal and says if the legislation is passed, it won't ratify any trade deal. So even if a deal is negotiated with the E.U. their Parliament would ensure there would still be No Deal and the Government could then use the power it has taken to break the WA.
I must be missing something or is this as nuts as I think it is? Leaving aside the moral/legal/political principle of not breaking an agreement already signed, why raise the prospect now when a deal may still be possible? This seems like the circular argument over the 'Backstop', all over again.
"T'was ever thus."
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lidar2
Castellan
You know, now that you mention it, I actually do rather like Attack of the Cybermen ...
Likes: 5,811
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Post by lidar2 on Sept 14, 2020 8:28:00 GMT
Hard to see how this ends well for Boris and Dom
Either they get a humiliating egg-on-face climbdown, or else the continue on their present course and the UK gets the short and long term pain of no deal, plus the possible break-up of the UK.
I think they underestimated the strength of the reaction to what was intended as a bit of brinkmanship and playing to the gallery in the red wall. They thought that there would be a bit of complaining which would then be forgotten about when Boris had another negotiating surrender, er . . *cough* . . triumph like he did last year.
I also think Boris is eroding his own position amongst Conservative MPs in the medium to longer term. Even before BJ became PM, there was very little love for Dom even amongxt the brexiteers, most of whom he made no secret of his contempt for during the referendum. And then there are the more centrist Tory voters who were prepared to vote for him in 2019 when the alternative was Corbyn, but are not up for turning the UK into a rogue state. If Boris and Dom continue along their current course they could well end up trashing the Tory brand and putting the Conservative Party out of power for a generation.
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Post by johnhurtdoctor on Sept 14, 2020 10:15:30 GMT
So first this government decides it can break international law & now Boris Johnson is planning to opt out of parts of the Human Rights Act! This country is sleepwalking into a fascist dictatorship.
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Post by sherlock on Sept 14, 2020 11:37:25 GMT
Cummings expelling a load of MPs from the Tory Party for daring to question him is becoming an annual tradition it seems. Something to bridge the start of school year and Halloween, I suppose.
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Post by number13 on Sept 14, 2020 19:47:33 GMT
Cummings expelling a load of MPs from the Tory Party for daring to question him is becoming an annual tradition it seems. Something to bridge the start of school year and Halloween, I suppose. "I'm A Backbencher - Get Me Out of Here!"
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Post by sherlock on Sept 17, 2020 8:12:41 GMT
So yesterday the Government compromised with the Tory rebels, and will apparently amend the Internal Market Bill to give more parliamentary oversight on the powers it gives ministers.
Meanwhile internationally, the Government’s actions aren’t going down so well...
‘Global Britain’ is of to a bad start...
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Post by number13 on Sept 17, 2020 12:24:47 GMT
There's always a lot of appealing to the powerful Irish-American demographic before an election. And it's perfectly possible that they end up with Pres. Biden and a GOP House (seems odd from a UK perspective but I think a lot of the Dem House wins in 2018 were very marginal and this is an 'odd' election all round...) which might well be the ideal outcome for us, though probably not for them with more 'deadlock'.
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