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Post by omega on Nov 22, 2015 6:01:02 GMT
I wasn't sure about Sara Kingdom. Since I haven't seen and it doesn't exist (as far as we know) I can't really speak to what happens in that episode. But I will change my statement: It is the first time in my experience that they have shown the companion while he/she is dying. The narration describes Sara aging to death, so I imagine that it was seen on screen. Whether or not she counts as a companion is another question though. She experienced a number of distinct, separate situations with the Doctor (mainly in Short Trips and Companion Chronicles), specifically spent six months travelling with him (as stated in the beginning of the novelisation for the second half of DMP), despite only appearing on TV in a single narrative. Blackpool and Hollywood in Feast of Steven should be enough to qualify for a couple of Short Trips-style stories. I think of her as a companion, and the stories she's in with Big Finish definitely qualify as such. Sara is far more of a companion than Katerina was, and appeared in more TV episodes.
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Post by david on Nov 22, 2015 7:44:14 GMT
Also...the front cover has Clara in a costume and setting we haven't seen this series...hmmm Though that looked rather Photoshopped (or am I missing the joke?) There's pics of Capaldi at the same diner set inside. I'd be very, very surprised if Jenna doesn't appear in that costume, in that setting, in the finale.
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Post by david on Nov 22, 2015 7:45:53 GMT
I wasn't sure about Sara Kingdom. Since I haven't seen and it doesn't exist (as far as we know) I can't really speak to what happens in that episode. But I will change my statement: It is the first time in my experience that they have shown the companion while he/she is dying. The narration describes Sara aging to death, so I imagine that it was seen on screen. Whether or not she counts as a companion is another question though. You don't need to trust narration, the telesnaps in the recon show her death and its pretty distressing to watch. It's very, very graphic for the time.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 22, 2015 7:54:58 GMT
Clara's death was only prolonged if you already knew what was going to happen. A real example of a proper spoiler. I thought it was going on a bit, my eleven year old son, who had no idea what was going to happen, got tenser and tenser throughout as he was willing the Doctor to come up with a last second save.
Sadly after the end, you could tell where Moffat has gone wrong when he asked if she was "proper dead, like Adric" or if she'd be back.
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Post by seeley on Nov 22, 2015 7:55:57 GMT
Though that looked rather Photoshopped (or am I missing the joke?) There's pics of Capaldi at the same diner set inside. I'd be very, very surprised if Jenna doesn't appear in that costume, in that setting, in the finale. Interesting. What's the context?
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Post by omega on Nov 22, 2015 8:02:47 GMT
Clara's death was only prolonged if you already knew what was going to happen. A real example of a proper spoiler. I thought it was going on a bit, my eleven year old son, who had no idea what was going to happen, got tenser and tenser throughout as he was willing the Doctor to come up with a last second save. Sadly after the end, you could tell where Moffat has gone wrong when he asked if she was "proper dead, like Adric" or if she'd be back. Adric came back in a Big Finish! Albeit a marmite story penned by Paul Magrs with giant scorpions, Adric played by Andrew Sachs and one of the guest characters played by Adrian Scarborough (for me best known from Miranda, as dreamboat/ping pong Charlie who bloody loves crisps!).
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Post by Timelord007 on Nov 22, 2015 8:25:28 GMT
A average story which was lifted to above average by Peter Capaldi's brilliant performance as the Doctor, who has quite honestly delivered exceptional performances throughout season 9.
This maybe Claras end but no doubt one of her splinters will feature in the finale.
I'd rate this episode 7/10
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Post by Tim Bradley on Nov 22, 2015 8:47:33 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Nov 22, 2015 9:00:53 GMT
The narration describes Sara aging to death, so I imagine that it was seen on screen. Not to mention the fact that an actress was hired exclusively to play the aged Sara. And that Jean Marsh describes the experience in an interview on the Loose Canon reconstruction of the serial. Apparently she was put in layers and layers of makeup between certain shots to present something much like Ayesha's demise in She and the death itself sounds extremely graphic for something that might have been done off-screen. Plus considering Kert Gantry's death where we see him get exterminated point blank, it's very unlikely that they shied away from what eventually happened to the Space Security Service agent. Not to mention, Katarina who we see floating peacefully in space with her crazed would-be murderer as she suffocates to death, moments after she blows the both of them straight out of the airlock. I was very impressed by "Face the Raven", I thought the worldbuilding they were able to put together in forty-five minutes for the trap street was breathtaking and Clara's eventual fate was very poignant for someone who on occasion could have been replaced with a lamp. Capaldi and Coleman really do make you feel it.
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Post by TinDogPodcast on Nov 22, 2015 9:13:33 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Nov 22, 2015 13:14:48 GMT
A average story which was lifted to above average by Peter Capaldi's brilliant performance as the Doctor, who has quite honestly delivered exceptional performances throughout season 9. This maybe Claras end but no doubt one of her splinters will feature in the finale. I'd rate this episode 7/10 Not expecting one of her splinters, I think it's a matrix illusion
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Post by Deleted on Nov 22, 2015 13:26:05 GMT
Clara dying was great. Although Clara coming back in some shape or form in the finale is very likely. An ok episode, not as strong as some of the earlier episodes of the season, but reasonably entertaining. I'd go 6/10 for this myself.
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Post by kimalysong on Nov 22, 2015 19:01:49 GMT
I actually felt for a long-term companions exit Clsra's was very underwhelming. Not a bad episode but I was expecting a bit more.
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Post by Audio Watchdog on Nov 22, 2015 21:00:34 GMT
In a season that has bristled with confidence, this was one of the most assured & confident episodes the show has produced. Calpaldi & Coleman were fantastic. Murray Gold turned in some of his best work and the episode looked gorgeous. I really respect the way Clara's death was handled. That in the end it was all for nothing is a really brave choice for the show. The easy choice would be to have Clara's death be this grand statement, saving the street & The Doctor but the way it was written seemed much more powerful to me. In the end Clara faced her end with dignity and by protecting the people around her from The Doctor & his grief. I don't know if this is the last we see of Clara but I hope it is. To bring her back would undercut the strength her character displayed in her final moments.
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Post by ausir on Nov 23, 2015 1:28:45 GMT
She didn't quite count as a companion back then, but she does by now, thanks to Big Finish.
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Post by Hieronymus on Nov 23, 2015 5:16:38 GMT
Is Clara now in competition with Rory for Most Companion Deaths?
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Post by Hieronymus on Nov 23, 2015 5:21:28 GMT
I wasn't sure about Sara Kingdom. Since I haven't seen and it doesn't exist (as far as we know) I can't really speak to what happens in that episode. But I will change my statement: It is the first time in my experience that they have shown the companion while he/she is dying. We saw Sara Kingdom die on screen. There still exists a series of production stills showing her age to death. The Face of Boe also passed away on screen (aka You Know Who). We've also seen not-Rory turn to dust. . . and real Rory fade to nothingness. You could make the argument that we saw Adric die. And we would have seen Peri die on screen if JNT hadn't backed out at the last minute.
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Post by omega on Nov 23, 2015 5:37:49 GMT
I actually felt for a long-term companions exit Clsra's was very underwhelming. Not a bad episode but I was expecting a bit more. At least it wasn't overplayed and overly dramatic. Rose, Martha and Donna each exited stage left at the end of hugely dramatic finales and the Ponds got a five episode farewell tour. In comparison Clara's exit was quiet.
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Post by icecreamdf on Nov 23, 2015 6:49:34 GMT
Is Clara now in competition with Rory for Most Companion Deaths? It depends whether or not you count the splinters as part of Clara, or as separate individuals. Either way, I'm pretty sure Jack is winning.
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There’s a horror movie called Alien? That’s really offensive. No wonder everyone keeps invading you.
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Post by shutupbanks on Nov 23, 2015 10:30:16 GMT
I liked it. It wasn't the best episode of the season, but it was far from the worst. And, since there has been a pretty high level of quality this season, I don't think there has actually been a bad episode this season... so far. The setting was terrific and Clara's death was so well done. I will be annoyed if she does come back, even as a splinter, this season: I think we need a good, long break before something like that should happen. Capaldi nailed it, all the way through. I hated the cue cards, when they appeared in episode 3, but here they were genuinely moving, and the Doctor, trying so hard not to break his promise at the end, was astonishingly powerful. The only thing that really took me out of it was looking at the street when Clara fell down, and I wondered where all the leaves had come from: the street looked to be enclosed and there was very little plant life of any kind there, so why was Clara lying in leaves?
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