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Post by Deleted on Apr 1, 2020 9:12:25 GMT
I'd kinda flip this on it's head a bit, playing a bit of devil's advocate perhaps but I think the originals have had lots of love since BF started, honestly. People took to Evelyn, Hex or Lucie no problem. Klein and D.I. Menzies are two of the most popular pseudo-companions ever. If a release with Constance and Flip is announced I never see anyone look down on it because they're not TV canon companions.
If anything I think there's a case to be made that the under-appreciated companions are the ones who get "Oh, not them again" posts from listeners, like when there's "too much Leela" or "It'd be nice to have more Davison without Nyssa" or "Haven't they done enough with Ace?" - there are loads of those kinda comments online when something with the TV companions is announced. There are even people bored with hearing Tom and Lalla together - it's a minor miracle they agreed to work on the same projects in the first place! I think the likes of Lou Jameson often get overlooked as the rather stunning and versatile performer she is, and Sarah Sutton for being ridiculously good at being what a companion "should" be like. They're effortless. I think there's much to be said in familiarity breeding if not contempt then at least indifference.
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lidar2
Castellan
You know, now that you mention it, I actually do rather like Attack of the Cybermen ...
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Post by lidar2 on Apr 1, 2020 10:19:36 GMT
I'd kinda flip this on it's head a bit, playing a bit of devil's advocate perhaps but I think the originals have had lots of love since BF started, honestly. People took to Evelyn, Hex or Lucie no problem. Klein and D.I. Menzies are two of the most popular pseudo-companions ever. If a release with Constance and Flip is announced I never see anyone look down on it because they're not TV canon companions. If anything I think there's a case to be made that the under-appreciated companions are the ones who get "Oh, not them again" posts from listeners, like when there's "too much Leela" or "It'd be nice to have more Davison without Nyssa" or "Haven't they done enough with Ace?" - there are loads of those kinda comments online when something with the TV companions is announced. There are even people bored with hearing Tom and Lalla together - it's a minor miracle they agreed to work on the same projects in the first place! I think the likes of Lou Jameson often get overlooked as the rather stunning and versatile performer she is, and Sarah Sutton for being ridiculously good at being what a companion "should" be like. They're effortless. I think there's much to be said in familiarity breeding if not contempt then at least indifference. I would argue that all doctors need a healthy turnover of companions. Different companions bring out different aspects of a doctor's character, letting us see new sides of that particular incarnation. The greater the variety of companions the better.
I have said before that I think one of the reasons Six is such a popular dr on audio is because until recently he had the greatest variety of companions on audio. Likewise, whilst I loved the Capaldi era on TV I think it would have been a lot stronger overall had Clara left in series 8 and series 9 featured A N Other companion between Clara and Bill. Part of what makes Tennant's era so satisfying for me is that he had 3 separate companions (with a little overlap). Four and Ann Kelso was wonderfully refreshing last year, my only complaint is they tied up her arc and wrote her out too quickly - I'd have preferred a more leisurely unfolding over a couple of seasons.
I honestly don't think it is a negative criticism of any character/performer to say that they are overused. I would see it as simply a statement of fact - by definition one companion being overused means others are underused and other potential new companions don't get created. If my wife cooked my favourite meal tonight it would be great - but if she kept cooking the exact same meal every night for a month I would soon be sick of it and want a break from it. That's not a criticism of my wife's cooking, it's just reality.* To me that is the fundamental problem with the 3 overused companions (Leela/Nyssa/Ace), not anything in any way bad about the characters themselves or the performances. Imagine if Mrs Gale had hung around for seasons 4-6 of the Avengers - no Mrs Peel or Tara King. Would the overall 6 series be as good?
BF are not the only ones guilty of this - the Virgin New Adventures made the same mistake with Ace, who hung around far too long
The only genuinely negative thing that can be said about TV companions is that they all come with an inbuilt reset switch. BF have to tie in with what we have seen on TV, although to give credit where it is due, BF have done a marvellous job in developing these characters in spite of this limitation. But certain things are off-limits with TV companions - BF can't permanently kill off Jo Grant in the 3DAs, whereas they can kill off Lucie Miller. Tegan and Turlough can't get married, Susan can't regenerate in the 1DAs, etc. Original companions have no such limitations.
I get that there may well be behind the scenes reasons to do with actor availability that govern these artistic choices about which companion is used and that's fair enough - if that is the case then no one can argue about it.
*For the record, I do most of the cooking, the above example is for illustrative purposes only
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Post by polly on Apr 1, 2020 19:28:40 GMT
I'd kinda flip this on it's head a bit, playing a bit of devil's advocate perhaps but I think the originals have had lots of love since BF started, honestly. People took to Evelyn, Hex or Lucie no problem. Klein and D.I. Menzies are two of the most popular pseudo-companions ever. If a release with Constance and Flip is announced I never see anyone look down on it because they're not TV canon companions. If anything I think there's a case to be made that the under-appreciated companions are the ones who get "Oh, not them again" posts from listeners, like when there's "too much Leela" or "It'd be nice to have more Davison without Nyssa" or "Haven't they done enough with Ace?" - there are loads of those kinda comments online when something with the TV companions is announced. There are even people bored with hearing Tom and Lalla together - it's a minor miracle they agreed to work on the same projects in the first place! I think the likes of Lou Jameson often get overlooked as the rather stunning and versatile performer she is, and Sarah Sutton for being ridiculously good at being what a companion "should" be like. They're effortless. I think there's much to be said in familiarity breeding if not contempt then at least indifference. That's an interesting point. I have to confess, I like all three of the over-used companions you mentioned quite a bit. I think for me it's not so much the companions themselves, but what's being done with them. The Old Nyssa thing dragged on for a long time, even past its natural stopping point. But, it's not Nyssa I'm sick of, it's the arc. And I don't think it's just TV companions that are subject to that, just look at the latter half of Charley's tenure with Eight. Leela is a good example of avoiding that, in my opinion, because her appearances have been varied quite a bit. Teacher and Student Leela from the 4DAs is not the same as Gallifrey Leela, and her Jago and Litefoot appearances are different still. Big Finish has done wonders for a lot of these characters, it's just sometimes they get stuck in a rut.
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Post by kurumais on Jun 8, 2021 3:12:28 GMT
i ve been thinking lately "has liv chenka become 8 best companion while no one noticed?"
i LOVE lucie bleedin miller but liv might have surpassed her as 8's best mate. just look at liv's resume. she faced robots of death, survived a dalek occupation, gone to end of
the universe faced the eminance, the master, and the eleven. so far the only major baddies she hasnt faced are the cybermen. she is a grown woman and a doctor in her own right.
her relationship with the doctor is very different, from the younger charlie and lucie. she doesnt have to just follow along she can question the doctor even fight with him. but
no matter the tension between you never get the sense they arent good friends.
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