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Post by grinch on Dec 29, 2020 12:13:17 GMT
As someone who has just been taking a few tentative steps into Time Lord Victorious releases, for those who have consumed most of it what do you think of the overall event? Simply a matter of hit or miss? Or an overall waste of time?
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Post by sherlock on Dec 29, 2020 13:11:23 GMT
As someone who has just been taking a few tentative steps into Time Lord Victorious releases, for those who have consumed most of it what do you think of the overall event? Simply a matter of hit or miss? Or an overall waste of time? I’ve consumed everything except the interactive stuff, Annual, Eaglemoss stuff and Genetics of the Daleks. Overall I think it was worthwhile. I have really enjoyed seeing everything fall into place (so much so I’ve ended up writing a lot of the TARDIS Wiki literature on TLV subjects) and generally the stories have been of decent quality. There’s certainly nothing I’ve regretted experiencing. I do wish that the novels were a bit longer and DWM’s comic linked a bit more (as it is, it just throws some elements and characters in who don’t reappear anywhere). I also wish the Daleks didn’t own so much of the event, as nice as the unique TLV Daleks are I found the Kotturuh much more interesting. Though that said, if future storytelling gave the Daleks individual personalities like this more often I wouldn’t moan so much about them turning up every other month. Its not the greatest Who story ever. But as the first big experiment in multimedia storytelling for Doctor Who, I think it was definitely worthwhile. I hope it’ll lead to more collaboration between the medias in future, maybe on a smaller scale.
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melkur
Chancellery Guard
Likes: 3,964
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Post by melkur on Dec 29, 2020 23:45:16 GMT
I'll echo what Sherlock said - Whilst I don't think that I would consider it to be the greatest arc DW has ever had (but then there have been quite a few over the years), I've been enjoying what I've seen of it and am looking forward to running through it in full when 'Echoes Of Destruction' comes out. (I've done the books, comics, Dalek animated show & BF audios).
My only real complaint is that the 'Beautiful Creatures', the DWM comic, could maybe have benefited from a slightly extended runtime? I enjoy it enough as-is, but I feel that it should have had some more time dedicated to it rather than just 'hitting the beats'...
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Post by shallacatop on Dec 30, 2020 9:55:02 GMT
I’ve consumed it all except A Dalek Awakens and Time Fracture, which I won’t be bothering with, and I’m waiting on Eaglemoss #2 & #3 to arrive. I’ve really enjoyed it and think it’s been a worthwhile experience, certainly not something I’ve regretted buying into. I think it’s worth noting that there’s two things here; the Time Lord Victorious story and the Time Lord Victorious project. The story trilogy of The Waters of Mars, The Knight, The Fool and The Dead & All Flesh is Grass is great. The two books are slight, but that doesn’t affect what we get, which is a pair of fast paced adventures that lovingly recreate the show at the time whilst also pushing the Doctor into a different direction. It’s just they’re so good I’d have been happy to have read more and had certain things expanded upon! The actual project is the story and all of the supporting material, which is also great. It’s nice to get the lead up for the Eighth & Ninth Doctors, but as sherlock said, Monstrous Beauty doesn’t link up as well as it should. It’s probably missing another issue. The Eighth Doctor trilogy is fun and carefree, a nice throwback to his earlier adventures, but has the same issue as Monstrous Beauty in that it doesn’t take us directly into events of the books. The two books do a good job of linking into the audios and comics, so I’m assuming it’s a decision made by DWM & Big Finish respectively to make their contributions all the more standalone. I agree that the Daleks dominate, but I think that’s purely because they have the animated series. I really like the Dalek Time Squad and how distinctive they are. Defender of the Daleks is probably the only thing I’ve been a touch disappointed in, it’s just very meandering and doesn’t do a great deal. That’s more akin to a lot of the Titan Comics, rather than something specifically TLV, though. I’d just like to give The Minds of Magnox a passing reference. Probably the least appealing, given it’s an audiobook not read by any of the cast, but it’s the only item that isn’t standalone. If you’ve been buying into the project, then listening to this feels like a reward. It’s one of those treasures that’s overlooked. I think the epic aspect of Time Lord Victorious comes from the actual story and the sheer effort of getting all of these different licensees to contribute and all of them having their own link to other stories to build up rather the epic. That doesn’t mean the whole project is epic, however, if that makes sense? Personally, if I was to advise someone, I’d say rewatch The Waters of Mars and get the two books. If you enjoy them and want more, then get the audios, read the DWM comic, watch the Daleks! series. I think that works better and helps to keep expectations in check as you see everything link to the core story, rather than expecting them to be their own respective epics. If you’re not keen, then you’ve saved money and filled the gap of just what the Time Lord Victorious was. If you’ve enjoyed it, but don’t feel the need to delve into more, then you’ve got a great Tenth Doctor trilogy. I’d love to have another project like this in the future. In terms of improvement, I think the promotion and release schedule could do with tweaking. Either make it heavily linked, make that explicit in promotion and release them in order. Or do another TLV type affair, but this time make it more explicit that the story is the two books and then everything else connects to give a wider picture of The Dark Times; release the books first and then everything else afterwards. A defined timeline is a must, which was lacking with TLV until well after some stuff was released, as more companies participated. Anyway, enough of my rambling; it’s recommended! Start with the books and see where you want to go from there. I’m very much looking forward to Echoes of Extinction.
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Post by mark687 on Jan 4, 2021 21:52:28 GMT
Speculation
The new UK Lockdown (till at least Middle of February) will probably delay the release of TLV Echoes of Extinction Vinyl again
Regards
mark687
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Post by aussiedoctorwhofan on Jan 4, 2021 22:24:31 GMT
Speculation The new UK Lockdown (till at least Middle of February) will probably delay the release of TLV Echoes of Extinction Vinyl again Regards mark687 Is there a quote/source?
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Post by mark687 on Jan 4, 2021 22:41:44 GMT
Speculation The new UK Lockdown (till at least Middle of February) will probably delay the release of TLV Echoes of Extinction Vinyl again Regards mark687 Is there a quote/source? No it my own Speculation Regards mark687
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Post by whiskeybrewer on Jan 6, 2021 11:50:28 GMT
I reckon the same tbf
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Post by Whovitt on Jan 7, 2021 4:05:38 GMT
Having listened to the two Short Trips, all three Eighth Doctor Audios, Genetics of the Daleks, watched Daleks!, and read Monstrous Beauty and most of the Doctor Who Newsletter shorts, I've finally read The Knight, the Fool and the Dead, and I can't tell you how much of a relief it is to finally have some concept of what the heck this whole thing is about! Until now, all these disparate pieces have been exactly that - random pieces of story that didn't have any real meaning whatsoever. Now I understand where everything's going, I'm starting to get that sense of cohesiveness, and it's a good feeling On The Knight, the Fool and the Dead, it really was quite short, wasn't it? It did everything it needed to though, that being setting up the second novel (and very little else). In terms of being a self-contained story, I can't comment until I've read All Flesh is Grass, as I don't know what's unique to this piece of the overall TLV puzzle, but I think it's worth reading just for the last few pages. Like I say, having experience almost every other piece of ancillary material at this point, it's so rewarding to see it all finally culminating into the epic finale book two seems to be shaping up to be! After reading TKtFatD, I've also just finished Defender of the Daleks. Have to say, I'm not entirely sure what purpose this story has to the over TLV arc, but then I can say the same about Daleks!. Neither really seems to be feeding into the main events (as far as I can see), and as a consequent aren't as rewarding in terms of the TLV experience. Defender also didn't really make a lot of sense to me either (mild spoilers here): why did the Daleks have a vault on Skaro full of their own weapons that they didn't have any ability to open themselves? Just seems really dumb to me. And why aren't the Hond relevant to any other part of TLV? They seem so pointless and throw-away here, knowing they aren't present anywhere else in TLV really undercuts any sort of threat they may have posed. Anyway, now I've just got to get the last book and I'm just about finished. At this point, I'm prepared to say that TLV has been worthwhile. I love long-form, sprawling stories, so this kind of thing was always going to be right up my alley. What's more important is that it's connected enough to feel rewarding to me, so I would recommend trying to pick it up if anyone is still unsure
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Post by mark687 on Jan 8, 2021 17:13:23 GMT
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Post by sherlock on Jan 8, 2021 23:39:43 GMT
Having listened to the two Short Trips, all three Eighth Doctor Audios, Genetics of the Daleks, watched Daleks!, and read Monstrous Beauty and most of the Doctor Who Newsletter shorts, I've finally read The Knight, the Fool and the Dead, and I can't tell you how much of a relief it is to finally have some concept of what the heck this whole thing is about! Until now, all these disparate pieces have been exactly that - random pieces of story that didn't have any real meaning whatsoever. Now I understand where everything's going, I'm starting to get that sense of cohesiveness, and it's a good feeling On The Knight, the Fool and the Dead, it really was quite short, wasn't it? It did everything it needed to though, that being setting up the second novel (and very little else). In terms of being a self-contained story, I can't comment until I've read All Flesh is Grass, as I don't know what's unique to this piece of the overall TLV puzzle, but I think it's worth reading just for the last few pages. Like I say, having experience almost every other piece of ancillary material at this point, it's so rewarding to see it all finally culminating into the epic finale book two seems to be shaping up to be! After reading TKtFatD, I've also just finished Defender of the Daleks. Have to say, I'm not entirely sure what purpose this story has to the over TLV arc, but then I can say the same about Daleks!. Neither really seems to be feeding into the main events (as far as I can see), and as a consequent aren't as rewarding in terms of the TLV experience. Defender also didn't really make a lot of sense to me either (mild spoilers here): why did the Daleks have a vault on Skaro full of their own weapons that they didn't have any ability to open themselves? Just seems really dumb to me. And why aren't the Hond relevant to any other part of TLV? They seem so pointless and throw-away here, knowing they aren't present anywhere else in TLV really undercuts any sort of threat they may have posed. Anyway, now I've just got to get the last book and I'm just about finished. At this point, I'm prepared to say that TLV has been worthwhile. I love long-form, sprawling stories, so this kind of thing was always going to be right up my alley. What's more important is that it's connected enough to feel rewarding to me, so I would recommend trying to pick it up if anyone is still unsure Glad you’re enjoying it. The novels are definitely the main meat of the event. The Titan comic is an odd one. At the time of release it was just a standalone introduction for the TLV Daleks, but has been kinda superseded by Daleks! in that capacity. It’s probably got more relevance to the ongoing 10/13 crossovers than TLV itself. It is very weird that it makes such a big deal about the Hond.
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Post by tuigirl on Jan 10, 2021 15:45:10 GMT
Finished All Flesh is Grass. Maybe it is my current mood, but this was not my cup of tea at all. Basically one big confusing run around, breathless pacing, space battles and Daleks screeching "Exterminate". The plot just hurdles along at breakneck speed and there is no time to breathe and take in and understand the situation.
Also, none of the side characters get anything close to character development, and at times, I found it hard to keep track of the jumping between scenes and which Doctor was which.
The 10th Doctor as a villain is a nice idea, however, I could not get my head around the 10th Doctors motivations here for behaving so out of character. I somehow got a real "uncanny valley" effect from his behaviour and thought processes here. Weird. In retrospect, and I know I repeat myself here, the whole TLV event left me a bit disappointed. It just did not gel that well together and it was not really what I had expected.
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Post by constonks on Jan 10, 2021 22:18:39 GMT
I'm a bit behind because I was waiting for TKTF&TD to hit the library - now that I got it, I raced through it. As everyone said, it's short but it also just MOVES. Nothing lingers at all. This is like a Target novelization of a seven part story - here's the scene, keep moving, here's another scene! A lot of fun, and all very cinematic. Looking forward to Part 2 but I'm going to relisten to the Eighth Doc audios, reread Defender and rewatch Daleks! before I read AFIG.
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Post by aussiedoctorwhofan on Jan 12, 2021 10:58:26 GMT
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Post by mark687 on Jan 12, 2021 13:05:24 GMT
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Post by shallacatop on Jan 12, 2021 13:18:28 GMT
It’d be good if they could work something out to get the download released. The longer this will take, the more momentum they lose. I am keen on this being the last story piece of Time Lord Victorious, as it seems apt as a Tenth Doctor epilogue, but realistically you can only leave it so long before it loses its impact.
Obviously COVID is out of their control, and the release itself is a bit of an oddity between two companies, but if they could bite the bullet and make the download available I think that’d suffice for the time being.
I am interested in the vinyl too, but realistically I won’t be sticking that on any time I want to hear the story, especially as a lot of my Big Finish listening is done on the move!
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Post by aussiedoctorwhofan on Jan 23, 2021 22:22:00 GMT
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Post by theillusiveman on Jan 24, 2021 1:42:53 GMT
Given that I’ve only listened to the Big Fonish audio selection of TLV I felt that it could have been done so much better like don’t get me wrong Stoey 1&2 flow into each other nicely due to being interconnected but going from 2 to 3 Is so jarring (I know there is a novel set there but big finish could have had flashback to key scenes or dialogue to explain what happened) Also surprised there weren’t more short trips with Dudman as 9 or 10
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Post by eldersensorite on Jan 24, 2021 12:09:55 GMT
Having experienced pretty much all the TLV content I'm going to my verdict was... underwhelming. It kinda felt like everything was building up to more and setting up something else so the stories were never allowed to just... be stories in their own right. I wonder how just a small change in emphasis could've improved the project a lot, say if they released the two books as an initially standalone thing and then afterwards said "hey, now we're doing audios and comics that tie into those books" and each of those were complete stories in their own right. I guess it's natural to compare to Star Wars: The High Republic now that's getting going, and I've only read one book of that so far but I felt like I read a complete story which is something I never felt after a TLV story
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Post by coffeeaddict on Jan 24, 2021 16:45:46 GMT
Having experienced pretty much all the TLV content I'm going to my verdict was... underwhelming. It kinda felt like everything was building up to more and setting up something else so the stories were never allowed to just... be stories in their own right. I wonder how just a small change in emphasis could've improved the project a lot, say if they released the two books as an initially standalone thing and then afterwards said "hey, now we're doing audios and comics that tie into those books" and each of those were complete stories in their own right. I guess it's natural to compare to Star Wars: The High Republic now that's getting going, and I've only read one book of that so far but I felt like I read a complete story which is something I never felt after a TLV story I think that might be the nicest way to describe what has been a massive swing and a miss. This storyline has been overhyped and has underdelivered. Even taken on their own the audio stories have been "meh". The comic was poorly plotted and likely would have worked better as a backup story rather than a full run. The only thing stopping the books from receiving the title of worst in recent years are the abysmal offerings from Eric Saward.
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