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Post by theillusiveman on Jun 7, 2020 12:48:19 GMT
Having watched The Trial of a Time Lord recently i was wondering was there ever a story which The Master learns that The Valeyard is The Doctor? i know there was {Spoiler} The Ending of The End of The Line had The Master meeting The Valeyard but they both knew each other at that point so i was wondering now that Jon Culshaw is playing The Ainley Master would Big Finish ever consider giving us The First encounter of The Valeyard and The Master?
or should that remain a mystery due to the nature of The Valeyard?
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Post by johnhurtdoctor on Jun 7, 2020 12:53:20 GMT
Not something I have any interest in. But BF can't resist explaining every mystery so I'm sure it will happen.
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Post by theillusiveman on Jun 7, 2020 12:58:41 GMT
Not something I have any interest in. But BF can't resist explaining every mystery so I'm sure it will happen. Well Michael Jayston is 85 Years old so if they are going to do Valeyard stories then they should do it soon
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Post by Deleted on Jun 7, 2020 13:26:39 GMT
Having watched The Trial of a Time Lord recently i was wondering was there ever a story which The Master learns that The Valeyard is The Doctor? i know there was {Spoiler}The Ending of The End of The Line had The Master meeting The Valeyard but they both knew each other at that point so i was wondering now that Jon Culshaw is playing The Ainley Master would Big Finish ever consider giving us The First encounter of The Valeyard and The Master?
or should that remain a mystery due to the nature of The Valeyard?
It hasn't been done by Big Finish, yet. Time's Champion's has an implied revelation. Its prologue depicts the Master encountering him for the first time, from his perspective, via the Matrix on the orders of Vansell (at this stage, the Doctor's old friend was the intended prosecution, not the Valeyard). I've a pet theory that the Master and the Valeyard have been in each other's business for a long while before The Trial of a Time Lord. Many a thwarted scheme lies between those two. I think the Master ended up using Glitz and Dibber as reliable henchmen for missions where it was too dangerous for him to turn up in person.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 7, 2020 13:42:23 GMT
Having watched The Trial of a Time Lord recently i was wondering was there ever a story which The Master learns that The Valeyard is The Doctor? i know there was {Spoiler} The Ending of The End of The Line had The Master meeting The Valeyard but they both knew each other at that point so i was wondering now that Jon Culshaw is playing The Ainley Master would Big Finish ever consider giving us The First encounter of The Valeyard and The Master?
or should that remain a mystery due to the nature of The Valeyard?
Unless Big Finish came up with a really great storyline to bring about the first meeting of the Master with the Valeyard, I'd be content to leave it as it is - a mystery.
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Post by fitzoliverj on Jun 7, 2020 14:32:56 GMT
I've said for years I hoped that one day that the Main Range would be varied to allow other Doctors in - particularly Michael Jayston credited as the Doctor. Three trilogies could have shown him develop from a desperate refugee from whatever-his-origin-was to being a more mercenary and ruthless version of the Doctor to being outright villainous and intending to destroy his earlier self*. One of these stories could have ideally pitted him against the Beevers Master.
*I envisaged that the last story would be set after the JaystonDoc discovers he lacks a future wihtout acquiring regenerations, and has him land on a planet that the a particularly nasty version of the sixth Doctor is fighting to destroy. They would never meet, but JaystonDoc would fight to stop him. It would end with JaystonDoc vowing vengeance but the listener would then realise they'd heard it all from his outrageously-bisaed point of view and actually the sixth Doctor had done what he did because the alternative was a worse choice.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 7, 2020 14:45:57 GMT
I've said for years I hoped that one day that the Main Range would be varied to allow other Doctors in - particularly Michael Jayston credited as the Doctor. Three trilogies could have shown him develop from a desperate refugee from whatever-his-origin-was to being a more mercenary and ruthless version of the Doctor to being outright villainous and intending to destroy his earlier self*. One of these stories could have ideally pitted him against the Beevers Master. *I envisaged that the last story would be set after the JaystonDoc discovers he lacks a future wihtout acquiring regenerations, and has him land on a planet that the a particularly nasty version of the sixth Doctor is fighting to destroy. They would never meet, but JaystonDoc would fight to stop him. It would end with JaystonDoc vowing vengeance but the listener would then realise they'd heard it all from his outrageously-bisaed point of view and actually the sixth Doctor had done what he did because the alternative was a worse choice. I like it! Call Briggs!
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Post by whiskeybrewer on Jun 7, 2020 18:14:03 GMT
Maybe it'll happen during TLV
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Post by xlozdob on Jun 8, 2020 0:59:29 GMT
Maybe it'll happen during TLV The Valeyard in TLV would be so perfect! I've always assumed that's right about when he originated anyways.
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Post by commonman on Jun 22, 2020 19:10:17 GMT
I'm pretty sure that The End of the Line --from the 6th doctor regeneration audio boxset-- IS supposed to be their first encounter.
Am I misremembering?
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Post by theillusiveman on Jun 23, 2020 13:09:37 GMT
I'm pretty sure that The End of the Line --from the 6th doctor regeneration audio boxset-- IS supposed to be their first encounter. Am I misremembering? Nope They already knew each other
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mbt66
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Post by mbt66 on Jun 27, 2020 15:09:46 GMT
I'm pretty sure that The End of the Line --from the 6th doctor regeneration audio boxset-- IS supposed to be their first encounter. Am I misremembering? Nope They already knew each other And the Master appeared somewhat scarred of the Valeyard...so there could be a tale tell.
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Post by grinch on Jun 27, 2020 15:11:51 GMT
I mean for all we know, maybe the Valeyard is the main antagonist of the Masterful special.
That could theoretically work as their first encounter with one another.
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mbt66
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Post by mbt66 on Jun 27, 2020 15:22:17 GMT
I mean for all we know, maybe the Valeyard is the main antagonist of the Masterful special. That could theoretically work as their first encounter with one another. I hadn’t thought of that, but it would certainly fit the write up. The Master's finally done it. He's won. (He has defeated the Doctor, by replacing him with the Valeyard) Has the Master really conquered the universe? Or has something more awful been unleashed? Something that even all the Masters cannot stop?(And they cannot go to the Doctor for help, because he now is the “something more awful”) I like it!
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Post by grinch on Jun 27, 2020 15:27:06 GMT
I mean for all we know, maybe the Valeyard is the main antagonist of the Masterful special. That could theoretically work as their first encounter with one another. I hadn’t thought of that, but it would certainly fit the write up. The Master's finally done it. He's won. (He has defeated the Doctor, by replacing him with the Valeyard) Has the Master really conquered the universe? Or has something more awful been unleashed? Something that even all the Masters cannot stop?(And they cannot go to the Doctor for help, because he now is the “something more awful”) I like it! It’s a fun thought at least. I doubt this would happen but I’m imagining at the end of the story, when the Valeyard or whatever the main threat is defeated, the Master(s) have a brief conversation with the Doctor and before making their escape end with the final quip of: “After all, what is the universe without the Master?” The Masters all laugh and we cut to credits.
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mbt66
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Post by mbt66 on Jun 27, 2020 15:54:17 GMT
It would provide a nice counterpoint to stories like The Light at the End that have multiple Doctors against one Master, to have multiple Masters against one villainous Doctor in Valeyard form.
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Post by theillusiveman on Jun 27, 2020 16:30:48 GMT
Nope They already knew each other And the Master appeared somewhat scarred of the Valeyard...so there could be a tale tell. Well to be fair The Valeyard could have easily have killed The Master in both stories an unfettered evil version of Doctor would be the most terrifying foe in the master's eyes
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Post by Deleted on Jun 28, 2020 5:22:02 GMT
And the Master appeared somewhat scarred of the Valeyard...so there could be a tale tell. Well to be fair The Valeyard could have easily have killed The Master in both stories an unfettered evil version of Doctor would be the most terrifying foe in the master's eyes
And not a recent fear either, going by what the Keller Machine in The Mind of Evil chooses to manifest as the Master's worst fear. Makes you wonder...
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