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Post by mark687 on Sept 15, 2020 15:06:46 GMT
My view is yes if there wasn't an established fan base for something it wouldn't get spun off or expanded upon, its also highly likely that specific fan pleasing element's of the main series would be used.
Discuss
Regards
mark687
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Post by Digi on Sept 15, 2020 15:15:42 GMT
I don't understand what the poll is asking.
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Post by mark687 on Sept 15, 2020 15:19:08 GMT
I don't understand what the poll is asking. Sorry i'll drop the Other Regards mark687
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Post by Digi on Sept 15, 2020 15:20:33 GMT
I don't understand what the poll is asking. Sorry i'll drop the Other Regards mark687 No lol I don't mean the Other is confusing, I mean I literally do not understand what the question the poll is looking for an answer on. There's no either/or here to vote on.
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Post by mark687 on Sept 15, 2020 15:27:54 GMT
Sorry i'll drop the Other Regards mark687 No lol I don't mean the Other is confusing, I mean I literally do not understand what the question the poll is looking for an answer on. There's no either/or here to vote on. Is the point they exist Fan Service anyway so is the argument of too much Fan Service moot? Regards mark687
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Post by Deleted on Sept 15, 2020 15:34:58 GMT
No, I don't think so. Of course you're right in that spin-offs are capitalising on the goodwill of the original project but that's always going to happen in art and especially art that is designed to be sold. So Big Finish, for example, will make a spin-off of Doctor Who like say the Paternoster Gang. Is that fan service? No, but there may be elements of fan-service in the storytelling or in little Easter eggs along the way. As long as whatever the spin-off is has a grounding in it's own reality and doesn't feel lost or out of place it's got a chance.
It's not just storytelling either like audio drama, books, comics and film & television - you can see it in music. When an act goes solo they hope to take their audience from the old band with them. Look at Ozzy Osbourne for example - he went solo and was selling more records with Diary Of A Madman and Blizzard Of Oz than Black Sabbath were selling with Heaven & Hell and Mob Rules. There was some fan service there, Ozzy went for some doom-laden rock that he knew his old fans would sig but it was worthy material in it's own right.
Sure there are examples where spin-offs are built on fan-service but even then if they connect enough they can find their own identity in time.
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Post by polly on Sept 15, 2020 19:43:41 GMT
I think they're two different things with two different answers.
Spinoffs - Not necessarily. In my opinion, the best spinoffs are the ones that are very different from their source material without breaking the basic rules of the universe. That's what gives them their own identity. Angel, Deep Space Nine, and Torchwood are all good examples. If it were mere fanservice, you'd get more formulaic shows that didn't stray so far from home. Just look at Big Finish. On the one hand, you have your Gallifrey and your Jago & Litefoot. On the other, you have your Further Adventures of So-and-So boxsets.
Expanded Universe - Yes. Most definitely fanservice. These things exist to wring more money out of existing fans, and pore into the nooks and crannies of the established universe. Tie-in media like novels, comics, and yes, audios are not going to have mainstream appeal with very rare exceptions. They are products for dorks. I don't care how much you like Timothy Zahn, Heir to the Empire is not going to appeal to someone who doesn't already like Star Wars.
Fanservice has become something of a dirty word, but honestly, having products to further enrich the experience of your most devoted fans is no bad thing.
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Post by randomcomments on Sept 27, 2020 16:22:15 GMT
I think they're two different things with two different answers. Spinoffs - Not necessarily. In my opinion, the best spinoffs are the ones that are very different from their source material without breaking the basic rules of the universe. That's what gives them their own identity. Angel, Deep Space Nine, and Torchwood are all good examples. If it were mere fanservice, you'd get more formulaic shows that didn't stray so far from home. Just look at Big Finish. On the one hand, you have your Gallifrey and your Jago & Litefoot. On the other, you have your Further Adventures of So-and-So boxsets. Expanded Universe - Yes. Most definitely fanservice. These things exist to wring more money out of existing fans, and pore into the nooks and crannies of the established universe. Tie-in media like novels, comics, and yes, audios are not going to have mainstream appeal with very rare exceptions. They are products for dorks. I don't care how much you like Timothy Zahn, Heir to the Empire is not going to appeal to someone who doesn't already like Star Wars. Fanservice has become something of a dirty word, but honestly, having products to further enrich the experience of your most devoted fans is no bad thing. I must admit I have difficulty understanding a definition of "expanded universe" that doesn't include spin-offs. But then, Heir to the Empire /was/ actually the thing which got me into Star Wars, so... I think the thing about "fan service" as it is usually invoked is when something is being done "for the fans" /at the expense/ of the storytelling or character work. So the moment in Rogue One (to use a Star Wars example to hopefully avoid too much Who controversy) where the two guys from the cantina in the original film show up (on a different, doomed planet, days at most before the original film), bump into our protagonists, and then start to say their iconic dialogue from that film; that I'd call fan service in the negative sense. It's a weird beat that doesn't actually make much sense if you think about it, but is there just as a (distracting) nod to the original. (The background call for "General Syndulla" later in the film is also a fan service nod, but one that's much less intrusive). Now, the existence of the entire movie would qualify as "fan service" under some of the definitions in this thread. And on the one hand, that's fair. It's a film about the off-screen events before an iconic original film. Fans wanted to see that story. (Though I also know some folks who aren't fond of Star Wars generally who quite enjoyed it). But it's also doing something different with the tools in that sandbox - the rebels as our heroes, but also a genuinely disorderly coalition of folks with competing goals and morally-questionable histories is an interesting take, and of course the general thrust of the ending, with the sacrifices of a vast swath of unheralded heroes to make possible the feats for which the heroes of the original film will receive a medal ceremony and iconic status, is a fairly bold statement. So yes, the broader version of "fan service," in the sense that many stories exist because there is a desire among people with funds for these stories, exists. But I don't think it makes "fan service" a meaningless critique in the specific negative sense, and I think the two shouldn't be conflated.
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Post by johnhurtdoctor on Sept 27, 2020 16:34:45 GMT
No
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Post by polly on Sept 28, 2020 4:12:20 GMT
I must admit I have difficulty understanding a definition of "expanded universe" that doesn't include spin-offs. But then, Heir to the Empire /was/ actually the thing which got me into Star Wars, so... Just to elaborate on this point, to me "Expanded Universe" mostly refers to tie-in media outside the original format. These often have either no official canon status or a "lesser" one, and don't "count" the same way a spinoff film or TV show would. So novels, comics, video games, audio dramas etc I'd count as expanded universe, but not Torchwood. To piggyback on your Star Wars example Rogue One is a spinoff, the novels etc are EU. It's maybe splitting hairs but to me there is a distinction.
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