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Post by Kestrel on Feb 7, 2022 2:39:19 GMT
God forbid they try to invite new customers by, I dunno, lowering prices. Even if we accept that the new stuff is already priced as low as it can go, that doesn't really apply to 10+ year old content. EDIT: I wonder if BF is even aware of just how many fans casually recommend pirating their content due to how prohibitively expensive it is to new and (especially) younger fans? There are ways to combat piracy while simultaneously growing your consumer base, but sloganeering ain't one of 'em. Completely agree. I’ve mentioned it so many times now, but there’s half a dozen sets they could easily put on a permanently reduced download price of £9.99 that are not only great in their own right, but could naturally lead and cross over into other ranges. As for pirating, is it that prolific for Big Finish? I don’t doubt it exists, but BF is a niche product to begin with. It’d require someone to upload that and then spread word they’ve done it. I can’t see them attracting that many downloads and I’m not sure how they’d even quantify that as impacting. People who pirate are very rarely going to be actual customers in the first place. It just feels like it’s an easy excuse to say it’s impacting, without being able to quantify how it is. I’ve certainly never seen someone recommend they acquire an audio via illegal means. Knocking down the MR to $3 across the whole range after it concluded seemed like the obvious move to me, but it still hasn't happened. or at least $6 for 101-275. I don't know how big piracy is, and I'm definitely very skeptical of any stats w/r/t piracy out there (especially companies desperate to equate piracy with "lost sales"). What I do know is almost every time I've discussed Big Finish on Reddit or discord, especially if people talk about wanting to or not being able to buy stuff, someone will inevitably bring up piracy with a nudge and a wink. And in the 2 or so years since I've been seriously consuming Big Finish media, I have received around a half-dozen (unsolicited) DMs with links to torrents. Usually in the context of me saying, "X is on sale but I can only afford Y, what do you recommend?" And it just really makes me think of the PC gaming market when I was a kid in the early and mid-00s, where people were uniformly just very casual about piracy. Like the default reaction to anything someone didn't like or was skeptical about was, "oh, well, I'll just pirate it instead." PC gaming culture was piracy culture, to the point where many people justified (and some older folks still act this way) themselves as simply downloading "demos." It was so bad it nearly crippled the entire industry. PC game developers rapidly abandoned the platform for mobile and console markets. And the. Valve came along with Steam and reversed all of that within a few years simply by making a better, more convenient legitimate service that could compete with piracy. And to bring this all back to Big Finish's superficial slogan-changes, Valve did all of this when Steam was one of the ugliest-looking apps out there. This brutalist lime-green disaster of a program. But it worked because ultimately consumers care more about convenience and value than the superficial trappings of marketing.
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Post by thelonecenturion on Feb 8, 2022 15:25:35 GMT
God forbid they try to invite new customers by, I dunno, lowering prices. Even if we accept that the new stuff is already priced as low as it can go, that doesn't really apply to 10+ year old content. EDIT: I wonder if BF is even aware of just how many fans casually recommend pirating their content due to how prohibitively expensive it is to new and (especially) younger fans? There are ways to combat piracy while simultaneously growing your consumer base, but sloganeering ain't one of 'em. Completely agree. I’ve mentioned it so many times now, but there’s half a dozen sets they could easily put on a permanently reduced download price of £9.99 that are not only great in their own right, but could naturally lead and cross over into other ranges. As for pirating, is it that prolific for Big Finish? I don’t doubt it exists, but BF is a niche product to begin with. It’d require someone to upload that and then spread word they’ve done it. I can’t see them attracting that many downloads and I’m not sure how they’d even quantify that as impacting. People who pirate are very rarely going to be actual customers in the first place. It just feels like it’s an easy excuse to say it’s impacting, without being able to quantify how it is. I’ve certainly never seen someone recommend they acquire an audio via illegal means. Then you're lucky. All over reddit and Twitter, this conversation happens: "I would get Big Finish but they're so expensive" "There are... other ways... to get them for free"
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Post by shallacatop on Feb 8, 2022 16:17:39 GMT
Completely agree. I’ve mentioned it so many times now, but there’s half a dozen sets they could easily put on a permanently reduced download price of £9.99 that are not only great in their own right, but could naturally lead and cross over into other ranges. As for pirating, is it that prolific for Big Finish? I don’t doubt it exists, but BF is a niche product to begin with. It’d require someone to upload that and then spread word they’ve done it. I can’t see them attracting that many downloads and I’m not sure how they’d even quantify that as impacting. People who pirate are very rarely going to be actual customers in the first place. It just feels like it’s an easy excuse to say it’s impacting, without being able to quantify how it is. I’ve certainly never seen someone recommend they acquire an audio via illegal means. Then you're lucky. All over reddit and Twitter, this conversation happens: "I would get Big Finish but they're so expensive" "There are... other ways... to get them for free" Fair enough, but that still comes back to the question of whether piracy is actually lost revenue. In the example you’ve provided it’s not. They can’t afford to buy the product in the first place, unfortunately. I’m not justifying piracy in any way, but that isn’t at Big Finish’s loss there. I still maintain the absolute minimum they can do is permanently reduce half a dozen sets, though. That would really do them wonders and give a jumping on point for fans on the fence or unable to justify the original cost.
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Post by mark687 on Feb 8, 2022 16:37:38 GMT
Then you're lucky. All over reddit and Twitter, this conversation happens: "I would get Big Finish but they're so expensive" "There are... other ways... to get them for free" Fair enough, but that still comes back to the question of whether piracy is actually lost revenue. In the example you’ve provided it’s not. They can’t afford to buy the product in the first place, unfortunately. I’m not justifying piracy in any way, but that isn’t at Big Finish’s loss there. I still maintain the absolute minimum they can do is permanently reduce half a dozen sets, though. That would really do them wonders and give a jumping on point for fans on the fence or unable to justify the original cost. A remark that's been around a few years If Everyone we know of that Torrents bought direct from us we could permanently half our prices. So I guess that answers the question. Regards mark687
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Post by timleschild on Feb 8, 2022 16:51:45 GMT
Then you're lucky. All over reddit and Twitter, this conversation happens: "I would get Big Finish but they're so expensive" "There are... other ways... to get them for free" Fair enough, but that still comes back to the question of whether piracy is actually lost revenue. In the example you’ve provided it’s not. They can’t afford to buy the product in the first place, unfortunately. I’m not justifying piracy in any way, but that isn’t at Big Finish’s loss there. I still maintain the absolute minimum they can do is permanently reduce half a dozen sets, though. That would really do them wonders and give a jumping on point for fans on the fence or unable to justify the original cost. I don't think it is correct to say people pirate because they can't afford to buy the product. A lot just choose not to buy it. They are bad eggs.
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Post by shallacatop on Feb 8, 2022 16:53:49 GMT
Fair enough, but that still comes back to the question of whether piracy is actually lost revenue. In the example you’ve provided it’s not. They can’t afford to buy the product in the first place, unfortunately. I’m not justifying piracy in any way, but that isn’t at Big Finish’s loss there. I still maintain the absolute minimum they can do is permanently reduce half a dozen sets, though. That would really do them wonders and give a jumping on point for fans on the fence or unable to justify the original cost. A remark that's been around a few years If Everyone we know of that Torrents bought direct from us we could permanently half our prices. So I guess that answers the question. Regards mark687 But that’s just a statement that has no meaning or foundation. You cannot directly equate torrenting or piracy to lost revenue. And it’s absolute nonsense anyway; they would never reduce their prices if sales went up. It doesn’t work like that and also has no relation to permanently reducing prices of older releases… something Big Finish have done before.
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Post by shallacatop on Feb 8, 2022 16:54:39 GMT
Fair enough, but that still comes back to the question of whether piracy is actually lost revenue. In the example you’ve provided it’s not. They can’t afford to buy the product in the first place, unfortunately. I’m not justifying piracy in any way, but that isn’t at Big Finish’s loss there. I still maintain the absolute minimum they can do is permanently reduce half a dozen sets, though. That would really do them wonders and give a jumping on point for fans on the fence or unable to justify the original cost. I don't think it is correct to say people pirate because they can't afford to buy the product. A lot just choose not to buy it. They are bad eggs. I haven’t once said that. I am responding directly to the example provided, in which someone unfortunately cannot afford a release.
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Post by Kestrel on Feb 9, 2022 8:34:02 GMT
I've never found the piracy = lost revenue argument to be very compelling. People who pirate may or may not be able to afford to purchase the media, but it's fallacious to assume that if they could not pirate it they would, instead, purchase it. It's not a binary choice. Some pirates may not care enough about the media to buy it at any price, and some pirates will ultimately buy the media they pirated.
And speaking of fallacies, let's dig into this common refrain:
Yeah, Big Finish might have an argument here if they were selling milk or fruit, or some other perishable finite stock--but they don't. They sell digital media that, once created, exists in perpetuity and can be sold indefinitely. Every year--every month, practically every week--their catalog of media expands. That means Big Finish constantly has more media it can sell, and therefore more sales it can make.
Yet their business model is not to entice new customers by lowering prices on old media, content that has already produced a great deal of profit and can only ever produce more profit... it's to focus exclusively on squeezing as much money as possible out their existing, loyal customers. Like... we've all noticed how they tried to "hide" their big price hike last year, right? They cut the price by 15% and the length by 25%, so the price-per-minute ratio is worse.
Basically, their business model is to take us for granted.
Like, yes, there are legitimate arguments that can be made for keeping CD prices high, and new releases high. But digital copies? Years-old releases? No.
And look, if Big Finish's older stuff is still selling well... that indicates consistent demand, which means price reductions would generate more sales (and also that these high prices across the board are unjustified). But, conversely, if this old stuff is not selling well... that indicates a lack of demand, in which case Big Finish has very little to lose by reducing the price, and much to gain--as, again, lower prices would incentivize more sales.
We've all had those conversations right? Getting new folks into Big Finish? We always point to the early MRs and Unbound sets and the freebies... because we all know the high costs of these audios are the biggest impediment to potential new fans.
And this idea that we should just placidly tolerate paying $35 USD for a 10 year old boxset because, gasp, their brand-new sets are getting pirated is insulting.
And we can debate the ethics of piracy, the logistics of piracy, or simply dismiss the pirates as "bad eggs," but at the end of the day I can't really blame people for pirating Big Finish's media. It's not something I'd do myself, but I understand why others would. My criticism and incredulity is directed entirely at Big Finish here.
But, erm... yeah. As you can see it's really in all of our best interests here that Absent Friends release as soon as possible.
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Post by shallacatop on Feb 9, 2022 10:59:17 GMT
Brilliantly put, @kestrel. Of course, we know the statement about halving prices is nonsense because if that was the case it would naturally lead to their anticipated best selling releases to be priced lower when announced. But it doesn’t work like that, so we’re not expected to believe Big Finish would half their prices if they got double the sales because they don’t currently.
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Post by mark687 on Feb 9, 2022 11:30:01 GMT
Brilliantly put, @kestrel. Of course, we know the statement about halving prices is nonsense because if that was the case it would naturally lead to their anticipated best selling releases to be priced lower when announced. But it doesn’t work like that, so we’re not expected to believe Big Finish would half their prices if they got double the sales because they don’t currently. Yes cause that's the Statement! At the moment Pre-Order price for single boxset or Bundle is 40-45% Off the eventual Total RRP Prices (for UK Customers who purchase before the Release Date Postage is also included), so in fact if everyone who listens to BF Brought from BF, Standard Prices could be 10% cheaper then current pre order prices Regards mark687
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Post by shallacatop on Feb 9, 2022 12:02:42 GMT
Brilliantly put, @kestrel. Of course, we know the statement about halving prices is nonsense because if that was the case it would naturally lead to their anticipated best selling releases to be priced lower when announced. But it doesn’t work like that, so we’re not expected to believe Big Finish would half their prices if they got double the sales because they don’t currently. Yes cause that's the Statement! At the moment Pre-Order price for single boxset or Bundle is 40-45% Off the eventual Total RRP Prices (for UK Customers who purchase before the Release Date Postage is also included), so in fact if everyone who listens to BF Brought from BF, Standard Prices could be 10% cheaper then current pre order prices Regards mark687 Except the pre-order prices is the going rate for the product. What they increase them to later on isn’t RRP, it just serves them to put them in a sale at a later date and say they’ve discounted them. I said as much elsewhere a few days ago and you “liked” the post! I’m not really sure what your point is; Big Finish don’t reduce their prices for big selling releases. Out of Time has always been £8.99 / £10.99, for example. Given they don’t do that I don’t believe their statement, which you repeated on this thread, that they’d reduce their prices if sales went up. Lost sales they attribute to piracy, which is a load of nonsense because you cannot equate piracy to lost revenue. Which is what I’ve been saying. If we use your logic of them discounting at pre-order, coupled with their statement about what they’d do if everyone who pirates purchased, then putting them up 40 - 45% later on, then surely they’re acknowledging isn’t an issue for them? Except they're not looking at the increased prices following release either, they work entirely on the pre-order prices because it’s the going rate and is what drives their sales.
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Post by mark687 on Feb 9, 2022 12:32:18 GMT
Yes cause that's the Statement! At the moment Pre-Order price for single boxset or Bundle is 40-45% Off the eventual Total RRP Prices (for UK Customers who purchase before the Release Date Postage is also included), so in fact if everyone who listens to BF Brought from BF, Standard Prices could be 10% cheaper then current pre order prices Regards mark687 Except the pre-order prices is the going rate for the product. What they increase them to later on isn’t RRP, it just serves them to put them in a sale at a later date and say they’ve discounted them. I said as much elsewhere a few days ago and you “liked” the post! I’m not really sure what your point is; Big Finish don’t reduce their prices for big selling releases. Out of Time has always been £8.99 / £10.99, for example. Given they don’t do that I don’t believe their statement, which you repeated on this thread, that they’d reduce their prices if sales went up. Lost sales they attribute to piracy, which is a load of nonsense because you cannot equate piracy to lost revenue. Which is what I’ve been saying. If we use your logic of them discounting at pre-order, coupled with their statement about what they’d do if everyone who pirates purchased, then putting them up 40 - 45% later on, then surely they’re acknowledging isn’t an issue for them? Except they're not looking at the increased prices following release either, they work entirely on the pre-order prices because it’s the going rate and is what drives their sales. First I cant find the post you said I liked. 2nd the Intro package idea works as an intro are you saying that price model should be permanent which equals what I'm saying would happen if piracy was out of the equation? Its a viscous circle the potential revenue they lose through piracy would amount to lowering the current prices which is what makes piracy attractive. Or should BF just run and sell at cost all the time? If it were down to you what would you pay on a regular basis? Regards mark687
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Post by shallacatop on Feb 9, 2022 13:10:18 GMT
Except the pre-order prices is the going rate for the product. What they increase them to later on isn’t RRP, it just serves them to put them in a sale at a later date and say they’ve discounted them. I said as much elsewhere a few days ago and you “liked” the post! I’m not really sure what your point is; Big Finish don’t reduce their prices for big selling releases. Out of Time has always been £8.99 / £10.99, for example. Given they don’t do that I don’t believe their statement, which you repeated on this thread, that they’d reduce their prices if sales went up. Lost sales they attribute to piracy, which is a load of nonsense because you cannot equate piracy to lost revenue. Which is what I’ve been saying. If we use your logic of them discounting at pre-order, coupled with their statement about what they’d do if everyone who pirates purchased, then putting them up 40 - 45% later on, then surely they’re acknowledging isn’t an issue for them? Except they're not looking at the increased prices following release either, they work entirely on the pre-order prices because it’s the going rate and is what drives their sales. First I cant find the post you said I liked. 2nd the Intro package idea works as an intro are you saying that price model should be permanent which equals what I'm saying would happen if piracy was out of the equation? Its a viscous circle the potential revenue they lose through piracy would amount to lowering the current prices which is what makes piracy attractive. Or should BF just run and sell at cost all the time? If it were down to you what would you pay on a regular basis? Regards mark687 Post is here. I think you're confusing your points here and posing stuff in response to Kestrel's comments rather than my own. I haven't mentioned pricing of products except to say that I believe it would do Big Finish wonders to reduce some older sets permanently to £9.99. Your mention of pricing if piracy was out of the question is what you have said BF have stated in the past. My response is that it's nonsense. One, because you cannot equate piracy to lost sales or revenue because it simply doesn't work like that. There may be some that pirate as an alternative to purchasing, but the vast majority will pirate because they cannot afford it or simply aren't interested enough to justify the price. Those are not lost sales, they never existed in the first place. Two, Big Finish haven't got form of amending their pricing based on sales. For example, Out of Time didn't debut at a cheaper price because they knew it would be a bigger seller. If they don't do this variable pricing, then I simply cannot believe they'd amend their prices if their sales went up because they never have done, piracy or otherwise. I don't understand what you mean by "should BF just run and sell at cost all the time"? Who's saying they are? They clearly aren't otherwise they wouldn't be in business or investing in other ranges. Their current pricing clearly makes them money to operate as a business. The additional pricing following the release period will not be taken into consideration in their revenue or sales, because they are not budgeting or handling their profit margins based on that. The inflated price exists just to promote a percentage reduction in future sales. Not that I've ever mentioned their pricing being an issue, other than utilising older releases to provide a better jumping on point, but I'm not sure how to answer what price I would pay on a regular basis. I am a regular Big Finish customer. I do pay their prices. I think there's a discrepancy between the CD and download pricing, to the point where if I was a download customer I would probably purchase the CD and try to recoup my costs. I am just strongly in favour of reducing the likes of The Tenth Doctor Adventures Volume 1, The Diary of River Song Volume 1, Classic Doctors, New Monsters Volumes 1 & 2, The War Doctor: Only the Monstrous and UNIT Extinction to £9.99. They're great jumping on points, they've more than made their money at this point, given they all spawned additional volumes, and can naturally develop into interests in other ranges. I don't see any harm in doing that. I see the pirating as a separate issue because I have questioned and still don't buy how Big Finish could quantify their piracy as loss of sales. Indeed, it seems they equate it as 1:1, which lacks any sort of logic. However, if lowering some of the catalogue to a more attractive price does reduce piracy, then great, although I'm not so sure. I'd have thought it would mainly appeal to those who want to get into BF but wouldn't consider, or be aware of piracy routes to obtain the product. It's certainly interesting. And Big Finish should be better at it rather than being complacent.
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Post by mark687 on Feb 9, 2022 13:40:55 GMT
First I cant find the post you said I liked. 2nd the Intro package idea works as an intro are you saying that price model should be permanent which equals what I'm saying would happen if piracy was out of the equation? Its a viscous circle the potential revenue they lose through piracy would amount to lowering the current prices which is what makes piracy attractive. Or should BF just run and sell at cost all the time? If it were down to you what would you pay on a regular basis? Regards mark687 Post is here. I think you're confusing your points here and posing stuff in response to Kestrel's comments rather than my own. I haven't mentioned pricing of products except to say that I believe it would do Big Finish wonders to reduce some older sets permanently to £9.99. Your mention of pricing if piracy was out of the question is what you have said BF have stated in the past. My response is that it's nonsense. One, because you cannot equate piracy to lost sales or revenue because it simply doesn't work like that. There may be some that pirate as an alternative to purchasing, but the vast majority will pirate because they cannot afford it or simply aren't interested enough to justify the price. Those are not lost sales, they never existed in the first place. Two, Big Finish haven't got form of amending their pricing based on sales. For example, Out of Time didn't debut at a cheaper price because they knew it would be a bigger seller. If they don't do this variable pricing, then I simply cannot believe they'd amend their prices if their sales went up because they never have done, piracy or otherwise. I don't understand what you mean by "should BF just run and sell at cost all the time"? Who's saying they are? They clearly aren't otherwise they wouldn't be in business or investing in other ranges. Their current pricing clearly makes them money to operate as a business. The additional pricing following the release period will not be taken into consideration in their revenue or sales, because they are not budgeting or handling their profit margins based on that. The inflated price exists just to promote a percentage reduction in future sales. Not that I've ever mentioned their pricing being an issue, other than utilising older releases to provide a better jumping on point, but I'm not sure how to answer what price I would pay on a regular basis. I am a regular Big Finish customer. I do pay their prices. I think there's a discrepancy between the CD and download pricing, to the point where if I was a download customer I would probably purchase the CD and try to recoup my costs. I am just strongly in favour of reducing the likes of The Tenth Doctor Adventures Volume 1, The Diary of River Song Volume 1, Classic Doctors, New Monsters Volumes 1 & 2, The War Doctor: Only the Monstrous and UNIT Extinction to £9.99. They're great jumping on points, they've more than made their money at this point, given they all spawned additional volumes, and can naturally develop into interests in other ranges. I don't see any harm in doing that. I see the pirating as a separate issue because I have questioned and still don't buy how Big Finish could quantify their piracy as loss of sales. Indeed, it seems they equate it as 1:1, which lacks any sort of logic. However, if lowering some of the catalogue to a more attractive price does reduce piracy, then great, although I'm not so sure. I'd have thought it would mainly appeal to those who want to get into BF but wouldn't consider, or be aware of piracy routes to obtain the product. It's certainly interesting. And Big Finish should be better at it rather than being complacent. Sorry I Liked the Post because I agreed with this part And the main range did have a discount before their release… via the subscriptions. (Which is true and I'm of the position the current Pre order/Bundle method amounts to the same thing) Also Sorry I'm losing the Thread of thought here So what exactly is the issue with the current Models they no longer equal value for money in your and Kestrel's eyes? Regards mark687
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Post by thelonecenturion on Feb 9, 2022 14:25:10 GMT
Yes cause that's the Statement! At the moment Pre-Order price for single boxset or Bundle is 40-45% Off the eventual Total RRP Prices (for UK Customers who purchase before the Release Date Postage is also included), so in fact if everyone who listens to BF Brought from BF, Standard Prices could be 10% cheaper then current pre order prices Regards mark687 Except the pre-order prices is the going rate for the product. What they increase them to later on isn’t RRP, it just serves them to put them in a sale at a later date and say they’ve discounted them. I said as much elsewhere a few days ago and you “liked” the post! I’m not really sure what your point is; Big Finish don’t reduce their prices for big selling releases. Out of Time has always been £8.99 / £10.99, for example. Given they don’t do that I don’t believe their statement, which you repeated on this thread, that they’d reduce their prices if sales went up. Lost sales they attribute to piracy, which is a load of nonsense because you cannot equate piracy to lost revenue. Which is what I’ve been saying. If we use your logic of them discounting at pre-order, coupled with their statement about what they’d do if everyone who pirates purchased, then putting them up 40 - 45% later on, then surely they’re acknowledging isn’t an issue for them? Except they're not looking at the increased prices following release either, they work entirely on the pre-order prices because it’s the going rate and is what drives their sales. This is not true. BF is the only retailer to sell at the pre-order price - all other places that sell BF products do so at the RRP, not the pre-order price.
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Post by shallacatop on Feb 9, 2022 14:33:32 GMT
Post is here. I think you're confusing your points here and posing stuff in response to Kestrel's comments rather than my own. I haven't mentioned pricing of products except to say that I believe it would do Big Finish wonders to reduce some older sets permanently to £9.99. Your mention of pricing if piracy was out of the question is what you have said BF have stated in the past. My response is that it's nonsense. One, because you cannot equate piracy to lost sales or revenue because it simply doesn't work like that. There may be some that pirate as an alternative to purchasing, but the vast majority will pirate because they cannot afford it or simply aren't interested enough to justify the price. Those are not lost sales, they never existed in the first place. Two, Big Finish haven't got form of amending their pricing based on sales. For example, Out of Time didn't debut at a cheaper price because they knew it would be a bigger seller. If they don't do this variable pricing, then I simply cannot believe they'd amend their prices if their sales went up because they never have done, piracy or otherwise. I don't understand what you mean by "should BF just run and sell at cost all the time"? Who's saying they are? They clearly aren't otherwise they wouldn't be in business or investing in other ranges. Their current pricing clearly makes them money to operate as a business. The additional pricing following the release period will not be taken into consideration in their revenue or sales, because they are not budgeting or handling their profit margins based on that. The inflated price exists just to promote a percentage reduction in future sales. Not that I've ever mentioned their pricing being an issue, other than utilising older releases to provide a better jumping on point, but I'm not sure how to answer what price I would pay on a regular basis. I am a regular Big Finish customer. I do pay their prices. I think there's a discrepancy between the CD and download pricing, to the point where if I was a download customer I would probably purchase the CD and try to recoup my costs. I am just strongly in favour of reducing the likes of The Tenth Doctor Adventures Volume 1, The Diary of River Song Volume 1, Classic Doctors, New Monsters Volumes 1 & 2, The War Doctor: Only the Monstrous and UNIT Extinction to £9.99. They're great jumping on points, they've more than made their money at this point, given they all spawned additional volumes, and can naturally develop into interests in other ranges. I don't see any harm in doing that. I see the pirating as a separate issue because I have questioned and still don't buy how Big Finish could quantify their piracy as loss of sales. Indeed, it seems they equate it as 1:1, which lacks any sort of logic. However, if lowering some of the catalogue to a more attractive price does reduce piracy, then great, although I'm not so sure. I'd have thought it would mainly appeal to those who want to get into BF but wouldn't consider, or be aware of piracy routes to obtain the product. It's certainly interesting. And Big Finish should be better at it rather than being complacent. Sony I Liked the Post because I agreed with this part And the main range did have a discount before their release… via the subscriptions. (Which is true and I'm of the position the current Pre order/Bundle method amounts to the same thing) Also Sorry I'm losing the Thread of thought here So what exactly is the issue with the current Models they no longer equal value for money in your and Kestrel's eyes? Regards mark687 Hey, no worries, it's a long running conversation! I don't have an issue with the current model and haven't made any comments about it not being value for money. I just believe Big Finish could and should do more to help out new and prospective customers. The big thing for me would be to permanently reduce the sets I'd previously mentioned. If the customer enjoys what they've heard, then the selection of sets will help to continue with or try out other ranges and be prepared to pay the higher price.
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Post by shallacatop on Feb 9, 2022 14:43:49 GMT
Except the pre-order prices is the going rate for the product. What they increase them to later on isn’t RRP, it just serves them to put them in a sale at a later date and say they’ve discounted them. I said as much elsewhere a few days ago and you “liked” the post! I’m not really sure what your point is; Big Finish don’t reduce their prices for big selling releases. Out of Time has always been £8.99 / £10.99, for example. Given they don’t do that I don’t believe their statement, which you repeated on this thread, that they’d reduce their prices if sales went up. Lost sales they attribute to piracy, which is a load of nonsense because you cannot equate piracy to lost revenue. Which is what I’ve been saying. If we use your logic of them discounting at pre-order, coupled with their statement about what they’d do if everyone who pirates purchased, then putting them up 40 - 45% later on, then surely they’re acknowledging isn’t an issue for them? Except they're not looking at the increased prices following release either, they work entirely on the pre-order prices because it’s the going rate and is what drives their sales. This is not true. BF is the only retailer to sell at the pre-order price - all other places that sell BF products do so at the RRP, not the pre-order price. I'm not really sure how that discounts what I'm saying? If other retailers increase the price, then that's their decision and likely to be in line with a percentage on top of the purchase price from Big Finish. Just a quick look on Amazon, Book Depository, etc. and I can't see a single set priced at what Big Finish increase the sets to. Indeed, they're all cheaper than the inflated BF price. And many releases don't make it to other retailers, so what about them? Or the vinyls that don't alter in price? The pre-order price is the going rate for the product and is the price taken into account when considering their revenue and handling their profit margins. It's also the price they use to determine what a discount would be on a bundle. It isn't that hard to grasp.
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Post by mark687 on Feb 9, 2022 14:46:21 GMT
Sony I Liked the Post because I agreed with this part And the main range did have a discount before their release… via the subscriptions. (Which is true and I'm of the position the current Pre order/Bundle method amounts to the same thing) Also Sorry I'm losing the Thread of thought here So what exactly is the issue with the current Models they no longer equal value for money in your and Kestrel's eyes? Regards mark687 Hey, no worries, it's a long running conversation! I don't have an issue with the current model and haven't made any comments about it not being value for money. I just believe Big Finish could and should do more to help out new and prospective customers. The big thing for me would be to permanently reduce the sets I'd previously mentioned. If the customer enjoys what they've heard, then the selection of sets will help to continue with or try out other ranges and be prepared to pay the higher price. Ah so a selection of Boxsets under something like "New to Big Finish" at a permanent teaser Price of say £10 a box set then subsequent releases in their own Series Bundles adjusted accordingly? Regards mark687
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Post by shallacatop on Feb 9, 2022 14:53:11 GMT
Hey, no worries, it's a long running conversation! I don't have an issue with the current model and haven't made any comments about it not being value for money. I just believe Big Finish could and should do more to help out new and prospective customers. The big thing for me would be to permanently reduce the sets I'd previously mentioned. If the customer enjoys what they've heard, then the selection of sets will help to continue with or try out other ranges and be prepared to pay the higher price. Ah so a selection of Boxsets under something like "New to Big Finish" at a permanent teaser Price of say £10 a box set then subsequent releases in their own Series Bundles adjusted accordingly? Regards mark687 Yeah, pretty much! It'd require a bit of thinking, but I don't think it would be difficult to implement and it would be at no loss to Big Finish, frankly. They've made their money on the sets already; they were all big hits for them so more so and each one has spawned successor sets and ranges. Maybe one to suggest via email, rather than me repeating it on this forum!
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Post by aussiedoctorwhofan on Feb 13, 2022 9:50:06 GMT
So it's Christopher's birthday in 3 days.. I think #4 will be released on that day? Seems logical.
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