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Post by sherlock on Oct 24, 2022 13:10:35 GMT
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Post by christmastrenzalore on Oct 24, 2022 13:10:54 GMT
I've just realized that if you don't actually count David Tennant as another form, this has actually righted the War Doctor off-set. This also makes the third incarnation David Tennant has occupied counting the aborted Stolen Earth regen. Nothing's ever simple is it. XD
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Post by mark687 on Oct 24, 2022 13:14:13 GMT
As there's a sperate Thread for What Made You Smile Most I'll keep this general (hopefully most of us have now seen it)
Have to give this Ep (and really the whole Era) to Mandip Gill, she sells every beat so convincingly.
Sacha Dhawan does wonders with what he's given though the longer the EP went on it did make the Master seem petty and pathetic (UNIT Solders got guns will shoot, any TARDIS Traveler though won't Really? Didn't Factor in the Fugitive why?)
Ah Jodie I wonder if she decided to play the part factoring in that its got a shelf life? She's never seemed more comfortable in the part than from the Forced Regen onwards.
A fine end to an Era that didn't do anything wrong but gave itself an identity crisis.
Regards
mark687
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Post by timleschild on Oct 24, 2022 14:36:30 GMT
Behind the scenes video
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Post by elkawho on Oct 24, 2022 17:49:39 GMT
Was it perfect? No. Where there enough plot holes to house a large family of mice? Yes. Do I care? Absolutely not!!! It was the most fun I have had watching Doctor Who in ages! The fan service was amazing, and the regeneration was terrific. I loved that last line. I stayed up to watch it a second time when I really should have gone to bed and was up until 1:30 AM on a work night! And why hasn't anyone ever thought of a companion support group before? It's brilliant! Seeing William Russell was a gift. Especially since we know he doesn't even do Big Finish anymore.
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Post by The Brigadier on Oct 24, 2022 18:20:50 GMT
Was it perfect? No. Where there enough plot holes to house a large family of mice? Yes. Do I care? Absolutely not!!! It was the most fun I have had watching Doctor Who in ages! The fan service was amazing, and the regeneration was terrific. I loved that last line. I stayed up to watch it a second time when I really should have gone to bed and was up until 1:30 AM on a work night! And why hasn't anyone ever thought of a companion support group before? It's brilliant! Seeing William Russell was a gift. Especially since we know he doesn't even do Big Finish anymore. I was going to write my own post, but pretty much all of this ⬆️ (except the bit about staying up late to watch it a second time. Frankly I needed my beauty sleep.. 😜)
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Post by nucleusofswarm on Oct 24, 2022 20:25:13 GMT
Doubt I'm done digesting it yet, but I can give a 'fuller thoughts. What's worked about Chibnall's tenure still works here: looks great, sounds great, the returning villains are well characterized and threatening with Dhawan stealing every scene like the diabolical diva he is. Ra ra indeed! Even stuff that I've not been a big fan of mostly works here: this is a story that has suited Magnus Stone's manic sensibilities the best, moving fast and playing on spectacle. Ace and Tegan are well represented, even if Ace gets the lion's share, and their scenes with their AI Doctors were both very sweet. Also a good end showing for Jodie, reminding us she shines when 13 is desperate and overwhelmed.
Thing is, I'm of two minds: as a story on its own, it's a ton of fun. Naked nostalgia sugar, but its so gleeful and earnest it's hard to not get sucked in. As an ending to this era, as a closure (for now anyway) on the Timeless Child and everything else, I can't say it works. Really, it's more of an encapsulation of what's happened to the show since the pandemic: subtext and theme are almost entirely absent for the sake of shoving in more thrills; obvious parallels like the Cyber-planet being powered by another lost space child are never used and prior setups, like the watch or the Time Lords being inside the Cybermasters and the Doctor's home being gone, feel completely irrelevant. What has the Doctor really gained or learnt from all this? Even Yaz's departure feels wonky: you can't have spent almost two series actively not having deeper things, being really reliant on dialogue, and just now rely on subtext and more visual storytelling when clarity is so paramount. I'm one of the guys who defended 'the talk' in Can You Hear Me, and even I can't defend this. There just isn't enough here for me to understand how this is meant to work, which is a big shame as the ice cream scene was a nice moment between them.
It's a tough cookie, this one. If you loved it, I get it. If you hated it, I get it. Me, may need more time to really say, but for now, roll on RTD!
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Post by shallacatop on Oct 24, 2022 21:07:07 GMT
This made me realise that we were only missing Anneke & Freema from the scene. All of the other Earth based companions have either died / are unavailable in universe, or have died in real life, which was a real surprise when I thought about it.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 24, 2022 21:16:23 GMT
This made me realise that we were only missing Anneke & Freema from the scene. All of the other Earth based companions have either died / are unavailable in universe, or have died in real life, which was a real surprise when I thought about it. Or were maybe unavailable in real-life, which I assume was the case with Tosin Cole.
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Post by shallacatop on Oct 24, 2022 21:19:18 GMT
This made me realise that we were only missing Anneke & Freema from the scene. All of the other Earth based companions have either died / are unavailable in universe, or have died in real life, which was a real surprise when I thought about it. Or we’re maybe unavailable in real-life, which I assume was the case with Tosin Cole. I think you’re misunderstanding what I’m saying. I wasn’t criticising the scene for missing Anneke or Freema, or even speculating why they were absent. I was just noting that they’re the only other two contenders to be in the scene, due to circumstances both in universe, where companions are dead, trapped, mind wiped, etc., or have sadly passed away in real life. Ryan was written as being elsewhere in the story.
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Post by tuigirl on Oct 24, 2022 21:21:26 GMT
Well..... it took me 3 hours to get through this. I nearly collapsed because of hyperventilation. OMG.
Was this pure and utter fan fiction? YES. Was the plot a huge mess? Yes. Did this exceed my wildest ever imaginations? YES and double yes.
Can I just say- this is the most wonderful and beautiful and loveliest bits of Television in a VERY long time.
I feel like my insides have exploded. I cried like a baby.
THIS is why I watch this show. I still cannot believe it.
This looked great, the emotions and heart felt raw and real, and in general, this episode felt to me as if the soul has returned to the show. I actually thought half way through they had changed writers / authors, and I suddenly watched a souped up version of a Peter Davison script!!!!!!!!
And, PLEASE, someone give Sasha Dhawan an award for most amazing performance ever.
They needed someone who could be so utterly over the top that he was still shining bright against ALL THAT OTHER STUFF. And against all odds, Sasha Dhawan SUCCEEDED.
Oh, and by the way, have I mentioned in the past 30mins how much I admire Colin Baker? I still cannot believe he kept a straight face during the convention. With all these questions! But now thinking back, he threw out a few breadcrumbs and some of the things he said and told have now a VERY different meaning. VERY clever, in hindsight.
Especially that story he told about him playing a prank on his agent. I can just imagine Colin sitting on the plane home, laughing about his cleverness- he had just fooled a room full of 500 people. And we did all believe him. I would love to hug him all over again for this. Honestly, he might actually be one of the cleverest people I have ever met.
EDIT: I also contemplate changing my signature sentence to "I can wear whatever I like!"
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Post by tuigirl on Oct 24, 2022 21:23:46 GMT
Also, concerning the question about the missing companions: after this episode, I fully expect the others to turn up in the upcoming specials. There surely is NO WAY they will pass over JAMIE, is there? ? ?
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Post by Star Platinum on Oct 24, 2022 21:24:12 GMT
This made me realise that we were only missing Anneke & Freema from the scene. All of the other Earth based companions have either died / are unavailable in universe, or have died in real life, which was a real surprise when I thought about it. Furthermore, as of Power of The Doctor, the second Doctor is the only Doctor to have no companions played by their original actor on screen (archival footage not withstanding)
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Post by tuigirl on Oct 24, 2022 21:26:42 GMT
This made me realise that we were only missing Anneke & Freema from the scene. All of the other Earth based companions have either died / are unavailable in universe, or have died in real life, which was a real surprise when I thought about it. Furthermore, as of Power of The Doctor, the second Doctor is the only Doctor to have no companions played by their original actor on screen (archival footage not withstanding) Hence why I believe Jamie will be up next.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 24, 2022 21:27:48 GMT
Or we’re maybe unavailable in real-life, which I assume was the case with Tosin Cole. I think you’re misunderstanding what I’m saying. I wasn’t criticising the scene for missing Anneke or Freema, or even speculating why they were absent. I was just noting that they’re the only other two contenders to be in the scene, due to circumstances both in universe, where companions are dead, trapped, mind wiped, etc., or have sadly passed away in real life. Ryan was written as being elsewhere in the story. I know that. I’m sorry if I misinterpreted your comment.
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Post by Audio Watchdog on Oct 24, 2022 23:47:41 GMT
Yeah, the thing is kind of a mess but it was a hugely enjoyable mess that somehow juggled being both a love letter to the franchise and 13’s regeneration. I feel a little redeemed by Tennant being Doctor 14. When Gatwa was announced the first thing I noticed was that the 14th Doctor was never mentioned in any BBC official release. Press outlets assumed and you know what they say about assuming things. Anyway, I really liked Dan and was sorry to see him depart so quickly. I wish ]Flux had been two episodes longer both to spend more time with him and to see the UNIT subplot fleshed out more. Anyway, CC stuck the landing, tied up most loose ends and like the 5th Doctor, gave 13 her best episode to finish out her run. Speaking of 5, his scene with Tegan had me in tears. And how great was it that Tegan had not seen the Doctor in 38 years and as soon as she does see her, she is pissed off at her. Also loved Tegan not letting anything hold her back from seeing the inside of the TARDIS. So many little nods and grace notes. And the former companions support group is indeed a genius notion.
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Post by Star Platinum on Oct 25, 2022 0:02:27 GMT
Furthermore, as of Power of The Doctor, the second Doctor is the only Doctor to have no companions played by their original actor on screen (archival footage not withstanding) Hence why I believe Jamie will be up next. That would be a delight, I'd be over the moon if they got him to comment on the size of something!
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Post by tuigirl on Oct 25, 2022 0:54:40 GMT
Hence why I believe Jamie will be up next. That would be a delight, I'd be over the moon if they got him to comment on the size of something! OMG, we did not get enough of that joke during the convention! And Frazer slips in and out of Patrick's voice seamlessly... So yeah. Jamie will be back. And nobody will believe the size of it!
Just sad we now have to wait for ONE WHOLE YEAR
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Post by Kestrel on Oct 25, 2022 1:09:23 GMT
I don't want to see a Jamie cameo at all.
I want RTD2 to pull a Big Finish Six and make Jamie a companion again, at least for a few episodes, if not a full season.
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Post by relativetime on Oct 25, 2022 1:16:53 GMT
Like everyone else, I genuinely had a blast with it! Dhawan was the absolute highlight for me - I just truly think no other Master, not even Derek Jacobi, has played the part so, so evil and genuinely felt like an unstoppable force. And he STILL manages to channel the camp of the previous portrayals. That Rasputan scene reminded me so much of RTD I was surprised he didn't have a writing credit!
And of course all the scenes with the previous Doctors and companions was amazing! I loved the scenes between Tegan and Five and Ace and Seven and of course Thirteen talking with her past selves too. I like the regeneration scene as well. It feels like these past few regenerations have always ended with a several-minute long speech and while I haven't dislike them, it's nice to have something a little less played out this time and to end with something so fun and true to the Thirteenth's character.
Things I didn't like... Yeah, there's obvious things about how messy the story kind of is, thought that doesn't really bother me all that much. I think it's bigger things outside of the episode itself that kind of bother me. I still feel like we haven't had a proper ending for Flux, for instance. I know a lot of it can't be helped due to the pandemic, but all the same I couldn't help but expect a little more closure here than we ended up getting. As much as I do love how the episode handled all the returning faces and references, I think at times it feels like this episode is more of a love letter to the show as a whole first and a finale for the Thirteenth Doctor specifically second. I do understand why it ended up being this way of course and I'm not saying it doesn't work for what it is because it does and it still manages to be satisfying... but a part of me wonders what a last episode for Jodie might have looked like that wasn't on an anniversary year.
I also do wish they had done more with the Doctor/Yaz relationship than what we got, especially since it is an important bit of LGBT representation. Can you imagine if the Doctor and Rose's relationship had received this amount of attention? Not necessarily a problem with the episode itself... but yeah, I am a little peeved they didn't do SOMETHING more with it here too. Honestly I feel like I shouldn't have even brought it up because I know these kinds of things are subjective and, again, I know it's not a problem isolated just to this episode... buuuuut... EDIT: And I know there was a kind of resolution for that in Legend of the Sea Devils, I just thought there'd be maybe a bit more here than what we have if that makes any sense?
On the whole, I'm very happy with what we got, regardless of what I wanted or thought it should have been. It was a lot of fun and full of a lot of love for the show and I'm very happy this era of the show that's meant a lot to me personally ended on a high note. I'm excited to see what the next era brings us!
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