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Post by martinw8686 on Jan 28, 2023 19:32:53 GMT
With the recent announcements and speculation regarding the Whoniverse, what do we think RTD will be looking to develop in terms of Spin-offs, does anyone know anything rumoured?
I'd love to see more 8th Doctor but I'm doubtful it'll happen. Also the ongoing adventures of the 14th Doctor and Donna but again.
I could definitely see the return of UNIT, a rebooted Torchwood, Rose Tyler and shows based round the usual suspects of monsters.
I've got tons of ideas I'd love to see but I'd be very surprised if any of them come to be,
8th Doctor!!!!!!!!!!! Missy Master(s) Past Doctors (animations) Past companions TimeWar Gallifrey, featuring Jonathan Carley as young War Doctor, Lalla Ward and Louise Jameson
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Post by Sir Wearer of Hats on Jan 28, 2023 21:49:11 GMT
Political thriller a la House of Cards with the “totally not a fascist” Welsh fella we’ve seen in the photos from filming. Perhaps trying to catch lightning twice with a younger audience focused former companion series? Ace perhaps?
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Post by shallacatop on Jan 28, 2023 22:22:30 GMT
I would be shocked if Ace didn’t fill the Sarah Jane Adventures slot. Recently returned, RTD himself set up the modern backstory in Death of the Doctor and had plans for Sophie to reprise the role in Series 6 of SJA.
I think UNIT is a good shout too. Well established, Kate is a regular, is returning under RTD and offers that thriller aspect that Who generally lacks.
Those two also have natural scope for other companions to return without the need for their own shows. I think anything else is likely dependent on any new characters or scenarios we see in the 60th and series 14, 15, etc. I’m of the opinion no Doctors will get their own spin-offs, although I don’t think it’d be impossible they cameo in other shows. Just thinking about the intention for Tom to be in SJA at one point, showing RTD isn’t against the idea.
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shutupbanks
Castellan
There’s a horror movie called Alien? That’s really offensive. No wonder everyone keeps invading you.
Likes: 5,666
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Post by shutupbanks on Jan 28, 2023 23:53:55 GMT
I think that any spin-offs we do get will be based firmly around appearances in the specials and Series 14 and the reactions to them. My reasoning is that we only got Torchwood after they’d been seeded all through Series 1 and 2 and SJA after her appearance in School Reunion. Any other characters (like Ace, Tegan) might have to share a “created by” credit and that is a headache for showbiz accountants.
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Post by martinw8686 on Jan 29, 2023 2:43:28 GMT
I'm not sure an Earth based spin-off holds any interest for me, I've seen enough stories about UNIT, TORCHWOOD and past companions solving Monster of the Week scenarios, none of this carries enough intrigue to get me tuning in.
Now stories about time travel, alternative universes, alien worlds and Timelords does interest me.
Living in the times we do, I need escapism that takes me away from contemporary society, at a push I'd be interested in stories set in the distant past.
I guess I'm saying I don't want to see just another TORCHWOOD or Sarah Jane Adventures repackaged.
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Post by Sir Wearer of Hats on Jan 29, 2023 5:51:05 GMT
I'm not sure an Earth based spin-off holds any interest for me, I've seen enough stories about UNIT, TORCHWOOD and past companions solving Monster of the Week scenarios, none of this carries enough intrigue to get me tuning in. Now stories about time travel, alternative universes, alien worlds and Timelords does interest me. Living in the times we do, I need escapism that takes me away from contemporary society, at a push I'd be interested in stories set in the distant past. I guess I'm saying I don't want to see just another TORCHWOOD or Sarah Jane Adventures repackaged. My ideal spin off has always been “Timeless Doctors, Timeless Lands”. Who is has a quintessential “British” tone, if you will. So I’d commission production teams from India and Australia to produce their own “take” on Who. Ground rules - no police boxes, no Daleks, no Master, no UNIT/Paternosters/Torchwood. Film in those countries. Everyone’s from those countries. There is a Doctor, you know the gist but other than that? All yours.
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Post by shallacatop on Jan 29, 2023 8:49:34 GMT
Any other characters (like Ace, Tegan) might have to share a “created by” credit and that is a headache for showbiz accountants. I would’ve thought that would only extend to monsters, as we’ve seen in recent years with RTD & Moffat getting credit for, say, the Judoon or Weeping Angels making appearances. I think the Doctors and companions are not owned by any individual and I feel that’s likely where spin-offs would come from. After all, there’s never been an issue with the many returning Doctors and companions over the past 15+ years across the main show and spin-offs. Not to mention it’s Big Finish’s bread and butter.
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shutupbanks
Castellan
There’s a horror movie called Alien? That’s really offensive. No wonder everyone keeps invading you.
Likes: 5,666
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Post by shutupbanks on Jan 29, 2023 10:24:47 GMT
Any other characters (like Ace, Tegan) might have to share a “created by” credit and that is a headache for showbiz accountants. I would’ve thought that would only extend to monsters, as we’ve seen in recent years with RTD & Moffat getting credit for, say, the Judoon or Weeping Angels making appearances. I think the Doctors and companions are not owned by any individual and I feel that’s likely where spin-offs would come from. After all, there’s never been an issue with the many returning Doctors and companions over the past 15+ years across the main show and spin-offs. Not to mention it’s Big Finish’s bread and butter. When they return for an episode or two it’s not usually a problem but when it’s an ongoing series it can become quite expensive and be a nightmare to administrate. As an example, Big Finish have access to everything in Blakes 7 except Series D because the rights are tied up with multiple entities rather than just Terry Nation’s estate and the BBC.
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Post by shallacatop on Jan 29, 2023 11:08:29 GMT
I would’ve thought that would only extend to monsters, as we’ve seen in recent years with RTD & Moffat getting credit for, say, the Judoon or Weeping Angels making appearances. I think the Doctors and companions are not owned by any individual and I feel that’s likely where spin-offs would come from. After all, there’s never been an issue with the many returning Doctors and companions over the past 15+ years across the main show and spin-offs. Not to mention it’s Big Finish’s bread and butter. When they return for an episode or two it’s not usually a problem but when it’s an ongoing series it can become quite expensive and be a nightmare to administrate. As an example, Big Finish have access to everything in Blakes 7 except Series D because the rights are tied up with multiple entities rather than just Terry Nation’s estate and the BBC. Which I appreciate, but we’re talking about companions here. I really don’t think there’s any administration nightmare; they’re the property of the BBC, not anyone else. The sheer number of expanded universe material should attest to that, with Grace & Chang Lee being notable because they were created as part of the Universal co-production.
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shutupbanks
Castellan
There’s a horror movie called Alien? That’s really offensive. No wonder everyone keeps invading you.
Likes: 5,666
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Post by shutupbanks on Jan 29, 2023 13:16:19 GMT
When they return for an episode or two it’s not usually a problem but when it’s an ongoing series it can become quite expensive and be a nightmare to administrate. As an example, Big Finish have access to everything in Blakes 7 except Series D because the rights are tied up with multiple entities rather than just Terry Nation’s estate and the BBC. Which I appreciate, but we’re talking about companions here. I really don’t think there’s any administration nightmare; they’re the property of the BBC, not anyone else. The sheer number of expanded universe material should attest to that, with Grace & Chang Lee being notable because they were created as part of the Universal co-production. Grace and Chang Lee are owned by Universal and they have never even been mentioned since the movie, except for a reference in the final Divergent Universe story that featured Daphne Ashbrook and included the line, “There’s no grace here.” You may recall a few years ago the problems with the estate of Mervyn Haisman over the use of the Brigadier’s name in the show. Anthony Coburn’s family even tried to claim that the name of the TARDIS belonged to them and couldn’t be referenced without acknowledging Coburn. This article from a few years ago, explains some of the issues: www.plagiarismtoday.com/2018/01/18/the-strange-copyright-of-doctor-who/And this thread on Reddit explains some of the other issues at play, or at least suggests some of them: https://www.reddit.com/r/doctorwho/comments/rtsp70/who_owns_the_rights_to_the_characters_in_doctor/ Honestly, I’ve got a few dream spin-offs that I’d like to see, but I think that RTD will be mostly using characters that he has created simply because they will be entirely his.
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Post by shallacatop on Jan 29, 2023 13:33:53 GMT
Which I appreciate, but we’re talking about companions here. I really don’t think there’s any administration nightmare; they’re the property of the BBC, not anyone else. The sheer number of expanded universe material should attest to that, with Grace & Chang Lee being notable because they were created as part of the Universal co-production. Grace and Chang Lee are owned by Universal and they have never even been mentioned since the movie, except for a reference in the final Divergent Universe story that featured Daphne Ashbrook and included the line, “There’s no grace here.” You may recall a few years ago the problems with the estate of Mervyn Haisman over the use of the Brigadier’s name in the show. Anthony Coburn’s family even tried to claim that the name of the TARDIS belonged to them and couldn’t be referenced without acknowledging Coburn. This article from a few years ago, explains some of the issues: www.plagiarismtoday.com/2018/01/18/the-strange-copyright-of-doctor-who/And this thread on Reddit explains some of the other issues at play, or at least suggests some of them: https://www.reddit.com/r/doctorwho/comments/rtsp70/who_owns_the_rights_to_the_characters_in_doctor/ Honestly, I’ve got a few dream spin-offs that I’d like to see, but I think that RTD will be mostly using characters that he has created simply because they will be entirely his. None of this amounts to anything more than estates trying their luck and failing as they have no grounds to stand on. There’s no issue surrounding companions and no “headache for showbiz accountants” that you refer to, as demonstrated by the years and years of examples that prove otherwise. I agree that spin-offs will feature and be based on events from the 60th, Series 14, 15, etc. because they can be created with that potential and are current. I don’t think them being entirely with RTD really comes into it.
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Post by fitzoliverj on Jan 29, 2023 14:37:28 GMT
None of this amounts to anything more than estates trying their luck and failing as they have no grounds to stand on. There’s no issue surrounding companions There absolutely is. Back in the 1990s, Virgin got some complaints when they used characters without permission, although I think it was to much trouble to do anything else. And from the 1980s onwards, individual writers have licensed the use of characters to third-parties, which continues today. Bob Baker and Dave Martin retained the rights to K9 and used the character on their own, and the BBC had to come to a series of arrangements to use K9 in DW and SJA. The Hainsman estate did enforce their rights to the Brigadier, and BF now cite their permission when they release audios featuring him. Is it a *big* problem? That's another matter. How many pre-existing characters are likely to be the centre of a new spinoff from the BBC? Probably not many. But if we suddenly got "The New Adventures of Adric's Ghost", they'd definitely clear all possible claims before making a start, with payments and/or credits as appropriate.
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Post by fitzoliverj on Jan 29, 2023 14:40:24 GMT
Oh, and let's not forget that if "The Dark Dimension" hadn't been halted due to the budget having been miscalculated, or due to internal BBC politics, or the cast refusing to be in it, Paul Cornell would have had good grounds to sue over the character of "Summerfield".
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Post by shallacatop on Jan 29, 2023 15:40:36 GMT
None of this amounts to anything more than estates trying their luck and failing as they have no grounds to stand on. There’s no issue surrounding companions There absolutely is. Back in the 1990s, Virgin got some complaints when they used characters without permission, although I think it was to much trouble to do anything else. And from the 1980s onwards, individual writers have licensed the use of characters to third-parties, which continues today. Bob Baker and Dave Martin retained the rights to K9 and used the character on their own, and the BBC had to come to a series of arrangements to use K9 in DW and SJA. The Hainsman estate did enforce their rights to the Brigadier, and BF now cite their permission when they release audios featuring him. Is it a *big* problem? That's another matter. How many pre-existing characters are likely to be the centre of a new spinoff from the BBC? Probably not many. But if we suddenly got "The New Adventures of Adric's Ghost", they'd definitely clear all possible claims before making a start, with payments and/or credits as appropriate.Of course they would, that’s just common sense. However it isn’t the headache that it’s being made out to be for the most part, if at all. As for the Brigadier & K9, that’s noted and they’re the exception to the rule, as they were created to be one-offs. Ace, Tegan, Harry, Leela, etc. come as part of the Who licencing; there’s no credits for any individuals or payments for their use. As proven by all the media we consume on a very regular basis or indeed what RTD himself has done in the past. Going ahead without that licence, well that’s another story.
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Post by Digi on Jan 29, 2023 16:38:00 GMT
Much too early to guess at specifics IMO, we need to see what RTD gives us in the show before taking a swing in that level of detail.
More broadly though, based on both past RTD DW history and on RTD in general, I think we can make a reasonable guess that spinoffs will include (at least) one kid-centric series and one adults only series. Not only did he do this in the past (SJA/TW), if he's planning on expanding DW into a larger TV franchise, it makes a lot of sense to go after multiple target demographics. Maybe seed in some minor crossovers, nothing critical to each series, but 'nice to have' if you're a fan watching all--and maybe a tiny enticement to fans of show B to go have a look at show C.
Given what he did with It's A Sin, I think it's also possible that the 'adult' spinoff series is a lot more grown up and mature than Torchwood ever was. Yes I know TW was billed as for adults, but it was kind of a teenager's view of 'grown up'--"oh man we can get away with swearing and sex [but no nudity], YEAHHHH!" I'd guess that a new 'adult' DW spinoff is likely to be much more adult in the sense of adult themes and emotional situations that primarily arise from the characters' relationships, rather than 'alien, better get gun.'
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lidar2
Castellan
You know, now that you mention it, I actually do rather like Attack of the Cybermen ...
Likes: 5,812
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Post by lidar2 on Jan 30, 2023 10:46:02 GMT
When they return for an episode or two it’s not usually a problem but when it’s an ongoing series it can become quite expensive and be a nightmare to administrate. As an example, Big Finish have access to everything in Blakes 7 except Series D because the rights are tied up with multiple entities rather than just Terry Nation’s estate and the BBC. Which I appreciate, but we’re talking about companions here. I really don’t think there’s any administration nightmare; they’re the property of the BBC, not anyone else. The sheer number of expanded universe material should attest to that, with Grace & Chang Lee being notable because they were created as part of the Universal co-production. Ian Briggs talks about granting the BBC the rights to Ace on his Toby Hadoke's Whosround for more info on the rights to that specific character. I think in general the position is that if the production team decided to create a new companion and gave the brief to a writer, the BBC own the character. If the character was created by the writer as a one-off supporting character, but the producer subsequently decided they liked the character and would keep them on as a regular, then the rights belong to the writer unless the BBC and the writer can come to an arrangement (as happened with Ian Briggs and Ace)
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lidar2
Castellan
You know, now that you mention it, I actually do rather like Attack of the Cybermen ...
Likes: 5,812
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Post by lidar2 on Jan 30, 2023 10:49:23 GMT
I'm not sure why it is often assumed that any spin off would feature a recurring element we have already seen. I think it more likely any spin off would be a new element introduced via a backdoor pilot in series 14/15
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Post by martinw8686 on Jan 30, 2023 13:00:07 GMT
I'm not sure why it is often assumed that any spin off would feature a recurring element we have already seen. I think it more likely any spin off would be a new element introduced via a backdoor pilot in series 14/15 I'm with you on the idea of a back door pilot, it wasn't very imaginative of me to go straight to the idea of reoccurring elements. As long as newly introduced concepts feel right for the Whoniverse, I'm all for spin-offs developing this way. I would like to see a spin-off that comes away from area's already covered by the main show, if Doctor Who is doing monster of the week, base under seige, contemporary Earth stories, Invasions and kitchen sink companion arcs then why go there again in a different show. Now if the mainshow rarely goes to certain story types, for example one off UNIT adventures, Time agents,rogue time lords and popular guest characters, then by all means pursue audience interest in increasing these elements. Some franchises release spin-offs that feel pointless because their basically doing the same show over and over again, I love the Walking Dead but it's spin-offs have so far felt very samey.
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mbt66
Chancellery Guard
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Post by mbt66 on Jan 31, 2023 21:12:07 GMT
The Companion Support Group seen at the end of The Power of the Doctor would be a great way to repackage and introduce new viewers to the extensive back catalogue of Doctor Who.
Some episodes could focus on an individual story or have a theme and have clips from multiple stories.
Having it framed in a modern setting and with enhanced effects on the clips would make the old stories look their best and could entice new viewers to check out the full episodes.
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Post by timleschild on Jan 31, 2023 21:17:26 GMT
I'm not sure why it is often assumed that any spin off would feature a recurring element we have already seen. I think it more likely any spin off would be a new element introduced via a backdoor pilot in series 14/15 Definitely. I think this is what will happen, so RTD has ownership of the spin-offs based on original characters he has created with the Whoniverse. Empire building.
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