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Post by smith11 on Feb 15, 2018 13:41:17 GMT
Can anyone say which Doctors feature in which story??
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Post by mark687 on Feb 15, 2018 13:50:24 GMT
Can anyone say which Doctors feature in which story?? Young Winston= 11th
Human Conflict and Churchill's Double =9th
Churchill Victorious= 10th
Regards
mark687
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Post by smith11 on Feb 15, 2018 13:57:19 GMT
Can anyone say which Doctors feature in which story?? Young Winston= 11th
Human Conflict and Churchill's Double =9th
Churchill Victorious= 10th
Regards
mark687
Thanks, just one of these things I like to know going into a story
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Post by IndieMacUser on Feb 17, 2018 12:59:10 GMT
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Post by Zagreus on Feb 17, 2018 17:41:45 GMT
Have listened to the first three so far. All very good Glad to see Nine in two of them, and Vastra was a standout. All excellent little standalone stories so far. Not perfect, but nothing major wrong with them. My only complaint is a lack of Hetty Warner in the second story, which is set between The Oncoming Storm and Hounded from the previous set. Or really any mention of her whatsoever.
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Post by iainmclaughlin on Feb 17, 2018 23:37:32 GMT
Have listened to the first three so far. All very good Glad to see Nine in two of them, and Vastra was a standout. All excellent little standalone stories so far. Not perfect, but nothing major wrong with them. My only complaint is a lack of Hetty Warner in the second story, which is set between The Oncoming Storm and Hounded from the previous set. Or really any mention of her whatsoever. It's a while ago so my memory is a bit shoogly. Hetty was certainly discussed during the planning but I didn't think that it was a story where there was a lot for her to do. It's about Churchill and very much focuses on him. I think we would only have used Hetty if there was something of substance for her to do - or that may have been just my thinking. It was a while ago, so I'm not sure. You're right, though, I possibly could have added a line. How about Connolly is covering for her while she is away on a classified mission for the PM?
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Post by Audio Watchdog on Feb 17, 2018 23:48:20 GMT
I'd like a Churchill story with 6 and Constance. Anyway, I'm looking forward to digging into this set.
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Post by number13 on Mar 3, 2018 2:06:21 GMT
Halfway in and I'm loving this new volume after two more stories of Churchill and his most unusual friend. They're a couple of great adventures for our adventurous duo and (if you happen to be a real-life Churchill enthusiast) are also most enjoyable for the way both writers have skilfully merged his real life and imaginary life, creating new challenges for a man who objected only to a quiet life! It all sounds excellent, the music and sound design shifting smoothly across decades and locations and from the small scale to the epic. The guest cast (including one very special guest) are perfect - and Ian McNeice is simply brilliant once again. The only slight criticism I had of the first volume was the way the Ninth Doctor was portrayed, which seemed to me slightly to interrupt the flow of his story. Well, in this volume he appears in two stories and I was pleased to find he sounds perfectly at home in the one I've heard so far. 2.1 Young Winston is a turn-of-the-century treat from Paul Morris. With all the other stories concentrating (rightly) on Churchill the heroic war leader, I thought it was a great idea to have a story set forty years earlier, when a very young man was busy touring the world looking for trouble (in a professional sense!) to further his military and literary careers. The account of young Winston turning 21 (but not turning a hair!) as he comes under fire in Cuba is fully authentic and a great way to start the story. But it's a mysterious lady who brings the real danger... Iain Batchelor is excellent as young Winston, finding that his chance encounter in Havana with the dignified Carmen is somehow still with him four (highly adventurous and well-travelled) years later in London. I very much enjoyed this distinctly Holmesian story, one of the style where the protagonist returns from some far-flung corner of Empire (the Spanish empire in this case) and discovers that his travels unexpectedly follow him... Naturally, Churchill not only consults The Great Detective (the veiled lady of Paternoster Row rather than he of Baker Street) but also charges in to investigate his own case with more energy than skill - his Watson to her Holmes; a splendid partnership to take on Ortega's gang of ruffianly rebels. Only when the (Eleventh) Doctor eventually arrives do we discover the mystery of Carmen has science-fiction as well as historical roots (and a very good twist I didn't see coming), though the setting and period details are so good that I'd also have enjoyed it as a pure historical - with one non-human character, but of course the Earth is her planet too... It was wonderful hearing Neve McIntosh bringing Madame Vastra to BF at last, sharing the narration with the older Churchill as well as the action with his younger self. Their first (and hopefully not last) meeting is a memorable one and her closing line is one of the biggest 'teases' I've ever heard from BF: 'Or a chapter in ''The Adventures of Madame Vastra'?' Yes please! 2.2 Human Conflict by Iain McLaughlin is an all-action 'war movie' plus a 'Doctor Who' alien and a moral twist. It's a cracker and my favourite from the volume-and-a-half of (all excellent) stories heard so far. Part spy story, part commando mission and part moral dilemma, it's a non-stop ride as the scene shifts from London to Denmark to Dundee and finally out to the Hebrides, on a mission to prevent the Nazis getting their evil hands on alien weaponry (so far so good) - and to take it for the Allies instead - which is where things get complicated... The 'adventure' side of the story is just about perfect, throwing in a Lt. Fleming (expert in commando operations and presumably the brother of the Mr. Fleming) and daring flights by flying boat. And it allows a few determined Nazis a temporary foothold on British soil - which in turn allows Churchill to exchange fire with them in person (as I'm sure he often longed to do!) while zig-zagging through the streets of Dundee. And all for the sake of an alien scientist (or is she) with more than one secret. And through it all, appearing and disappearing even more than usual, the Ninth Doctor is a warning presence from another Total War - all too aware that some weapons are too terrible to contemplate using, however extreme the enemy... The moral dimension gives the story an excellent pay-off. In a war of national survival, how far is too far? It's worth noting that Churchill (and the Nazi commander) only rejects the offered alien weapons after the Doctor reveals the 'scientist' is really planning to sell her stolen arsenal to both sides, escalating the war until the Earth is reduced to (profitable) radioactive ruins. Then, a very temporary human alliance is formed to defeat her, before the war is back on its former course. I thought this was all very well written and argued - no doubt either side would have bought and used the weapons if they could have gained them exclusively; the Allies to shorten the war in defence of freedom, the Nazis for global domination. So the ending is serious and thought-provoking, but I must mention how much I enjoyed the lighter and action aspects of the earlier 'Dundee' segment and seeing Churchill leafing through 'The Beano' was a special treat. (Overseas listeners may not know that among Dundee's many claims to fame is as the home of popular comics; I was one of those young readers still enjoying 'The Beano' 30 years after Winston did here!) Churchill readers will also appreciate the enjoyable move of taking him back to Dundee, from where (as the story mentions) the voters decisively slung him out as their MP in 1922! That election night saw the Liberals (including at that time Churchill) defeated across the country, losing dozens of seats and pushed from their pre-war governing position into third place. However, Churchill (not for the last time) regenerated from the political dead and just two years later in 1924 (now a Conservative MP again), Winston was back! Two excellent 5* stories, and I'm looking forward to the second half of the set. (EDIT: A longer post than I intended, but it's been snowing for days and Britain is closed. Time on my hands... )
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Post by Audio Watchdog on Mar 8, 2018 3:51:08 GMT
Young Winston was a cracker of a good story by Paul Morris. The character of Madame Vastra is strong enough I don't feel like she needs the rest of the Gang. Excellent start to the box set.
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Post by pawntake on Mar 8, 2018 11:48:35 GMT
We have had "Jago and Litefoot and Strax" and also Madame Vastra appearing in "Churchill volume 2" And after the sad passing of Trevor Baxter.
Why not Madame Vastra Jago and Strax?? Don't tell me?? Big Finish do not have the licence for it!!! Oh well!! Just an idea!!
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Post by iainmclaughlin on Mar 8, 2018 16:38:43 GMT
We have had "Jago and Litefoot and Strax" and also Madame Vastra appearing in "Churchill volume 2" And after the sad passing of Trevor Baxter. Why not Madame Vastra Jago and Strax?? Don't tell me?? Big Finish do not have the licence for it!!! Oh well!! Just an idea!! I'd love to hear Jago with Madame Vastra! It would be a different dynamic for both and a lot of fun.
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mbt66
Chancellery Guard
Likes: 3,081
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Post by mbt66 on Mar 8, 2018 20:25:32 GMT
We have had "Jago and Litefoot and Strax" and also Madame Vastra appearing in "Churchill volume 2" And after the sad passing of Trevor Baxter. Why not Madame Vastra Jago and Strax?? Don't tell me?? Big Finish do not have the licence for it!!! Oh well!! Just an idea!! I'd love to hear Jago with Madame Vastra! It would be a different dynamic for both and a lot of fun. Absolutely! Vastra needs a man! Will Jago do?
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Post by Audio Watchdog on Mar 8, 2018 21:28:31 GMT
We have had "Jago and Litefoot and Strax" and also Madame Vastra appearing in "Churchill volume 2" And after the sad passing of Trevor Baxter. Why not Madame Vastra Jago and Strax?? Don't tell me?? Big Finish do not have the licence for it!!! Oh well!! Just an idea!! I thought the limits imposed on BF were for all the "Gang" to appear together? Vastra, or Strax for that matter, on their own are fine. Based on what we know, Vastra & Jago should not be an issue.
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Post by ollychops on Mar 8, 2018 21:52:16 GMT
I'm sure I read somewhere that BF still had to ask special permission to use Strax and Vastra, despite them showing up individually and not part of the Gang.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Mar 8, 2018 22:35:00 GMT
Does that still apply now that Capaldi is no longer the incumbent? (Have they passed from the "current" license to the "past" license?)
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Post by ollychops on Mar 8, 2018 23:28:02 GMT
Does that still apply now that Capaldi is no longer the incumbent? (Have they passed from the "current" license to the "past" license?) I'm not sure it was anything to do with them being in Capaldi's era. We've had elements from his era in BF already (Kate, Osgood - and those two characters were more prevalent in his era, PG were only in his first episode) and they don't seem to have required any special permission, so I think it's more down to Moffat more than anything. I think he may be holding off on allowing BF to create their own Paternoster Gang spinoff in case he wants to go down that road in the future, which is why BF are having to request special permission to use those characters.
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Post by number13 on Mar 9, 2018 10:30:53 GMT
Back for the second half... 2.3 I Was Churchill's Double is another superb story by Alan Barnes. As with his story 'Hounded' (my favourite of Volume 1) he has written the most fantastical story of the set, "Churchill Through the Looking Glass" in more ways than one. It's inventive, funny, exciting and has at least three twists, none of which I guessed! (As it should be!) The authentic detail of the opening is well done, Churchill off to spend the weekend at his borrowed country house at Ditchley, because the PM's official retreat at Chequers was (of course) known to the Germans and easy to identify from the air. So he goes where there should have been peace and quiet and safety - and naturally, finds the mirror image of all that! The 'alternative world in a magic mirror' idea is ages old of course, but the way it's used here is original and as I said, fooled me most enjoyably. As 'Doctor Who' fans, we know all about that other authoritarian universe with its eyepatch-wearing Brigadier, but this mirror-world is quite different. I liked the use of audio to keep secrets from us that would have been perfectly visible to Churchill - notably the uniforms & helmets that the Germans are wearing; Germans who serve Kaiser Wilhelm III in a world where Imperial Germany won the First (and only) World War and mirror-Churchill leads the British Resistance and the fight against not only the Germans, but the traitors and Quislings in his own country. Whichever reality, the unflappable Ninth Doctor can deduce and explain - it's all down to alien gizmos of course, not magic. And Churchill's way home depends on his faith in the Doctor and his strength of will - both of which are pretty robust! - making for a neat and unusually satisfying variation on the 'it was all a dream' ending. My equal-favourite of the set with 'Human Conflict'. Memo: if it's an Alan Barnes story, get off the airship quick... ------------- 2.4 Churchill Victorious begins with as much fun as I'd expected from the authors of 'Kingdom of Lies' and my favourite BF release of 2016, 'The Ravelli Conspiracy'. Churchill at a loose end in Downing St. on VE day (abandoned by all his staff, gone to celebrate victory), sets fire to the kitchen while trying to cook a wildly ambitious lunch and then goes out into the VE day crowds looking for trouble (as reported in a dispatch from Special Branch) wearing an unconvincing alias and an even more unconvincing disguise. It's a delightfully absurdist fantasy of course; if the previous story was "Churchill Through the Looking Glass", this one starts off as "Churchill in Wonderland". The PM would never be left unattended and even if he was, Churchill was the last man on Earth to think he wouldn't instantly be recognised virtually anywhere, with or without false whiskers - in fact, he would probably have felt insulted by the suggestion! But it's a lot of fun and I was expecting the story would carry on in much the same style, which it does, up to a point where the plot takes a surprising and clever twist. Churchill suddenly has the opportunity to gain alien weapons for (genuinely planned) 'Operation Unthinkable' - a new war against the Soviet Union to drive the Red Army out of liberated (and instantly re-occupied by Stalin) Eastern Europe. However, with a little (unspoken) help from the Tenth Doctor and some magnified home truths from a redoubtable Cockney lady, he turns the chance down with the same self-knowledge as Galadriel rejecting the One Ring - thus, Churchill Victorious over himself. It's a clever idea, although we'd seen something similar in 'Human Conflict', in which Churchill also rejects alien weapons that would have given the Allies a decisive military advantage. In real life, 'Operation Unthinkable' was modified into a defensive strategy to respond to any Soviet attack westward - but only after offensive operations were deemed impossible, not simply 'unthinkable'. If Churchill had taken up the offer of alien super-weapons... who knows what alternative timeline might have resulted? So his decision here to reject them and another war shows him in a noble light and at least partly understanding of the views of war-weary Britain (maybe more so than in reality). And perhaps we see him here making a split-second decision to play the long game of a Cold War instead? And so off he goes through the grateful crowds, feeling sure of victory at the Election. But elections are won on hope for the future, not gratitude for the past; Labour won in 1945 by a landslide and most thought Churchill had fought and lost his last battle. But elections usually are won on future promises not past successes, so despite all Labour's achievements in those difficult post-war years, in 1951 the Conservatives were returned to government - led at first by a familiar figure somehow regenerated from the political dead yet again. Perhaps he really did know the Doctor... ------------- An excellent volume, imo even better than the first and I strongly hope we will have more entries from 'The Churchill Years' in future. Perhaps a Cold War story from the early 50s for the man who warned about the descent of 'The Iron Curtain', or a maritime mystery for the First Lord during WWI or one from his time on the Western Front? I eagerly await the next dispatches from BF's brilliant writers and hope they will send Vol 3 along without undue delay. In the phrase Churchill had printed on his most urgent orders: Action this day! (Thanks for reading.)
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mbt66
Chancellery Guard
Likes: 3,081
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Post by mbt66 on Mar 13, 2018 19:59:25 GMT
Does that still apply now that Capaldi is no longer the incumbent? (Have they passed from the "current" license to the "past" license?) I'm not sure it was anything to do with them being in Capaldi's era. We've had elements from his era in BF already (Kate, Osgood - and those two characters were more prevalent in his era, PG were only in his first episode) and they don't seem to have required any special permission, so I think it's more down to Moffat more than anything. I think he may be holding off on allowing BF to create their own Paternoster Gang spinoff in case he wants to go down that road in the future, which is why BF are having to request special permission to use those characters. Yes I think it must be that Mr Moffat owns the rights to the characters and is still thinking about using them in the future. However he must have given the OK to Strax meeting Jago & Litefoot, so I would imagine that he wouldn’t have an issue with a one off Vastra & Jago release.
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Post by xlozdob on Apr 21, 2018 15:11:39 GMT
Where would you guys place these stories in each Doctor's respective timelines?
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Post by ollychops on Apr 21, 2018 15:16:53 GMT
Where would you guys place these stories in each Doctor's respective timelines? Young Winston seems to take place sometime after Amy and Rory have left, given the description of Eleven’s outfit and Vastra says something about losses and makes a point of looking at Eleven, IIRC. So between The Angels Take Manhattan and The Snowmen? Or it could also go between The Name of the Doctor and The Day of the Doctor, since Eleven is only travelling with Clara every so often at that point so it could be one of the times that he’s travelling without her. As for the others, I’m not sure. I don’t remember anything immediately jumping out to me in regards to placements.
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