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Post by Deleted on Sept 6, 2018 17:58:58 GMT
As for World Enough and Time/The Doctor Falls-I actually wished that was his regeneration story not the one we got just a personal opinion. The scene of him running and voicing to the Cybermen all his successes and their defeats would have been an absolutely heroic finale. I agree. We had the clips of old companions and a 'death scene' and everything. While I was glad we got one more Moffat/Capaldi story, and while the idea of the Doctor's struggle to hold off regeneration was an interesting one, I think - ultimately - the eventual Christmas story was highly anti-climactic, despite David Bradley's reappearance. It was everything was in place in the previous story two parter it really was. Its like all the Doctor Regeneration stories...am like oh get on with it. I never felt that way in old WHO I was genuinely touched emotionally though with Karen Gillan and Matts scene in his story.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 6, 2018 17:59:46 GMT
I can't agree less about the Xmas story. The Doctor Falls WAS the big epic regen story, we got a fairytale coda as a goodbye which feels like the best possible way for Moffat to sign off. I love how ballsy it was to do a last story like that. No Daleks, Master, Cybermen or ANY villain. Just reflection and friendship.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 6, 2018 18:18:24 GMT
I agree. We had the clips of old companions and a 'death scene' and everything. While I was glad we got one more Moffat/Capaldi story, and while the idea of the Doctor's struggle to hold off regeneration was an interesting one, I think - ultimately - the eventual Christmas story was highly anti-climactic, despite David Bradley's reappearance. It was everything was in place in the previous story two parter it really was. Its like all the Doctor Regeneration stories...am like oh get on with it. I never felt that way in old WHO I was genuinely touched emotionally though with Karen Gillan and Matts scene in his story. And in ten years time i will probably think WOW that’s was the best regeneration story ever as we are all very fickle lol
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Post by Deleted on Sept 6, 2018 18:33:33 GMT
I can't agree less about the Xmas story. The Doctor Falls WAS the big epic regen story, we got a fairytale coda as a goodbye which feels like the best possible way for Moffat to sign off. I love how ballsy it was to do a last story like that. No Daleks, Master, Cybermen or ANY villain. Just reflection and friendship. Like i said its all personal taste...and very much of the moment
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Post by Deleted on Sept 6, 2018 20:26:41 GMT
I can't agree less about the Xmas story. The Doctor Falls WAS the big epic regen story, we got a fairytale coda as a goodbye which feels like the best possible way for Moffat to sign off. I love how ballsy it was to do a last story like that. No Daleks, Master, Cybermen or ANY villain. Just reflection and friendship. This. I mean whilst i dont think i would have minded TDF’s as his last story (tbh compared to tennant and smiths finals it would has still been quite tame) but i think TUAT really works for Capaldi and is one of my favorite regeneration storys.
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Post by barnabaslives on Sept 6, 2018 21:02:00 GMT
I expect I'll be less critical next time I re-watch Capaldi episodes. I think I must have some odd sense of urgency about perfecting my complaints in public so I can e-mail them to the BBC or something, a lot of the gripes I could have sent about shows from the Moffat era somehow really don't seem to matter half as much the minute Moffat and Capaldi left. I might as well think up hate mail for First Doctor episodes, what would be the point now? :-)
Next time round I can focus more on things I liked than on things I didn't. I think it will be a lot more fun and relaxed re-watching the Capaldi era now that I already know that it's not really going to come up with any deal-breakers or lead anywhere I can't follow, and that it ends on a very high note that for me lasts an entire season.
I agree Capaldi could have had a great farewell episode with The Doctor Falls, but nothing wrong in my book with having a very lovely Christmas bonus. There's a lot about it that I found really likable (including Mark Gatiss, I was very happy about that because I know of him through Big Finish, so I got to cheer for my Home Team when he walked on set, as when Nick does Daleks for TV).
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Post by Deleted on Sept 7, 2018 7:13:41 GMT
I really can't put my finger on WHY I didn't like Twice Upon A Time, issues with The First Doctor withstanding (especially in his interactions with Bill, The First Doctor, I know would have been wary, but still taken her under his cloak and it would been a nice contrast to Twelve's, especially in regards to World Enough and Time/The Doctor Falls, oh God, the misappropiation of the smacked bottom line and while I'm not denying there wasn't sexism in The First Doctor stories, The First Doctor was incredibly fond of and respected Barbara, respected Vicki's intelligience and Hartnell insisting on removing lines about companions doing the cleaning, etc), something about the story just didn't...flow well. It didn't help that I really didn't get a good handle on what version of Bill we encountered here, either (at the time, I thought it was last vestiges of human Bill, but was still confused and author's intent only came across four months later in the novelisation) and I don't really know how The Doctor managed to shift those hours, either.
Everything about it I should have loved, The Doctor finally scrambling forward into the light after facing the shadows and reconciling his identity as The Doctor, having to shed a sense of permeancy in his life with River, hell, even and the idea that goodness does exist, but will always failable due to being delievered by mortals which honestly, I think is so beautifully Doctor Who (you can practically feel Four tapping his nose and The Curator giving a sad little smirk about his past incarnation). I don't have that much of an issue with Testimony being around in the Doctor Who universe, because I sure it'll be taken care of in the upcoming series and it was a nice coda for Twelve's journey.
I loved Series 10, though.
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Post by thethirddoctor on Sept 7, 2018 8:36:57 GMT
How can you end the negativity, when people are being negative in this thread?
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Post by tuigirl on Sept 7, 2018 8:47:12 GMT
How can you end the negativity, when people are being negative in this thread? How is that? Everybody is trying to share at least something positive and giving valid points why they feel they did not like something. That is not negativity, that is critical thinking.
I found this threat quite positive compared to really negative ones elsewhere on the net.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 7, 2018 9:22:28 GMT
I really can't put my finger on WHY I didn't like Twice Upon A Time, issues with The First Doctor withstanding (especially in his interactions with Bill, The First Doctor, I know would have been wary, but still taken her under his cloak and it would been a nice contrast to Twelve's, especially in regards to World Enough and Time/The Doctor Falls, oh God, the misappropiation of the smacked bottom line and while I'm not denying there wasn't sexism in The First Doctor stories, The First Doctor was incredibly fond of and respected Barbara, respected Vicki's intelligience and Hartnell insisting on removing lines about companions doing the cleaning, etc), something about the story just didn't...flow well. It didn't help that I really didn't get a good handle on what version of Bill we encountered here, either (at the time, I thought it was last vestiges of human Bill, but was still confused and author's intent only came across four months later in the novelisation) and I don't really know how The Doctor managed to shift those hours, either. Everything about it I should have loved, The Doctor finally scrambling forward into the light after facing the shadows and reconciling his identity as The Doctor, having to shed a sense of permeancy in his life with River, hell, even and the idea that goodness does exist, but will always failable due to being delievered by mortals which honestly, I think is so beautifully Doctor Who (you can practically feel Four tapping his nose and The Curator giving a sad little smirk about his past incarnation). I don't have that much of an issue with Testimony being around in the Doctor Who universe, because I sure it'll be taken care of in the upcoming series and it was a nice coda for Twelve's journey. I loved Series 10, though. Series 10 was brilliant, I think it's one of the best seasons of NuWho we've had so far (long may it continue ). I've been in the same boat, pondering much the same thing. I'm more favourably inclined towards the gags with the First Doctor now, ironically, because of similar done with Cable in Deadpool 2. Yeah, I don't quite understand it either, but there it is. I don't think they work for me personally, my sense of humour's different, but they don't actively rub me the wrong way like they did before. I think Twice Upon a Time has the very, very hard task of being not a finale for Twelve -- that was The Doctor Falls -- but an epilogue. In storytelling terms, we've had the stage explode into light and colour, and now we're watching him turn off all the lights and lock the doors behind him. Babylon 5, which the previous story takes a few cues from, does something very similar with its characters. It was an episode all about how the universe is moving on without these characters... but Twice is trying something very different. Walking obituaries testimony to the idea that nothing ever truly dies if it's remembered. There's nothing really here to test the Twelfth Doctor's mettle beyond an intellectual puzzle. It's tempting certainly, but they don't seem like an entity that would force people to give themselves over to them. So... Essentially, we have what can be called an Excuse Plot (or what I like to call a poke-it-with-a-stick plot): something that nudges the characters along solely for them to spark off each other. That's not bad, that can be rather fascinating, but personally I find it... fine? Don't love it, don't hate it. It's... fine.
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Post by thethirddoctor on Sept 7, 2018 10:10:40 GMT
I loved Series 10, though. Series 10 was brilliant, I think it's one of the best seasons of NuWho we've had so far (long may it continue ). I've been in the same boat, pondering much the same thing. I'm more favourably inclined towards the gags with the First Doctor now, ironically, because of similar done with Cable in Deadpool 2. Yeah, I don't quite understand it either, but there it is. I don't think they work for me personally, my sense of humour's different, but they don't actively rub me the wrong way like they did before. What did you like about series 10?
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Post by Deleted on Sept 7, 2018 10:26:57 GMT
Series 10 was brilliant, I think it's one of the best seasons of NuWho we've had so far (long may it continue ). I've been in the same boat, pondering much the same thing. I'm more favourably inclined towards the gags with the First Doctor now, ironically, because of similar done with Cable in Deadpool 2. Yeah, I don't quite understand it either, but there it is. I don't think they work for me personally, my sense of humour's different, but they don't actively rub me the wrong way like they did before. What did you like about series 10? Oh, where to begin... I thought having the trio aboard the TARDIS was a really nice idea. Bill who's new to all of this and able to perk up the Doctor's more world-weary side and Nardole who keeps him honest to his wider responsibilities (i.e. little people and big picture with Twelve in the middle). I thought each episode had a nice thematic flow to it and a nice rhythm. It's a very good sign when your audience is asking for just five or ten minutes more of each story to explore the concepts inside of it. There was a nice variety to the settings being visited and the arc with Missy in the background managed to break some new ground for televised Who with the Doctor and Master's really quite tragic friendship. What else... The Twelfth Doctor's characterisation really sung true this season too. All the best bits of the previous two seasons got incorporated into this marvellously well-rounded sort of being. It felt like a natural progression from the seesaw we'd seen previously. I liked the Doctor's conversation about murder in Thin Ice in particular ("Have you ever killed anyone?" "...Yes."), it was very honest and didn't shortchange anyone in the process of being brought up. Oxygen brought to mind the best of Vengeance on Varos, where it's this really vile system enabling tyrants that's the true menace. Empress of Mars was pure Barsoom and a really fun hodgepodge of pulp sci-fi. I had a lot of fun with this season. It just kept getting better and better as the stories rolled on.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 7, 2018 10:35:48 GMT
What did you like about series 10? Oh, where to begin... I thought having the trio aboard the TARDIS was a really nice idea. Bill who's new to all of this and able to perk up the Doctor's more world-weary side and Nardole who keeps him honest to his wider responsibilities (i.e. little people and big picture with Twelve in the middle). I thought each episode had a nice thematic flow to it and a nice rhythm. It's a very good sign when your audience is asking for just five or ten minutes more of each story to explore the concepts inside of it. There was a nice variety to the settings being visited and the arc with Missy in the background managed to break some new ground for televised Who with the Doctor and Master's really quite tragic friendship. What else... The Twelfth Doctor's characterisation really sung true this season too. All the best bits of the previous two seasons got incorporated into this marvellously well-rounded sort of being. It felt like a natural progression from the seesaw we'd seen previously. I liked the Doctor's conversation about murder in Thin Ice in particular ("Have you ever killed anyone?" "...Yes."), it was very honest and didn't shortchange anyone in the process of being brought up. Oxygen brought to mind the best of Vengeance on Varos, where it's this really vile system enabling tyrants that's the true menace. Empress of Mars was pure Barsoom and a really fun hodgepodge of pulp sci-fi. I had a lot of fun with this season. It just kept getting better and better as the stories rolled on. I agree with this entirely. I'd just add that the bedrock of Series 10 for me was the TARDIS team, which worked brilliantly and proved to be my favourite team-up since the show came back in 2005. Visually, they were very eccentric: a wild-haired, wirey, authoritative Doctor; a street wise, very aware, funny, appealing girl with equally wild hair; a diminutive, superficially bewildered retainer with no hair. Their chemistry was great - fiery, witty and very believable. What a team! I knew I'd miss them and I do.
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Post by tuigirl on Sept 7, 2018 11:01:37 GMT
Oh, where to begin... I thought having the trio aboard the TARDIS was a really nice idea. Bill who's new to all of this and able to perk up the Doctor's more world-weary side and Nardole who keeps him honest to his wider responsibilities (i.e. little people and big picture with Twelve in the middle). I thought each episode had a nice thematic flow to it and a nice rhythm. It's a very good sign when your audience is asking for just five or ten minutes more of each story to explore the concepts inside of it. There was a nice variety to the settings being visited and the arc with Missy in the background managed to break some new ground for televised Who with the Doctor and Master's really quite tragic friendship. What else... The Twelfth Doctor's characterisation really sung true this season too. All the best bits of the previous two seasons got incorporated into this marvellously well-rounded sort of being. It felt like a natural progression from the seesaw we'd seen previously. I liked the Doctor's conversation about murder in Thin Ice in particular ("Have you ever killed anyone?" "...Yes."), it was very honest and didn't shortchange anyone in the process of being brought up. Oxygen brought to mind the best of Vengeance on Varos, where it's this really vile system enabling tyrants that's the true menace. Empress of Mars was pure Barsoom and a really fun hodgepodge of pulp sci-fi. I had a lot of fun with this season. It just kept getting better and better as the stories rolled on. I agree with this entirely. I'd just add that the bedrock of Series 10 for me was the TARDIS team, which worked brilliantly and proved to be my favourite team-up since the show came back in 2005. Visually, they were very eccentric: a wild-haired, wirey, authoritative Doctor; a street wise, very aware, funny, appealing girl with equally wild hair; a diminutive, superficially bewildered retainer with no hair. Their chemistry was great - fiery, witty and very believable. What a team! I knew I'd miss them and I do. I could not agree more with both of you. I absolutely loved it for exactly the same reasons. I actually have a hard time picking a favorite episode because they all had something going for them.
I even liked "The lie of the land" which is widely considered as one of the low points, but that intro with the Doctor doing his soft, calm, evil voice was amazing, it send shivers down my spine. And that manical laugh when he crashed the ship. Pure gold.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 7, 2018 11:24:53 GMT
I missed out Missy. She became an integral part of this team, and I'm really glad she was in Twelve's first and his (almost) final story. Like Delgado to Pertwee, so Gomez was to Capaldi. A brilliant performance throughout and proof that the female is just as deadly as the male!
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Post by glutamodo on Sept 7, 2018 15:00:31 GMT
Now I have NOT re-watched any of NuWho - let alone Capaldi. I would watch each season as it came out either on DVD or later, streamed, one to two times per episode, on average. Some exceptional episodes might get an extra airing or two. But compared to how many times I saw some of the Classic Series episodes, it pales in comparison. Now that Big Finish is doing NuWho series, I find I kind of forget the details about some of the characters they feature and have to look them up online for a refresher.
I digress... no, this thread is more about the Capaldi era, right? Now, I totally accept and expect that all of the Doctors have their un-good elements and/or episodes, and certainly 12 had a couple of them. (which ones may be in the eye of the beholder, but they are there) but really, it's nothing new. I really liked Peter Capaldi's Doctor though, it really reminded me of the tone that Old Sixie brought to the role. I was a huge fan of Colin Baker's Doctor long before I found BF, and hell it was to hear more of him that got me started with BF. Now, some people ask when Peter will jump on board with Big Finish, but at this point I'm fine with him letting the New Series go onward while he takes a step back. Over at BF, we still have Colin, and as long as he's able to play Ol' Sixie I'll be ready to listen. Now, if it happens that Peter never does jump on board with BF later on, I will be disappointed, but for now I'm happy with what we have!
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Post by doctorkernow on Sept 7, 2018 15:25:34 GMT
Hello again.
Season 10? Agree with most of the above. No season is perfect. It is all subjective, what works for one does not work for another. For me, season 10 is a classic.
Doctor Who is an unusual program, it gains huge amounts of investment from its fans. The sheer volume of creativity this programme inspires is amazing.
I watched the world tour documentary accompanying season 8. This creativity is global!! Art, animation, fan fiction, music, comedy and audio fan adventures...
Commentary and analysis of episodes are part of this. What makes a good episode? Fans who have looked at what makes their favourite show tick have sometimes gone on to work in the industry.
So, to the future. The reason Dr. Who is so adored is that it never stands still. It constantly reinvents itself, regenerates(!) and begins again. This is one of those times, with a month to go, a new era awaits...
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shutupbanks
Castellan
There’s a horror movie called Alien? That’s really offensive. No wonder everyone keeps invading you.
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Post by shutupbanks on Sept 7, 2018 23:36:32 GMT
Capaldi turned the show back into "must see" tv for me. I've mentioned before that I watched the '05 season religiously then watched the seasons afterwards with great enjoyment that gradually tapered off, but Capaldi turned me back into a fan. He's the best actor (imnsho) to have played the part since Davison and like Davison he can lift a dud line into something compelling. The poster that came with the 500th issue of DWM graces the wall of my classroom, the first time I openly displayed my fannishness in the workplace.
Capaldi nailed the part from the get-go. He had an idea of what the character should be and he let that out all through the run of his first season despite each writers best efforts to put their own "stamp" on what he should be. I didn't enjoy every episode of it, but I enjoyed him and I started to warm to Clara as a character as well. They kept me coming back each week.
Season 9 was much better: the writers were more confident of what made the character work (should've talked to Peter from the start) and that made the stories feel a lot more consistent. They weren't always brilliant but when the worst story of the season (for me it was Sleep No More) was still a really interesting mix of ideas and okay writing you know that something is going right. And, of course, it gave us the magnificent Heaven Sent.
Season 10, though, was different. I started talking more about the show at work, with students. It inspired me to spend a large sum of money to travel across the country to spend ten seconds in the company of Peter Capaldi and Pearl Mackie. It was a really consistently good run of episodes the show hadn't seen for several years. It had great writing, fantastic production values, great actors and it gave us the most charismatic and interesting TARDIS team in years, possibly decades. I wasn't sold on the idea of Matt Lucas as a companion but he on me over in Captain Mysterio. Pearl Mackie was brilliant and managed to create a genuinely interesting character who I liked as a person as well as a role: I was genuinely worried for her in World Enough And Time and her scenes in The Doctor Falls are superb. As I've mentioned before, it's the only time I've bought the season on DVD in the entire run of the revived show.
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