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Post by ollychops on Dec 2, 2023 20:37:16 GMT
Liked it but the absolute secrecy around the episode was completely unnecessary.
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Post by relativetime on Dec 2, 2023 20:44:49 GMT
Hmmm… not sure entirely how I feel about this one yet.
I mostly liked it overall. There’s some good spooky vibes here that absolutely put me in mind of some of Davies’ past horror scripts. The “No-Things” are a bit on the nose considering their obvious inspiration, but it’s still a fun concept for Doctor Who to take a swing at and when you think the Doctor’s gone and left the real Donna behind, it really is effective. I liked the heart-to-heart conversations here too - that’s always been Davies’ strength as a writer - and I’m so happy to see the Timeless Child and the Flux are being acknowledged and treated as canon going forward. The ending with Wilf was absolutely lovely - well, okay, the world’s falling apart around them, but it’s always going to be lovely every time Bernard Cribbins is on the screen!
However, there were some things about the episode I didn’t care for. I don’t think the attempts at body horror worked all that well here. The effects felt very 2000s Doctor Who and rather than feeling unnerved or scared, I just felt like it looked a bit silly more often than not. I think the No-Things worked best when they were completely non-CG and just seemed exactly like the Doctor and Donna but not quite. I don’t know if they should have done away with the CG entirely, but there are moments where it might have benefitted from being toned down a touch. There’s also a few moments in the first half of the episode that I felt could have been trimmed down a bit too - mostly just to keep us from seeing too much or the hallway, since I felt the longer I saw it, the more fake it looked.
Overall, for me, this had a lot of highs but a couple lows I just couldn’t look past and hampered my experience with the story. I feel like I need to see this a few more times before I really make my mind up about it.
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Post by number13 on Dec 2, 2023 20:52:26 GMT
Donna in wonderland! (Or in 'Scherzo' if we want to be BF about it. )
I thought that was great! Science fiction setting, but really a weird (and brilliantly played) two-hander full of weirdy weirdness, double-crossing and double-double-crossing and lovely little tease moments. The Doctor being worried that by invoking superstition at the edge of the Universe he might have opened it up to - something.
Then the other clue that it was far too late to worry about that - the 'beings' said they were attracted to our Universe 'by the games you play'! So presumably, like the Queen of Time and you-know-who-for-next-week, they were two more of those celestial troublemakers trying to move in to an exciting new realm full of games to play with living pieces.
And as we know, one of them is already here in our universe and looking forward to a final(?) round of his cosmic game with the Doctor.
Only one criticism: Isacc Newton was never, ever, at any time in his busy and illustrious life, 'hot'.
EDIT: On the subject of games, notice that the alien captain who sacrificed herself for the Universe looked like a chess knight?
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Post by nucleusofswarm on Dec 2, 2023 20:52:38 GMT
The Isaac Newton opening fell completely flat for me, that was the only bit I disliked
Quite apart from everything else, Newton was an anti-social obssessed paranoid nerd. If Doctor Who had been around in the seventeenth century, he would have been a fan on the internet. And you *know* what kind of fan I mean. The kind who finds Outpost Gallifrey staid and mainstream. And, yet, RTD has him portrayed as a Byronic hearththrob. Has he never heard of his illustrious predecessor's prediliction for 'doable barkers' ?
Yeah, but then the real Nero wasn't jolly old Derek Francis either.
And I don't say that just to be faecitious (well, 90% anyway), but because it's clearly RTD trying to do a Spooner bit. I was pretty mild on it myself, though I liked Tate and Tennant in the scene.
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Post by fitzoliverj on Dec 2, 2023 20:54:53 GMT
it's clearly RTD trying to do a Spooner bit. Maybe, although I think those Hartnell historicals, some of which bore no relation to history at all, at least riffed on familiar images of the figures involved.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 2, 2023 20:55:35 GMT
Liked it but the absolute secrecy around the episode was completely unnecessary. That was the fun bit!
RTD is a mischievous so and so... By keeping the 'supporting cast' a secret RTD knew that some fans were going to be guessing that someone special was coming back... so that kept the fans busy whilst RTD sat in his office and laughed his head off as he perused the Doctor Who online socials. Well played Russell ...
We did get to see the return of Wilf though and that was very heart warming as we know that [the great] Bernard Cribbins is no longer with us. I loved that scene at the end.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 2, 2023 21:04:26 GMT
Quite apart from everything else, Newton was an anti-social obssessed paranoid nerd. If Doctor Who had been around in the seventeenth century, he would have been a fan on the internet. And you *know* what kind of fan I mean. The kind who finds Outpost Gallifrey staid and mainstream. And, yet, RTD has him portrayed as a Byronic hearththrob. Has he never heard of his illustrious predecessor's prediliction for 'doable barkers' ?
Yeah, but then the real Nero wasn't jolly old Derek Francis either.
And I don't say that just to be faecitious (well, 90% anyway), but because it's clearly RTD trying to do a Spooner bit. I was pretty mild on it myself, though I liked Tate and Tennant in the scene.
Not sure about Spooner specifically. It was just as much "GEORGE Stephenson?" from Mark Of The Rani, really. Either way, it was just a bit of fluff to open with a set up, then pay off the "mavity" joke later. Nathaniel deserves a bigger part but then, just about everyone in It's A Sin does. I think it's RTD's masterpiece. While Lydia West and Olly Alexander were on plenty of bookie's lists for 15th Doc casting. Would love to see them both in the show.
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Post by theother13 on Dec 2, 2023 21:04:38 GMT
That was a weird one but I liked it
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Post by sherlock on Dec 2, 2023 21:11:24 GMT
Yeah, but then the real Nero wasn't jolly old Derek Francis either.
And I don't say that just to be faecitious (well, 90% anyway), but because it's clearly RTD trying to do a Spooner bit. I was pretty mild on it myself, though I liked Tate and Tennant in the scene.
Not sure about Spooner specifically. It was just as much "GEORGE Stephenson?" from Mark Of The Rani, really. Either way, it was just a bit of fluff to open with a set up, then pay off the "mavity" joke later. Nathaniel deserves a bigger part but then, just about everyone in It's A Sin does. I think it's RTD's masterpiece. While Lydia West and Olly Alexander were on plenty of bookie's lists for 15th Doc casting. Would love to see them both in the show. Who knows, maybe Gatwa’s Doctor will pop back to 1666 next season to correct the timeline a tad.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 2, 2023 21:12:58 GMT
Not sure about Spooner specifically. It was just as much "GEORGE Stephenson?" from Mark Of The Rani, really. Either way, it was just a bit of fluff to open with a set up, then pay off the "mavity" joke later. Nathaniel deserves a bigger part but then, just about everyone in It's A Sin does. I think it's RTD's masterpiece. While Lydia West and Olly Alexander were on plenty of bookie's lists for 15th Doc casting. Would love to see them both in the show. Who knows, maybe Gatwa’s Doctor will pop back to 1666 next season to correct the timeline a tad. Best be careful - Davison and co are just down the road! Three Docs, one time...it's Pompeii or Atlantis all over again!
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Post by sherlock on Dec 2, 2023 21:16:53 GMT
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Post by timleschild on Dec 2, 2023 21:20:24 GMT
Liked it but the absolute secrecy around the episode was completely unnecessary. I think it was a case of this one being filmed behind closed doors. So why not keep it all secret? I can see why some think that as this is an anniversary special that means it would have returning characters & cameos. We already got that in POTD.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 2, 2023 21:34:48 GMT
Hmmm… not sure entirely how I feel about this one yet. I mostly liked it overall. There’s some good spooky vibes here that absolutely put me in mind of some of Davies’ past horror scripts. The “No-Things” are a bit on the nose considering their obvious inspiration, but it’s still a fun concept for Doctor Who to take a swing at and when you think the Doctor’s gone and left the real Donna behind, it really is effective. I liked the heart-to-heart conversations here too - that’s always been Davies’ strength as a writer - and I’m so happy to see the Timeless Child and the Flux are being acknowledged and treated as canon going forward. The ending with Wilf was absolutely lovely - well, okay, the world’s falling apart around them, but it’s always going to be lovely every time Bernard Cribbins is on the screen! However, there were some things about the episode I didn’t care for. I don’t think the attempts at body horror worked all that well here. The effects felt very 2000s Doctor Who and rather than feeling unnerved or scared, I just felt like it looked a bit silly more often than not. I think the No-Things worked best when they were completely non-CG and just seemed exactly like the Doctor and Donna but not quite. I don’t know if they should have done away with the CG entirely, but there are moments where it might have benefitted from being toned down a touch. There’s also a few moments in the first half of the episode that I felt could have been trimmed down a bit too - mostly just to keep us from seeing too much or the hallway, since I felt the longer I saw it, the more fake it looked. Overall, for me, this had a lot of highs but a couple lows I just couldn’t look past and hampered my experience with the story. I feel like I need to see this a few more times before I really make my mind up about it. That's pretty much exactly my thoughts on this episode. I'm guessing the cavity stuff will end up being important in Season 1, otherwise it was just a weird digression that the episode would have worked better without.
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Post by christmastrenzalore on Dec 2, 2023 21:37:39 GMT
I could watch a 100 episodes of 14 and Donna wandering around abandoned spaceships trying to figure out what the heck is going on.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 2, 2023 21:38:43 GMT
I can see why some think that as this is an anniversary special that means it would have returning characters & cameos. We already got that in POTD. Speculation is fun... it's part of being a fan. After all, I'm still hoping for a Dalek to turn up at some stage ... Why not? If ye can have your wild guesses, why can't I?
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Post by timleschild on Dec 2, 2023 21:44:25 GMT
I can see why some think that as this is an anniversary special that means it would have returning characters & cameos. We already got that in POTD. Speculation is fun... it's part of being a fan. After all, I'm still hoping for a Dalek to turn up at some stage ... Why not? If ye can have your wild guesses, why can't I? When did I say you couldn't?
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Post by Deleted on Dec 2, 2023 21:45:58 GMT
I can see why some think that as this is an anniversary special that means it would have returning characters & cameos. We already got that in POTD. Speculation is fun... it's part of being a fan. After all, I'm still hoping for a Dalek to turn up at some stage ... Why not? If ye can have your wild guesses, why can't I? You just had the CiN minisode and a whole year of DWM comics for Daleks! What did RTD say? "Might be time for a rest" for them? Hmmmm. Maybe 5-10 years, what do you think?
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Post by timleschild on Dec 2, 2023 21:50:39 GMT
Daleks will never be rested. Hopefully something new done with them. I don't hold out much hope.
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Post by charlesuirdhein on Dec 3, 2023 0:10:57 GMT
Daleks will never be rested. Hopefully something new done with them. I don't hold out much hope. RTD said one of his regrets from when he was showrunner was never getting Nick Briggs to write a Dalek story for him. Well, now he's back so who knows.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 3, 2023 0:43:34 GMT
Daleks will never be rested. Hopefully something new done with them. I don't hold out much hope. RTD said one of his regrets from when he was showrunner was never getting Nick Briggs to write a Dalek story for him. Well, now he's back so who knows. Just imagine...
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