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Post by Deleted on Sept 4, 2016 23:47:43 GMT
Hey everyone,
Why is misgony so widespread in across various fandoms? Why can't little boys grow up and play with the girls?
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Post by jasonward on Sept 4, 2016 23:52:04 GMT
I don't believe it is any more prevalent amongst fandom than amongst the general populace, just that fandom combined with the internet makes people think it's OK to express opinions they would normally not.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 5, 2016 0:38:44 GMT
Yup, anonymity is definitely a factor.
Misogynistic or misandric comments are often made by those who lack the imagination to go for real insults, it's an easy switch to flip for either gender. The fact that they think it's okay means that either they've had a poor experience with the opposite sex, don't really know how to act towards women/men in a way that's healthy or have been brought up believing that such values are okay. The demographic I've noticed that tend to demonstrate such values tend to be in the teenage bracket where the brain is gOinG A liTTLE RouNd tHe bEnD because of hormones and stress. Little boys and girls can grow up, but people often forget that growing up is absolute hell in your teens. It really is. For the rest, I think it's a vocal minority. You rarely get people going around shouting: "MEN AND WOMEN ARE EQUAL, DIFFERENT AND IT IS GOOD THAT EVERYONE IS DIFFERENT," on subforums because, well, there's no need to prove that statement.
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Post by anothermanicmondas on Sept 10, 2016 20:16:19 GMT
I believe the problems are down to a combination of factors including
1) History sexism has been around for a long, long time the young media of video games and American comics have been primarily targetted at adolescent, straight, white males since creation so have a primarily white male audience. as do some areas of fan interest. This is the only thing that makes the associated fandoms different from society in general
2) Ignorance and the internet it is said that "a little knowledge is a dangerous thing" because people with a little knowledge often think they know a lot more than they actually do know and get things badly wrong. Thanks to the internet a lot of people have access to a little knowledge.
3) Fear, especially the fear of change American comics and video games are growing up to become closer to other media, subject to the same criticisms as other media, diversifying to reach a wider audience - and some of the established audience are confused and panicking. they fear the diversification will remove what they like. They consider any criticisms of what they like to be "personal insult"s. Video game fans don't want proper criticism of video games - just a couple of paragraphs followed by an inflated score.
4) "Us and Them" menatlity some (a vocal minority) within fandom gather into groups ("us") and label other people in groups ("Them") which they can use as ad hominem arguments. They pretend every person they put together has an identical extreme position (for use in strawman arguments) and then adopt an opposite exteme position. They don't bother paying any attention to what any of "them" are saying and instead place blind trust in the words of any of "Us" perpetuating misunderstandings.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 11, 2016 6:30:11 GMT
I don't like the way the question links misogyny and fandom.
If a person is misogynistic that will likely come out in their interactions with people.
Whether they are also a fan of something is irrelevant.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 11, 2016 10:38:34 GMT
I don't like the way the question links misogyny and fandom. If a person is misogynistic that will likely come out in their interactions with people. Whether they are also a fan of something is irrelevant. That's a good point, misogynistic and misandric practices tend to be a result of more than just the fandoms they belong to. I'm a fan of the James Bond franchise, but I definitely don't ascribe to applying his rather outdated attitude towards women to my own life.
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Post by anothermanicmondas on Sept 11, 2016 13:00:46 GMT
I assumed the question was inspired by GamerGate and similar problems in comics fandom. In both cases, a vocal minority who don't seem to understand the arguments and trying to fight against problems which do not exist (or at least not to the extent they imagine) and acting worse than the people they complain about. Other fandoms can contain misogyny but probably not significantly worse than society in general.
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Post by ryan on Sept 11, 2016 13:42:17 GMT
I don't like the way the question links misogyny and fandom. If a person is misogynistic that will likely come out in their interactions with people. Whether they are also a fan of something is irrelevant. Agreed. Misogyny is, unfortunately, rife in many social and professional settings. Although much of it is more covert nowadays, it's still very much prominent.
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Post by mrperson on Sept 11, 2016 16:20:34 GMT
There's also quite a bit in any online multiplayer game, especially those not monitored by some central group of GMs (ie, chat in Call of Duty games or anything on a third party voice network like Ventrilo)
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Post by Deleted on Sept 23, 2016 18:37:24 GMT
Misogny's a very strong word, though, isn't it... Anyway, you get tons of people like it in the real world not just in fandoms. Then again, you get people do the opposite and use incredibly sexist and racist people who go around saying that white men sexually assault them because they have a different opinion. www.youtube.com/watch?v=FeNJFz-WCZs
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bobod
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Post by bobod on Dec 19, 2016 10:48:08 GMT
I remember, when Capaldi was cast, hearing a reaction of "good - that'll get rid of the fangirls who fancy the Doctor"
A) not very flattering to Peter B) Only Doctor Who fans could find themselves actually advocating fewer people watching the show C) People can watch the show for whatever reasons they want, your approval is not needed.
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Post by ulyssessarcher on Dec 20, 2016 7:45:44 GMT
Hey everyone,
Why is misgony so widespread in across various fandoms? Why can't little boys grow up and play with the girls? Hmm, I'm probably a sexist, i'll admit it. I think there are things I do, that a woman cant do, but there are also things I do that most men cant do either. I'm literally a monster. 6'4 400lbs and only a 9 percent fat in my bmi. In my younger days I could toss around a 350lb dead hog like it was store mannequin. I'm freakishly stout. When it comes to my job, i have no problem with women doing the same job as me, for the same pay. I will open the door for a woman, where i might not for a man, i show women more respect than i do men, in the real world. Probably due to the fact that my mother raised me to respect everyone, but especially women. I am dreading the day that the doctor turns into a woman. Though, i will give it a chance. (on a side note, i wonder why there has been no talk about the doctor changing race, instead of gender, imagine a Chinese looking doctor, or a doctor of any other color, other than white, what if they kill 2 birds with one stone, and make the next doctor a black woman?) I will also say that, making Thor a woman, made no sense, making Johnny Storm a black man in the last movie killed the movie, and you don't throw away years of history, in fandom, just for diversity's sake, it has to fit into the story, cause i hated miles morales as the new spider man, but way back in the 90's when they 'killed' Frank Castle, i really enjoyed the woman who replaced him. I hate Dakken, but love Wolverine, and i enjoy x-23, it's all about the story, and having the story make sense, instead of just, hey, the fantastic four are all white, and only one of them is a woman, we need a mandatory minority, that's crap. Just like the FF cartoon in the 70's with Herbie instead of Johnny Storm. Good thing about BF, i haven't heard any real crap yet, hopefully i wont.
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Post by icecreamdf on Dec 20, 2016 21:29:50 GMT
Hey everyone,
Why is misgony so widespread in across various fandoms? Why can't little boys grow up and play with the girls? (on a side note, i wonder why there has been no talk about the doctor changing race, instead of gender, imagine a Chinese looking doctor, or a doctor of any other color, other than white, what if they kill 2 birds with one stone, and make the next doctor a black woman?) I suspect that it is because nobody is really against the Doctor changing race. We all assume that it is possible, it just hasn't happenned yet.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 20, 2016 21:50:58 GMT
(on a side note, i wonder why there has been no talk about the doctor changing race, instead of gender, imagine a Chinese looking doctor, or a doctor of any other color, other than white, what if they kill 2 birds with one stone, and make the next doctor a black woman?) I suspect that it is because nobody is really against the Doctor changing race. We all assume that it is possible, it just hasn't happenned yet. 100%. I can't imagine how someone could buy that William Hartnell could be the same person as Matt Smith but that Eccleston couldn't be the same person as Chiwitel Ejifor, for example. He's had incarnations where he's gone blonde, incarnations where he's become Scottish (and even said so on screen), and incarnations where he's changed from being tall and heavy to small and slender. I can't see why skin colour wouldn't be part of the lottery of regeneration. We, of course, saw Ken Bones regenerate into a black woman in the last season finale so it can happen..it just hasn't yet. I can't think of a black woman, to answer Ulysess query, who I would cast in the role off-hand but I'm sure she's out there. Lenoara Critchley perhaps. I've certainly got 3 or 4 women I'd like to see in the part including Olivia Colman. Tilda Swinton too, though I think she'd fail my clunkily named "Can you see this person working 9 months a year on wet nights in Cardiff for less money than they can earn in film" test as would another choice of mine, Emma Thompson. Diane Morgan would also be on my list as well though she's not acted as much as others. Helen McRory and Ruth Wilson are also actresses I think would bring something fresh to the role.
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