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Post by relativetime on Jun 15, 2022 13:26:06 GMT
Obi-Wan Kenobi Part V
Ooh, I loved this! This was everything I’ve been wanting since they announced the show! Can’t wait to see how they wrap things up.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 16, 2022 0:06:32 GMT
The Leia & Reva Show.....oh i mean Kenobi Ep 5. Ah yes the Jake Kenobi show (in which one of the main writers confidently said he never watched revenge of the sith) Only one episode left Don't get me started Disney are a joke, wish Dave Feloni was in charge of this but sadly Kathleen Kennedy & her woke agenda overseeing this show.
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Post by theillusiveman on Jun 16, 2022 1:24:44 GMT
Ah yes the Jake Kenobi show (in which one of the main writers confidently said he never watched revenge of the sith) Only one episode left Don't get me started Disney are a joke, wish Dave Feloni was in charge of this but sadly Kathleen Kennedy & her woke agenda overseeing this show. The only “good” Star Wars thing Disney has ever produced is Rogue One and even that has massive issues
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Post by elkawho on Jun 16, 2022 10:55:20 GMT
I love Obi-Wan. Woke agenda? Really? You guys crack me up. Anyway....
I'm loving Ms. Marvel! Iman Vellani is perfect and I love every minute she's on the screen. The look of it is engaging and fun, and they really capture the feel of New Jersey/Jersey City, in the shadow of NYC.
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Post by aussiedoctorwhofan on Jun 16, 2022 10:57:15 GMT
I love Obi-Wan. Woke agenda? Really? You guys crack me up. Anyway.... I'm loving Ms. Marvel! Iman Vellani is perfect and I love every minute she's on the screen. The look of it is engaging and fun, and they really capture the feel of New Jersey/Jersey City, in the shadow on NYC.
Oh yes.. NJ..!
OMG the 2nd ep was great. that cliff hanger!! OOH!
And yes, she is 10001% perffffect in the role.. I think she is in the Captain Marvel 2 movie along with the woman from the WandaVision tv show..
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Post by Deleted on Jun 16, 2022 11:31:53 GMT
I love Obi-Wan. Woke agenda? Really? You guys crack me up. Anyway.... I am not in love with the show but wokeness is not even a billionth of the issues I would have. It is faithful to the prequels in one major way - Ewan is doing his best to lift everyone else around him. Can do no wrong. I like that this week DID let us have an out for why Vader would still think this counts as him still as a learner with Obi-Wan as his Master - that was clever. Moses was fantastic in The Queens Gambit and The Tragedy of Macbeth so I think the hate - the racist BS, lets call it what it is - is a dark stain on pop culture. I think she is fine at points but in her angriest moments is really kinda miscast. But the quieter moments, her talks with Ben this week? Fantastic. Sad that "I dont think she is the correct person for the role" or "she doesnt nail it for me" has to become personal abuse on Twitter. For Ewan to have to make a vid to say these people are not Star Wars fans and are not welcome to watch was really sad. I saw Hayden - no stranjer to attacks from SW fans - say similar this week.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 16, 2022 11:39:50 GMT
I love Obi-Wan. Woke agenda? Really? You guys crack me up. Anyway.... I am not in love with the show but wokeness is not even a billionth of the issues I would have. It is faithful to the prequels in one major way - Ewan is doing his best to lift everyone else around him. Can do no wrong. I like that this week DID let us have an out for why Vader would still think this counts as him still as a learner with Obi-Wan as his Master - that was clever. Moses was fantastic in The Queens Gambit and The Tragedy of Macbeth so I think the hate - the racist BS, lets call it what it is - is a dark stain on pop culture. I think she is fine at points but in her angriest moments is really kinda miscast. But the quieter moments, her talks with Ben this week? Fantastic. Sad that "I dont think she is the correct person for the role" or "she doesnt nail it for me" has to become personal abuse on Twitter. For Ewan to have to make a vid to say these people are not Star Wars fans and are not welcome to watch was really sad. I saw Hayden - no stranjer to attacks from SW fans - say similar this week. Exactly. Wokeness is one of the most overused terms in recent history. I haven’t seen Kenobi yet due to me not having Disney+, but I hope I’ll enjoy it when I do.
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Post by theillusiveman on Jun 16, 2022 11:49:19 GMT
The main issue with Obi Wan suffers from extremely poor writing
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Post by tuigirl on Jun 16, 2022 13:56:55 GMT
In all seriousness- What exactly does "wokeness" even mean? I have seen this accusation towards wildly different shows and styles and messages and even have been accused of it myself on various occasions, even by the same people calling me a "fascistic socialist". I therefore assume it is a word generally expressing dislike of somebody else's views? Because it totally makes no sense to me.
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Post by shallacatop on Jun 16, 2022 14:28:07 GMT
I'm loving Obi-Wan Kenobi myself. Ewan is fantastic and the Empire stuff is great. My two issues have remained the same since episode one; some frantic editing and the soundtrack not referencing existing themes. The former has gotten better and the latter is what it is. I agree with Davy when it comes to Moses Ingram; it's the ranty moments that stand out and don't quite fit, other than that she's good, particularly the quieter scenes with Leia last week and Ben this week.
As for Dave Filoni being in charge? I think that'd be the worst hands for Star Wars, frankly. I appreciate he's well loved within the fandom, but his expertise lie with animation and the intricacies of that. Throw him into live action, as he's done with The Mandalorian / The Book of Boba Fett and you get stilted direction and pure exposition. Remove the fact he brings back characters or pairs X with Y and his reputation would be vastly different; let's not forget The Clone Wars reception for the first couple of seasons, specifically Ahsoka, or Rebels until Vader and Ahsoka turned up.
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Post by masterdoctor on Jun 16, 2022 15:28:41 GMT
Dave Feloni is definitely an ideas man, but not one you should put in charge. He by himself is too focused on the same few things and doesn’t let Star Wars grow under his watch. We would not be getting shows like The Acolyte if he was fully in charge for sure, and that would be a damn shame cuz at least some of the shows seem to be moving away from the Skywalker fetish.
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Post by relativetime on Jun 16, 2022 15:49:10 GMT
In all seriousness- What exactly does "wokeness" even mean? I have seen this accusation towards wildly different shows and styles and messages and even have been accused of it myself on various occasions, even by the same people calling me a "fascistic socialist". I therefore assume it is a word generally expressing dislike of somebody else's views? Because it totally makes no sense to me. I think it depends on who’s using it and what they REALLY mean to say. It seems to me like shorthand for bigotry, the way it’s used to demonize shows that feature anyone who isn’t a Christian, cis, heterosexual white man.
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Post by muckypup on Jun 16, 2022 16:10:57 GMT
Kenobi ep 5 What a wasted episode…….a point less flashback, a revelation, a betrayal n a easy escape……; There throwing it away all the hard work from previous eps…..;doing a game of thrones es not letting the plot points evolve ……
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Post by tuigirl on Jun 16, 2022 16:57:27 GMT
In all seriousness- What exactly does "wokeness" even mean? I have seen this accusation towards wildly different shows and styles and messages and even have been accused of it myself on various occasions, even by the same people calling me a "fascistic socialist". I therefore assume it is a word generally expressing dislike of somebody else's views? Because it totally makes no sense to me. I think it depends on who’s using it and what they REALLY mean to say. It seems to me like shorthand for bigotry, the way it’s used to demonize shows that feature anyone who isn’t a Christian, cis, heterosexual white man. Yeah, I figured. Was more like a rhetorical question. I was called a fascist socialist with a woke agenda while battling some trolls who got upset that a gay couple played a (minor) part in a certain youth audio series I follow.
I pointed out that the very same long running series had a TRANS character 20 years (!!!!) ago, who was treated like a totally NORMAL person.
So how could the mere presence of a gay couple be such an issue?
The discussion devolved into a long incoherent rant about the end of Western civilization which I just refused to follow.
So as a burnt child, as soon as I see the word "woke" I am more like, oh, here we go again.
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Post by relativetime on Jun 16, 2022 17:14:54 GMT
I think it depends on who’s using it and what they REALLY mean to say. It seems to me like shorthand for bigotry, the way it’s used to demonize shows that feature anyone who isn’t a Christian, cis, heterosexual white man. Yeah, I figured. Was more like a rhetorical question. I was called a fascist socialist with a woke agenda while battling some trolls who got upset that a gay couple played a (minor) part in a certain youth audio series I follow.
I pointed out that the very same long running series had a TRANS character 20 years (!!!!) ago, who was treated like a totally NORMAL person.
So how could the mere presence of a gay couple be such an issue?
The discussion devolved into a long incoherent rant about the end of Western civilization which I just refused to follow.
So as a burnt child, as soon as I see the word "woke" I am more like, oh, here we go again.
Oops, I should have figured it was meant rhetorically! Sorry bout that - I’ll have to get better at recognizing that. But yeah, it’s really frustrating to see how widespread this attitude is amongst science fiction fandoms especially.
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Post by tuigirl on Jun 16, 2022 17:24:23 GMT
Yeah, I figured. Was more like a rhetorical question. I was called a fascist socialist with a woke agenda while battling some trolls who got upset that a gay couple played a (minor) part in a certain youth audio series I follow.
I pointed out that the very same long running series had a TRANS character 20 years (!!!!) ago, who was treated like a totally NORMAL person.
So how could the mere presence of a gay couple be such an issue?
The discussion devolved into a long incoherent rant about the end of Western civilization which I just refused to follow.
So as a burnt child, as soon as I see the word "woke" I am more like, oh, here we go again.
Oops, I should have figured it was meant rhetorically! Sorry bout that - I’ll have to get better at recognizing that. But yeah, it’s really frustrating to see how widespread this attitude is amongst science fiction fandoms especially. No worries at all.
Sigh. I wish it was only SciFi fandoms. I wish.
Sadly, it seems to have taken over all popular culture in general.
These trolls I am arguing with on the youth audio drama site (NOT scifi) also started then to use Doctor Who in their arguments to tell me of an example of "How this woke agenda destroyed a fandom". I rubbed my fists. Bring it on, I thought. Walked right into my turf. Sadly, the opponent conceded the battle after a few short strikes, tail between his legs, telling me "I actually have never seen Doctor Who and do know nothing about. I just read this on the internet." Quod erat demonstrandum.
Idiot troll without a clue shouting loud until someone steps onto his tongue.
Oh, and by the way, for this youth audio series (not scifi): The producer is senile, the script editor a retard, the writers tired and without imagination and the actors who have been doing this for more than 40 years are simply idiots.
Does this sound in any way familiar?
Sometimes I think all these troll posts are written by the same 3 lonely trolls in their hidden basements.
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Post by fitzoliverj on Jun 17, 2022 17:08:06 GMT
In all seriousness- What exactly does "wokeness" even mean? I think the best way to break it down is as follows:
1) Good Woke - a concern for issues of social justice, beyond that expressed by the average person
2) Bad Woke - a concern for issues of social justice, beyond that expressed by the average person, but which is either
a) poorly expressed
b) dogmatic, or associated with alternative prejudices
c) poorly-informed
d) superficial or, in extreme cases, insincere
3) Good Anti-Woke - a concern that issues of social justice must be properly examined
4) Bad Anti-Woke - a rejection of issues of social justice as unwelcome (usually expressed in an offensive manner)
The classic example I'll give is the word 'Eskimo'. There's been a push in recent years to abandon the use of this word in favour of 'Inuit' because the word Eskimo is deemed to be offensive by the communities it describes. So, a Woke person would say 'Inuit' over 'Eskimo' - except, that could very easily be Bad Woke, if somebody is unaware that misuse of the word 'Inuit' is marginalising non-Western cultures and being used to oppress minority groups. That's precisely the kind of thing that a Woke person is supposed to be concerned about. So the Good Anti-Woke position is to point out that the etymology that gives 'Eskimo' an offensive meaning is no longer believed to be correct, and that only the Eskimos in Canada and Greenland can be properly called Inuit - those in Alaska and Siberia are Yupik, and while not enthused about the word 'Eskimo' - which, while not inherently offensive, is a non-native term - much prefer it to Inuit which is a word that they feel excludes them. There's also an issue in Greenland where all idigenous peoples are defined in law as Inuit, so smaller groups are unable to claim that the discrimination they sometimes experience is racist - the Inghuit, the most northerly of Greenlanders, were evicted from their homeland to make way for a US airbase and when they sued many years later, they recieved much less compensation than they expected because the courts had no power to recognise them as a different ethnic group.
The Bad Anti-Woke, of course, will jsut call them all whatever the hell they like and damn the consequences.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 17, 2022 18:44:27 GMT
I tried getting in to Obi-Wan Kenobi but for me it was more of a Boba Fett than a Mandalorian in the entertainment stakes... so I stopped watching it after Ep 3 and watched Pistol instead! (It might be a load of bollocks, but at least it was fun!)
Up next: Stranger Things S4.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 17, 2022 20:53:59 GMT
Going back to out discussion about wokeness, I bet a lot of these people that are against it would say that someone that has done something wrong needs to be removed from something they are a part of because it’s hypocrisy on the part of whoever is running that thing. And when they are removed, the same people who said they should have been removed really round that person and say that they are being ‘cancelled’.
Maybe this should be its own thread because this thread isn’t directly related to it. Or not as the case may be.
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Post by grinch on Jun 18, 2022 14:24:48 GMT
The Midwich Cuckoos (Episode Two)
Proving to be a lot better than I first thought. Makes for a more thoughtful approach to how such an event would occur in the more interconnected modern world.
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