Does physical punishment work?

I'm not a behavioral scientist or educator so I'm not really qualified to make a judgement but what I do feel mildly comfortable in saying is the application of pain as a teaching method doesn't seem like one which would result in a positive outcome.

Well, that's the beauty of this type of structure: it's alloted to a specific section of the forum, so if you're not interested,
you cna move on by and stick to the threads you like.

But as far as why, why not? If we can talk about the Cheeto in Chief, education systems and Brexiting down the national highway, then this isn't that much of a stretch.

I can remember my cousin and me at 5 years old. Crossin the railroad tracks at mamaw's house and goin into the corn field. We had heard bout electric fences, but didn't know what one really was. Well, he caught it first, and bout the time he yelped I had grabbed it.

That application of pain did teach me, don't grab an electric fence. A positive outcome? Well, I wet my pants, so I learned, but it sure wasn't a positive outcome from my perspective.

I don't condone using electrical shocks on humas, as a teaching method, but they have taught my dog what his boundaries are. He has an electric collar on so he can wander around the whole yard, it makes a high pitched sound he can hear when he hits those boundaries and recognizes that as a warning to a potential shock if he keeps going. I wish I would have invested in one much earlier, as he is healthier and happier being able to run the yard, instead of chained up to a tree. And he is safe because the boundary keeps him out of the roadway(not that theres really any traffic on it), and keeps him from wandering to places he shouldn't be.

After reading some of the things on here, and giving it some thought, I want to change my view on things.


Paddling/spanking/physical punishment, does not belong in public schools. I had never really given much thought to how other folks had brought up their kids, never thought about how a kid who was beaten at home would respond to it, or any of that really.  And I cant see the fairness in one child whose parents have no problem with spankings, getting a spanking, while another child, whose parents oppose spankings, not getting a spanking for the exact same offence.


So yeah, I don't think that kind of thing belongs in public schools.


Private schools, well, you know the rules going into that school, and they are exactly the same for everyone, and some private schools may well practice that. And that is a decision that belongs to the parent, whether to enroll a child in that private school. If they make you wear a uniform, pray before class, learn the hail Mary's, and spank for what they consider inappropriate behavior. Well, no parent is being forced to send their child to a private school in this country. And I would assume even Catholic schools would do no more than just spanking a hand much anymore. But that's just an assumption.

That may well be a thread unto itself. The day we live in, with the internet being so convenient, and the ability of youngsters to get on sites, is a huge WOW factor.

That might be thread or 3. What with parents letting their children explore the internet, some, unfortunately, with very little adult supervision. What with some folks seein just the forums for a doctor who site, they might just assume, no harm there.

I have maintained for years now, that the generation coming of age right now, maybe the first generation, with a great number of folks, raised by only their teachers in school, video games, the internet, and television. With this next generation you could add cell phones. I'm not sayin every child was raised like that, but a huge number(that does not equate to a huge percentage, it could be as low as 5 percent, IMO), that I would hope we would get some information about in the near future, as to what the actual numbers may look like.  Parents forced to work overtime, and have both parents workin just to make ends meet, when you figure in the greater travel time for folks to get to work nowadays, it really leaves a very small amount of time for folks to spend together at home, for a number of families.

You made a very good point. I don't want a 10 or 12 year old readin bout certain topics, that they really might not understand, or worse(I would hope I wouldn't have to elaborate). But where is the middle ground? Do away with all political posts to protect children who may or may not be on here, or something else. I will try to moderate my language, and not post all my views, that much I can do. But stating an opinion on a topic, could upset adults on here.

Some topics I think should remain off limits to political discussion on these forums, because they are such hot button topics. And they are some that I have made comments on in the past. Topics that are very close to many on these boards.

It literally would kill me on the inside if I heard that a youngin, readin on these boards had committed suicide. And I know it would eat up a lot of folks on here too. And what with the high suicide rates of youngsters anymore, especially among those who are being bullied for whatever reason, we do have a moral responsibility to help those youngsters, and do nothing to endanger them.

Thanks for helpin me to grow up a bit. Man never can be to old to do that.

No. Timelord called it - violence is never the answer. You can beat someone into doing what you want but that's not teaching them anything - certainly not respect, it's creating fear. You'd be appalled seeing someone treat a dog with violence - there's no excuse for using it on children. At all. I know kids who were from violent homes who have grown up to be very violent people. They didn't "learn" anything" but how to be bullies on the most vulnerable members of their lives.

That said, for the sake of mucky and members like him, I will request future comments tone down more graphic details or explicit references to anatomy.

I was disciplined physically as a kid (spanked by my parents, whipped by a grandfather). My wife and I don't physically discipline our daughter. She's ten years old now and I'm reluctant to employ a phrase as reductionist as a "good kid", but she thinks about the consequences of her actions before she performs them.

She makes me think of one of the better-known quotes from Thomas Merton, who was Catholic monk and peace activist who was born in Kentucky and died in Thailand. 

"My Lord God, I have no idea where I am going. I do not see the road ahead of me. I cannot know for certain where it will end. Nor do I really know myself, and the fact that I think I am following your will does not mean that I am actually doing so. But I believe that the desire to please you does in fact please you."

She doesn't always do the right thing. But nobody lives up to their principles all the time. Her mood or her temper sometimes get the better of her. But she always tries to do the right thing, and I'm very proud of her for that.

My philosophy on discipline ties back into what I said in other threads when we were discussing torture. The best arguments against beatings as discipline is that they are counterproductive. More flies with honey than vinegar and all that.

As Ela said 

What's the lesson that you teach by disciplining a child with violence? That you get to make the rules because you're stronger than they are? I don't mean to put words in Ela's mouth and she can correct me if I'm wrong, but what I took away from her statement is that kids disciplined in such a way want to avoid the consequences of the actions that led to the punishment, but it does nothing to change the behavior that led to the punishment in the first place. 

charlesuirdhein said it much more eloquently than I could. 

Feb 18, 2017 17:01:06 GMT charlesuirdhein said:

I've drafted and deleted several comments on here. I'll simply state that I have a picture of my late father's hands hanging on my wall. Hands that held me up and never beat me down, for any reason.

And that in turn made me think of something that I love from Madeleine L'Engle "The entire purpose of loving punishment is to teach, and it lasts only as long as is needed for the lesson. And the lesson is always love." (And for an ardent atheist, I'm sure quoting a lot of prominent Christians in support of my point.)

Yes, that's the point I was trying to make, though I clearly didn't as articulate it as clearly as I could have.