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Post by nucleusofswarm on Feb 18, 2017 0:31:03 GMT
Is the use of whooping actually effective as a solution towards bad behaviour, or does it simply promote violence as an acceptable solution to a problem? If yes, then should it also be extended back to schools and other public areas?
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Post by ulyssessarcher on Feb 18, 2017 3:33:51 GMT
Is the use of whooping actually effective as a solution towards bad behaviour, or does it simply promote violence as an acceptable solution to a problem? If yes, then should it also be extended back to schools and other public areas? What a good question! I never whipped my kids until I caught my son reaching for the electrical outlet. He was 2. He never, ever reached for that outlet again. In my mind, a red butt, or a fried child, no choice there. We didn't have the safety things available now, to protect kids from things like that, but it's a different decision for every parent. I was not one for sparing the rod. I ended up raising 2 conservatives, 1 liberal, and 1 socialist. Go figure. I thought we learned more and more and changed our parenting as time went by, so none of them were raised exactly the same. If a parent has no problem with a teacher or principal whipping their kids for misbehaving, I'm all for it. As for myself, I got my pants warmed up bout once a month at least until high school, and there was never a whippin in school, which I didn't earn. But the ones in school was easy, it was the ones when I got home that was much worse, that phone call from the principal meant I was not eatin while sittin down at the table that night, but as I said, I never got one I didn't earn.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 18, 2017 5:44:00 GMT
Absolutely not. What it does is embitters whomever is punished to act out in more extravagant ways. There was a classmate I knew who used to get beaten by his mother, he eventually reacted by taking his desk and throwing it at a teacher. When she reacted by throwing her arm up to strike him, he screamed and screamed and screamed he didn't want to be hit again.
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Post by ulyssessarcher on Feb 18, 2017 6:58:17 GMT
Huge difference tween getting a beating and getting a whippin.
My dad beat me when I was 9 for quiting the pee wee football team, made me move the wood pile, whipped me till he couldn't swing anymore, made me move the wood pile back, whipped me again, and that kept up for bout 5 hours, till my mother got home. That was a beatin.
My grandmother would make me go get my own switch, and though I never understood it at the time, always told me this hurt her more than it did me, as I got older I understood what she meant. That was a whippin.
I was whipped by my mother, father, 2 different grandmothers and 1 grandfather, and a countless number of teachers and principles. And the embarrassment of it was the worst part in school for me, there was no real pain in a paddling from a teacher.
I know the difference, some folks don't, so perhaps it doesn't belong in public schools.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 18, 2017 7:44:17 GMT
It certainly scarred me for life. I didn't know them well, but there is something haunting about someone acting half their age, trying to bury themselves into a wall unable to move because they're stuck in their own nightmare. She didn't strike him, but the damage had already been done at home, the sweep of her arm just triggered him. I mean it. He was screaming at the top of his lungs like someone was trying to kill him. We never saw him again after that, I have no idea where he went. I was lucky, my parents considered it a barbaric practice. The closest I've come was when someone tried to hit me and my aunt grabbed whatever it was they were holding and slammed it down on their hand. Crack. "Terrible when they can fight back, huh?" she said. After her ex-husband, I don't think she would have tolerated that kind of violence against anyone in her home, let alone children.
In my opinion, irrespective of euphemism is used (it's not "abuse", it's an "education"), hurting a child to make them behave is a betrayal of your responsibility as an adult to defend them against such harm. There are always other ways to scold them and the idea that physical punishment works is something that's been disproved time and again by mental health professionals who believe that it harms your child psychologically in ways you can't anticipate. Look at it this way, an adult beating another adult because they've done something wrong is considered assault and a felony. An adult beating a child should be considered worse because you know better than they do. You do. You can get posttraumatic stress disorder and depressive episodes from anyone, the age is irrelevant and teaching them that being beaten is how people love us is thoroughly disgusting.
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Post by ulyssessarcher on Feb 18, 2017 9:19:14 GMT
I don't think you and I will come real close to agreeing on the topic. Most of what ive seen shows me that mental abuse is much worse than physical abuse, when it comes to a child.
As I said, my grandmother would take a switch to me, and she would have tears in her eyes. I was not a good kid, I know that now, and for me, the whippins took. For others they might not.
I think a lot of it would depend on the mental toughness of the child. But if all else fails, what would be better? A whippin administered properly, or in the worst situations, possibly shipping the child off to someone else? That's about the worst possible punishment I could think of.
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Post by Sir Wearer of Hats on Feb 18, 2017 9:45:23 GMT
So basically a "whipping" might or might not be effective depending on the kid, the adult and the situation.
bollocks to that.
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Post by jasonward on Feb 18, 2017 9:46:28 GMT
I have views I would normally have expressed, but I'm not willing to even start on this discussion when it involves someone that thinks that there should be state instituted televised murder and the cutting off of limbs as punishment.
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Post by ulyssessarcher on Feb 18, 2017 10:02:40 GMT
So basically a "whipping" might or might not be effective depending on the kid, the adult and the situation. bollocks to that. Just stating what I know from first hand experience. They helped get me in line, but, twas a different world then.
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Post by Timelord007 on Feb 18, 2017 10:14:28 GMT
Violence is never the answer, my dad hit me & belittled me & i was violently bullied at school because of my OCD & what that did for a long time is make me a angry aggressive person, i took up aikido so i could defend myself & hit those who hit me which is exactly what happened.
Did it make me feel better...no, did i find enjoyment or a resolution...no i didn't, in fact i became someone i didn't like & so i decided to find a alternative way of dealing with stuff & i have spent the last 20 years or so in becoming a better man.
Talking through problems is the only way of sorting them out, violence solves nothing it only fuels more violence.
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Post by ulyssessarcher on Feb 18, 2017 10:17:01 GMT
I have views I would normally have expressed, but I'm not willing to even start on this discussion when it involves someone that thinks that there should be state instituted televised murder and the cutting off of limbs as punishment. I thought that was a different thread. But for the record, I don't consider killing a convicted murderer, murder. I call it justice. And would cutting the testicles off, from a convicted child molester be considered cutting of a limb? Just wondering. I was trying to have a nice chat on this topic, and I was actually learning some things on this topic, but you couldn't help yourself, and as you see, I couldn't either.
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Post by ulyssessarcher on Feb 18, 2017 10:23:51 GMT
Violence is never the answer, my dad hit me & belittled me & i was violently bullied at school because of my OCD & what that did for a long time is make me a angry aggressive person, i took up aikido so i could defend myself & hit those who hit me which is exactly what happened. Did it make me feel better...no, did i find enjoyment or a resolution...no i didn't, in fact i became someone i didn't like & so i decided to find a alternative way of dealing with stuff & i have spent the last 20 years or so in becoming a better man. Talking through problems is the only way of sorting them out, violence solves nothing it only fuels more violence. I know all bout the dad hittin part, and the bullyin at school, but mine was because I was the fat, uncoordinated kid, I got angry at some of my classmates over it. And as you can tell, I am an angry aggressive person, but ive started counseling. The becoming a better man is the trickiest part for me. Dealin with the anger is hard to do, when you're angry at God. Aint no preachers can help me, Don't put much luck in the counseling. So what have you done for the last 20 years or so in becoming a better man?
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Post by Timelord007 on Feb 18, 2017 10:30:19 GMT
Violence is never the answer, my dad hit me & belittled me & i was violently bullied at school because of my OCD & what that did for a long time is make me a angry aggressive person, i took up aikido so i could defend myself & hit those who hit me which is exactly what happened. Did it make me feel better...no, did i find enjoyment or a resolution...no i didn't, in fact i became someone i didn't like & so i decided to find a alternative way of dealing with stuff & i have spent the last 20 years or so in becoming a better man. Talking through problems is the only way of sorting them out, violence solves nothing it only fuels more violence. I know all bout the dad hittin part, and the bullyin at school, but mine was because I was the fat, uncoordinated kid, I got angry at some of my classmates over it. And as you can tell, I am an angry aggressive person, but ive started counseling. The becoming a better man is the trickiest part for me. Dealin with the anger is hard to do, when you're angry at God. Aint no preachers can help me, Don't put much luck in the counseling. So what have you done for the last 20 years or so in becoming a better man? I let go of my anger through thearpy & found good people to surround myself with like my cousins & niece who keep me grounded, anger eventually consumes the soul & it was making me a nasty person who thrived on conflict, the man i was is still inside me but i no longer let him out. Mindfulness meditation has helped me, i rediscovered my passion for painting again & despite my daily bipolar depressive battles I've made peace & forgiven myself.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 18, 2017 10:30:50 GMT
I don't think you and I will come real close to agreeing on the topic. Most of what ive seen shows me that mental abuse is much worse than physical abuse, when it comes to a child. As I said, my grandmother would take a switch to me, and she would have tears in her eyes. I was not a good kid, I know that now, and for me, the whippins took. For others they might not. Probably not, my experiences are very different. I've learned from academia and life in general that physical abuse tends to lead to mental abuse, self-harm being the most apparent and that's not just in the realm of home either. I've had friends who tried to throw themselves down stairways because of other people's cruelty. It began with being punched by a classmate and it ended with a trip in an ambulance. Nobody gained anything. I think a lot of it would depend on the mental toughness of the child. But if all else fails, what would be better? A whippin administered properly, or in the worst situations, possibly shipping the child off to someone else? That's about the worst possible punishment I could think of. Pick a third option. Non-punitive discipline, removal of privileges while everyone cools down and then a careful negotiation of what the parent wants, what the child wants and how the two of them can come to a consensus. Children are amazingly clever and more than willing to talk something out if they're treated as they expect adults are treated. It's also likely that what they consider terribly important to their lives, won't seem quite as central from an adult's perspective. As Timelord007 can attest, it doesn't matter what the intent was, smacking them around solves nothing.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 18, 2017 10:35:41 GMT
I know all bout the dad hittin part, and the bullyin at school, but mine was because I was the fat, uncoordinated kid, I got angry at some of my classmates over it. And as you can tell, I am an angry aggressive person, but ive started counseling. The becoming a better man is the trickiest part for me. Dealin with the anger is hard to do, when you're angry at God. Aint no preachers can help me, Don't put much luck in the counseling. So what have you done for the last 20 years or so in becoming a better man? I let go of my anger through thearpy & found good people to surround myself with like my cousins & niece who keep me grounded, anger eventually consumes the soul & it was making me a nasty person who thrived on conflict, the man i was is still inside me but i no longer let him out. Mindfulness meditation has helped me, i rediscovered my passion for painting again & despite my daily bipolar depressive battles I've made peace & forgiven myself. Rage is exhausting and you're ultimately fighting a losing battle. It's pointless, endless and useless. There's a greater power in choosing not to harm -- neither yourself or others -- and one of the greatest steps forward in doing the latter is to nurture the former. I'd like to see some of those paintings one day.
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Post by ulyssessarcher on Feb 18, 2017 10:38:12 GMT
I hope my passion for baseball helps, instead of hindering. I'm very on the fence about that, but ill find out in just over a week. I say that cause the biggest thing on my mind on Nov. 4th was the disappointment of the world series. When that is your biggest worry, you really have no worries.
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shutupbanks
Castellan
There’s a horror movie called Alien? That’s really offensive. No wonder everyone keeps invading you.
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Post by shutupbanks on Feb 18, 2017 12:40:01 GMT
My own mother had a wooden spoon that she would threaten to use on us as a very last resort - although I don't ever recall it actually being used: the threat was enough... which is a whole 'nother discussion.
My own experience as a parent was that kids respond really well to a loud cupped-hand slap on a nappy-padded bottom as a consequence to naughty/ negative behaviour: it's more the noise than anything else: and we always made sure there was noise rather than pain. Other than that we've rarely had to use physical punishment on our kids. It also helps that we back it up with sanctions like grounding or withholding favourite toys or treats as an effective punishment or in later years taking the offender's charging cord off them for up to a week.
As a teacher and a student I don't think that physical punishment has a place in a school: I remember a lot of my parents friends boasting about having "six of the best" on a fairly regular basis - routinely followed with boasts of "It never did me any harm!" I've thought since then that if it was such an effective punishment why did you keep getting it?
I remember a few days in Year 3 when my class went away on a camp and I didn't (we had some dates clashing for family stuff) so I spent a few days in another classroom where the teacher would routinely punish kids by slapping them across the back of the knees with a metal ruler. I was in her room for 3 days and I remember her doing it twice. This was also around the middle of the year when you've put all your classroom routines in place and the kids are used to you.
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Post by Timelord007 on Feb 18, 2017 12:46:20 GMT
I let go of my anger through thearpy & found good people to surround myself with like my cousins & niece who keep me grounded, anger eventually consumes the soul & it was making me a nasty person who thrived on conflict, the man i was is still inside me but i no longer let him out. Mindfulness meditation has helped me, i rediscovered my passion for painting again & despite my daily bipolar depressive battles I've made peace & forgiven myself. Rage is exhausting and you're ultimately fighting a losing battle. It's pointless, endless and useless. There's a greater power in choosing not to harm -- neither yourself or others -- and one of the greatest steps forward in doing the latter is to nurture the former. I'd like to see some of those paintings one day. Some of my paintings are my Google+ page.
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Post by Timelord007 on Feb 18, 2017 12:58:14 GMT
Believe me it took me years to actually find some sort of closure & i ain't perfect, i lost it when i seen my cousins stepdad the other day but i managed to not lose it because if I'd smacked him it wouldn't bring back my cousin it would just fuel my anger, so I'll just cut that particular person out my life & have nothing more to do with him, as wolfie53 quite rightly said "rage is tiring".
The first step is always look within yourself & see what changes you need to make, for myself i had to forgive myself for the crazy crap i did & let my past go because all that was there was darkness & finally begin liking myself again, it's not easy but what is in life.
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Post by whiskeybrewer on Feb 18, 2017 16:22:00 GMT
My mum smacked me and my brother when we were younger when we did wrong, but only ever on the bum with her hand. Same with my dad. But we were never beaten nor were objects used. And we grew up fine.
But any parent who beats there child to within and inch of life, leaving bruises and cuts? and pushing them down mentally? well they arent parents at all. They are scum.
I will turn every cheek, then when thats done and there are no other cheeks to turn, may whatever Deity you pray to protect you, because you are mine. (Okay Im actually gonna use that last line in a story, because its given me chills and its mine lol)
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