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Post by dalekbuster523finish on Jan 9, 2018 16:24:44 GMT
What do we think the Chibnall's era tone should be?
I'm hoping for something lighter compared to the Moffat era, and I think a light thriller would play to Chibnall's strengths. I'd really like to see him include a cliffhanger at the end of each episode like the classic series, to give an added incentive for viewers to tune in each week and make Doctor Who unmissable TV in the eyes of the Great British Public again.
Perhaps the tone could also be similar to the kids' books by Roald Dahl also?
By this, I don't mean turning Doctor Who into a kids' show but capturing the sense of wonder and magic of Charlie And The Chocolate Factory, but also with a hint of darkness (such as what happens to every kid bar Charlie in Charlie And The Chocolate Factory).
What do you think? What do you want the tone to be?
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Post by constonks on Jan 9, 2018 19:22:13 GMT
Different to anything we've had before - and a little bit weirder, if possible.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 9, 2018 21:44:05 GMT
What do we think the Chibnall's era tone should be? I'm hoping for something lighter compared to the Moffat era, and I think a light thriller would play to Chibnall's strengths. I'd really like to see him include a cliffhanger at the end of each episode like the classic series, to give an added incentive for viewers to tune in each week and make Doctor Who unmissable TV in the eyes of the Great British Public again. Perhaps the tone could also be similar to the kids' books by Roald Dahl also? By this, I don't mean turning Doctor Who into a kids' show but capturing the sense of wonder and magic of Charlie And The Chocolate Factory, but also with a hint of darkness (such as what happens to every kid bar Charlie in Charlie And The Chocolate Factory). What do you think? What do you want the tone to be? I think it's a given it's going to be lighter and a return to the rollercoaster ride of the Nine to Eleven eras. The darker approach was always going to be risky, although given what UK fans have told me and the shows continued great success internationally and how series nine was promoted (reiterarting that it was Clara and Twelve back toghether in the TARDIS rather then promoting anything new) , I do think the BBC's scheluding of the series had more to do with it's decline then anything else. People were excited for Calpadi. I do think the series also went on hiatus one to many times, although that defiantly had more to do with the BBC then Moffatt. I have a feeling we're going to be done with the Time War, etc. Not that it's NOT going to inform Thirteen or her actions, but I do think series nine is going to have a more optimistic tone then previous series with The Doctor striding forward into the light before her eventual return to Galifery (which will probably be series twelve territory).
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Post by stcoop on Jan 9, 2018 22:41:52 GMT
Well according to BBC Worldwide the the plan is to "grow youth audiences, engage families with young children, and deepen the property’s relationship with existing fans"; two out of three of which fell away over the past few years. And interestingly there will be over 11 hours of new Who this year, which is way over the 8.5 you get by adding up the previously announced episode lengths. merchandise.thedoctorwhosite.co.uk/doctor-who-brand-and-licensing-update/
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Post by Deleted on Jan 9, 2018 22:45:11 GMT
Well according to BBC Worldwide the the plan is to "grow youth audiences, engage families with young children, and deepen the property’s relationship with existing fans"; two out of three of which fell away over the past few years. And interestingly there will be over 11 hours of new Who this year, which is way over the 8.5 you get by adding up the previously announced episode lengths. merchandise.thedoctorwhosite.co.uk/doctor-who-brand-and-licensing-update/I'm not completely sold on the fifty minute format, though. The breezy forty-five minute format just suits the nature of the show incredibly well.
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Post by dalekbuster523finish on Jan 9, 2018 23:25:38 GMT
What do we think the Chibnall's era tone should be? I'm hoping for something lighter compared to the Moffat era, and I think a light thriller would play to Chibnall's strengths. I'd really like to see him include a cliffhanger at the end of each episode like the classic series, to give an added incentive for viewers to tune in each week and make Doctor Who unmissable TV in the eyes of the Great British Public again. Perhaps the tone could also be similar to the kids' books by Roald Dahl also? By this, I don't mean turning Doctor Who into a kids' show but capturing the sense of wonder and magic of Charlie And The Chocolate Factory, but also with a hint of darkness (such as what happens to every kid bar Charlie in Charlie And The Chocolate Factory). What do you think? What do you want the tone to be? I think it's a given it's going to be lighter and a return to the rollercoaster ride of the Nine to Eleven eras. The darker approach was always going to be risky, although given what UK fans have told me and the shows continued great success internationally and how series nine was promoted (reiterarting that it was Clara and Twelve back toghether in the TARDIS rather then promoting anything new) , I do think the BBC's scheluding of the series had more to do with it's decline then anything else. People were excited for Calpadi. I do think the series also went on hiatus one to many times, although that defiantly had more to do with the BBC then Moffatt. I have a feeling we're going to be done with the Time War, etc. Not that it's NOT going to inform Thirteen or her actions, but I do think series nine is going to have a more optimistic tone then previous series with The Doctor striding forward into the light before her eventual return to Galifery (which will probably be series twelve territory). The question is how it will do lighter differently to the RTD era. I think the answer to that lies in Broadchurch, and how Chibnall keeps the audience guessing right to the very last moment. I think Series 11 is going to have one story that takes place in the background of the others, and it will be a narrative full of twists and turns designed to completely shock the audience.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 9, 2018 23:32:30 GMT
I think it's a given it's going to be lighter and a return to the rollercoaster ride of the Nine to Eleven eras. The darker approach was always going to be risky, although given what UK fans have told me and the shows continued great success internationally and how series nine was promoted (reiterarting that it was Clara and Twelve back toghether in the TARDIS rather then promoting anything new) , I do think the BBC's scheluding of the series had more to do with it's decline then anything else. People were excited for Calpadi. I do think the series also went on hiatus one to many times, although that defiantly had more to do with the BBC then Moffatt. I have a feeling we're going to be done with the Time War, etc. Not that it's NOT going to inform Thirteen or her actions, but I do think series nine is going to have a more optimistic tone then previous series with The Doctor striding forward into the light before her eventual return to Galifery (which will probably be series twelve territory). The question is how it will do lighter differently to the RTD era. I think the answer to that lies in Broadchurch, and how Chibnall keeps the audience guessing right to the very last moment. I think Series 11 is going to have one story that takes place in the background of the others, and it will be a narrative full of twists and turns designed to completely shock the audience. I'd love that, but I think the arc is going to be pretty loose. As much as I hate to say it, this series is going to be one huge adjustment for a lot of viewers and Chibnall will need to play the long-game with that. You can still differiate, though. The Doctor has wrestled with her demons and stides out anew to all of space and time....
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Post by Deleted on Jan 9, 2018 23:35:24 GMT
Just no more boring long self-aggrandizing speeches from Doctor Who please.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 9, 2018 23:40:36 GMT
Just no more boring long self-aggrandizing speeches from Doctor Who please. I absolutely loved/love Peter Capaldi as The Doctor but I agree. The speeches were too long and preaching. And the talk of being kind was laboured too much, especially for a Doctor whose kindness was less obvious than some others (this isn't a criticism, I love his waspishness, but lines like "Your friend's the top layer if you want to say a few words," isn't the epitome of kindness).
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Post by dalekbuster523finish on Jan 9, 2018 23:43:46 GMT
The question is how it will do lighter differently to the RTD era. I think the answer to that lies in Broadchurch, and how Chibnall keeps the audience guessing right to the very last moment. I think Series 11 is going to have one story that takes place in the background of the others, and it will be a narrative full of twists and turns designed to completely shock the audience. I'd love that, but I think the arc is going to be pretty loose. As much as I hate to say it, this series is going to be one huge adjustment for a lot of viewers and Chibnall will need to play the long-game with that. You can still differiate, though. The Doctor has wrestled with her demons and stides out anew to all of space and time.... I get what you're saying, but I feel like it could also be a good way to hook the audience if done right. Game of Thrones for instance has done a very good job at sustaining a loyal audience through that kind of heavy narrative arc.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 9, 2018 23:51:43 GMT
Just no more boring long self-aggrandizing speeches from Doctor Who please. I absolutely loved/love Peter Capaldi as The Doctor but I agree. The speeches were too long and preaching. And the talk of being kind was laboured too much, especially for a Doctor whose kindness was less obvious than some others (this isn't a criticism, I love his waspishness, but lines like "Your friend's the top layer if you want to say a few words," isn't the epitome of kindness). Yes. & there were so many of them, basically the same speech rewritten again & again! Boring! Oh & also less reliance on the show's own history/mythology please!
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Post by mrperson on Jan 10, 2018 1:06:56 GMT
I see no need for a concerted effort to make a "lighter" tone, and I'm not even sure I buy the notion that Moffat's era was darker. But before we get into weird debates, how about we state what we mean by lighter and darker tones?
I don't think it should be either light or dark intentionally. Whatever works best for a given story should be used.
What's "Dark" to me? The Girl Who Waited, The Settling, Prisoners of Fate, Heaven Sent, Father's Day, Amy's Choice, Silence/Forest, All of Dalek Empire, Lucie Miller/To The Death, Most/All of War Doctor, Damaged Goods, Colditz & the later trilogy, Spare Parts, Creatures of Beauty.
"Light"? Sometimes there's comic light: The One Doctor or Dinosaurs on a Space Ship. Or maybe a non-romp that simply isn't bitterly dark, has a few jokes. Kingmaker?
So really, what are we even saying when we want darker or lighter or neither? Does the "dark" involve sadness, death, lack of jokes? Things generally going badly?
On my re-watch of the new series, I hit S4 and S1. There's tons of darkness. The main difference I see between RTD and Moffat isn't about dark v. light, but rather (1) deification in RTD v. flip-flopping between deification and fallibility of the Doctor in Moffat, (2) Moffat either having complex plot arcs with great set-ups and bad landings (S6 for example) or weirdly unnecessary themes (S8 "am I a good man"?).
I say ignore making any effort on lightness v. darkness, but tone down overly complex plot arcs and if he needs to have one, make sure it's plotted from beginning to end before episodes are written. Just focus on good storytelling. Be Big Finish, but on TV, basically.
(And yeah, enough of the speeches).
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Post by mrperson on Jan 10, 2018 1:11:29 GMT
Well according to BBC Worldwide the the plan is to "grow youth audiences, engage families with young children, and deepen the property’s relationship with existing fans"; two out of three of which fell away over the past few years. And interestingly there will be over 11 hours of new Who this year, which is way over the 8.5 you get by adding up the previously announced episode lengths. merchandise.thedoctorwhosite.co.uk/doctor-who-brand-and-licensing-update/I'm not completely sold on the fifty minute format, though. The breezy forty-five minute format just suits the nature of the show incredibly well. I dunno. I think BF found the perfect formula for shorter eps: 60 minutes. 45 can work but for me, it often feels rushed. I'd rather have 60 minutes regularly. It'd be great if longer ones could be anywhere between 90 and 120+ minutes, but I'm guessing the demands other shows create would make that impossible for TV and only possible in something like Big Finish or Audiobook format. I wouldn't be surprised if 60 minutes was also generally impractical for TV. But in a perfect world, that's what I'd want: 60 minutes, or 90-150 minutes, depending entirely on the story to be told.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 10, 2018 1:29:00 GMT
I see no need for a concerted effort to make a "lighter" tone, and I'm not even sure I buy the notion that Moffat's era was darker. But before we get into weird debates, how about we state what we mean by lighter and darker tones? I don't think it should be either light or dark intentionally. Whatever works best for a given story should be used. What's "Dark" to me? The Girl Who Waited, The Settling, Prisoners of Fate, Heaven Sent, Father's Day, Amy's Choice, Silence/Forest, All of Dalek Empire, Lucie Miller/To The Death, Most/All of War Doctor, Damaged Goods, Colditz & the later trilogy, Spare Parts, Creatures of Beauty. "Light"? Sometimes there's comic light: The One Doctor or Dinosaurs on a Space Ship. Or maybe a non-romp that simply isn't bitterly dark, has a few jokes. Kingmaker? So really, what are we even saying when we want darker or lighter or neither? Does the "dark" involve sadness, death, lack of jokes? Things generally going badly? On my re-watch of the new series, I hit S4 and S1. There's tons of darkness. The main difference I see between RTD and Moffat isn't about dark v. light, but rather (1) deification in RTD v. flip-flopping between deification and fallibility of the Doctor in Moffat, (2) Moffat either having complex plot arcs with great set-ups and bad landings (S6 for example) or weirdly unnecessary themes (S8 "am I a good man"?). I say ignore making any effort on lightness v. darkness, but tone down overly complex plot arcs and if he needs to have one, make sure it's plotted from beginning to end before episodes are written. Just focus on good storytelling. Be Big Finish, but on TV, basically. (And yeah, enough of the speeches). Sorry, but I disagree with this. The Twelfth Doctor era was darker then the previous revival eras. It's a tougher darker universe that bites throughout with none of the easy answers of previous series with The Doctor wrestling with his morality and sense of purpose then ever before. The life of a companion kills Clara. Bill, an abuse victim who The Doctor encourages to reach her potential is turned into a Cyberman, Danny Pink, a soldier wrestling with his humanity is turned into a Cyberman, Missy violates the dead and tricks them into giving up their emotions, The Doctor a war hero is tormented for thousands of years by his own people instead of being trusted and respected and snaps and nearly destroys everything he tried to save, the renegade Zygons gleefully sacrifice their own people to support their revolution,. It's hard to imagine stories like Flatline, Murder on the Orient Express, Dark Water/Death in Heaven being told in the Ninth, Tenth or Eleventh Doctor eras.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 10, 2018 1:29:18 GMT
I'm not completely sold on the fifty minute format, though. The breezy forty-five minute format just suits the nature of the show incredibly well. I dunno. I think BF found the perfect formula for shorter eps: 60 minutes. 45 can work but for me, it often feels rushed. I'd rather have 60 minutes regularly. It'd be great if longer ones could be anywhere between 90 and 120+ minutes, but I'm guessing the demands other shows create would make that impossible for TV and only possible in something like Big Finish or Audiobook format. I wouldn't be surprised if 60 minutes was also generally impractical for TV. But in a perfect world, that's what I'd want: 60 minutes, or 90-150 minutes, depending entirely on the story to be told. Audio and TV aren't the same thing, though. Big Finish has to do more with dialogue to set up the story. And I think regular sixity minute episodes would put too much of a strain on the production team.
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Post by mrperson on Jan 10, 2018 1:46:47 GMT
I see no need for a concerted effort to make a "lighter" tone, and I'm not even sure I buy the notion that Moffat's era was darker. But before we get into weird debates, how about we state what we mean by lighter and darker tones? I don't think it should be either light or dark intentionally. Whatever works best for a given story should be used. What's "Dark" to me? The Girl Who Waited, The Settling, Prisoners of Fate, Heaven Sent, Father's Day, Amy's Choice, Silence/Forest, All of Dalek Empire, Lucie Miller/To The Death, Most/All of War Doctor, Damaged Goods, Colditz & the later trilogy, Spare Parts, Creatures of Beauty. "Light"? Sometimes there's comic light: The One Doctor or Dinosaurs on a Space Ship. Or maybe a non-romp that simply isn't bitterly dark, has a few jokes. Kingmaker? So really, what are we even saying when we want darker or lighter or neither? Does the "dark" involve sadness, death, lack of jokes? Things generally going badly? On my re-watch of the new series, I hit S4 and S1. There's tons of darkness. The main difference I see between RTD and Moffat isn't about dark v. light, but rather (1) deification in RTD v. flip-flopping between deification and fallibility of the Doctor in Moffat, (2) Moffat either having complex plot arcs with great set-ups and bad landings (S6 for example) or weirdly unnecessary themes (S8 "am I a good man"?). I say ignore making any effort on lightness v. darkness, but tone down overly complex plot arcs and if he needs to have one, make sure it's plotted from beginning to end before episodes are written. Just focus on good storytelling. Be Big Finish, but on TV, basically. (And yeah, enough of the speeches). Sorry, but I disagree with this. The Twelfth Doctor era was darker then the previous revival eras. It's a tougher darker universe that bites throughout with none of the easy answers of previous series with The Doctor wrestling with his morality and sense of purpose then ever before. The life of a companion kills Clara. Bill, an abuse victim who The Doctor encourages to reach her potential is turned into a Cyberman, Danny Pink, a soldier wrestling with his humanity is turned into a Cyberman, Missy violates the dead and tricks them into giving up their emotions, The Doctor a war hero is tormented for thousands of years by his own people instead of being trusted and respected and snaps and nearly destroys everything he tried to save, the renegade Zygons gleefully sacrifice their own people to support their revolution,. It's hard to imagine stories like Flatline, Murder on the Orient Express, Dark Water/Death in Heaven being told in the Ninth, Tenth or Eleventh Doctor eras. Well, this kind of thing is all down to personal preference anyway. The most important thing for me is storytelling in Who. I simply don't mind darker episodes, even a lot of them in a row. And on the other hand with Moffat, the things you mention that happen to the companions have their good side (and the ones you didn't). Amy & Rory: Rory keeps coming back to life, ultimately, they get to live their lives out enjoyably and in peace. Clara: Dies, but then gets sort-of-ressurected. On the one hand, normal biological functions are frozen, so she cannot start a family. On the other hand, she gets a TARDIS and life as long as she chooses. Some cultures have held that to be the greatest gift. (ie, The Hindu Gods grant Bishma that same ability, in exchange for a vow of sacrifice; The Mahabharata). Then, before the moment of her final death, gets her mind transported into a future super-robot and live quite a bit longer. Bill: Dies, but then gets brought back as a Cyberman. Suffering. But then saved by Magic Space Girl, exists X years traveling the universe in/with a sentient ship that apparently matches the TARDIS in space/time travel, and then before the moment of her final death, gets her mind transported into a future super-robot. Again, she is preserved twice over. It's a mixed bag. They go through a lot, but they also ultimately get "more" (in some sense or another) life than a normal person. Unlike most original series companions, which were generally improved by the experience without suffering horrific consequences. (Well, one of them blew up and two had their memories erased, but still...) I'm still in my rewatch of reboot S1-Tennant Specials, so it'll be a while before I remind myself fully what that was like. I think the last time I saw it all the way through is 7-8 years ago. I did finish S1 recently, and it overall seemed pretty dark to me. Eccleston seems to me to radiate that war-scarred hero character, even to the point where it seemed like he was covering pain with a jovial attitude much of the time. There were episodes with rather dark themes (Father's Day, the Doctor's preparation to end life on Earth in the second bid to end the Time War in Parting of Ways, and more). Anyway, like I said, this is all just my personal preference. I just want the story to come first, and whatever tone is appropriate to the story to follow.
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Post by masterdoctor on Jan 10, 2018 2:52:01 GMT
I see no need for a concerted effort to make a "lighter" tone, and I'm not even sure I buy the notion that Moffat's era was darker. But before we get into weird debates, how about we state what we mean by lighter and darker tones? I don't think it should be either light or dark intentionally. Whatever works best for a given story should be used. What's "Dark" to me? The Girl Who Waited, The Settling, Prisoners of Fate, Heaven Sent, Father's Day, Amy's Choice, Silence/Forest, All of Dalek Empire, Lucie Miller/To The Death, Most/All of War Doctor, Damaged Goods, Colditz & the later trilogy, Spare Parts, Creatures of Beauty. "Light"? Sometimes there's comic light: The One Doctor or Dinosaurs on a Space Ship. Or maybe a non-romp that simply isn't bitterly dark, has a few jokes. Kingmaker? So really, what are we even saying when we want darker or lighter or neither? Does the "dark" involve sadness, death, lack of jokes? Things generally going badly? On my re-watch of the new series, I hit S4 and S1. There's tons of darkness. The main difference I see between RTD and Moffat isn't about dark v. light, but rather (1) deification in RTD v. flip-flopping between deification and fallibility of the Doctor in Moffat, (2) Moffat either having complex plot arcs with great set-ups and bad landings (S6 for example) or weirdly unnecessary themes (S8 "am I a good man"?). I say ignore making any effort on lightness v. darkness, but tone down overly complex plot arcs and if he needs to have one, make sure it's plotted from beginning to end before episodes are written. Just focus on good storytelling. Be Big Finish, but on TV, basically. (And yeah, enough of the speeches). Sorry, but I disagree with this. The Twelfth Doctor era was darker then the previous revival eras. It's a tougher darker universe that bites throughout with none of the easy answers of previous series with The Doctor wrestling with his morality and sense of purpose then ever before. The life of a companion kills Clara. Bill, an abuse victim who The Doctor encourages to reach her potential is turned into a Cyberman, Danny Pink, a soldier wrestling with his humanity is turned into a Cyberman, Missy violates the dead and tricks them into giving up their emotions, The Doctor a war hero is tormented for thousands of years by his own people instead of being trusted and respected and snaps and nearly destroys everything he tried to save, the renegade Zygons gleefully sacrifice their own people to support their revolution,. It's hard to imagine stories like Flatline, Murder on the Orient Express, Dark Water/Death in Heaven being told in the Ninth, Tenth or Eleventh Doctor eras. I don't remember Bill being abused. The only thing that I think you might be talking about is the relationship with her (foster?) mom which, in my view was just strained and was hurtful by both sides, not abusive.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 10, 2018 4:20:04 GMT
Sorry, but I disagree with this. The Twelfth Doctor era was darker then the previous revival eras. It's a tougher darker universe that bites throughout with none of the easy answers of previous series with The Doctor wrestling with his morality and sense of purpose then ever before. The life of a companion kills Clara. Bill, an abuse victim who The Doctor encourages to reach her potential is turned into a Cyberman, Danny Pink, a soldier wrestling with his humanity is turned into a Cyberman, Missy violates the dead and tricks them into giving up their emotions, The Doctor a war hero is tormented for thousands of years by his own people instead of being trusted and respected and snaps and nearly destroys everything he tried to save, the renegade Zygons gleefully sacrifice their own people to support their revolution,. It's hard to imagine stories like Flatline, Murder on the Orient Express, Dark Water/Death in Heaven being told in the Ninth, Tenth or Eleventh Doctor eras. I don't remember Bill being abused. The only thing that I think you might be talking about is the relationship with her (foster?) mom which, in my view was just strained and was hurtful by both sides, not abusive. Maybe it's my personal experience colouring this (which wasn't family), but.....Bill's relationship with her Stepmother to me read completely as abusive. The worst thing about is that isn't some evil mastermind, she's just a shitty person. In the Pilot, after learning that The Doctor is actually from the University, despite saying the right thing, it's conveyed in a barely contained scornful tone ("You better work hard at it"). Later in the episode, when Bill expresses concern over her going on a date with her ex-boyfriend when she calls from his phone, she gaslights Bill. (And the guy she is probably some poor guy who she's brought down so he can never think he can find anyone better and she's garbaged to Bill to deal with her own issues after wearing out her friends) In The Pryamid at The End of the World, seeing Bill with a 'friend', embarrasses Bill insinuating that she tricks drunken vulnerable men into sleeping with her, so she can never be bothered by seeing Penny again. We know that Bill wanted to go to university, but didn't -and it's no wonder with Moria's running commentary through her head. Bill's deeply insecure about herself and it just isn't about her sexuality - it's the result of her abuse. The worst thing is that Moria doesn't see herself as a bad person and probably wonders why she doesn't have many friends or an extended social life and takes it out on Bill, whose she's hurt throughout her life. And ugh, let's not go into what her relationship with Bill's Dad was probably like or the ckear disconnect between Bill and her Father. She's a nasty piece self-deluded piece of work. And what I love about Twice Upon a Time is that Bill is finally together with humanity (she had friends, but I can't imagine she felt that close to them) and at peace with herself.
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Post by masterdoctor on Jan 10, 2018 4:55:10 GMT
I don't remember Bill being abused. The only thing that I think you might be talking about is the relationship with her (foster?) mom which, in my view was just strained and was hurtful by both sides, not abusive. Maybe it's my personal experience colouring this (which wasn't family), but.....Bill's relationship with her Stepmother to me read completely as abusive. The worst thing about is that isn't some evil mastermind, she's just a shitty person. In the Pilot, after learning that The Doctor is actually from the University, despite saying the right thing, it's conveyed in a barely contained scornful tone. Later in the episode, when Bill expresses concern over her going on a date with her ex-boyfriend, she gaslights Bill. (And the guy she is probably some poor guy who she's brought down so he can never think he can find anyone better and she's garbaged to Bill to deal with her own issues after wearing out her friends) In The Pryamid at The End of the World, seeing Bill with a 'friend', embarrasses Bill insinuating that she tricks drunken vulnerable men into sleeping with her, so she can never be bothered by seeing Penny again. We know that Bill wanted to go to university, but didn't -and it's no wonder with Moria's running commentary through her head. Bill's deeply insecure about herself and it just isn't about her sexuality - it's the result of her abuse. The worst thing is that Moria doesn't see herself as a bad person and probably wonders why she doesn't have many friends or an extended social life and takes it out on Bill, whose she's hurt throughout her life. And ugh, let's not go into what her relationship with Bill's Dad was like or the disconnect between Bill and her Father. She's a nasty piece self-deluded piece of work. And what I love about Twice Upon a Time is that Bill is finally together with humanity (she had friends, but I can't imagine she felt that close to them) and at peace with herself. Fair enough, and with the examples you provided, I would have to agree with you. I must not have really clued in, however, I will say that I am glad that it wasn't a main focus of any episode, but more of an intricate detail about Bill's character and background. Actually, Moffat does well with this kind of thing(as well as going way to far in depth of others) especially in Capaldi's era and Sherlock.
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Post by sherlock on Jan 10, 2018 12:37:15 GMT
It should be different.
That's all I've got really, either lighter or darker could work I suppose depending on quality of stories.
On a side note, speaking of Charlie and the Chocolate Factory when I saw the musical version in London a year or so ago I couldn't help but compare Willy Wonka to the Doctor. The way he was portrayed in the musical (quirky and charming but with an underlying seriousness and glimpses of darkness) just reminded me of the Doctor.
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