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Post by theillusiveman on Dec 5, 2020 13:17:58 GMT
Since we have The Unbound Range for The Doctor (which features The Gattis Unbound Master) i was wondering what if Big Finish had decided to make an Unbound Range for The Master? what ideas do you think they would do for it?
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Post by grinch on Dec 5, 2020 13:25:02 GMT
Hmm. It’s an interesting idea. One which would be hard to do without just making him into the Doctor. I did have a few ideas on what you could do with an Unbound Master though.
One where The Master was captured before he could leave Gallifrey and has spent the majority of his time in prison. Becoming ever bitter at hearing the news of what his old friend has got up to and wondering what might have been. Could imagine a Time Lord visiting him and asking;
“And tell me, what are you a Master of exactly?”
Be rather a depressing tale all things considered. Probably would end with him destroying Gallifrey leaving him the sole ruler (or Master) over a destroyed landscape. And there he would wait, biding his time until his old friend finally returns.
One where Susan was in fact The Master’s granddaughter. Definitely be one I’d be curious to see develop. Could see her being corrupted by The Master’s growing arrogance and general distaste towards the universe. Or perhaps calling in the Time Lords to arrest him, completely betraying his trust as she realises that they never should have left Gallifrey and dedicating the rest of her life to quiet non interference or simply observation. Watched over of course by the Time Lords to ensure she doesn’t follow in her grandfather’s footsteps.
And then, of course, there is the most obvious story idea. What if the Master truly changed his ways?
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mbt66
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Post by mbt66 on Dec 5, 2020 14:55:03 GMT
It’s an interesting thought...The Master Unbound...it sounds quite scary!
Most things I can think of they could do. I am sure the Big Finish writers could come up with a reason for the Master to turn good for a couple of episodes or even for a run of stories. They wouldn’t need to class it as Unbound.
And as for a path not taken scenario the only one that comes to mind is what if Nyssa left Trakken and traveled with her “father”. A sufficient part of Tremas being left within the Master so he felt affection for and would never hurt his sweet daughter.
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mbt66
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Post by mbt66 on Dec 6, 2020 11:41:39 GMT
To the Master a Daughter
When I read this thread for some reason this notion jumped into my head and now I cannot get rid of the idea, so to help excise it I thought I would write a few things down.
The emotions that Tremas had for his daughter somehow still residing in the Master. Therefore he feels compelled to be with and keep safe his only daughter.
The Master doesn’t understand these feelings and is disgusted with himself, but it is a compulsion he cannot resist.
He has to convince Nyssa that he is still her father and suggests she ask him something only her father would know. So she does and he gives her the answer she was hoping for. He also says and does other things that persuades her that he is still her father.
It is only later that the audience discovers that the Master had already hypnotised Nyssa and primed himself with the answers and actions needed to convince her.
The problem with the Master having a companion is he doesn’t seem to need one and if he did have one we know the companion wouldn’t last very long! Resolving this was one of the reasons I liked the Master and young apprentice Master set up. For me this Master and Daughter set up would be similar as the Master would contain himself from killing his companion at the slightest provocation.
Nyssa would bring out a bit of good in the Master and conversely the Master would bring out a bit of bad in Nyssa.
Having someone else to care about would effect the Master’s plans and Nyssa would definitely assist the Master in concocting less outlandish and overly complicated schemes.
The Master would become an even greater foe for the Doctor. He might very well win on a more regular basis.
And speaking of the Doctor, the fact that the pivotal Logopolise would never play out with the Master’s involvement, might it still be the Fourth Doctor and Adric they encounter later in their adventures. And might Nyssa once again see the Fourth Doctor regenerate, but this time from a completely different perspective!?
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Post by commonman on Dec 7, 2020 2:09:48 GMT
mbt66 posts made me think about something: has it often been theorised that Missy's Daughter from season 9 is actually Nyssa? (certainly not Moffat's intention when writing it though) Also I think a story about the Master staying on Gallifrey because the Doctor never left either. Since there already is a story where the Doctor never left, this audio could be in the same universe. I guess this Master would become an overtly efficient member like the cia coordinator or the new Burner, following Braxiatel in the position. Also, what if the Master left to follow another renegade. I think the Monk would have the most potential for such a story. The Five Masters: What if Borusa recruited the Master's incarnation to uncover the secret of Rassilon. A polemic one since many want this to be the case in the main timeline: what if the Timeless Child became the Master?
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Post by constonks on Dec 7, 2020 17:59:09 GMT
One where Susan was in fact The Master’s granddaughter. Definitely be one I’d be curious to see develop. I actually think the series (and the EU) missed a trick way way back when. It doesn't work with everything we know now, but imagine if the Master and the Doctor had *both* been Susan's grandparents. Susan as the child of the Doctor's son and the Master's daughter... certainly better than the "Master is the Doctor's brother" idea, IMO! But here are a few prompts from me: What if the Master......had left Gallifrey with the Doctor and they travelled on together? ...was UNIT's scientific advisor? ...was the Last of the Time Lords, after the death of the Doctor? ...became the President of the Time Lords? ...had successfully stolen the Doctor's body? (Tom Baker's my pick for that Master incarnation!) ...got a Wonderful Life-esque look at what the universe would have been like without him ...died and someone else took up the mantle? (The first Perfect Timing anthology apparently includes a future "Doctor" who was really the Last Companion.)I also considered, as above... What if Borusa recruited the Master's incarnation to uncover the secret of Rassilon. ...because imagine five different Masters in a death match to claim immortality! Given that it's an Unbound setting, they could even successfully kill off some of their past and future selves! This whole thing is a Divergent Wordsmiths anthology waiting to happen though, isn't it, @wolfie53 / @dramaman? Especially since J.A. Prentice did "What if the Master was sent to Skaro instead of the Doctor?" in Genesis of Terror before the release of Anti-Genesis!
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Post by Deleted on Dec 7, 2020 20:06:36 GMT
One where Susan was in fact The Master’s granddaughter. Definitely be one I’d be curious to see develop. I actually think the series (and the EU) missed a trick way way back when. It doesn't work with everything we know now, but imagine if the Master and the Doctor had *both* been Susan's grandparents. Susan as the child of the Doctor's son and the Master's daughter... certainly better than the "Master is the Doctor's brother" idea, IMO! But here are a few prompts from me: What if the Master......had left Gallifrey with the Doctor and they travelled on together? ...was UNIT's scientific advisor? ...was the Last of the Time Lords, after the death of the Doctor? ...became the President of the Time Lords? ...had successfully stolen the Doctor's body? (Tom Baker's my pick for that Master incarnation!) ...got a Wonderful Life-esque look at what the universe would have been like without him ...died and someone else took up the mantle? (The first Perfect Timing anthology apparently includes a future "Doctor" who was really the Last Companion.)I also considered, as above... What if Borusa recruited the Master's incarnation to uncover the secret of Rassilon. ...because imagine five different Masters in a death match to claim immortality! Given that it's an Unbound setting, they could even successfully kill off some of their past and future selves! This whole thing is a Divergent Wordsmiths anthology waiting to happen though, isn't it, @wolfie53 / @dramaman ? Especially since J.A. Prentice did "What if the Master was sent to Skaro instead of the Doctor?" in Genesis of Terror before the release of Anti-Genesis! Love the sound of it. I think these Master ideas could actually work for a third volume of Unbound Imaginings! While it's not gonna happen anytime soon, you are more than welcome to share some full-length stories ideas.
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Post by fitzoliverj on Dec 7, 2020 20:31:53 GMT
The Master's already been UNIT's Scientific Advisor (alongside Ian and Barbara) in "The Face of the Enemy" (in whcih, incidentally, he encountered the Inferno-universe Koschei who had been the CIA agent featured in that universe's version of "The Web of Fear" in the absence of the Doctor). But... I wonder... 1) What if the Master got trapped in E-Space? 2) What if the Master successfully blackmailed the universe into making him its ruler? 3) What if UNIT, "The Sea Devils" and the Master resembled "The Navy Lark" (since it also had a The Master in the seventies)? *
* with Tim Treloar in the Jon Pertwee roles, of course, and (to make clear whcih Unbound this is to be balanced against) Arabella Weir in the Heather Chasen roles.
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Post by constonks on Dec 7, 2020 21:37:35 GMT
The Master's already been UNIT's Scientific Advisor (alongside Ian and Barbara) in "The Face of the Enemy" (in whcih, incidentally, he encountered the Inferno-universe Koschei who had been the CIA agent featured in that universe's version of "The Web of Fear" in the absence of the Doctor.) I'd considered that but it's not quiiite the same as the Master in exile, working willingly with a Brigadier who has no reason to distrust him...
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Post by Deleted on Dec 8, 2020 6:26:53 GMT
It’s an interesting thought...The Master Unbound...it sounds quite scary! Most things I can think of they could do. I am sure the Big Finish writers could come up with a reason for the Master to turn good for a couple of episodes or even for a run of stories. They wouldn’t need to class it as Unbound. And as for a path not taken scenario the only one that comes to mind is what if Nyssa left Trakken and traveled with her “father”. A sufficient part of Tremas being left within the Master so he felt affection for and would never hurt his sweet daughter. I think Jacobis Master has cornered Evil...it’s would be cool if this Unbound was kind caring empathic the Unbounds Santa Claus 🤭😉
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Post by doctorkernow on Dec 9, 2020 22:25:26 GMT
Hello again.
The Master Unbound... there is certainly a lot of potential in the ideas given so far. Each incarnation has different characteristics and there is probably space for a 'Turn Left' moment for each incarnation. I like the idea of the Master having to deal with a stronger influence from Tremas's character and having Nyssa as a companion. As already has been said, Nyssa could be the brake on the Master's tendency to ally himself with beings who he in realilty, has no means of ultimate control over. She could actually help the Master become a dangerous enemy for the Doctor.
I wondered what if Sacha Dwahan's Master was the Timeless Child. The knowledge would explain his reason for destroying Gallifrey. What would he do after destroying Gallifrey? Would he go back in time and find out where Tecteun had found her.
What if Simm's Master and Missy instead of killing each other, joined forces. There being a hidden incarnation of the Master between them who was good, like the Good Dalek. Missy's redemption by Twelve being a legacy of this 'good' incarnation.
Lots of potential here, the Master has always been a fascinating character. Moriaty to the Doctor's Holmes. Best wishes...
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Post by constonks on Dec 10, 2020 21:37:40 GMT
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Post by doctorkernow on Dec 10, 2020 23:01:46 GMT
Hello again.
Oh that would explain why I've now been shrunk to the size of a Character figure and my grandaughter has put me on the Christmas tree...
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Post by Kestrel on Dec 11, 2020 7:19:27 GMT
I mean, I'd love it, obviously--who wouldn't?
But... I don't see it happening, given Mark Gatiss tends to be working on so many different things. More practically, I'd be rooting for the Unbound Master to feature as a recurring villain for the NABS, to pit him against the Warner-Doctor again--something I kinda feel we got cheat out of in the Unbound Arc, since Gatiss was mostly playing opposite Bowerman in that story.
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mbt66
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Post by mbt66 on Jun 5, 2022 7:03:10 GMT
With the return of Classic Doctors : New Monsters, I wondered if we could ever get… Classic Doctors : New Masters!
Due to the New Masters introduction it would probably have to fall under the Unbound label.
So who would you want to meet in such a release?
For me, I still subscribe to the chameleon arch changing peoples perception of the user, so the War Master could have meet all the Doctors in the past; but I would love to hear Tom Baker and Derek Jacobi verbally battling.
As for the others, for some reason I find the thought of the Fifth Doctor meeting Missy very appealing, but I don’t have any preference for the Sixth and Seventh Doctors new nemesis.
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Post by tuigirl on Jun 6, 2022 8:35:44 GMT
That actually might be a great idea. As what does the MacQueen Master count? Is he a "new" one? Because we definitely need more of him. Derek Jacobi is always good value, he could go head to head with any of them. However, if I could wish for something.... The Unbound Warner Doctor meeting the War Master. That would be epic.
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Post by Kestrel on Jun 6, 2022 23:31:31 GMT
Big Finish would probably lump Macqueen in with Classic, but personally I think of him (and McGann) as being more New than Classic. With the return of Classic Doctors : New Monsters, I wondered if we could ever get… Classic Doctors : New Masters! Due to the New Masters introduction it would probably have to fall under the Unbound label. So who would you want to meet in such a release? For me, I still subscribe to the chameleon arch changing peoples perception of the user, so the War Master could have meet all the Doctors in the past; but I would love to hear Tom Baker and Derek Jacobi verbally battling. As for the others, for some reason I find the thought of the Fifth Doctor meeting Missy very appealing, but I don’t have any preference for the Sixth and Seventh Doctors new nemesis. This is a great idea that seems at once both too good to actually happen... and also brilliant enough to be an inevitability. Though if this ever happens, I promise you I'm gonna insist on calling it New Masters, Classic Doctors, just to avoid having two different ranges with the CDNM initialism (which I expect Big Finish, in their ongoing quest to make things as confusing as possible, to embrace). For specific matchups... yeah, Jacobi and Baker would be great to see side by side. Honestly as much as I liked it, and as much as it made sense contextually, I'm still kind of bummed we didn't get a scene of the two in Anti-Genesis. I think it was probably the right decision to make, though. But it does lead to the next thought: at the risk of further beating a dead horse, I am very much against explaining any discontinuity. There was a Time War prior to New Who. That is explanation enough. Beyond that... two characters who I absolutely cannot even imagine interacting with each other are Missy and the 3rd Doctor, so I'd like to see that. McGann and Beevers would also be fun, but I also totally want to see Beevers face off against everyone.
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Post by theillusiveman on Jun 7, 2022 1:30:40 GMT
Personally I saw Roberts as the last Classic Master and Macqueen as a new series Master
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