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Post by mark687 on Aug 1, 2023 13:57:56 GMT
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Post by aussiedoctorwhofan on Aug 25, 2023 9:25:50 GMT
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Post by mark687 on Sept 1, 2023 15:07:24 GMT
Trailer Online
Regards
mark687
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Post by mark687 on Sept 23, 2023 12:45:33 GMT
Due Out Tuesday 26th September
Regards
mark687
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Post by aussiedoctorwhofan on Sept 26, 2023 8:07:12 GMT
Out now ..So this will be the final boxset story according to the article..
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Post by bonehead on Sept 27, 2023 12:44:10 GMT
I'm sure my insignificant little post won't affect sales for this set one way or another, so I'll just say I'm sad that Survivors has come to an end. I don't believe the series has run its course, but I do believe the spirit of the series has been changed into something it never was on television. Ken Bentley, who has written extensively for the latter stories, has always said how proud he is of having developed the series from Terry Nation's original ideas to make this something of a women's story. I can't even be bothered to justify my disagreement with this by pointing out that I am very pro-feminism, but was this really Terry Nation's original intent for Survivors? He often wrote strong roles for women, but balanced that with similar roles for men too. His characters were flawed, but often basically good - male or female. To make Survivors almost wholly female, with male characters essentially being either villainous and/or stupid, betrays the spirit of now originally, people - not specific sexes - had to get together to survive in this new world. By straying from that, the original ideals have been lost and as a result, interest has waned (inclusing mine) and how we have reached the end of the run. In one recent instalment, Abbey meets a male character who is actually decent, which surprises her: the men she has met upto this point have all been thugs and bullies, she says (or words to that effect). I'm sure Greg, Barney, Paul, Vic, Arthur and Jimmy from the television show, would be delighted to hear that.
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Post by aussiedoctorwhofan on Sept 27, 2023 20:11:10 GMT
I'm sure my insignificant little post won't affect sales for this set one way or another, so I'll just say I'm sad that Survivors has come to an end. I don't believe the series has run its course, but I do believe the spirit of the series has been changed into something it never was on television. Ken Bentley, who has written extensively for the latter stories, has always said how proud he is of having developed the series from Terry Nation's original ideas to make this something of a women's story. I can't even be bothered to justify my disagreement with this by pointing out that I am very pro-feminism, but was this really Terry Nation's original intent for Survivors? He often wrote strong roles for women, but balanced that with similar roles for men too. His characters were flawed, but often basically good - male or female. To make Survivors almost wholly female, with male characters essentially being either villainous and/or stupid, betrays the spirit of now originally, people - not specific sexes - had to get together to survive in this new world. By straying from that, the original ideals have been lost and as a result, interest has waned (inclusing mine) and how we have reached the end of the run. In one recent instalment, Abbey meets a male character who is actually decent, which surprises her: the men she has met upto this point have all been thugs and bullies, she says (or words to that effect). I'm sure Greg, Barney, Paul, Vic, Arthur and Jimmy from the television show, would be delighted to hear that.
This ^.. I have had a couple conversations with 2 female friends of mine about this Range, and they pretty much say the exact thing.
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Post by bonehead on Sept 27, 2023 20:42:39 GMT
I'm sure my insignificant little post won't affect sales for this set one way or another, so I'll just say I'm sad that Survivors has come to an end. I don't believe the series has run its course, but I do believe the spirit of the series has been changed into something it never was on television. Ken Bentley, who has written extensively for the latter stories, has always said how proud he is of having developed the series from Terry Nation's original ideas to make this something of a women's story. I can't even be bothered to justify my disagreement with this by pointing out that I am very pro-feminism, but was this really Terry Nation's original intent for Survivors? He often wrote strong roles for women, but balanced that with similar roles for men too. His characters were flawed, but often basically good - male or female. To make Survivors almost wholly female, with male characters essentially being either villainous and/or stupid, betrays the spirit of now originally, people - not specific sexes - had to get together to survive in this new world. By straying from that, the original ideals have been lost and as a result, interest has waned (inclusing mine) and how we have reached the end of the run. In one recent instalment, Abbey meets a male character who is actually decent, which surprises her: the men she has met upto this point have all been thugs and bullies, she says (or words to that effect). I'm sure Greg, Barney, Paul, Vic, Arthur and Jimmy from the television show, would be delighted to hear that.
This ^.. I have had a couple conversations with 2 female friends of mine about this Range, and they pretty much say the exact thing.
I hesitated to post that because I didn't want to sound like a sexist old dinosaur, so I'm glad it didn't come across like that. I'm actually really annoyed about how the Survivors audios have gradually and determinedly been turned into this one-sided crusade. The first 6 or 7 series were great, and perfectly balanced between the sexes. We had villainous males like the abhorrent hooligan-cum-leader Vinnie in series 3, and the female villain Carol in series 5, who was a skillful balance of antagonist and victim. But there was always a symmetry that has been deliberately crushed. I'm surprised someone at Big Finish didn't question what Ken Bentley was doing with the series, but he remains resolutely pleased with what he's achieved. And now the series is no more ... |
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Post by elkawho on Sept 28, 2023 0:27:57 GMT
This ^.. I have had a couple conversations with 2 female friends of mine about this Range, and they pretty much say the exact thing.
I hesitated to post that because I didn't want to sound like a sexist old dinosaur, so I'm glad it didn't come across like that. I'm actually really annoyed about how the Survivors audios have gradually and determinedly been turned into this one-sided crusade. The first 6 or 7 series were great, and perfectly balanced between the sexes. We had villainous males like the abhorrent hooligan-cum-leader Vinnie in series 3, and the female villain Carol in series 5, who was a skillful balance of antagonist and victim. But there was always a symmetry that has been deliberately crushed. I'm surprised someone at Big Finish didn't question what Ken Bentley was doing with the series, but he remains resolutely pleased with what he's achieved. And now the series is no more ... I completely agree with every word. I used to love this series, now I can't even bring myself to finish listening to this last set. Oh, there have been female villains since the series has turned militant feminist, and they are the smart, crafty villains who use the stupid, selfish men to their advantage. And the problem with this last boxset has an even bigger and more encompassing problem. It's boring. I'm in the middle of the second story and I don't care about any of the characters anymore, nor about what is going on. It was at lease somewhat interesting when they were trying to build a new civilization, but now that that's done it's just more of the same old thing, only not as good as it used to be. Jenny and Abby (I used to love them both but now I don't care anymore) meeting mostly terrible people doing terrible things. Those two women used to have purpose but they don't any longer. And if someone isn't terrible they are going to die so why should I care? |
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Post by bonehead on Sept 28, 2023 4:57:13 GMT
I hesitated to post that because I didn't want to sound like a sexist old dinosaur, so I'm glad it didn't come across like that. I'm actually really annoyed about how the Survivors audios have gradually and determinedly been turned into this one-sided crusade. The first 6 or 7 series were great, and perfectly balanced between the sexes. We had villainous males like the abhorrent hooligan-cum-leader Vinnie in series 3, and the female villain Carol in series 5, who was a skillful balance of antagonist and victim. But there was always a symmetry that has been deliberately crushed. I'm surprised someone at Big Finish didn't question what Ken Bentley was doing with the series, but he remains resolutely pleased with what he's achieved. And now the series is no more ... I completely agree with every word. I used to love this series, now I can't even bring myself to finish listening to this last set. Oh, there have been female villains since the series has turned militant feminist, and they are the smart, crafty villains who use the stupid, selfish men to their advantage. And the problem with this last boxset has an even bigger and more encompassing problem. It's boring. I'm in the middle of the second story and I don't care about any of the characters anymore, nor about what is going on. It was at lease somewhat interesting when they were trying to build a new civilization, but now that that's done it's just more of the same old thing, only not as good as it used to be. Jenny and Abby (I used to love them both but now I don't care anymore) meeting mostly terrible people doing terrible things. Those two women used to have purpose but they don't any longer. And if someone isn't terrible they are going to die so why should I care? Sad to hear. I haven't even ordered this latest set, even to complete my collection, and I'm not sure I will. I've found some recent stories pretty dull too and that isn't because I think the series has run out of steam - it's purely due to the creative decision that has been made, which seems entirely due to one person and isn't anything to to do with Terry Nation's original concept, or anything that came after (at least as far as I can see). And now Big Finish have added it to their growing list of discontinued lines, which is a shame ... and, I believe, unnecessary. A rare case of BF shooting themselves in the foot. |
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lidar2
Castellan
You know, now that you mention it, I actually do rather like Attack of the Cybermen ...
Likes: 5,819 
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Post by lidar2 on Sept 28, 2023 12:22:42 GMT
I completely agree with every word. I used to love this series, now I can't even bring myself to finish listening to this last set. Oh, there have been female villains since the series has turned militant feminist, and they are the smart, crafty villains who use the stupid, selfish men to their advantage. And the problem with this last boxset has an even bigger and more encompassing problem. It's boring. I'm in the middle of the second story and I don't care about any of the characters anymore, nor about what is going on. It was at lease somewhat interesting when they were trying to build a new civilization, but now that that's done it's just more of the same old thing, only not as good as it used to be. Jenny and Abby (I used to love them both but now I don't care anymore) meeting mostly terrible people doing terrible things. Those two women used to have purpose but they don't any longer. And if someone isn't terrible they are going to die so why should I care? Sad to hear. I haven't even ordered this latest set, even to complete my collection, and I'm not sure I will. I've found some recent stories pretty dull too and that isn't because I think the series has run out of steam - it's purely due to the creative decision that has been made, which seems entirely due to one person and isn't anything to to do with Terry Nation's original concept, or anything that came after (at least as far as I can see). And now Big Finish have added it to their growing list of discontinued lines, which is a shame ... and, I believe, unnecessary. A rare case of BF shooting themselves in the foot. This is an interesting discussion and I have previously made similar points on other Survivors threads so I am in agreement with the general sentiment. I think Survivors has been turned into something else, quite different to the original concept, and whilst the new concept is not a bad one in and of itself, it ain't Survivors as we knew it. I would like to hear someone from BF involved in the recent Survivors boxsets seriously engaging with the arguments here, though I doubt they ever will. They will either dismiss the objections as simple sexism (which they aren't) or just prattle on about how wonderful it is to have strong female characters (as if that is still some kind of novelty in 2023). |
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Post by aussiedoctorwhofan on Sept 28, 2023 20:12:47 GMT
Sad to hear. I haven't even ordered this latest set, even to complete my collection, and I'm not sure I will. I've found some recent stories pretty dull too and that isn't because I think the series has run out of steam - it's purely due to the creative decision that has been made, which seems entirely due to one person and isn't anything to to do with Terry Nation's original concept, or anything that came after (at least as far as I can see). And now Big Finish have added it to their growing list of discontinued lines, which is a shame ... and, I believe, unnecessary. A rare case of BF shooting themselves in the foot. This is an interesting discussion and I have previously made similar points on other Survivors threads so I am in agreement with the general sentiment. I think Survivors has been turned into something else, quite different to the original concept, and whilst the new concept is not a bad one in and of itself, it ain't Survivors as we knew it. I would like to hear someone from BF involved in the recent Survivors boxsets seriously engaging with the arguments here, though I doubt they ever will. They will either dismiss the objections as simple sexism (which they aren't) or just prattle on about how wonderful it is to have strong female characters (as if that is still some kind of novelty in 2023). Agreed ^.
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Post by mark687 on Oct 1, 2023 19:39:25 GMT
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lidar2
Castellan
You know, now that you mention it, I actually do rather like Attack of the Cybermen ...
Likes: 5,819
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Post by lidar2 on Nov 21, 2023 17:25:16 GMT
In the process of listening and will post my thoughts when I finish.
In the meantime beware ep1 interviews track has spoilers for ep 2
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lidar2
Castellan
You know, now that you mention it, I actually do rather like Attack of the Cybermen ...
Likes: 5,819
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Post by lidar2 on Nov 27, 2023 13:04:59 GMT
So, have now finished this and I am both sad and glad that this looks to be the final end of Survivors. Sad because it was one of BF's finest series and one I really enjoyed. Glad because it has been losing its way for some time now and I think I prefer to see it end rather than listen to it continue down the wrong path.
I won't bore readers by repeating points previously made about how Survivors has been turned into little more than a vehicle for "strong female characters" but that is the nub of the problem. But even though this was the case in previous boxsets, at least there was still an exciting story. Whatever its other faults, at least Survivors was a good thriller but this latest boxset isn't even that. It is too cerebral and ends up getting a bit too touchy feely / mother earthy for my taste. Andrew Smith had no involvement in New Dawn 3 & 4 and his absence is felt. Smith may well have been the only creative keeping Survivors half decent.
I think Ken Bentley actually puts his finger on the problem in the Extras when he says at one point that he didn't want to be too self-indulgent. Unfortunately he and Matt Fitton failed in that, and self-indulgent is exactly what Survivors has become*. New Dawn 4 is the first totally non-thriller boxset and I think Survivors has reached the end of the line.
* As a digression, one could argue this point about BF generally, that it has lost its way a bit creatively and is far too self-indulgent nowadays, e.g the continual "X meets Y" crossovers in Doctor Who, but that's a discussion for another thread.
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