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Post by Deleted on Oct 30, 2019 22:11:12 GMT
Am I the only one thinking that Jo Swinson, in expressing the position that she cannot allow Jeremy Corbyn to be Prime Minister, hence her reluctance to form an alliance, whilst making increasingly vocal her own ambitions to be Prime Minister, potentially the next one, is sending a message to Labour moderates. Namely that in the event of a hung parliament or no overall majority, the only way to power will be to accept herself as leader of a coalition government between the two parties and not Jezza. It would seem to be her surest route to power, barring a big electoral party shift on the night from reds to yellows on the map. There's a very real chance the Libs will remain as the 4th biggest party at the GE - surely the PM can't be from that low down the pecking order. I mean...anyone who can command confidence can become PM, sure, but realistically that would be quite a coup (literally and figuratively) It is not a case of what I think is likely, but what I suspect she may think plausible. Some call it delusional, but its still within the bounds of possibility, hence the burgeoning confidence and ambition.
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lidar2
Castellan
You know, now that you mention it, I actually do rather like Attack of the Cybermen ...
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Post by lidar2 on Oct 30, 2019 22:22:07 GMT
Am I the only one thinking that Jo Swinson, in expressing the position that she cannot allow Jeremy Corbyn to be Prime Minister, hence her reluctance to form an alliance, whilst making increasingly vocal her own ambitions to be Prime Minister, potentially the next one, is sending a message to Labour moderates. Namely that in the event of a hung parliament or no overall majority, the only way to power will be to accept herself as leader of a coalition government between the two parties and not Jezza. It would seem to be her surest route to power, barring a big electoral party shift on the night from reds to yellows on the map. When the Lib-Lab discussions took place after the 2010 election, part of the deal would have been Brown stepping down as Labour leader. Never came to anything because the Libs chose to go into government with the Tories, but I suspect something like that is the sort of thing Swinson has in mind. She has been careful to say she won't support Corbyn as PM, not that she won't support a Labour government.
But given the choice between a pro-brexit Johnston and a pro-referendum Corbyn, I think the Liberals would have to plump for Labour to secure a referendum but not support Labour's more radical policies. ( Although BJ is so unprincipled I wouldn't put it past him to offer a referendum in those circumstances.)
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Post by number13 on Oct 31, 2019 0:06:47 GMT
Am I the only one thinking that Jo Swinson, in expressing the position that she cannot allow Jeremy Corbyn to be Prime Minister, hence her reluctance to form an alliance, whilst making increasingly vocal her own ambitions to be Prime Minister, potentially the next one, is sending a message to Labour moderates. Namely that in the event of a hung parliament or no overall majority, the only way to power will be to accept herself as leader of a coalition government between the two parties and not Jezza. It would seem to be her surest route to power, barring a big electoral party shift on the night from reds to yellows on the map. When the Lib-Lab discussions took place after the 2010 election, part of the deal would have been Brown stepping down as Labour leader. Never came to anything because the Libs chose to go into government with the Tories, but I suspect something like that is the sort of thing Swinson has in mind. She has been careful to say she won't support Corbyn as PM, not that she won't support a Labour government.
But given the choice between a pro-brexit Johnston and a pro-referendum Corbyn, I think the Liberals would have to plump for Labour to secure a referendum but not support Labour's more radical policies. ( Although BJ is so unprincipled I wouldn't put it past him to offer a referendum in those circumstances.)
"Unprincipled" is another of those 'Yes, Minster' irregular political words isn't it?
He is unprincipled and will do anything for power.
You are indecisive and flip-flopping.
I am responsive to events and The Will Of The People.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 31, 2019 12:15:54 GMT
Happy Brexit Day!
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Post by sherlock on Nov 1, 2019 17:42:01 GMT
Well this will be...interesting.
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Post by doctorkernow on Nov 1, 2019 19:55:48 GMT
Hello again.
I notice that the UK has not actually exploded so have taken my fingers out of my ears.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 1, 2019 20:24:37 GMT
Hello again. I notice that the UK has not actually exploded so have taken my fingers out of my ears. Welcome back. I don't know if you are on Twitter, but can I recommend the #BritainHasExploded hashtag? Our politics may be **** and our national sanity is certainly questionable, but the one thing we still do brilliantly is take the ****. My personal favourite..
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Post by number13 on Nov 2, 2019 1:21:11 GMT
Hello again. I notice that the UK has not actually exploded so have taken my fingers out of my ears. Welcome back. I don't know if you are on Twitter, but can I recommend the #BritainHasExploded hashtag? Our politics may be **** and our national sanity is certainly questionable, but the one thing we still do brilliantly is take the ****. My personal favourite..
I don't know though... I once saw that turn nasty in a place called Devil's End at Beltane and yesterday was Hallowe'en so...
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Post by nucleusofswarm on Nov 3, 2019 14:12:30 GMT
Farage is not standing for election, continuing his track record of running away anytime the fight actually gets heated. Why do Brexiteers still bother acting like this guy means anything?
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Post by Deleted on Nov 3, 2019 14:49:41 GMT
Farage is not standing for election, continuing his track record of running away anytime the fight actually gets heated. Why do Brexiteers still bother acting like this guy means anything? He wants to be anti-establishment. He craves on being the underdog figure rallying against the so-called political elite.
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lidar2
Castellan
You know, now that you mention it, I actually do rather like Attack of the Cybermen ...
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Post by lidar2 on Nov 6, 2019 11:33:03 GMT
I think it would be a mistake to equate party choice and Brexit choice even at this election. There will be many Leave voters who still vote Labour because they are 'Labour people' and Remainers who still vote Conservative because they are proud Tories. And every other combination imaginable. (It's like some on the left try to lump together all non-Conservative voters as 'the anti-Tory vote' to prove the Tories don't really win! Does not work!)
Article on BBC website today by Sir John Curtice seems to say that for approximately 80% of people their vote in the 2019 GE will be in line with their vote in the 2016 referendum, but the other 20% will vote the other way in 2019 to the way they did in 2016
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Post by sherlock on Nov 6, 2019 12:11:26 GMT
Ahead of the Tories’ campaign launch, the Wales Secretary just resigned after being connected to a former aide making claims which led to the collapse of a rape trial.
This is is in addition to the other scandals plaguing the Tories (Holding off publishing report into Russian interference, Rees-Mogg’s comments on Grenfell and Andrew Bridgen’s dire attempt to justify them, sharing an edited video of Keir Starmer being interviewed on twitter). All in all a very bad backdrop for Johnson’s election launch.
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Post by nucleusofswarm on Nov 6, 2019 15:19:12 GMT
Ahead of the Tories’ campaign launch, the Wales Secretary just resigned after being connected to a former aide making claims which led to the collapse of a rape trial. This is is in addition to the other scandals plaguing the Tories (Holding off publishing report into Russian interference, Rees-Mogg’s comments on Grenfell and Andrew Bridgen’s dire attempt to justify them, sharing an edited video of Keir Starmer being interviewed on twitter). All in all a very bad backdrop for Johnson’s election launch. Yeah, but Tory voters have, alas, proven that these things don't trouble them.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 6, 2019 15:56:52 GMT
Ahead of the Tories’ campaign launch, the Wales Secretary just resigned after being connected to a former aide making claims which led to the collapse of a rape trial. This is is in addition to the other scandals plaguing the Tories (Holding off publishing report into Russian interference, Rees-Mogg’s comments on Grenfell and Andrew Bridgen’s dire attempt to justify them, sharing an edited video of Keir Starmer being interviewed on twitter). All in all a very bad backdrop for Johnson’s election launch. not forgetting James Cleverly being empty chaired by a furious Kay Burley, Piers Morgan ripping into the Conservative chairman over the video of Starmer and James O'brien fact checking Johnson's election launch speech. And it's only day 1...
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Post by charlesuirdhein on Nov 7, 2019 1:50:14 GMT
I'm still pondering Patterson's quoting of Michael Collins. What alternate hell have I found myself in?
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Post by number13 on Nov 7, 2019 11:44:29 GMT
Seems I'm the only one who's noticed this:
or this:
Understandable I guess that these minor stories should have gone under the radar when there's the thrill of an empty chair being told off!
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Post by sherlock on Nov 7, 2019 11:49:28 GMT
Seems I'm the only one who's noticed this:
or this:
Understandable I guess that these minor stories should have gone under the radar when there's the thrill of an empty chair being told off! Yes it seems Day 2 of the campaign has swung dramatically the other direction, with Labour now hit with a wave of bad headlines. Arguably the most damning headline of today is this one-
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Post by number13 on Nov 7, 2019 12:55:29 GMT
Seems I'm the only one who's noticed this:
or this:
Understandable I guess that these minor stories should have gone under the radar when there's the thrill of an empty chair being told off! Yes it seems Day 2 of the campaign has swung dramatically the other direction, with Labour now hit with a wave of bad headlines. Arguably the most damning headline of today is this one- You're right, it is. Labour is not my party but I simply don't understand how the party that had EdM as its leader just four years ago has come to this. I've disagreed with Labour about many things for my whole adult life, but only twice before (in 1983 - defence during the Cold War, and 2010 -those illiberal ID cards) have I felt genuinely alarmed at the idea of them taking power. This time is much much worse.
BJ is not, to put it mildly, my first choice for Tory PM and Brexit wasn't my choice either. But I'm sure as hell going to vote Conservative when faced with this Labour alternative.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Nov 7, 2019 13:00:20 GMT
Yes it seems Day 2 of the campaign has swung dramatically the other direction, with Labour now hit with a wave of bad headlines. Arguably the most damning headline of today is this one- You're right, it is. Labour is not my party but I still don't see how the party that had EdM as its leader just four years ago has come to this. I've disagreed with Labour about many things for my whole adult life, but only twice before (in 1983 - defence during the Cold War, and 2010 -those illiberal ID cards) have I felt genuinely alarmed at the idea of them taking power. This time is much much worse.
BJ is not, to put it mildly, my first choice for Tory PM and Brexit wasn't my choice either. But I'm sure as hell going to vote Conservative when faced with this Labour alternative.
Wow. A Tory voter! Tbh I find it incredulous that anyone can vote Tory.
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Post by number13 on Nov 7, 2019 13:06:35 GMT
You're right, it is. Labour is not my party but I still don't see how the party that had EdM as its leader just four years ago has come to this. I've disagreed with Labour about many things for my whole adult life, but only twice before (in 1983 - defence during the Cold War, and 2010 -those illiberal ID cards) have I felt genuinely alarmed at the idea of them taking power. This time is much much worse.
BJ is not, to put it mildly, my first choice for Tory PM and Brexit wasn't my choice either. But I'm sure as hell going to vote Conservative when faced with this Labour alternative.
Wow. A Tory voter! Tbh I find it incredulous that anyone can vote Tory. I have Lib Dem and Labour (and ex-Labour) friends and I can believe six impossible things before breakfast. So I'm not surprised when some people don't vote Tory.
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