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Post by Deleted on Dec 10, 2018 2:04:56 GMT
That would be brilliant! Team him up with the Rosa racist (can't remember his name, even though he was so memorable... ) and develop him up a bit, and I think we could get a really nice Monk/companion-type relationship that would prove a challenge for 13 Awful idea. Yeah... developing a one-note racist character so he becomes likeable and you've got... a really, dreadfully bad idea.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 10, 2018 2:29:10 GMT
Yeah... developing a one-note racist character so he becomes likeable and you've got... a really, dreadfully bad idea. Whoever said likeable? Their relationship could be portrayed as extremely unhealthy, the Monk enabling him through wilful ignorance without actually liking the fellow. They could even actively hate each other and still be working together because each is useful to the other. A twisted parody of the Doctor/companion team:
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Post by number13 on Dec 11, 2018 11:24:29 GMT
But like many villains, the Monk (copying the Doctor, I strongly suspect, though he'd never admit it!) aspires to a certain degree of old-fashioned Britishness - loves his (stolen) objets d'art and soft furnishings in the console room, afternoon tea and cakes on a little trolley for guests, affects sweeping robes or a smart suit and a carefully cultivated moustache and equally carefully cultivated conversation. And he has no viewpoint or aim too inflexible to wriggle into the most advantageous position for whatever his latest scheme is.
I don't think he could tolerate sharing his TARDIS with a practically conversationless obsessive ineffectual cardboard cut-out like Krasko for more than five minutes before 'accidentally' leaving him behind on an airless asteroid or somewhere equally hospitable. 'Oh dear, I'm getting so forgetful in this regeneration... Still, I can't go back and rescue him now it's too late, can I? Naughty Monk for even thinking such a thing! What would the Doctor say about the Web of Time if I did that? Ah well, no use crying over spilt milk... milk... yes, a nice cup of tea and a petit four and I'm sure I'll have forgotten all about... whatever his name was. There, better already!'
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Post by charlesuirdhein on Dec 11, 2018 21:01:23 GMT
But like many villains, the Monk (copying the Doctor, I strongly suspect, though he'd never admit it!) aspires to a certain degree of old-fashioned Britishness - loves his (stolen) objets d'art and soft furnishings in the console room, afternoon tea and cakes on a little trolley for guests, affects sweeping robes or a smart suit and a carefully cultivated moustache and equally carefully cultivated conversation. And he has no viewpoint or aim too inflexible to wriggle into the most advantageous position for whatever his latest scheme is.
I don't think he could tolerate sharing his TARDIS with a practically conversationless obsessive ineffectual cardboard cut-out like Krasko for more than five minutes before 'accidentally' leaving him behind on an airless asteroid or somewhere equally hospitable. 'Oh dear, I'm getting so forgetful in this regeneration... Still, I can't go back and rescue him now it's too late, can I? Naughty Monk for even thinking such a thing! What would the Doctor say about the Web of Time if I did that? Ah well, no use crying over spilt milk... milk... yes, a nice cup of tea and a petit four and I'm sure I'll have forgotten all about... whatever his name was. There, better already!' Totally hearing that in Rufus Hound's voice.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 11, 2018 22:20:29 GMT
Yeah... developing a one-note racist character so he becomes likeable and you've got... a really, dreadfully bad idea. Whoever said likeable? Their relationship could be portrayed as extremely unhealthy, the Monk enabling him through wilful ignorance without actually liking the fellow. They could even actively hate each other and still be working together because each is useful to the other. A twisted parody of the Doctor/companion team: Bringing him back would just turn him into a recurring villain. I think it would undermine what he represented in Rosa. He was the right villain for the right episode. What evil scheme does horrible racist have next? Not something I'd want to see.
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Post by elkawho on Dec 12, 2018 1:18:34 GMT
But like many villains, the Monk (copying the Doctor, I strongly suspect, though he'd never admit it!) aspires to a certain degree of old-fashioned Britishness - loves his (stolen) objets d'art and soft furnishings in the console room, afternoon tea and cakes on a little trolley for guests, affects sweeping robes or a smart suit and a carefully cultivated moustache and equally carefully cultivated conversation. And he has no viewpoint or aim too inflexible to wriggle into the most advantageous position for whatever his latest scheme is.
I don't think he could tolerate sharing his TARDIS with a practically conversationless obsessive ineffectual cardboard cut-out like Krasko for more than five minutes before 'accidentally' leaving him behind on an airless asteroid or somewhere equally hospitable. 'Oh dear, I'm getting so forgetful in this regeneration... Still, I can't go back and rescue him now it's too late, can I? Naughty Monk for even thinking such a thing! What would the Doctor say about the Web of Time if I did that? Ah well, no use crying over spilt milk... milk... yes, a nice cup of tea and a petit four and I'm sure I'll have forgotten all about... whatever his name was. There, better already!' Totally hearing that in Rufus Hound's voice. Me too!
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Post by number13 on Dec 12, 2018 1:24:52 GMT
But like many villains, the Monk (copying the Doctor, I strongly suspect, though he'd never admit it!) aspires to a certain degree of old-fashioned Britishness - loves his (stolen) objets d'art and soft furnishings in the console room, afternoon tea and cakes on a little trolley for guests, affects sweeping robes or a smart suit and a carefully cultivated moustache and equally carefully cultivated conversation. And he has no viewpoint or aim too inflexible to wriggle into the most advantageous position for whatever his latest scheme is.
I don't think he could tolerate sharing his TARDIS with a practically conversationless obsessive ineffectual cardboard cut-out like Krasko for more than five minutes before 'accidentally' leaving him behind on an airless asteroid or somewhere equally hospitable. 'Oh dear, I'm getting so forgetful in this regeneration... Still, I can't go back and rescue him now it's too late, can I? Naughty Monk for even thinking such a thing! What would the Doctor say about the Web of Time if I did that? Ah well, no use crying over spilt milk... milk... yes, a nice cup of tea and a petit four and I'm sure I'll have forgotten all about... whatever his name was. There, better already!' Totally hearing that in Rufus Hound's voice. Thank you Charles and Elka, so did I!
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Post by Deleted on Dec 12, 2018 1:40:50 GMT
But like many villains, the Monk (copying the Doctor, I strongly suspect, though he'd never admit it!) aspires to a certain degree of old-fashioned Britishness - loves his (stolen) objets d'art and soft furnishings in the console room, afternoon tea and cakes on a little trolley for guests, affects sweeping robes or a smart suit and a carefully cultivated moustache and equally carefully cultivated conversation. And he has no viewpoint or aim too inflexible to wriggle into the most advantageous position for whatever his latest scheme is.
I don't think he could tolerate sharing his TARDIS with a practically conversationless obsessive ineffectual cardboard cut-out like Krasko for more than five minutes before 'accidentally' leaving him behind on an airless asteroid or somewhere equally hospitable. 'Oh dear, I'm getting so forgetful in this regeneration... Still, I can't go back and rescue him now it's too late, can I? Naughty Monk for even thinking such a thing! What would the Doctor say about the Web of Time if I did that? Ah well, no use crying over spilt milk... milk... yes, a nice cup of tea and a petit four and I'm sure I'll have forgotten all about... whatever his name was. There, better already!' *psst* (number13, you should really write something.)
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Post by number13 on Dec 17, 2018 11:52:15 GMT
But like many villains, the Monk (copying the Doctor, I strongly suspect, though he'd never admit it!) aspires to a certain degree of old-fashioned Britishness - loves his (stolen) objets d'art and soft furnishings in the console room, afternoon tea and cakes on a little trolley for guests, affects sweeping robes or a smart suit and a carefully cultivated moustache and equally carefully cultivated conversation. And he has no viewpoint or aim too inflexible to wriggle into the most advantageous position for whatever his latest scheme is.
I don't think he could tolerate sharing his TARDIS with a practically conversationless obsessive ineffectual cardboard cut-out like Krasko for more than five minutes before 'accidentally' leaving him behind on an airless asteroid or somewhere equally hospitable. 'Oh dear, I'm getting so forgetful in this regeneration... Still, I can't go back and rescue him now it's too late, can I? Naughty Monk for even thinking such a thing! What would the Doctor say about the Web of Time if I did that? Ah well, no use crying over spilt milk... milk... yes, a nice cup of tea and a petit four and I'm sure I'll have forgotten all about... whatever his name was. There, better already!' *psst* (number13, you should really write something.) Wolfie, you say the nicest things!
But I know my limits - a couple of lines in the voice of a familiar character where clever people have done all the work of establishing them and how they talk, not difficult. On the other hand, creating an original story with a plot, interesting twists, new characters and giving them voices, etc. is WAY beyond me and I know it. I wouldn't have a clue!
I am so grateful for the creative wizards who can do these things so I can explore their worlds and meet the people they dream into existence. And thus I make regular financial offerings at the shrine of BF in their honour.
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Post by GroundedCompanion on Dec 19, 2018 23:27:07 GMT
It's an interesting thought. This season has definitely been one focussed on the idea of humanity as the big bad, more fantastical creations have been few and far between. What's the expression... Evil is ordinary? For this particularly investigative Doctor with a fascination for how things work... The Toymaker would be an interesting choice, each occupying the opposing end of a cosmic game, but how about the Eternals? They fit the current tone of the series rather well, grandiose but largely impassive beings who use living creatures as playthings for their own amusement. Creatures with a Black Mirror brand of cruelty. From yacht races ( Enlightenment) to arms races ( Uninvited Guest) to... something rather interesting I'll wager. I guess anything could work with a good story. I'd have never expected a sequel featuring the Tribe of Gum to be so compelling, but Hunters of the Burning Stone achieved it in spades.
Given that Chibnall has moved away from RTD and Moffatt positioning The Doctor as the centre of the Doctor Who universe, The Elementals and The Celestial Toymaker would be nice adversaries to pit Thirteen agasint, particularly given her arc. I do wonder if technically the TV series could cast David Ballie as The Toymaker?
We're heading to Galifery eventually, but it looks like Chibnall is going to stack his deck with new stuff in the interim.
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Post by agentten on Dec 20, 2018 0:01:21 GMT
I'm in the camp of keeping up the newness for the time being, however, when the time comes, I think the Daleks may be the way to go. If the interest and momentum that the show seems to be gaining right now are maintained, then using the monster that even the most casual of viewers will likely know of, but in an exciting and dangerous way, could generate a lot of excitement but not leave people feeling like they're missing something because they don't follow the continuity. I recall how terribly excited I was when "Dalek" aired. To see them again after a long time away during the wilderness years, but with the fresh eyes of a companion who'd never encountered them combined with the Doctor's emotional response made "Dalek" a really exciting episode to watch because the Daleks felt so dangerous. Even just one of them was a massive threat. Still my favorite episode of Nine's run. Whatever/whoever they decide to bring back, I hope it generates those same thrills.
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Post by GroundedCompanion on Dec 20, 2018 0:04:20 GMT
I'm in the camp of keeping up the newness for the time being, however, when the time comes, I think the Daleks may be the way to go. If the interest and momentum that the show seems to be gaining right now are maintained, then using the monster that even the most casual of viewers will likely know of, but in an exciting and dangerous way, could generate a lot of excitement but not leave people feeling like they're missing something because they don't follow the continuity. I recall how terribly excited I was when "Dalek" aired. To see them again after a long time away during the wilderness years, but with the fresh eyes of a companion who'd never encountered them combined with the Doctor's emotional response made "Dalek" a really exciting episode to watch because the Daleks felt so dangerous. Even just one of them was a massive threat. Still my favorite episode of Nine's run. Whatever/whoever they decide to bring back, I hope it generates those same thrills.
It wouldn't suprise me if Chibnall went down the route of stripping them of their empire and making them dark, deadly and desperate. Pushed to the mettle agasint Thirteen's resolve. Maybe we'll even have an ongoing Dalek narrative across Thirteen's era?
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Post by Deleted on Dec 20, 2018 0:14:55 GMT
Mr. Sin
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Post by GroundedCompanion on Dec 20, 2018 0:19:36 GMT
He was already explored to good effect in The Butcher of Brisbane and honestly, outside of that, I'm not sure what else can really be done with him.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 20, 2018 1:33:00 GMT
He was already explored to good effect in The Butcher of Brisbane and honestly, outside of that, I'm not sure what else can really be done with him.
Not heard it. But that was audio so doesn't preclude him being used on telly.
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Post by constonks on Dec 20, 2018 2:34:38 GMT
I'm fine with the Daleks and Cybermen taking a break for a little while longer - I'd rather see one of those secondary-but-recognizable Who monsters show up - basically Silurians, Sontarans, Zygons, Ice Warriors or the Ood. (I would include Weeping Angels but I honestly think they're more limited in what you can do with them.)
Or I guess some of the other monsters BF has used for Classic Doctors, New Monsters would be good to see again - namely the Sycorax, Judoon or Vashta Nerada.
But I doubt Chib's gonna go more obscure than that - and I don't know that he should. Pick one from this list, and keep the rest of the season full of new creatures and worlds.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 21, 2018 14:39:29 GMT
*psst* (number13, you should really write something.) Wolfie, you say the nicest things! But I know my limits - a couple of lines in the voice of a familiar character where clever people have done all the work of establishing them and how they talk, not difficult. On the other hand, creating an original story with a plot, interesting twists, new characters and giving them voices, etc. is WAY beyond me and I know it. I wouldn't have a clue!
I am so grateful for the creative wizards who can do these things so I can explore their worlds and meet the people they dream into existence. And thus I make regular financial offerings at the shrine of BF in their honour. Aw, bless, that's a really lovely way of looking at it. That said, if I ever get around to that Third Doctor meets Ian Fleming or Timelash prequel, you'll be the first person I consult to check the authenticity of their dialogue. It's an interesting thought. This season has definitely been one focussed on the idea of humanity as the big bad, more fantastical creations have been few and far between. What's the expression... Evil is ordinary? For this particularly investigative Doctor with a fascination for how things work... The Toymaker would be an interesting choice, each occupying the opposing end of a cosmic game, but how about the Eternals? They fit the current tone of the series rather well, grandiose but largely impassive beings who use living creatures as playthings for their own amusement. Creatures with a Black Mirror brand of cruelty. From yacht races ( Enlightenment) to arms races ( Uninvited Guest) to... something rather interesting I'll wager. I guess anything could work with a good story. I'd have never expected a sequel featuring the Tribe of Gum to be so compelling, but Hunters of the Burning Stone achieved it in spades. Given that Chibnall has moved away from RTD and Moffatt positioning The Doctor as the centre of the Doctor Who universe, The Elementals and The Celestial Toymaker would be nice adversaries to pit Thirteen agasint, particularly given her arc. I do wonder if technically the TV series could cast David Ballie as The Toymaker?
We're heading to Galifery eventually, but it looks like Chibnall is going to stack his deck with new stuff in the interim.
I'd love to see David Ballie in the role. After things like It Takes You Away, Thirteen feels way more at home with entities much "larger" than herself like the Toymaker, the Animus or the Eternals.
They're not recurring adversaries by any stretch, but I'd be fascinated to see her go up against something inspired by the Endless from Neil Gaiman's Sandman comics. Something that rolled up in the Guardians' or Eternals' absence and filled their ecological niche.
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Post by number13 on Dec 21, 2018 21:51:59 GMT
Wolfie, you say the nicest things! But I know my limits - a couple of lines in the voice of a familiar character where clever people have done all the work of establishing them and how they talk, not difficult. On the other hand, creating an original story with a plot, interesting twists, new characters and giving them voices, etc. is WAY beyond me and I know it. I wouldn't have a clue!
I am so grateful for the creative wizards who can do these things so I can explore their worlds and meet the people they dream into existence. And thus I make regular financial offerings at the shrine of BF in their honour. Aw, bless, that's a really lovely way of looking at it. That said, if I ever get around to that Third Doctor meets Ian Fleming or Timelash prequel, you'll be the first person I consult to check the authenticity of their dialogue. I want to hear that story now! There has to be a cracking WWII historical just waiting to be told - one for 'The Churchill Years Vol 3' if there ever is one.
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