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Post by nucleusofswarm on Dec 29, 2018 1:44:58 GMT
Between the will of Omega and the Bristol Boys versus the games of Rassilon and Uncle Terry, which anniversary special comes out on top for you?
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shutupbanks
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Post by shutupbanks on Dec 29, 2018 3:03:57 GMT
Five Doctors for me: Three was clearly the important milestone and the original but Five amps it up a bit more with a few more twists (Borusa is the baddie! The Master gets ticked off for not being trusted! The Cyber-massacre!) and with a bit more of an movie/ event story.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 29, 2018 3:15:10 GMT
That's a toughie.
The Bristol boys were always great at concept stories, taking an interesting idea and fleshing it out as deeply as they could. Understanding it. They do a good job in The Three Doctors of understanding the formulae of each Doctor's tenure. The Third Doctor leads the investigative charge, the Second Doctor hosts a base-under-siege and, in a rather cruel bit of irony, the First Doctor is absent for large parts of the story, but crucial for its progression.
Credit to them for not reverting to an older adversary, though. The decision to bring in Omega -- an exile, just like the Doctor -- was a strong one. Particularly his role in the foundation of Time Lord society. The antimatter amoeba that devours UNIT HQ makes for a credible vanguard and the gel guards look like golems conjured up to carry out a straightforward objective. I also like how while the Doctors don't get on (and really, meeting yourself in the past with all the mistakes you could've avoided with hindsight, that rings annoyingly true) the narrative still treats each with respect, there's no particularly overt favouritism towards one or other.
The Five Doctors is rather impressive for how well it manages its enlarged cast. Juggling an A, B, C and D-plot is no mean feat and it never feels as overcrowded as it should. The Doctors' various lives and legacies all feel tangible for the first time too. A unity of TARDISes. Gallifrey itself has also taken leaps and bounds since the beginning of the season in Arc of Infinity, which is nice to see as well. (Fun fact that I discovered literally two minutes ago: The Australian Broadcasting Commission donated $60,000AUD to the production forgoing a co-production credit on the programme itself. No wonder it looks so glossy, I wonder how that contract came about...?)
The final choice for the Gamemaster was very strong, his ruthlessness is in keeping with Assassin and it echoes the tragic circumstances of Omega in the original. The Death Zone is a great creation, particularly the very overt hints that the Time Lords have come a looooong way from the days of their ancestors. A history buried deep and trapped by censors, abandoned by all except a choice few. There's this sense that if not for the power drain, they wouldn't give a jot about what happens outside the council chambers. Why? They're sequestered in total isolation. Nothing can touch them unless it comes from within.
I'd have liked Bill Hartnell well enough to be in Three, but ultimately, I find it impossible to choose between the two stories. They both have really strong merits and both are equally as strong as pillars of lore.
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Post by elkawho on Dec 29, 2018 5:51:51 GMT
I'm in the Five Doctors camp. I've only seen The Three Doctors once, but aside from the event of having the three of them meet, I didn't like the episode very much. But boy, do I love The Five Doctors. I have so much fun watching that episode. I can watch that one over and over. Sarah Jane's fall down the hill gets me every time, and I think the Raston warrior is a fantastic addition to Who. And, like Wolfie, I appreciate the addition to Gallifreyan history it introduces.
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Post by aussiedoctorwhofan on Dec 29, 2018 6:17:56 GMT
5 :-)
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Post by Deleted on Dec 29, 2018 8:54:36 GMT
Five Doctor's, were else you going here lines such as "no not the mind probe".
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Post by Deleted on Dec 29, 2018 9:53:41 GMT
Five Doctor's, were else you going here lines such as "no not the mind probe". Haha yes. But what about The Five(ish) Doctors?
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Post by Deleted on Dec 29, 2018 10:14:16 GMT
Both of these are great, but The Five Doctors is the one for me. I believe at the time, JNT felt strongly it should be his final contribution to the series.
To me, The Five Doctors was one of the those rare occasions where Doctor Who was indeed 'as good as it used to be' (before crashing back down to Earth again - or beneath it - with the cheap and cheerful Warriors of the Deep a couple of months later). It was great to see a Dalek back again after such a long time (four years since the previous Dalek story - imagine that), and although this story considerably weakened them, The Cybermen were great value. But above all, the Doctors all back, doing their thing (I didn't miss Tom Baker as much as I thought I would, funnily enough). Huge fun.
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Post by mark687 on Dec 29, 2018 11:20:57 GMT
5 (But Patrick Troughton and Nicholas Courtney are the best thing in both)
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Post by Deleted on Dec 29, 2018 13:09:25 GMT
Five Doctor's, were else you going here lines such as "no not the mind probe". Haha yes. But what about The Five(ish) Doctors? I love it, makes me laugh everytime i watch it.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 29, 2018 13:10:13 GMT
5 (But Patrick Troughton and Nicholas Courtney are the best thing in both) Regards mark687 There brilliant together aren't they.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 29, 2018 14:49:21 GMT
I'm gonna have to go against the flow and say The Three Doctors. On broadcast in 1972 it was the first time I'd seen Patrick Troughton and William Hartnell as 'The Doctor', having only read Target novelisations featuring them in the role, and boy was I jolly excited. I might have even wet my pants at the time, it was a special episode. The Five Doctors was okay and I did enjoy it, but for me The Three Doctors was a great episode, from a great season, from a great era, of Doctor Who.... and there's nothing the vet could do to change that one!
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Post by eric009 on Dec 29, 2018 17:37:58 GMT
three doctors without that story there migth never been a five
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Post by nucleusofswarm on Dec 29, 2018 17:48:33 GMT
I'm gonna have to go against the flow and say The Three Doctors. On broadcast in 1972 it was the first time I'd seen Patrick Troughton and William Hartnell as 'The Doctor', having only read Target novelisations featuring them in the role, and boy was I jolly excited. I might have even wet my pants at the time, it was a special episode. The Five Doctors was okay and I did enjoy it, but for me The Three Doctors was a great episode, from a great season, from a great era, of Doctor Who.... and there's nothing the vet could do to change that one! Speaking of Three and avoiding wetness:
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Post by Deleted on Dec 29, 2018 21:23:45 GMT
It's no contest really, is it?
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Post by glutamodo on Dec 30, 2018 2:26:16 GMT
I don't know. Back in the 80s, I remember watching 5 Docs first, many times - hell I think I still have a copy of the original version of it that I recorded off-air with the original sort of dodgy time-scoop effects and the better Voice of Rassilon…
I knew only of The Three Doctors from the Programme Guide. Then PBS started showing Pertwee. And soon enough they got around to 3 Docs. Did I have a Nerdgasm? No, not really, it wasn't bad, and I liked Patrick, naturally, but it wasn't the greatest story. Too bad that Hartnell's heath necessitated filmed inserts. I think it might have been better had they been able to work him into the story better. (this was first time I'd ever seen the First Doctor)
So I think I'd vote for 5 Doctors.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 30, 2018 7:05:54 GMT
I've got to admit, I've a pair of favourite quotes from the two of them. Right down to the performances. From Three:
And from Five:
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Post by eric009 on Dec 30, 2018 14:17:34 GMT
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Post by eric009 on Dec 30, 2018 23:08:22 GMT
and last line from both shows for me,The Three Doctors wins The Three Doctors Mr Ollis "you never believe me women supper's ready"
The Five Doctors 5th Doctor "that's how it all started"
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Post by constonks on Dec 31, 2018 3:23:21 GMT
That's a toughie.
The Bristol boys were always great at concept stories, taking an interesting idea and fleshing it out as deeply as they could. Understanding it. They do a good job in The Three Doctors of understanding the formulae of each Doctor's tenure. The Third Doctor leads the investigative charge, the Second Doctor hosts a base-under-siege and, in a rather cruel bit of irony, the First Doctor is absent for large parts of the story, but crucial for its progression. That's incredible. I never thought of it that way at all. I definitely would say The Three Doctors over The Five Doctors - it's more the Second Doctor guest starring in a Third Doctor story so it feels more streamlined - and it means every character gets their own good interaction with him. It was my favourite serial when I watched the series through the first time and I'd probably still name it as such if asked. On the other hand, The Five Doctors doesn't have a whole lot of character crossover involved - the Second Doctor and Third Doctor barely meet anyone other than their designated companion until the final scene, Susan's interactions with the Fifth Doctor really aren't as satisfying as they should be (and he barely even talks to Sarah!) All in all, I think The Five Doctors is that very rare type of classic Doctor Who story - one that should be a little longer.
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