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Post by mrperson on Oct 12, 2016 15:14:29 GMT
But Hitler and Nazis? Well, let's whip out our funny fake German accents and behave like morons. I see you've heard Colditz too !!! I wasn't criticizing the use of fake German accents and I certainly wasn't thinking of Colditz (which was a rather good episode and linked to a great three-parter later on). I was criticizing the notion of trying to generate humor by having people dress up as Nazis and put on a show of buffoonery. (Or, similarly, haha let's have Rory punch Hitler. Let's put Hitler in a closet, isn't that hilarious. That kind of ****).
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Post by Ela on Oct 13, 2016 2:58:34 GMT
The Hitler cameo in Let's Kill Hitler was really besides the point of the whole episode. Don't know why they bothered to even include him. (Except, I guess, that thing - can't remember what it's called - was trying to wipe out villains of history. But still pointless. They could have done that differently.) 1. "They" as in the miniturized people in the shape-changing machine? That was "The teleselecta"; the people are there to torture historical criminals just before their moment of death because that's justice in the future, I guess. 2. The real reason that Hitler was there was to "piss off Hitler, now that he's dead" by "[taking] the mickey out of him, make him a joke, make him be punched by Rory." (Moffatt). www.bbcamerica.com/anglophenia/2011/08/doctor-whos-day-roundup-steven-moffat-says-taking-the-mickey-out-of-hitler-was-the-plan3. As far as I could make out from the story, it was supposed to be there to torture Hitler, which makes either the Teleselecta crew or Moffatt rather incompetent because Hitler doesn't die until 1945, when he shoots himself in a bunker. Anyway, the machine is going to meet Hitler to do something when Hitler gets scared and shoots Mel by accident, instead of the "Teleselecta". Then she regenerates and the Teleselecta chases River, presumably to torture her (as indeed it ultimately does for a bit later int he episode). But that too makes no sense on the story's plotline because River dies in the Library's hard drive room, saving Ten, and time traveling justice-torturers should probably know that. If she dies earlier in her timeline - "now" from the episode's perspective - then she cannot save 10 who cannot become 11, whom she then cannot meet in her own past. She also cannot shoot the Doctor at the lake if it happens then. It's one of those "just accept it" plots in which whatever rules for time travel might still 'exist' for the show are ignored. It really was built around trying to make fun of Hitler, which has got to be the epitome of bad story-telling. I knew "teleselecta" wasn't right, so I just looked it up. It's Teselecta.
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Post by paulmorris7777 on Oct 13, 2016 10:45:17 GMT
I see you've heard Colditz too !!! I wasn't criticizing the use of fake German accents and I certainly wasn't thinking of Colditz (which was a rather good episode and linked to a great three-parter later on). I was criticizing the notion of trying to generate humor by having people dress up as Nazis and put on a show of buffoonery. (Or, similarly, haha let's have Rory punch Hitler. Let's put Hitler in a closet, isn't that hilarious. That kind of ****). The difficulty of using a historical figure, such as Hitler, is that history cannot be changed. Hitler will, and would, always be the same character - he can't be changed. If they had done some sort of dictator story set on an alien planet, or in the far future, then they can make the point and change the future! Or, at the very least, a thought provoking script!
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Post by mrperson on Oct 13, 2016 21:26:16 GMT
Superheroes. Superheroes are taboo for Who.
Thus spake Mr. Person.
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Post by nucleusofswarm on Feb 5, 2017 1:01:05 GMT
While there could some great human drama in there, anything concerning ISIS, Al Qaeda or the Middle East directly.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 5, 2017 1:36:28 GMT
While there could some great human drama in there, anything concerning ISIS, Al Qaeda or the Middle East directly. Mmm, for the time being. It's much like how they couldn't have a serial directly about the Nazi regime during the 1960s, it's too fresh a conflict for people to view it in the context of fiction yet.
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Post by ulyssessarcher on Feb 5, 2017 3:52:27 GMT
Castro, the Cuban Missile Crisis, The Kennedy Assassination, Martin Luther King Jr., Bobby Kennedy, and everything from then on, seems to pretty much be taboo to the Doctor Who writers. Both on tv and at BF. As does almost all of American history. WIth just a few exceptions, Nixon springs to mind. However, I don't think Trump will be Taboo for the writers, I expect a character like him to show up as early as this season, if not on tv, then in some BF stories. There could be some great drama about the Alamo, the underground railroad, the war on organized crime, and tons of other things from America's history, that the writers just don't want to delve into. (possibly because we, Americans, whipped yall pretty badly, not once but twice. It's a joke, it's funny, because it's true) We can make jokes out of what happened 200 years ago or so(war of 1812), but it's hard to find much humor in stuff that people have actually lived thru. Only thing I think should never be touched by who is the holocaust, I'm not sure any good story can come from that. Perhaps time will change things, but not in my lifetime.
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Post by Sir Wearer of Hats on Feb 5, 2017 4:01:23 GMT
Superheroes. Superheroes are taboo for Who. Thus spake Mr. Person. Do you still think that?
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Post by Deleted on Feb 5, 2017 4:32:24 GMT
Castro, the Cuban Missile Crisis, The Kennedy Assassination, Martin Luther King Jr., Bobby Kennedy, and everything from then on, seems to pretty much be taboo to the Doctor Who writers. Both on tv and at BF. As does almost all of American history. WIth just a few exceptions, Nixon springs to mind. However, I don't think Trump will be Taboo for the writers, I expect a character like him to show up as early as this season, if not on tv, then in some BF stories. There could be some great drama about the Alamo, the underground railroad, the war on organized crime, and tons of other things from America's history, that the writers just don't want to delve into. (possibly because we, Americans, whipped yall pretty badly, not once but twice. It's a joke, it's funny, because it's true) We can make jokes out of what happened 200 years ago or so(war of 1812), but it's hard to find much humor in stuff that people have actually lived thru. Only thing I think should never be touched by who is the holocaust, I'm not sure any good story can come from that. Perhaps time will change things, but not in my lifetime. There was a whole MA about Who Killed Kennedy? that covered November 1963, Blood Harvest covered Alphonse Capone and the Prohibition thuggery and Bad Blood featured both George Custer and Tatanka Yotanka. In that last story, Destrii's uncle Jodafra uses Custer and his men to kidnap Lakota children to be sacrificed to an alien entity as part of a pact that will ensure easy navigation through the time vortex in his own vessel. He armed them with advanced weaponry and once he had the children, betrayed them by massacring the lot aside from Custer himself who (quite naturally) fled in terror. I'd still love to hear a story with the Sixth Doctor and Peri set during the Boston Tea Party, but the fact of the matter is that the show was for a very long time British and therefore hadn't any interest in exploring large portions of American history. More Captain Bligh rather than Paul Revere. It was a lack of budget more than anything else, other countries rarely featured either. China itself was only really seen in any depth in Marco Polo and Japan wasn't addressed beyond the Draconians in Frontier in Space. Personally, I'd like to hear more about the African Congo, The Ghosts of Gralstead was a real treat in that regard.
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Post by mrperson on Feb 5, 2017 20:57:21 GMT
Superheroes. Superheroes are taboo for Who. Thus spake Mr. Person. Do you still think that? Yeah. Especially when they're a superhero because the human stomach can apparently harness a magic bean.
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Post by nucleusofswarm on May 12, 2017 23:54:40 GMT
Could yield dramatic fruit, perhaps even a compelling ST, but incest is another thorny one.
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Post by TinDogPodcast on May 13, 2017 7:55:26 GMT
My perspective is, in terms of historical events, anything having occurred 45 years prior is fine, but anything after is kinda pushing it. That's 1972! Toooooo soon.
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Post by Deleted on May 13, 2017 11:13:11 GMT
My perspective is, in terms of historical events, anything having occurred 45 years prior is fine, but anything after is kinda pushing it. That's 1972! Toooooo soon. Wait, that'd mean covering the Manson Family is fine, but Skylab's falling out of orbit is off-limits. I... Hum. Hmm...
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Post by sherlock on May 13, 2017 11:17:36 GMT
There could be some great drama about the Alamo, the underground railroad, the war on organized crime, and tons of other things from America's history, that the writers just don't want to delve into. (possibly because we, Americans, whipped yall pretty badly, not once but twice. It's a joke, it's funny, because it's true) We can make jokes out of what happened 200 years ago or so(war of 1812), but it's hard to find much humor in stuff that people have actually lived thru. Only thing I think should never be touched by who is the holocaust, I'm not sure any good story can come from that. Perhaps time will change things, but not in my lifetime. Tbh I suspect the lack of American history is simply because us Brits don't know much of it. It's not on our education syllabus so just doesn't get taught. I agree about the Holocaust. There are places to write about and depict it and Who is not one of them.
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Post by pawntake on May 13, 2017 11:37:34 GMT
Following the 1996 television movie, Universal retained some rights to produce new Doctor Who stories, but without a broadcaster attached, they allowed those rights to expire. Full production rights therefore reverted to the BBC in 1997. Had things been different,we might well have seen a lot of American history portrayed in Doctor Who?
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Post by Deleted on May 13, 2017 12:29:11 GMT
Following the 1996 television movie, Universal retained some rights to produce new Doctor Who stories, but without a broadcaster attached, they allowed those rights to expire. Full production rights therefore reverted to the BBC in 1997. Had things been different,we might well have seen a lot of American history portrayed in Doctor Who? I'd say that's a very strong possibility. Given that it was a Canadian co-production, I'd have been really surprised if the War of 1812 didn't turn up eventually.
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Post by pawntake on May 13, 2017 12:58:09 GMT
Following the 1996 television movie, Universal retained some rights to produce new Doctor Who stories, but without a broadcaster attached, they allowed those rights to expire. Full production rights therefore reverted to the BBC in 1997. Had things been different,we might well have seen a lot of American history portrayed in Doctor Who? I'd say that's a very strong possibility. Given that it was a Canadian co-production, I'd have been really surprised if the War of 1812 didn't turn up eventually.
In 1814 we took a little trip Along with Colonel Jackson down the mighty Mississippi We took a little bacon and we took a little beans And we caught the bloody British in the town of New Orleans
We fired our guns and the British kept a-comin' There wasn't nigh as many as there was a while ago We fired once more and they began to runnin' On down the Mississippi to the Gulf of Mexico
Lol! (The Doctor caught right in the middle) Just Imagine!! We are all friends now though,are we not?
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Post by Deleted on May 13, 2017 22:43:31 GMT
I'd say that's a very strong possibility. Given that it was a Canadian co-production, I'd have been really surprised if the War of 1812 didn't turn up eventually. Lol! (The Doctor caught right in the middle) Just Imagine!! We are all friends now though,are we not?
Shows what a little time can do. "Hello there! I'm the Doc--" *a bullet goes straight past his head* "That kind of accent can get you killed in these parts." [to himself] "Accent...?" "Where y'from?" "Gallifrey." *the bullets come down like hail* "Get the bleedin' Irishman!"
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