Deleted
Deleted Member
Likes:
|
Post by Deleted on Jul 24, 2017 15:55:14 GMT
Sigh. This is another of those irritating "DB repeatedly makes completely unfounded statements that everyone else disagrees with" threads, isn't it.
|
|
|
Post by escalus5 on Jul 24, 2017 15:59:41 GMT
Multi-Doctor stories should be kept strictly for anniversaries. The Two Doctors should never have happened because it wasn't an anniversary. I couldn't even begin to agree with you there. I am SO glad that The Two Doctors happened, anniversary or not. Yeah, The Two Doctors is great. Better than most of Capaldi's stories.
|
|
|
Post by sherlock on Jul 24, 2017 16:07:10 GMT
I don't see why multi-Doctor stories are limited to anniversaries. Big Finish did The Sirens of Time and The Four Doctors years away from anniversaries. We've just had one trailer to base this on and I highly doubt Moffat will allow Capaldi to be overshadowed in his last story. It lessens the impact if you get a Multi-Doctor story before an anniversary (more so on TV). True. But this is only the third story where the first Doctor has a direct role in proceedings, so I think this is unique enough to stand out. It's only the sixth multi-Doctor story on TV anyway (not counting the abomination that is Dimensions in Time) so it's not like we're saturated with them.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Likes:
|
Post by Deleted on Jul 24, 2017 17:39:22 GMT
I couldn't even begin to agree with you there. I am SO glad that The Two Doctors happened, anniversary or not. Yeah, The Two Doctors is great. Better than most of Capaldi's stories. Not for me... And that applies to both sentences!
|
|
|
Post by Audio Watchdog on Jul 24, 2017 19:12:09 GMT
Multi-Doctor stories should be kept strictly for anniversaries. The Two Doctors should never have happened because it wasn't an anniversary. Says who? You? Please. A good story is a good story is a good story. We will find out on Christmas Day if it is indeed a good story.
|
|
|
Post by Audio Watchdog on Jul 24, 2017 19:14:12 GMT
Sigh. This is another of those irritating "DB repeatedly makes completely unfounded statements that everyone else disagrees with" threads, isn't it. Well, there is usually a 50/50 chance, so odds are even that you may well be right.
|
|
|
Post by dalekbuster523finish on Jul 24, 2017 19:23:36 GMT
Multi-Doctor stories should be kept strictly for anniversaries. The Two Doctors should never have happened because it wasn't an anniversary. Says who? You? Please. A good story is a good story is a good story. We will find out on Christmas Day if it is indeed a good story. It looks like a good episode, but it doesn't look like a swansong for 12.
|
|
|
Post by mrperson on Jul 24, 2017 19:24:02 GMT
I really don't see why to impose an artificial restriction on multi-Doctor stories, such as during an anniversary only. As long as it isn't overused in general, all that I need to see is a good story.
(I also don't need a "swan song" in the sense of playing up the regeneration for its own sake. Just tell a good story, and make sure he dies trying to save the day.)
|
|
|
Post by Audio Watchdog on Jul 24, 2017 19:31:34 GMT
Says who? You? Please. A good story is a good story is a good story. We will find out on Christmas Day if it is indeed a good story. It looks like a good trailer, but it doesn't look like a swansong for 12. We won't know that until Christmas and as noted, has there ever been a trailer that devotes all 60 seconds to The Doctor? Or the other way of looking at, maybe, just maybe, it is the swansong for 12 that both Moffat & Capaldi wanted.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Likes:
|
Post by Deleted on Jul 25, 2017 6:10:02 GMT
Says who? You? Please. A good story is a good story is a good story. We will find out on Christmas Day if it is indeed a good story. It looks like a good episode, but it doesn't look like a swansong for 12. Well, this is exactly what the swansong for 12 looks like. Given his relationship with Moffat I'm sure they wouldn't do it this way unless Capaldi was happy with it.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Likes:
|
Post by Deleted on Jul 25, 2017 7:27:03 GMT
It looks like a good episode, but it doesn't look like a swansong for 12. Well, this is exactly what the swansong for 12 looks like. Given his relationship with Moffat I'm sure they wouldn't do it this way unless Capaldi was happy with it. And I think this is a rather sneaky way of getting some kind of on-screen regeneration for the First Doctor in the archive. They have Bradley and I'm happy they're using him while they can, but I really hope they get that balance right.
|
|
|
Post by dalekbuster523finish on Jul 25, 2017 9:17:28 GMT
It looks like a good episode, but it doesn't look like a swansong for 12. Well, this is exactly what the swansong for 12 looks like. Given his relationship with Moffat I'm sure they wouldn't do it this way unless Capaldi was happy with it. He may be happy with it...but what about those of us among the audience who want a swansong for 12 that pays tribute to the Doctor we're about to say goodbye to? The perfect 12th Doctor swansong would have been 12 and Clara v a newly regenerated Missy (Michelle Gomez, not a new Missy).
|
|
|
Post by sherlock on Jul 25, 2017 9:30:33 GMT
Well, this is exactly what the swansong for 12 looks like. Given his relationship with Moffat I'm sure they wouldn't do it this way unless Capaldi was happy with it. He may be happy with it...but what about those of us among the audience who want a swansong for 12 that pays tribute to the Doctor we're about to say goodbye to? The perfect 12th Doctor swansong would have been 12 and Clara v a newly regenerated Missy (Michelle Gomez, not a new Missy). No more Clara, please. A cameo's fine but nothing more. Her story is done, there is nothing to gain from the character returning yet again. Missy's story is also finished in The Doctor Falls, so what's there to gain from bringing them back from a character perspective? These episode might well pay tribute to Capaldi's era, bringing back old characters is not the only way. Regardless we can't judge the episode's success as a swansong for Capaldi 5 months before it airs!
|
|
|
Post by dalekbuster523finish on Jul 25, 2017 9:32:52 GMT
He may be happy with it...but what about those of us among the audience who want a swansong for 12 that pays tribute to the Doctor we're about to say goodbye to? The perfect 12th Doctor swansong would have been 12 and Clara v a newly regenerated Missy (Michelle Gomez, not a new Missy). No more Clara, please. A cameo's fine but nothing more. Her story is done, there is nothing to gain from the character returning yet again. Missy's story is also finished in The Doctor Falls, so what's there to gain from bringing them back from a character perspective? Those two characters are the most essential to 12's era, therefore they should be there for his swansong.
|
|
|
Post by sherlock on Jul 25, 2017 9:41:06 GMT
No more Clara, please. A cameo's fine but nothing more. Her story is done, there is nothing to gain from the character returning yet again. Missy's story is also finished in The Doctor Falls, so what's there to gain from bringing them back from a character perspective? Those two characters are the most essential to 12's era, therefore they should be there for his swansong. Returning characters are not necessary for a good swansong. The Caves of Androzani features only the Doctor and Peri as recurring characters (not counting the floating head cameos), likewise returning characters didn't feature in The Parting of the Ways, or Logopolis, or The War Games or The Time of the Doctor. Returning characters are not essential though they can be beneficial to the story as in Planet of the Spiders with the entire UNIT family (more or less) and The End of Time with Wilf. The two characters you've cited have both had their stories finished elsewhere, and I can't see the benefit of bringing them back again.
|
|
|
Post by dalekbuster523finish on Jul 25, 2017 9:47:06 GMT
Those two characters are the most essential to 12's era, therefore they should be there for his swansong. Returning characters are not necessary for a good swansong. The Caves of Androzani features only the Doctor and Peri as recurring characters (not counting the floating head cameos), likewise returning characters didn't feature in The Parting of the Ways, or Logopolis, or The War Games or The Time of the Doctor. Returning characters are not essential though they can be beneficial to the story as in Planet of the Spiders with the entire UNIT family (more or less) and The End of Time with Wilf. The two characters you've cited have both had their stories finished elsewhere, and I can't see the benefit of bringing them back again. The Caves of Androzani was before TV became more about story arcs and concluding narratives. Bad Wolf/Parting of the Ways featured all the main players during 9's brief era. The Time of the Doctor concluded many of 11's plot threads and Amy appeared in a cameo, so it felt like an end to his era.
|
|
|
Post by sherlock on Jul 25, 2017 10:27:52 GMT
Returning characters are not necessary for a good swansong. The Caves of Androzani features only the Doctor and Peri as recurring characters (not counting the floating head cameos), likewise returning characters didn't feature in The Parting of the Ways, or Logopolis, or The War Games or The Time of the Doctor. Returning characters are not essential though they can be beneficial to the story as in Planet of the Spiders with the entire UNIT family (more or less) and The End of Time with Wilf. The two characters you've cited have both had their stories finished elsewhere, and I can't see the benefit of bringing them back again. The Caves of Androzani was before TV became more about story arcs and concluding narratives. Bad Wolf/Parting of the Ways featured all the main players during 9's brief era. The Time of the Doctor concluded many of 11's plot threads and Amy appeared in a cameo, so it felt like an end to his era. That still doesn't prove returning characters are somehow essential to make Christmas a good swansong for Capaldi's Doctor. I still can't see the benefit of bringing back Clara (whose relationship with the Doctor has been done to death) and Missy (whose story has nowhere else to go).
|
|
|
Post by dalekbuster523finish on Jul 25, 2017 10:31:43 GMT
The Caves of Androzani was before TV became more about story arcs and concluding narratives. Bad Wolf/Parting of the Ways featured all the main players during 9's brief era. The Time of the Doctor concluded many of 11's plot threads and Amy appeared in a cameo, so it felt like an end to his era. That still doesn't prove returning characters are somehow essential to make Christmas a good swansong for Capaldi's Doctor. I still can't see the benefit of bringing back Clara (whose relationship with the Doctor has been done to death) and Missy (whose story has nowhere else to go). The benefit is that they are important to 12's era and a lot of his era has been about Clara and Missy. It would have been a good conclusion to the 12th Doctor era to round it off where its central conflict pretty much begun: 12 and Clara v Missy.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Likes:
|
Post by Deleted on Jul 25, 2017 10:38:11 GMT
No more Clara, please. A cameo's fine but nothing more. Her story is done, there is nothing to gain from the character returning yet again. Missy's story is also finished in The Doctor Falls, so what's there to gain from bringing them back from a character perspective? Those two characters are the most essential to 12's era, therefore they should be there for his swansong. Considering you highly rated The Doctor Falls... if that was Capaldi's last one would you be fine? After all, that one didn't have Clara.
|
|
|
Post by dalekbuster523finish on Jul 25, 2017 10:39:44 GMT
Those two characters are the most essential to 12's era, therefore they should be there for his swansong. Considering you highly rated The Doctor Falls... if that was Capaldi's last one would you be fine? After all, that one didn't have Clara. That would have been a good end to me, although if it was the very last Peter Capaldi episode I would have been disappointed in the lack of Clara given how important she has been to his era.
|
|