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Post by barnabaslives on Jan 10, 2020 8:12:17 GMT
Another interesting thing ... A quick scroll down the Vortex page on the BF website shows that the MR has not been the main cover picture and headline since July 2015. Up to that point the MR was the main cover item for 2 or 3 issues a year. Again, it suggests BF's main interests lie elsewhere nowadays. Maybe to you it does. Goes to show that maybe it's easy to get the wrong impression I guess. You could take it to mean they're not even interested in promoting the MR anymore, or you could take it to mean they're more interested in promoting some of the explosion of endeavors that came with the New Series licenses and maybe even trust the MR to carry itself without that level of promotion. I also think if you look at who's writing that could be easy to take the wrong way too, like there's a brain drain toward the box sets. Indeed, not to denigrate anyone's talents but some of us have simply come to hold names like Dorney and Adams in very high esteem - just say their names and timelord007 and I will be happy to part with our "Lizzie Winsors", no questions asked, lol. FWIW, I don't think the MR has suffered from not having Dorney or Adams write everything, and I think the diversity of very talented authors that have been utilized for the MR has paid off well. If anything diminished my enjoyment of the MR at all the past several years, I think it's been what's been happening with companions that I think are experiments that didn't go quite as well as they could - playing Kamelion or Mags a bit close to the TV cuff, or having companions that have "doomed from the start" written all over them. One hardly gets time to like them and pfft - but experimentation seems to have always been part of the MR and has led to much memorable and cherished material. Maybe the other thing I wasn't completely thrilled with was the two-story releases. There's an experiment that I think was very successful, but 2 hour full cast stories are probably the biggest attraction to the MR for me - nice meaty adventures to sink your teeth into. It probably isn't even in my constitution to be that thrilled about 1 hour MR stories, lol. I could take all this to mean that they don't care anymore about what happens to the MR, but I think it's probably just a case of can't please all of the people all of the time. I very much agree with the idea that splitting up the MR duties among talented teams that might be able to be more devoted to things indeed reflects considerable importance still being placed on the range. Dunno, maybe on occasion the MR starts to seem a little lackluster just for starting to take it for granted, which might be easy to do sometimes for how spoiled rotten we are?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 10, 2020 8:19:04 GMT
Hmm. I think the wording "best" writers is wrong. That is of very subjective opinion. There are plenty of examples of things everybody raves about as "the best" that I do not like, and many things I love that other people dislike. I think you might mean "higher profile" or "more experienced". But I still think we got some really great releases these past 2 years. Writing for a show that has had such a long life cannot be easy and will be quite honest the fact that these writers are still coming up with ideas fascinates me. I cannot write-good or bad so I have every respect for each and everyone of them. I have heard one REALLY BAD story now EXILE and thank goodness that wasn’t main range. I don’t know how the Main Range will change in format but I like the box set Idea Tom Baker range has benefitted I think from it and with each new other release where the CDs are all in one set am used to now yes I used to love individual covers but hey if it keeps the cost down for me the buyer am fine with it now. BF have experimented and have been nurturing new writing talent and with each release hopefully those writers will grow to new strengths and bounce ideas around with old hands and reinvigorate them too.
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Post by Audio Watchdog on Jan 10, 2020 19:14:49 GMT
Hmm. I think the wording "best" writers is wrong. That is of very subjective opinion. There are plenty of examples of things everybody raves about as "the best" that I do not like, and many things I love that other people dislike. I think you might mean "higher profile" or "more experienced". But I still think we got some really great releases these past 2 years. Of course it is subjective. While I generally enjoy what Dorney & Fitton write, for my money the best BF writer at the moment is James Goss. Just my opinion and I would not be arrogant enough to push that view on to others or to believe mine is the only correct opinion. I don't know what Big Finish is going to do with the Main Range after March of 2021 but I do think this influx of new writers only makes the range and the company stronger. Time will tell.
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Post by constonks on Jan 10, 2020 19:36:05 GMT
I keep checking this thread thinking that something has been announced for March 2020...
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Post by themeddlingmonk on Jan 10, 2020 21:19:45 GMT
I keep checking this thread thinking that something has been announced for March 2020... Glad it isn’t just me.
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Post by Audio Watchdog on Jan 10, 2020 21:55:34 GMT
I keep checking this thread thinking that something has been announced for March 2020... Have you not heard? The Main Range is no longer a Big Finish priority, so consider yourself lucky if you receive details an hour before it is released.
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Post by tuigirl on Jan 10, 2020 22:51:09 GMT
Hmm. I think the wording "best" writers is wrong. That is of very subjective opinion. There are plenty of examples of things everybody raves about as "the best" that I do not like, and many things I love that other people dislike. I think you might mean "higher profile" or "more experienced". But I still think we got some really great releases these past 2 years. Writing for a show that has had such a long life cannot be easy and will be quite honest the fact that these writers are still coming up with ideas fascinates me. I cannot write-good or bad so I have every respect for each and everyone of them. I have heard one REALLY BAD story now EXILE and thank goodness that wasn’t main range. I don’t know how the Main Range will change in format but I like the box set Idea Tom Baker range has benefitted I think from it and with each new other release where the CDs are all in one set am used to now yes I used to love individual covers but hey if it keeps the cost down for me the buyer am fine with it now. BF have experimented and have been nurturing new writing talent and with each release hopefully those writers will grow to new strengths and bounce ideas around with old hands and reinvigorate them too. Oh god yes. Nothing is as bad as Exile.
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dorney
Big Finish Creative Team
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Post by dorney on Jan 11, 2020 12:50:09 GMT
Hmm. I think the wording "best" writers is wrong. That is of very subjective opinion. There are plenty of examples of things everybody raves about as "the best" that I do not like, and many things I love that other people dislike. I think you might mean "higher profile" or "more experienced". But I still think we got some really great releases these past 2 years. Of course it is subjective. While I generally enjoy what Dorney & Fitton write, for my money the best BF writer at the moment is James Goss. Just my opinion and I would not be arrogant enough to push that view on to others or to believe mine is the only correct opinion. I don't know what Big Finish is going to do with the Main Range after March of 2021 but I do think this influx of new writers only makes the range and the company stronger. Time will tell.
One other thing to mention - where writers end up is really just a question of individual schedules and where people tend to think those writers would be deployed best at any given time - not the levels of belief in that particular range. I’ve not written masses of the MR for about eight years, I’d say, but also not much in the way of Torchwood or Jago and Litefoot. I’ve barely written Colin, but lots of the other Doctors. I’m sure you’d find anomalies in other writer’s lists as well (Matt’s literally only written for Tom once, for example, and you’d struggle to suggest that range wasn’t thought well of).
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Post by number13 on Jan 11, 2020 13:47:28 GMT
Looking back at last year's MR in light of the above discussion, I can't see any pattern in my opinions of the stories and the newness (or otherwise) to the MR of their writers. Having heard 11/13 so far, my least favourite of the year was written by one of BF's most experienced writers while I greatly enjoyed a story by one of the newest writers. (And no doubt some other listeners will have thought exactly the opposite from me, and me from them.)
I love getting a story by a 'name' who I'm confident will deliver again, but I also enjoy 'meeting' a new writer, maybe new to BF or at least new to a particular range.
EDIT: Edited for length. I do 'go on a bit' sometimes.
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Post by axelotl38 on Jan 11, 2020 18:01:20 GMT
So at some point we have to consider that, not to be cliche and say Ocams Razor and declare the argument over, but perhaps it is simply that BF are trying to do something different to marketing. The analysis of how much different writers write what is kinda silly (by the same logic, as Stranded isn't solely a Dorney/Fitton affair, it's clearly a sign of lack of faith in the Eighth Doctor adventures?), and there's nothing to indicate sales are any lower for the Main Range than they ever are. And hey, we still dunno covers for the Fourth Doctor Adventures Series 9B. There's no trailer for the Twelfth Doctor Chronicles which is out next month. So perhaps, very simply, it's not a sign of lack of faith, and is just a sign of "Big Finish, as a noticeable trend amongst multiple ranges, are not revealing stuff far in advance."
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lidar2
Castellan
You know, now that you mention it, I actually do rather like Attack of the Cybermen ...
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Post by lidar2 on Jan 12, 2020 1:27:03 GMT
Well, my thoughts on the MR seem to have produced quite a reaction. Now I know how paulmorris777 must have felt!
Seriously though, I am surprised by how what I thought were a few fairly innocuous observations seem to have touched a nerve. A lot of very valid points have been made in response and it has been a worthwhile discussion, for which I thank everyone, even if one member did seem to be getting a bit hot under the collar about it all. My view is clearly not the majority view, but I stand by it nonetheless. However since I have said what I wanted to say on the subject, there's no point going round in circles repeating myself.
I was actually surprised by the points people did and did not pick up on. My description of 3 particular writers as BF's best or top writers and my view that their reduced involvement in the MR had meant the MR was not quite as good seems to have gone down like the proverbial lead balloon. In the same way as saying Pele was the greatest footballer ever* would not be seen as denigrating other players such as David Beckham or Bobby Charlton, so my saying these 3 are BF's top writers is not intended to denigrate others, just to acknowledge exceptional talent. And I did acknowledge in my earlier post that it was a subjective view.
I kind of regret mentioning it, not because I have changed my view, but because it took the focus away from what I thought was the more interesting point for discussion, namely what form the revamp/restructuring/rebranding/whatever that Nick talked about a couple of podcasts ago will take. The way he talked about there not really being any rationale for the way 5/6/7 are lumped together in one range while other Docs have their own range made me think we would see the MR rebranded as 5DAs, 6DAs and 7DAs and the numbering restarted at 1.1, but over the course of the year there would still be one release per month, which would tie in with what we know has already happened behind the scenes with the 3 different production teams. And in that context I absolutely accept Scott Handcock's point that this behind the scenes development can be taken as evidence of commitment to the MR, but surely the corollary of that is that prior to this change there had been a degree of drift that having 3 separate production teams was intended to address, but let's not go there.
Contrary to the impression I may have given, I am still enjoying the MR, in fact more so than some other forum members, and anyone who looks at my and others' posts in the relevant release threads will see that this is so. And despite all I said about the lack of announcements, I still intend to take out another 12 month sub when my current one expires after the next release. It would be nice to know a bit more about what I am going to get before I open my wallet, but I'll still be opening it nonetheless.
* I would of course never say such a foolish thing. George Best was in fact the greatest footballer ever.
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ljwilson
Chancellery Guard
It's tangerine....not orange
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Post by ljwilson on Jan 12, 2020 10:06:29 GMT
Well, my thoughts on the MR seem to have produced quite a reaction. Now I know how paulmorris777 must have felt! Seriously though, I am surprised by how what I thought were a few fairly innocuous observations seem to have touched a nerve. A lot of very valid points have been made in response and it has been a worthwhile discussion, for which I thank everyone, even if one member did seem to be getting a bit hot under the collar about it all. My view is clearly not the majority view, but I stand by it nonetheless. However since I have said what I wanted to say on the subject, there's no point going round in circles repeating myself. I was actually surprised by the points people did and did not pick up on. My description of 3 particular writers as BF's best or top writers and my view that their reduced involvement in the MR had meant the MR was not quite as good seems to have gone down like the proverbial lead balloon. In the same way as saying Pele was the greatest footballer ever* would not be seen as denigrating other players such as David Beckham or Bobby Charlton, so my saying these 3 are BF's top writers is not intended to denigrate others, just to acknowledge exceptional talent. And I did acknowledge in my earlier post that it was a subjective view. I kind of regret mentioning it, not because I have changed my view, but because it took the focus away from what I thought was the more interesting point for discussion, namely what form the revamp/restructuring/rebranding/whatever that Nick talked about a couple of podcasts ago will take. The way he talked about there not really being any rationale for the way 5/6/7 are lumped together in one range while other Docs have their own range made me think we would see the MR rebranded as 5DAs, 6DAs and 7DAs and the numbering restarted at 1.1, but over the course of the year there would still be one release per month, which would tie in with what we know has already happened behind the scenes with the 3 different production teams. And in that context I absolutely accept Scott Handcock's point that this behind the scenes development can be taken as evidence of commitment to the MR, but surely the corollary of that is that prior to this change there had been a degree of drift that having 3 separate production teams was intended to address, but let's not go there. Contrary to the impression I may have given, I am still enjoying the MR, in fact more so than some other forum members, and anyone who looks at my and others' posts in the relevant release threads will see that this is so. And despite all I said about the lack of announcements, I still intend to take out another 12 month sub when my current one expires after the next release. It would be nice to know a bit more about what I am going to get before I open my wallet, but I'll still be opening it nonetheless. * I would of course never say such a foolish thing. George Best was in fact the greatest footballer ever. It was a good debate, and you are right to stick to your guns. It will be a shame if we don't get as far as (for instance) MR 369 The Blood of the Zranbi, I quite like the ridiculous amount of stories we have and want it to continue.
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mbt66
Chancellery Guard
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Post by mbt66 on Jan 12, 2020 10:43:20 GMT
Because of all the exciting boxsets that kept coming out I let my subscription expire after 204.
The monthly range hasn’t been my main range for awhile. Thanks to various sales I have acquired The Two Masters trilogy and a lot of the Sixth Doctor’s adventures, but Dark Universe is the first monthly release I have pre-ordered since 2014.
So the points I want to make are a, including in the monthly range what I consider an “event release” Big Finish are upping the monthly ranges profile. (So too does the following release, but for a completely different reason) b, if they had introduced trilogy subscriptions rather than 6 or 12 month versions they would have gotten more money from me!
I hope the monthly range continues as a monthly download and a quarterly CD boxset.
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Post by tuigirl on Jan 12, 2020 10:51:02 GMT
Because of all the exciting boxsets that kept coming out I let my subscription expire after 204. The monthly range hasn’t been my main range for awhile. Thanks to various sales I have acquired The Two Masters trilogy and a lot of the Sixth Doctor’s adventures, but Dark Universe is the first monthly release I have pre-ordered since 2014. So the points I want to make are a, including in the monthly range what I consider an “event release” Big Finish are upping the monthly ranges profile. (So too does the following release, but for a completely different reason) b, if they had introduced trilogy subscriptions rather than 6 or 12 month versions they would have gotten more money from me! I hope the monthly range continues as a monthly download and a quarterly CD boxset. I actually think they are going the „event“ route with the main range this year. This is why they wait with announcements since they want maximum attention and impact and therefore trigger impulse buy. I think we are in for a few treats this year.
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mbt66
Chancellery Guard
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Post by mbt66 on Jan 12, 2020 11:04:28 GMT
Because of all the exciting boxsets that kept coming out I let my subscription expire after 204. The monthly range hasn’t been my main range for awhile. Thanks to various sales I have acquired The Two Masters trilogy and a lot of the Sixth Doctor’s adventures, but Dark Universe is the first monthly release I have pre-ordered since 2014. So the points I want to make are a, including in the monthly range what I consider an “event release” Big Finish are upping the monthly ranges profile. (So too does the following release, but for a completely different reason) b, if they had introduced trilogy subscriptions rather than 6 or 12 month versions they would have gotten more money from me! I hope the monthly range continues as a monthly download and a quarterly CD boxset. I actually think they are going the „event“ route with the main range this year. This is why they wait with announcements since they want maximum attention and impact and therefore trigger impulse buy. I think we are in for a few treats this year. The rumour that Winston Churchill is in the next, currently unannounced, release would back that supposition up! It has been awhile since they had a multi-Doctor linked trilogy, so I have my fingers crossed for one of them....but with no trilogy subscription perhaps I should uncross those theoretical fingers of mine!
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Post by fitzoliverj on Jan 12, 2020 11:44:36 GMT
I've thought for years that there should be a modicum of flexibility in the mainthly rangeventures, with different Doctors coming in for a trilogy or coming out and having a box set instead, where storytelling warrants a different length or format of narrative. Nick Briggs's comments in the new podcast about different ranges competing against each other for the same market suggests to me (if not to anybody at BF) that we might all be better off if other Doctors occasionally cropped up in the two-CD trilogy format.
Plus, I really want Michael Jayston to get a trilogy credited as the Doctor.
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Post by tuigirl on Jan 12, 2020 11:49:22 GMT
I actually think they are going the „event“ route with the main range this year. This is why they wait with announcements since they want maximum attention and impact and therefore trigger impulse buy. I think we are in for a few treats this year. The rumour that Winston Churchill is in the next, currently unannounced, release would back that supposition up! It has been awhile since they had a multi-Doctor linked trilogy, so I have my fingers crossed for one of them....but with no trilogy subscription perhaps I should uncross those theoretical fingers of mine! Then I hope you can control your impulses.
I admit I re-newed my subscription for the coming year just because I am pretty convinced of my theory. Now I can just sit back, await the announcements and be save in the knowledge that "I knew it".
They somehow have to test the waters for whatever they are thinking of doing with the range in the future. And now is the time to do it.
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Post by tuigirl on Jan 12, 2020 11:51:26 GMT
I've thought for years that there should be a modicum of flexibility in the mainthly rangeventures, with different Doctors coming in for a trilogy or coming out and having a box set instead, where storytelling warrants a different length or format of narrative. Nick Briggs's comments in the new podcast about different ranges competing against each other for the same market suggests to me (if not to anybody at BF) that we might all be better off if other Doctors occasionally cropped up in the two-CD trilogy format. Plus, I really want Michael Jayston to get a trilogy credited as the Doctor.Oh PLEASE yes. However, considering what Nick said about them all having cool ideas but not the budget to do them all... I think it is highly unlikely to happen. I would be more inclined to bet on a return of Frobisher.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 12, 2020 13:21:40 GMT
I like the Monthly Range because unlike many of the box-sets, each release or trilogy, doesn't always strive to be an 'event.' I would always prefer an engaging story rather than 'what if so-and-so met so-and-so', or for everything to be part of some ongoing arc. This is one of the reasons I haven't really been inclined to keep up with the adventures of The Eighth Doctor, and welcome the developments of Stranded. Perhaps the idea of a monthly download, followed by a limited CD edition of each trilogy would be the way to go. That way, everyone would be happy. But I wouldn't like to see the monthly range stop being a selection of (mainly) powerful standalone stories that are entertaining for themselves rather than being part of some ongoing umbrella theme. Quieter stories have their place too, in my view
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lidar2
Castellan
You know, now that you mention it, I actually do rather like Attack of the Cybermen ...
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Post by lidar2 on Jan 12, 2020 14:05:11 GMT
Because of all the exciting boxsets that kept coming out I let my subscription expire after 204. The monthly range hasn’t been my main range for awhile. Thanks to various sales I have acquired The Two Masters trilogy and a lot of the Sixth Doctor’s adventures, but Dark Universe is the first monthly release I have pre-ordered since 2014. So the points I want to make are a, including in the monthly range what I consider an “event release” Big Finish are upping the monthly ranges profile. (So too does the following release, but for a completely different reason) b, if they had introduced trilogy subscriptions rather than 6 or 12 month versions they would have gotten more money from me! I hope the monthly range continues as a monthly download and a quarterly CD boxset. I actually think they are going the „event“ route with the main range this year. This is why they wait with announcements since they want maximum attention and impact and therefore trigger impulse buy. I think we are in for a few treats this year. 13 events per year could be hard to sustain.
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