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Post by Deleted on Jun 16, 2024 14:51:54 GMT
Look at the number of 4 and 5 votes here, which also reflects most of the feedback on my socials. People can say what they like subjectively but RTD KNOWS how to do popular big finales that get people excited. It’ll be interesting to see if he sticks the landing because I feel that’s where he’s weaker as a writer - he’s great at the hype but bad at the resolutions. Which, subjectively, is fine and I agree for some (End Of Time especially) but AI scores where it's not fanboys and girls marking it prove his finales are almost always the public favourites and have usually had the highest ratings though clearly that last point will be moot now it's about the +28s for the BBC and the subs and views for Disney.
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Post by timleschild on Jun 16, 2024 15:32:27 GMT
It’ll be interesting to see if he sticks the landing because I feel that’s where he’s weaker as a writer - he’s great at the hype but bad at the resolutions. Which, subjectively, is fine and I agree for some (End Of Time especially) but AI scores where it's not fanboys and girls marking it prove his finales are almost always the public favourites and have usually had the highest ratings though clearly that last point will be moot now it's about the +28s for the BBC and the subs and views for Disney. ?
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Post by timleschild on Jun 16, 2024 15:33:17 GMT
the hunt for Ruby's bio-mum led nowhere oh SHE is coming...
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Kestrel
Chancellery Guard
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Post by Kestrel on Jun 16, 2024 16:25:30 GMT
And I figured the Susan thing was never going to be THE Susan, since RTD IMO would sell that like hotcakes with "leaked" info on Carole Ann Ford's glorious return etc. That's not something you throw away. One thing to consider w/r/t Susan is that there's really only a small, ever-diminishing window of time where Carol Ann Ford could conceivably reprise the role. Perhaps it's impolite, or impolitic, to mention it... but that's life. And something to be aware of as RTD uses the tease of Susan returning as a red herring -- the opportunity to actually do that for real won't be around forever. I'm not sure how active Carol Ann Ford is these days, but if it's possible it might be interesting/worthwhile for RTD to bring her in for a day or three to shoot a short regeneration story, akin to Night of the Doctor, so they could pass the character's torch to whomever else if and when they're finally willing to do something with her. Which, subjectively, is fine and I agree for some (End Of Time especially) but AI scores where it's not fanboys and girls marking it prove his finales are almost always the public favourites and have usually had the highest ratings though clearly that last point will be moot now it's about the +28s for the BBC and the subs and views for Disney. What even is an "AI score?" And are you implying that somehow the ratings would be more accurate if the scores given by fans of the show were discounted? Just how, exactly, does that make any sense? Just thinking about it logically, you'd expect people who aren't fans of the show to rate the finales lower, simply because they don't like the show.
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Post by fitzoliverj on Jun 16, 2024 16:44:06 GMT
This divergent Doctor hasn't. Yet, he said. Implying timey-wimey shenannigans with canon and maybe looping back to become a pre-1st? The original line of Doctors, however... But who knows how Gallifreyan family dynamics work? Maybe fostering or adopting is standard practice? This is a divergent Doctor? Where is that stated? I assume this is a reference to his being a bigeneration.
Meanwhile, over on Twitter Laurence Miles has described how a big twist in the latest episode was nothing more than a throwaway joke in a novel he pitched many years ago
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Post by Deleted on Jun 16, 2024 16:49:16 GMT
Which, subjectively, is fine and I agree for some (End Of Time especially) but AI scores where it's not fanboys and girls marking it prove his finales are almost always the public favourites and have usually had the highest ratings though clearly that last point will be moot now it's about the +28s for the BBC and the subs and views for Disney. What even is an "AI score?" And are you implying that somehow the ratings would be more accurate if the scores given by fans of the show were discounted? Just how, exactly, does that make any sense? Just thinking about it logically, you'd expect people who aren't fans of the show to rate the finales lower, simply because they don't like the show.It makes perfect sense - if you bothered to google what an AI score is rather than post a quite narky response first. I'm quite sure almost everyone here knows of them, they're even listed next to every Who story on wiki next to the ratings. It asks the PUBLIC to score what they've watched from 1-10. That's the metric the BBC and other broadcasters use to know what the general public think - not just fans who would watch anything Who. "Fanboys"/girls and "viewers" are not the same thing. Clearly. The AI establishes what is popular with the people who make the show a hit - the casuals. On the right next to every season and story you'll see what the public thought. The "not we". en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Doctor_Who_episodes_(2005%E2%80%93present)en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Appreciation_Index#:~:text=The%20main%20Pulse%20measure%2C%20the,score%20and%201%20the%20lowest.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 16, 2024 16:54:52 GMT
This is a divergent Doctor? Where is that stated? I assume this is a reference to his being a bigeneration.
Meanwhile, over on Twitter Laurence Miles has described how a big twist in the latest episode was nothing more than a throwaway joke in a novel he pitched many years ago
I...don't get why it being a bi-generation makes it divergent. I know it wasn't your post and you're guessing too but - we know Ncuti comes after Tennant, hence the rehab thing. He rehabs, gets better and at some point becomes Ncuti (or, hey, it's Who, someone else first?) but still the same lineage, surely. As for Miles, he's pretty much on Ian Levine level for "people I don't care to hear what they have to say" - he managed to be "cancelled" before that was a thing, he was such a ****.
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Kestrel
Chancellery Guard
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Post by Kestrel on Jun 16, 2024 17:00:15 GMT
I'm sorry if you felt I was being "snarky" with my post, @peterp , but I was genuinely confused. And no, simply googling "AI score" would not have clarified what you'd said at all -- I suggest you google that yourself, and see what pops up.
All you really had to say was that AI = Audience Appreciation Index. Using the term "AI" by itself is, I think, needlessly confusing if you're not talking about, you know, AI.
EDIT: And I should also point out that the Audience Appreciation Index does not measure the opinions of non-fans, it measures the opinions of the audience as a whole, including fans. And looking back on the various other seasons of New Who pretty much all of the first and last episodes of each season have the highest AAI scores -- and those are seldom all that much higher than the other episodes. I don't think the difference is enough to say it's meaningful one way or another.
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Post by fitzoliverj on Jun 16, 2024 17:00:22 GMT
As for Miles, he's pretty much on Ian Levine level for "people I don't care to hear what they have to say" - he managed to be "cancelled" before that was a thing, he was such a ****. Oh, well for everybody else, at least, it's quite amusing. Whether it's a coincidence is quite another matter, although let's not forget that Kate Stewart is in this episode.
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Post by number13 on Jun 16, 2024 22:07:17 GMT
Well that certainly had a twist at the end. I had seen some of the fan theories of Sutekh but didn’t buy them cos sand and “Sue-Tech” seems too flimsy. I guess not! Nice to hear Gabriel Woolf is still the voice of all things utterly evil. Its a bit of a change to Sutekh to promote him from one of a number of Osirans believed to be a god by ancient Egyptians to an actual god, but then maybe Harriet is just blowing his trumpet a little. Certainly more dramatic to proclaim yourself “mother and father and other to them all” than “some Egyptians thought I was god of death and then I got stuck in a chair”. The rest of the episode is really just hurtling towards that twist, but it’s nice to see the Doctor bulldozing his way through an arc rather than waiting for it to come to him (even if in this case, it turns out that was exactly the trap). Susan is well used as a red-herring to drive him to spring that trap (“did you think I was family?” Ouch). So not much memorable in its own right, though Kate being angry yet another soldier got fed to the UNIT meat grinder in service of the Doctor is a nice moment. All in all, a lot for Empire of Death to wrap up. He is not a dog - a god. ![;)](//storage.proboards.com/6343532/images/ZBDvOFPmQgNwxFXLpuoD.gif)
(Or a kangaroo either. Or (since it's apparently the month for them) a killer wombat.)
Although he is dead at least twice that we know of and stuck in a time-loop, and yet still able to turn up for a finale, so he clearly has something special going for him. ![:)](//storage.proboards.com/6343532/images/mW7FMmAyG_vqxkNOJyyh.gif)
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Post by Deleted on Jun 17, 2024 3:59:59 GMT
As for Miles, he's pretty much on Ian Levine level for "people I don't care to hear what they have to say" - he managed to be "cancelled" before that was a thing, he was such a ****. Oh, well for everybody else, at least, it's quite amusing. Whether it's a coincidence is quite another matter, although let's not forget that Kate Stewart is in this episode. He's posted things Gareth Roberts would be ashamed of, and a few Lawrence Fox would think twice about. So yeah, not fussed if he's amusing tbh.
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Post by theillusiveman on Jun 17, 2024 8:23:50 GMT
Oh, well for everybody else, at least, it's quite amusing. Whether it's a coincidence is quite another matter, although let's not forget that Kate Stewart is in this episode. He's posted things Gareth Roberts would be ashamed of, and a few Lawrence Fox would think twice about. So yeah, not fussed if he's amusing tbh. Really I just thought that he didn’t get on with a lot of the “Fitz Roy tavern” writers and that the only controversial thing I heard was him saying back in the day that mark Gattis wrote the unquiet dead as an anti refugee story
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Post by sherlock on Jun 18, 2024 10:14:08 GMT
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Post by number13 on Jun 18, 2024 10:49:25 GMT
Let's hope lots of younger fans take the chance to discover one of the greatest 'Doctor Who' stories ever made. Robert Holmes brought the gift of Gothic excellence to all humanity!
Great production, what a cast - and what a Doctor, at the very top of his game.
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Post by timleschild on Jun 18, 2024 16:03:06 GMT
Theory that just occurred to me: with all the suggestions that Sutekh was sent to the end/edge of the universe that the Doctor and Donna visited in Wild Blue Yonder, is it possible that Sutekh was killed by the creatures there and this is a copy? Thinking about it there may be something to the copy theory. If it was the events of WBY that enabled Sutekh to enter our world & bond with the TARDIS, we have a 2nd TARDIS of course. As far as we know 14s TARDIS is a complete copy of 15s (or vice versa I can't remember) so it stands to reason there are 2 Sutekhs.
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Post by whiskeybrewer on Jun 21, 2024 16:17:27 GMT
Hopefully he brings Milk and Ocelots
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Post by timleschild on Jun 21, 2024 18:11:29 GMT
Hopefully he brings Milk and Ocelots ?
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Post by mark687 on Jun 21, 2024 18:33:32 GMT
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Post by number13 on Jun 21, 2024 20:54:06 GMT
Hopefully he brings Milk and Ocelots Pyramids of Moos! ![:D](//storage.proboards.com/6343532/images/IwGTjEvWiMqDCgEk5m52.gif) Oh Mummy that was fun!
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Post by relativetime on Jun 22, 2024 0:40:05 GMT
I'm rewatching this before Empire of Death later today and it really is striking how much this also feels like a backdoor pilot for a UNIT spinoff. This is the first time since the 70s it feels like that we've had proper UNIT sets, disregarding the Black Archive. If for nothing else, I love that about this episode.
Still think it's full of a lot of good character moments and a lot of good suspense for a part one, but I still can't help but feel apprehensive about where it all might be leading to. Guess I'll find out shortly!
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