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Post by Deleted on Sept 1, 2017 11:06:41 GMT
Sylvester McCoy. Horrible Doctor. Horrible Actor.
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Post by Bazoolium on Sept 1, 2017 11:14:07 GMT
Sylvester McCoy. Horrible Doctor. Horrible Actor. I wouldn't say bad, just inconsistent. He veers from brilliant to terrible in one sentence. When he is being quiet and menacing he's great. When we has to speak at any volume he looses any sense of gravitas he had. Many of the 4+ part stories don't justify their length. I just finished Ambassadors of Death and absolutely nothing happens, bar some very dire action scenes.
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Post by number13 on Sept 1, 2017 11:24:03 GMT
Sylvester McCoy. Horrible Doctor. Horrible Actor. This paper scores 1 out of 3, for spelling the name right at the top... I admit that for me Season 24 is the unchallenged low point of the classic era, but an actor can only play a character as they are written and directed to play that character. I didn't like the Seventh Doctor in his first run of stories (in fact I loathed the stories and disliked the Doctor so much I missed some of the next season, uniquely in all my years of 'Who') but then came the Daleks and I started watching again... Same actor, same character, different interpretation, different scripts - and what a difference! A mysterious, powerful Doctor in an excellent run of stories right through to his most untimely TV end. (And in the future, starring in many classics from Big Finish.)
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Post by Deleted on Sept 1, 2017 11:37:26 GMT
Here again I find myself flying in the face of popular opinion. I remember watching Series 24 and thinking what a fresh new direction for the show it was, after being bogged down with returning monsters and continuity (continuity consultant: Ian Levine - I rest my case). Yes, Time and the Rani remains incomprehensible to me, but it looked great and featured some of the best effects in the show upto that point. Sylvester was a powerhouse even in that - you truly didn't know what he was going to do next. Even Pip'n'Jane's jargon could barely contain him.
But with Paradise Towers, when Andrew Cartmel's script-editor-ship kicked in, I found myself loving the dark fiarytale aspect of it all. Doctor Who was still under Michael Grade's shadow at this time of course, and concessions had to be made to his nonsensical instructions that violence had to go, and humour had to be increased. That's why Cartmel's dark stories were smothered with family-friendly production values.
I love Series 24, absolutely love it. And then Series 25 and 26 were even better.
Sylvester remains central to that for me. Yes, he went OTT, but didn't a few other Doctors (in fact the only Doctor actors that I think didn't go OTT were Pertwee and Capaldi)? I think his portrayal is playful, silly and very dangerous, fully suiting the new shroud of mystery that was being placed over the character at that time - and his work form BF retains all those good things. For me.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 1, 2017 13:33:51 GMT
Here again I find myself flying in the face of popular opinion. I remember watching Series 24 and thinking what a fresh new direction for the show it was, after being bogged down with returning monsters and continuity (continuity consultant: Ian Levine - I rest my case). Yes, Time and the Rani remains incomprehensible to me, but it looked great and featured some of the best effects in the show upto that point. Sylvester was a powerhouse even in that - you truly didn't know what he was going to do next. Even Pip'n'Jane's jargon could barely contain him. But with Paradise Towers, when Andrew Cartmel's script-editor-ship kicked in, I found myself loving the dark fiarytale aspect of it all. Doctor Who was still under Michael Grade's shadow at this time of course, and concessions had to be made to his nonsensical instructions that violence had to go, and humour had to be increased. That's why Cartmel's dark stories were smothered with family-friendly production values. I love Series 24, absolutely love it. And then Series 25 and 26 were even better. Sylvester remains central to that for me. Yes, he went OTT, but didn't a few other Doctors (in fact the only Doctor actors that I think didn't go OTT were Pertwee and Capaldi)? I think his portrayal is playful, silly and very dangerous, fully suiting the new shroud of mystery that was being placed over the character at that time - and his work form BF retains all those good things. For me. Pertwee was very on point about keeping things credible where possible. I think he turned a makeshift hang-glider in The Five Doctors into the rappel line that we see in the televised story because he thought the former would be a bit improbable. Despite its faults and a shockingly poor characterisation of the new Doctor, there's some genuine pathos between the Lakertyans in Time and the Rani. They managed to do emotion very, very well through all the spangles. My favourite moment is still when Faroon realises she's lost her daughter and she doesn't quite know how to grieve; the first person she thinks of is Sarn's father, Beyus. Ah, those last three years... Ben Aaronovitch knew that Doctor Who had been criticised for its violence, so he made most of the firefights in Remembrance between the two Dalek factions. Cartmel was very aware of the production limitations, so he pushed more for Earthbound stories that the BBC production crews would actually be able to handle on their meagre budget. The Doctor's behaviour got a great deal darker and more ill-tempered (a mix of Steel and John Steed), but the potential mayhem in his character was transferred to Ace (whose weapons got upgraded from baseball bats and grenade launchers to assault rifles and smart bombs come the NAs). Those last couple years of the programme were just so damn clever.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 1, 2017 14:29:59 GMT
Pertwee was very on point about keeping things credible where possible. I think he turned a makeshift hang-glider in The Five Doctors into the rappel line that we see in the televised story because he thought the former would be a bit improbable. Despite its faults and a shockingly poor characterisation of the new Doctor, there's some genuine pathos between the Lakertyans in Time and the Rani. They managed to do emotion very, very well through all the spangles. My favourite moment is still when Faroon realises she's lost her daughter and she doesn't quite know how to grieve; the first person she thinks of is Sarn's father, Beyus. Ah, those last three years... Ben Aaronovitch knew that Doctor Who had been criticised for its violence, so he made most of the firefights in Remembrance between the two Dalek factions. Cartmel was very aware of the production limitations, so he pushed more for Earthbound stories that the BBC production crews would actually be able to handle on their meagre budget. The Doctor's behaviour got a great deal darker and more ill-tempered (a mix of Steel and John Steed), but the potential mayhem in his character was transferred to Ace (whose weapons got upgraded from baseball bats and grenade launchers to assault rifles and smart bombs come the NAs). Those last couple years of the programme were just so damn clever. One of the moments I enjoyed in Time and the Rani, apart from those you quite rightly mention, was when Mel and The Doctor were finally reunited and finally realised who they both were. McCoy's look of hurt resentment when she stared incredulously at his new face were nicely played, I thought. I thought moments like that were genuinely quite sweet. Equally, McCoy's line in Remembrance, when Ace tells him what he can and can't do, that "I can do anything I like!" is excellent. I wanted more of that kind of thing. Destroying Skaro was incredible and reckless, but he did it1 How was it resolved that Skaro was not destroyed after all, I think I missed that?
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Post by Deleted on Sept 2, 2017 2:12:04 GMT
Pertwee was very on point about keeping things credible where possible. I think he turned a makeshift hang-glider in The Five Doctors into the rappel line that we see in the televised story because he thought the former would be a bit improbable. Despite its faults and a shockingly poor characterisation of the new Doctor, there's some genuine pathos between the Lakertyans in Time and the Rani. They managed to do emotion very, very well through all the spangles. My favourite moment is still when Faroon realises she's lost her daughter and she doesn't quite know how to grieve; the first person she thinks of is Sarn's father, Beyus. Ah, those last three years... Ben Aaronovitch knew that Doctor Who had been criticised for its violence, so he made most of the firefights in Remembrance between the two Dalek factions. Cartmel was very aware of the production limitations, so he pushed more for Earthbound stories that the BBC production crews would actually be able to handle on their meagre budget. The Doctor's behaviour got a great deal darker and more ill-tempered (a mix of Steel and John Steed), but the potential mayhem in his character was transferred to Ace (whose weapons got upgraded from baseball bats and grenade launchers to assault rifles and smart bombs come the NAs). Those last couple years of the programme were just so damn clever. One of the moments I enjoyed in Time and the Rani, apart from those you quite rightly mention, was when Mel and The Doctor were finally reunited and finally realised who they both were. McCoy's look of hurt resentment when she stared incredulously at his new face were nicely played, I thought. I thought moments like that were genuinely quite sweet. Equally, McCoy's line in Remembrance, when Ace tells him what he can and can't do, that "I can do anything I like!" is excellent. I wanted more of that kind of thing. Destroying Skaro was incredible and reckless, but he did it1 How was it resolved that Skaro was not destroyed after all, I think I missed that? He was always trying, whatever the script gave him. Skaro I think is the Dal word for "home" and War of the Daleks claims that it was shifted off its orbit and replaced by a planet called Antalin instead. However, it's far more likely that Antalin became the new Skaro when the original was destroyed and the Dalek Prime was orchestrating a propaganda campaign to maintain power while Davros was still alive. One of the Dalek Annuals has either Falkus or Omega Mysterium house a gene-bank that could be used to completely repopulate the homeworld if it were wiped out in a cataclysm like its sun going nova. They're deceptively good forward planners those Daleks. That new Skaro could be any number of worlds, maybe even something in the Blake's 7 Federation-sized power bloc they established in Seriphia Galaxy at the end of The Apocalypse Element.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 2, 2017 10:17:04 GMT
He was always trying, whatever the script gave him. Skaro I think is the Dal word for "home" and War of the Daleks claims that it was shifted off its orbit and replaced by a planet called Antalin instead. However, it's far more likely that Antalin became the new Skaro when the original was destroyed and the Dalek Prime was orchestrating a propaganda campaign to maintain power while Davros was still alive. One of the Dalek Annuals has either Falkus or Omega Mysterium house a gene-bank that could be used to completely repopulate the homeworld if it were wiped out in a cataclysm like its sun going nova. They're deceptively good forward planners those Daleks. That new Skaro could be any number of worlds, maybe even something in the Blake's 7 Federation-sized power bloc they established in Seriphia Galaxy at the end of The Apocalypse Element. Thanks for that. I think that, as the show had been brave enough to destroy Skaro, it should have stayed destroyed and another planet be named as the Dalek home world. Problem is, 'Skaro' is just a great, scary sounding word!
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Post by sherlock on Sept 2, 2017 10:40:25 GMT
Pertwee was very on point about keeping things credible where possible. I think he turned a makeshift hang-glider in The Five Doctors into the rappel line that we see in the televised story because he thought the former would be a bit improbable. Despite its faults and a shockingly poor characterisation of the new Doctor, there's some genuine pathos between the Lakertyans in Time and the Rani. They managed to do emotion very, very well through all the spangles. My favourite moment is still when Faroon realises she's lost her daughter and she doesn't quite know how to grieve; the first person she thinks of is Sarn's father, Beyus. Ah, those last three years... Ben Aaronovitch knew that Doctor Who had been criticised for its violence, so he made most of the firefights in Remembrance between the two Dalek factions. Cartmel was very aware of the production limitations, so he pushed more for Earthbound stories that the BBC production crews would actually be able to handle on their meagre budget. The Doctor's behaviour got a great deal darker and more ill-tempered (a mix of Steel and John Steed), but the potential mayhem in his character was transferred to Ace (whose weapons got upgraded from baseball bats and grenade launchers to assault rifles and smart bombs come the NAs). Those last couple years of the programme were just so damn clever. One of the moments I enjoyed in Time and the Rani, apart from those you quite rightly mention, was when Mel and The Doctor were finally reunited and finally realised who they both were. McCoy's look of hurt resentment when she stared incredulously at his new face were nicely played, I thought. I thought moments like that were genuinely quite sweet. Equally, McCoy's line in Remembrance, when Ace tells him what he can and can't do, that "I can do anything I like!" is excellent. I wanted more of that kind of thing. Destroying Skaro was incredible and reckless, but he did it1 How was it resolved that Skaro was not destroyed after all, I think I missed that? On-screen there's been no explanation. Off-screen, there's War of the Daleks' elaborate 'it was never destroyed in the first place' explanation, which in doing so basically rewrites the entirety of Dalek history. Given that the Daleks went on to fight a Time War, which involved large-scale altering of history, is it possible one of their first acts in the War was to alter history to save Skaro?
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Post by Deleted on Sept 2, 2017 10:44:36 GMT
One of the moments I enjoyed in Time and the Rani, apart from those you quite rightly mention, was when Mel and The Doctor were finally reunited and finally realised who they both were. McCoy's look of hurt resentment when she stared incredulously at his new face were nicely played, I thought. I thought moments like that were genuinely quite sweet. Equally, McCoy's line in Remembrance, when Ace tells him what he can and can't do, that "I can do anything I like!" is excellent. I wanted more of that kind of thing. Destroying Skaro was incredible and reckless, but he did it1 How was it resolved that Skaro was not destroyed after all, I think I missed that? On-screen there's been no explanation. Off-screen, there's War of the Daleks' elaborate 'it was never destroyed in the first place' explanation, which in doing so basically rewrites the entirety of Dalek history. Given that the Daleks went on to fight a Time War, which involved large-scale altering of history, is it possible one of their first acts in the War was to alter history to save Skaro? Now that's a possibility I like very much! I remember reviews of War of the Daleks and decided to give it a miss. I'm not usually one to let reviews persuade or dissuade me from watching/buying/reading something, but - as you say - re-writing everything the television series told us about Dalek history struck me as being more than a little audacious.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 2, 2017 11:16:10 GMT
On-screen there's been no explanation. Off-screen, there's War of the Daleks' elaborate 'it was never destroyed in the first place' explanation, which in doing so basically rewrites the entirety of Dalek history. I remember reviews of War of the Daleks and decided to give it a miss. Trust me, you didn't miss much. I think it's one of the worst written Doctor Who novels ever.
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Post by valeyard on Sept 2, 2017 11:16:57 GMT
On-screen there's been no explanation. Off-screen, there's War of the Daleks' elaborate 'it was never destroyed in the first place' explanation, which in doing so basically rewrites the entirety of Dalek history. Given that the Daleks went on to fight a Time War, which involved large-scale altering of history, is it possible one of their first acts in the War was to alter history to save Skaro? Now that's a possibility I like very much! I remember reviews of War of the Daleks and decided to give it a miss. I'm not usually one to let reviews persuade or dissuade me from watching/buying/reading something, but - as you say - re-writing everything the television series told us about Dalek history struck me as being more than a little audacious. Whether or not blowing up Skaro was a good or bad idea, it's what happened after the series that doesn't make much sense. War of the Daleks (a book rarely read by fans) say Skaro was never destroyed, but in tv terms Moffat brought Skaro back with no explanation. This isn't a Classic Who problem!
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Post by Deleted on Sept 2, 2017 11:53:05 GMT
On-screen there's been no explanation. Off-screen, there's War of the Daleks' elaborate 'it was never destroyed in the first place' explanation, which in doing so basically rewrites the entirety of Dalek history. Given that the Daleks went on to fight a Time War, which involved large-scale altering of history, is it possible one of their first acts in the War was to alter history to save Skaro? Now that's a possibility I like very much! I remember reviews of War of the Daleks and decided to give it a miss. I'm not usually one to let reviews persuade or dissuade me from watching/buying/reading something, but - as you say - re-writing everything the television series told us about Dalek history struck me as being more than a little audacious. Wasn't it revealed in The Witch's Farmaliar that the Daleks rebuilt Skaro for Davros to honour their past?
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Post by Deleted on Sept 2, 2017 12:16:55 GMT
Now that's a possibility I like very much! I remember reviews of War of the Daleks and decided to give it a miss. I'm not usually one to let reviews persuade or dissuade me from watching/buying/reading something, but - as you say - re-writing everything the television series told us about Dalek history struck me as being more than a little audacious. Wasn't it revealed in The Witch's Farmaliar that the Daleks rebuilt Skaro for Davros to honour their past? It's entirely possible, and that I missed that detail (as did valeyard). I find it difficult to imagine that Steven Moffat, who likes tying up loose ends, wouldn't have offered at least some explanation.
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Post by valeyard on Sept 2, 2017 14:18:31 GMT
Wasn't it revealed in The Witch's Farmaliar that the Daleks rebuilt Skaro for Davros to honour their past? It's entirely possible, and that I missed that detail (as did valeyard). I find it difficult to imagine that Steven Moffat, who likes tying up loose ends, wouldn't have offered at least some explanation. It isn't explained in Asylum of the Daleks.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 2, 2017 15:35:49 GMT
It's entirely possible, and that I missed that detail (as did valeyard ). I find it difficult to imagine that Steven Moffat, who likes tying up loose ends, wouldn't have offered at least some explanation. It isn't explained in Asylum of the Daleks. But it is s in The Witch's Farmaliar
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Post by Deleted on Sept 2, 2017 15:45:12 GMT
Now that's a possibility I like very much! I remember reviews of War of the Daleks and decided to give it a miss. I'm not usually one to let reviews persuade or dissuade me from watching/buying/reading something, but - as you say - re-writing everything the television series told us about Dalek history struck me as being more than a little audacious. Wasn't it revealed in The Witch's Farmaliar that the Daleks rebuilt Skaro for Davros to honour their past? Yes, Davros explained to the Doctor that the "Daleks rebuilt Skaro". Which is a better - and much simpler - explanation than what John Peel gave us.
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Post by valeyard on Sept 2, 2017 15:50:30 GMT
It isn't explained in Asylum of the Daleks. But it is s in The Witch's Farmaliar What's the explanation?
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Post by Deleted on Sept 2, 2017 15:58:07 GMT
But it is s in The Witch's Farmaliar What's the explanation? @stevo:
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Post by valeyard on Sept 2, 2017 17:28:57 GMT
@stevo : When the "Daleks rebuilt Skaro", that could mean either, a) the took another planet and rebuilt it in the image of Skaro, or b) they actually rebuilt Skaro from the debris left over. A sounds better, but sadly it's not expanded, or explained more.
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