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Post by Deleted on Jun 13, 2017 4:40:06 GMT
3.58 million watched Doctor Who last night. On overnights, it was the fifth most watched show of the day, behind the news, hospital drama Casualty, Scotland vs England and The Voice Kids (I mean, what?). Drama is always going to loose to Sport especially home nations clashes and people like talent shows and judgement, Casualty resurgence is interesting they've gone back to grittier plots but kept Charlie, Josh and Duffy as that strong moral positive centre.
I think fictional TV Broadcasting changed now if you've more then 2 million watching live and then another 3 million + Catch-up hits then it can be considered still ok in the show pool.
Regards
mark687
And besides, the show's appreciation index still remains strong. Just one point behind the highest-rated show of the evening, Casualty, at eighty-three. You have to wonder if executives nowadays measure the success of their programmes by purchases rather than viewing figures. Actually, there's an interesting question. Is a profitable business venture for the classic series considered a success just for the original or for its revival counterpart as well? |
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Post by number13 on Jun 13, 2017 8:48:21 GMT
Yes, I agree with all you folks who loved it. It had such a great Classic Who feel to it. I had a sense that if we had a four-part story we would have really gotten to know the Captain quite well. The Ice Warrior were portrayed wonderfully and I really liked The Empress. But I, too wondered why the Tardis left? There was absolutely no reason for it. In practical terms, it meant Nardole had to release Missy so she could return the TARDIS to Mars and show the Doctor how very, very reformed she is now... The question is, who took it in the first place? It would have to be someone devious and highly skilled in the remote operation of a TARDIS, someone like... Ah!  |
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Post by dalekbuster523finish on Jun 13, 2017 9:14:23 GMT
Yes, I agree with all you folks who loved it. It had such a great Classic Who feel to it. I had a sense that if we had a four-part story we would have really gotten to know the Captain quite well. The Ice Warrior were portrayed wonderfully and I really liked The Empress. But I, too wondered why the Tardis left? There was absolutely no reason for it. In practical terms, it meant Nardole had to release Missy so she could return the TARDIS to Mars and show the Doctor how very, very reformed she is now... The question is, who took it in the first place? It would have to be someone devious and highly skilled in the remote operation of a TARDIS, someone like... Ah! John Simm's Master? |
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Post by omega on Jun 13, 2017 9:47:01 GMT
The Doctor finally got new spacesuits. Wonder what happened to the ones he got from the Sanctuary Base on Krop Tor.
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Post by number13 on Jun 13, 2017 10:25:16 GMT
In practical terms, it meant Nardole had to release Missy so she could return the TARDIS to Mars and show the Doctor how very, very reformed she is now... The question is, who took it in the first place? It would have to be someone devious and highly skilled in the remote operation of a TARDIS, someone like... Ah! John Simm's Master? He does seem the obvious candidate, doesn't he? Tempting his later self to escape and return to the bad old ways. Though I suppose it could be a future action by Missy after she eventually gets out of the vault, so she could prove she had reformed by not escaping, or even done in the future by the Doctor himself, for some reason to be explained? |
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Post by sherlock on Jun 13, 2017 10:28:45 GMT
He does seem the obvious candidate, doesn't he? Tempting his later self to escape and return to the bad old ways. Though I suppose it could be a future action by Missy after she eventually gets out of the vault, or even done in the future by the Doctor himself, for some reason to be explained? I saw one theory that the TARDIS itself did it to remove itself from a critical point in history. If it had stayed the Doctor may have just evacuated the soldiers, preventing the understanding being reached and potentially preventing the Ice Warriors making contact with {Spoiler}
Alpha Centuari, which would prevent the 'Martian Golden Age' the Doctor referenced and presumably also significantly impact on the timeline further down the line around the time of the Peladon stories. |
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Post by theotherjosh on Jun 13, 2017 10:41:43 GMT
I thought this one was average. Didn't love it, didn't hate it. It did feel like a Classic Who story in a lot of ways and it probably would have benefitted from a longer run time. As it was, the pacing felt very stop and go, and I felt the Godsacre's backstory wasn't as cleanly integrated with the rest of the story as it could have been. That said, I appreciated the Classic series cameo and I liked that the Ice Warriors looked like, well Ice Warriors.
Not sure how I feel about the NASA framing mechanism. Probably a soft recommend.
Bill continues to improve every episode, and she started from a really strong position. I do hope Pearl Mackey stays on.
When the Doctor said, "I'll go first," and started removing his helmet, my daughter remarked, "Yeah, because that worked really well for you last time." Then she paused it and wanted to know why the TARDIS didn't extend an envelope of atmosphere like it did last time.
I'm going to be unsatisfied if we don't get a compelling reason for the events that led to Missy's release.
It took a while to get there, but I thought it was engaging once it did.
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Post by dalekbuster523finish on Jun 13, 2017 11:00:09 GMT
He does seem the obvious candidate, doesn't he? Tempting his later self to escape and return to the bad old ways. Though I suppose it could be a future action by Missy after she eventually gets out of the vault, so she could prove she had reformed by not escaping, or even done in the future by the Doctor himself, for some reason to be explained? I'm hoping Simm's Master because it would tie in so well with how he piloted the Doctor's TARDIS before in Utopia and turned it into a paradox machine. |
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Post by number13 on Jun 13, 2017 11:08:24 GMT
He does seem the obvious candidate, doesn't he? Tempting his later self to escape and return to the bad old ways. Though I suppose it could be a future action by Missy after she eventually gets out of the vault, or even done in the future by the Doctor himself, for some reason to be explained? I saw one theory that the TARDIS itself did it to remove itself from a critical point in history. If it had stayed the Doctor may have just evacuated the soldiers, preventing the understanding being reached and potentially preventing the Ice Warriors making contact with {Spoiler}
Alpha Centuari, which would prevent the 'Martian Golden Age' the Doctor referenced and presumably also significantly impact on the timeline further down the line around the time of the Peladon stories. {Spoiler}
In the old days, it would have been the Time Lords manipulating the Doctor once again to get exactly that result. They did take an interest in this series of events, didn't they?
At the end of 'The Curse of Peladon' the Doctor tells Jo it was no coincidence that they landed on Peladon at that precise moment in its history. 'Time Lords again?' she says, and he confirms it.
I'm not sure it fits with them now though; the Time Lords are not what they were, unfortunately.
I liked the classic idea of the watchers and (strictly on the quiet!) adjusters of Time and timelines, with the Doctor as their 'cosmic puppet' occasionally, in exchange for his freedom. |
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Post by omega on Jun 13, 2017 11:43:32 GMT
He does seem the obvious candidate, doesn't he? Tempting his later self to escape and return to the bad old ways. Though I suppose it could be a future action by Missy after she eventually gets out of the vault, or even done in the future by the Doctor himself, for some reason to be explained? I saw one theory that the TARDIS itself did it to remove itself from a critical point in history. If it had stayed the Doctor may have just evacuated the soldiers, preventing the understanding being reached and potentially preventing the Ice Warriors making contact with {Spoiler}
Alpha Centuari, which would prevent the 'Martian Golden Age' the Doctor referenced and presumably also significantly impact on the timeline further down the line around the time of the Peladon stories. I like it, the TARDIS taking a far more cautious approach than the Doctor. {Spoiler}
Peladon and the Federation's role in its history is also a part of the Doctor's personal timeline at several points in the Classic Series, not to mention at least one novel (Legacy) and two audios (The Bride of Peladon and The Prisoner of Peladon). |
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Post by MayoTango131 on Jun 13, 2017 15:38:54 GMT
Definitely much better than the mediocre movie of Tom Cruise, and never expect it to be more or less a prequel to The Curse of Peladon.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 13, 2017 23:17:25 GMT
A more low key adventure this time around. Not quite a classic, but very enjoyable with some nice character momments.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 13, 2017 23:21:01 GMT
I'm kind of worried we're going to see Missy influencing her own past with the Simm Master meetup (and subsquent regeneration?) and have the events of Dark Water/Death in Heaven be some lingering trace memory. Don't get me wrong, it'd be a nice way to close her involvement in Twelve's era, but it'd be intresting to see Missy out there doing 'good' and challenging The Doctor's morality. |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 14, 2017 2:39:23 GMT
I saw one theory that the TARDIS itself did it to remove itself from a critical point in history. If it had stayed the Doctor may have just evacuated the soldiers, preventing the understanding being reached and potentially preventing the Ice Warriors making contact with {Spoiler}
Alpha Centuari, which would prevent the 'Martian Golden Age' the Doctor referenced and presumably also significantly impact on the timeline further down the line around the time of the Peladon stories. I like it, the TARDIS taking a far more cautious approach than the Doctor. {Spoiler}
Peladon and the Federation's role in its history is also a part of the Doctor's personal timeline at several points in the Classic Series, not to mention at least one novel (Legacy) and two audios (The Bride of Peladon and The Prisoner of Peladon).
I think it's part of the ongoing narrative, you can't call back too much to old contiunty which most of the audience isn't aware of.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 14, 2017 3:15:35 GMT
I saw one theory that the TARDIS itself did it to remove itself from a critical point in history. If it had stayed the Doctor may have just evacuated the soldiers, preventing the understanding being reached and potentially preventing the Ice Warriors making contact with Alpha Centuari, which would prevent the 'Martian Golden Age' the Doctor referenced and presumably also significantly impact on the timeline further down the line around the time of the Peladon stories. I like it, the TARDIS taking a far more cautious approach than the Doctor. Peladon and the Federation's role in its history is also a part of the Doctor's personal timeline at several points in the Classic Series, not to mention at least one novel (Legacy) and two audios (The Bride of Peladon and The Prisoner of Peladon). It doesn't happen often, but she's definitely been known to do it. The TARDIS does have agency all of her own. Peladon might actually be one of the few worlds where the Doctor's influence has repeatedly and radically altered their history. I think I can only name a handful -- Earth, Skaro, Peladon, Artaris and arguably Vortis. Peladon is an interesting case though because unlike Skaro, I don't think it's ever made clear why exactly the Time Lords were so interested in its ratification. Their planet enters the Galactic Federation, yes, but to what end? Why interfere? |
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Post by dalekbuster523finish on Jun 14, 2017 8:57:35 GMT
I like it, the TARDIS taking a far more cautious approach than the Doctor. Peladon and the Federation's role in its history is also a part of the Doctor's personal timeline at several points in the Classic Series, not to mention at least one novel (Legacy) and two audios (The Bride of Peladon and The Prisoner of Peladon). It doesn't happen often, but she's definitely been known to do it. The TARDIS does have agency all of her own. Peladon might actually be one of the few worlds where the Doctor's influence has repeatedly and radically altered their history. I think I can only name a handful -- Earth, Skaro, Peladon, Artaris and arguably Vortis. Peladon is an interesting case though because unlike Skaro, I don't think it's ever made clear why exactly the Time Lords were so interested in its ratification. Their planet enters the Galactic Federation, yes, but to what end? Why interfere? Perhaps Peladon entering the Galactic Federation is a fixed point in time, and something was happening that could have caused a different outcome? |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 14, 2017 9:17:43 GMT
It doesn't happen often, but she's definitely been known to do it. The TARDIS does have agency all of her own. Peladon might actually be one of the few worlds where the Doctor's influence has repeatedly and radically altered their history. I think I can only name a handful -- Earth, Skaro, Peladon, Artaris and arguably Vortis. Peladon is an interesting case though because unlike Skaro, I don't think it's ever made clear why exactly the Time Lords were so interested in its ratification. Their planet enters the Galactic Federation, yes, but to what end? Why interfere? Perhaps Peladon entering the Galactic Federation is a fixed point in time, and something was happening that could have caused a different outcome? That's certainly a thought. What was the external influence though? In Attack of the Cybermen, it was a later generation attempting to rewrite the destruction of their homeworld. That's why they interfered, pulling the TARDIS to Halley's Comet and sabotaging the console so Peri couldn't shut the doors. That first Peladon story isn't quite as clear. Maybe, much like The Brain of Morbius, they sent the Doctor to safeguard changes that could happen because of events elsewhere. Ripples in time indirectly affecting the history of Peladon, in this case. Maybe he's there to maintain the preexisting continuity of a world that will have a significant influence on future galactic history. |
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Post by number13 on Jun 14, 2017 10:00:29 GMT
I like it, the TARDIS taking a far more cautious approach than the Doctor. Peladon and the Federation's role in its history is also a part of the Doctor's personal timeline at several points in the Classic Series, not to mention at least one novel (Legacy) and two audios (The Bride of Peladon and The Prisoner of Peladon). It doesn't happen often, but she's definitely been known to do it. The TARDIS does have agency all of her own. Peladon might actually be one of the few worlds where the Doctor's influence has repeatedly and radically altered their history. I think I can only name a handful -- Earth, Skaro, Peladon, Artaris and arguably Vortis. Peladon is an interesting case though because unlike Skaro, I don't think it's ever made clear why exactly the Time Lords were so interested in its ratification. Their planet enters the Galactic Federation, yes, but to what end? Why interfere? {Spoiler}
In 'The Monster of Peladon', the planet's mineral supplies are essential for the Federation in fighting a war with errrr... Galaxy 5 was it? A major war with someone from 'outside' anyway and the Pels had the vital resources. If they had not been in the Federation and technologically developed enough for large-scale mining it could have imperiled the whole Galaxy - and it's the Time Lords' galaxy too - maybe that was their reason? |
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Post by sherlock on Jun 14, 2017 10:09:29 GMT
It doesn't happen often, but she's definitely been known to do it. The TARDIS does have agency all of her own. Peladon might actually be one of the few worlds where the Doctor's influence has repeatedly and radically altered their history. I think I can only name a handful -- Earth, Skaro, Peladon, Artaris and arguably Vortis. Peladon is an interesting case though because unlike Skaro, I don't think it's ever made clear why exactly the Time Lords were so interested in its ratification. Their planet enters the Galactic Federation, yes, but to what end? Why interfere? {Spoiler}
In 'The Monster of Peladon', the planet's mineral supplies are essential for the Federation in fighting a war with errrr... Galaxy 5 was it? A major war with someone from 'outside' anyway and the Pels had the vital resources. If they had not been in the Federation and technologically developed enough for large-scale mining it could have imperiled the whole Galaxy - and it's the Time Lords' galaxy too - maybe that was their reason? {Spoiler}
And note when those vital mineral supplies were threatened by a crisis on Peladon, the Doctor just so happened to turn up again. Could it be the Time Lords gave the TARDIS a little nudge in the right direction to get him there? |
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Post by number13 on Jun 14, 2017 11:33:08 GMT
{Spoiler}
In 'The Monster of Peladon', the planet's mineral supplies are essential for the Federation in fighting a war with errrr... Galaxy 5 was it? A major war with someone from 'outside' anyway and the Pels had the vital resources. If they had not been in the Federation and technologically developed enough for large-scale mining it could have imperiled the whole Galaxy - and it's the Time Lords' galaxy too - maybe that was their reason? {Spoiler}
And note when those vital mineral supplies were threatened by a crisis on Peladon, the Doctor just so happened to turn up again. Could it be the Time Lords gave the TARDIS a little nudge in the right direction to get him there? Yes, exactly my theory too. In the classic era after his exile to Earth was lifted, the Doctor arrived at places 'by accident' a lot less often than even he realised! Several later stories implied that the Time Lords were keeping track of him - as you would expect; he's an exceptional agent for them to use to fix things on the quiet. I miss the old omniscient Time Lords of the classic era. They were such a good way to explain the bizarre fact that the Doctor can't take his companions anywhere, for any reason, without finding themselves fighting to save the world / galaxy / Universe! |
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