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Post by sherlock on Mar 23, 2018 1:01:32 GMT
The Rise of the New Humans.
Decent story, Hound's Monk a delight as always.
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Post by aussiedoctorwhofan on Mar 23, 2018 4:01:01 GMT
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Post by thegreendeath on Mar 23, 2018 5:01:58 GMT
The Rise of the New Humans. Decent story, Hound's Monk a delight as always. I thought the first two episodes beat out the second two, where it became more of a runaround - but it all was made inestimably betterment with the inclusion of Hound’s Monk who was amazing and played well off of 3.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 23, 2018 11:47:02 GMT
The Rise of the New Humans.
I cannot listen to these 3DAs without a huge smile. Tim Treloar is BF's Third Doctor. Not Jon Pertwee, of course, but BF's Third Doctor nonetheless. The sad unavailability of so many regulars means that this Third Doctor is more of a loner, less of a team player in an ensemble, and more of duo alongside Katy Manning's still groovy Jo Grant. Where to begin with this? I love the way it quietly addresses 'issues' regarding Who 'mythos' - for example, why is the Monk called 'the Monk?' ("I don't know: you don a robe for a few days and all of a sudden you're typecast.")
The central idea is pretty weighty. Innocent people can be spared death and suffering, thanks to 'the Monk's' mustache - 'magnificent mustache' - twirling villain and his time-travel perversions. And yet to keep the web of time on the straight and narrow, the Doctor has to let these people suffer. It's a deceptively simple, and yet very emotive issue on which to hang a story - reminiscent of Bary Letts' infusion of topical issues back in the early 1970s. It takes up until episode 3 for the Doctor to uncover a convincing reason why the Monk/the Administrator's plan is in fact evil - filthy lucre.
Guy Adams' terrific tale gives everyone lots of interesting things to do. The Doctor can be terrifically supercilious, Katy Manning gets the chance to play Jo in a frighteningly different way, and Rufus Hound seems to be having great fun and IS great fun as the Monk/the Administrator.
Although I'd love more regular 3DAs, the 'one-a-year' schedule means that each set is still very much an event, and one of the highlights of BF's range. Excellent.
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Post by Timelord007 on Mar 23, 2018 12:38:38 GMT
But what about the Cybermen? I harassed Big Finish for years for a full cast Third Doctor Vs Cybermen story, so does it deliver the goods?
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Post by mark687 on Mar 23, 2018 13:51:37 GMT
But what about the Cybermen? I harassed Big Finish for years for a full cast Third Doctor Vs Cybermen story, so does it deliver the goods? I think so:
{Spoiler} It starts out with an almost a Western then becomes a base under the siege job, but through it all the Cybermen are the focus I think its clos the best of what they could've done in the 70s with that added BF Gloss
Regards
mark687
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Post by coffeeaddict on Mar 23, 2018 16:32:05 GMT
Did anyone else find that the Cyber-leveler sound far too similar to a Dalek?
That aside, two fantastic stories. And we honestly need more stories with the Monk!
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Post by sherlock on Mar 25, 2018 1:27:57 GMT
The Tyrants of Logic.
A decent Cyberman story overall. Thought the first half was better, with the story somewhat trailing off in the second half.
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Post by elkawho on Mar 25, 2018 14:53:37 GMT
With all the talk in recent years about where Rufus Hound's incarnation of the Monk falls in relation to Graham Garden {Spoiler} Did anyone catch his "brassy blondes from Blackpool" comment? I would say that comment puts him AFTER Lucie Miller. I don't know why this thrills me so much. I'm still waiting for the confrontation post To The Death between him and Eight that we will probably never get. I loved this set! This is another range which was really good to start, but gets so much better with each release. Anyway, back to the set. I loved Rise Of The New Humans from the start, and I'm never disappointed by Rufus Hound. The moral ambiguity of this one was great to build a story around. I had a little bit of a slower start with the Cybermen story, however by the time it was done I realized just how much I enjoyed it. Looking forward to more of these sets! And looking forward to the Third Doctor showing up in some UNIT stories!
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Post by constonks on Mar 26, 2018 3:04:18 GMT
I'm still waiting for the confrontation post To The Death between him and Eight that we will probably never get. Well, it happened in Doom Coalition 4, but the Monk rather shrugged it all off as the actions of another incarnation.
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Post by number13 on Mar 27, 2018 10:39:59 GMT
The Rise of the New HumansAn excellent story from Guy Adams. The first and fourth episodes are styled as an enjoyably traditional adventure. And they surround two episodes which are not only thought-provoking and packed with ideas, but which develop the mystery in a way which is so mysterious I hadn't a clue what was going on the first time round... Which is as it should be; even the Doctor doesn't realise for a long time... For me this was one of those stories deserving an immediate second listen to get the full benefit of 20/20 hindsight; it's very cleverly done. And oh my goodness this Monk is a fun Monk! (And a selfish *£%^$** too!) The three leads are all brilliant individually and even better together. Rufus Hound gives (in the Monk's own phrase) a 'simply delicious' performance and hearing the flippant, deceitful Monk sparring with the serious Third Doctor is a highlight of the story. Tim Treloar perfectly brings out 'my' Doctor at his most thoughtful and campaigning, in this story where ideas and debate are key parts of the plot. And Katy Manning is wonderful as always, playing not only ever-loyal and lovely Jo, but also Jo on her own strange journey where she makes a new friend (that's very Jo) and behaves in a way that's very not Jo! (And as a Jo fan since 1971 may I just comment that the episode 2 cliff-hanger made me say something very unfortunate - and totally justified! - about the Monk! ) The opening episode is a terrific bit of early-70s 'Who' with a dramatic start (I could imagine the HAVOC stuntmen at work!) and a rather grumpy Doctor being sent to see the results. (I imagine the Brig. wrote a full UNIT report as to why the case was interesting - and the Doctor didn't bother to read it!) A quick bit of investigating and we're soon off in 'Bessie' with some comedy business thanks to rain, wind and tyre-sucking mud on the way to spend a night in 'Dracula's Castle' (as Jo sarcastically calls their destination) - when a desparate patient escapes from the remote hospital and asks for help. Something is clearly Going On... It's all so authentic and the cliff-hanger is a corker; the Doctor and Jo are expecting 'old pointy-beard' again, when in strolls... the Monk! Even though we know he's coming, it's a standout moment because so well played by all. And at that point the story suddenly switches into two episodes of an enclosed, increasingly spooky mystery running in the background of well thought out debates and discussions about the merits and morals of the Monk's latest scheme. It's a great idea and cleverly written: the Monk and dangerously obsessed Dr. Kurdi and even the Doctor are so busy with their own private schemes and arguments, no-one sees or even suspects what's really going on - except Jo (who is not her usual self.) The Monk and Dr. Kurdi think their plan has stalled and take drastic means to force the Doctor to help. But they don't notice that a new power is rising all around them; they have already succeeded and yet the prize is already far beyond their reach... It's very ingenious; we can hear the Doctor, the Monk and Dr. Kurdi at their debates and we can hear Jo hearing a fog of voices from mysterious characters in the background and I still couldn't work it out on first listen. Until the truth suddenly dawns all round: "Evolution's Revenge". The results of evolution (even artifical evolution) ultimately 'belong' to the entire species. The conspirators wanted to give humans super-adaptable bodies able to mutate ('malleable' is the word used here) at the cellular level - but in their arrogance they never stopped to think that success would inevitably mean their 'creation' would literally take on a life of its own... And the Doctor was so focused on stopping their meddling and saving Jo that even he didn't pick up the clues to what was happening. I liked this very much - for once the Doctor wasn't way ahead of us, the listeners. Fortunately, in focusing on the one problem he has already prepared the solution to the other - sometimes being a super-genius is not enough, the Doctor has to be lucky too! So now we're into the final episode and the style shifts into a classic base-under-siege with the mutant New Humans led by the super-adaptable Harriet - and there's just time to include an appearance from UNIT to tick another authenticity box and keep us fans happy!, but using them in a different way. The Monk (as is his usual habit) flaps and panics entertainingly as his latest scheme comes looking for payback - and he hopes the Doctor can get him out of trouble. Which of course, the Doctor does with the help of Jo - and Charlie, a most unusual ally. It's a feature of Monk stories that he ends up hoist by his own petard, begs the Doctor to save him, thinks he's escaped... and then discovers the Doctor has left him trapped again... I was pleased to see events play out in the traditional way and hope the Meddling Moustache will be back to annoy various Doctors before too long! {Continuity Spoiler}When the Doctor and Dr Kurdi are arguing about her vision of a new society, the Doctor abruptly jumps to the conclusion that workers would be forced to have gills and live in the sea. This sudden leap left me floundering - until I remembered he'd seen it happen under another nutty scientist who thought nothing in the world could stop him now! (Too long again, sorry! Must try harder...)
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Post by thegreatone on Mar 27, 2018 17:11:44 GMT
I listened to the Cyberman story today and thoroughly enjoyed it. One question not sure if anyone can answer but where would you place this story in the Third Doctors timeline?
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Post by Deleted on Mar 27, 2018 20:49:55 GMT
Only heard Rise Of The Humans.
I'm going to swim against the tide here, I thought Hound was the weak link. I've liked his Monk but this was him playing the part by way of Chris Biggins and Tim Curry in Rocky Horror. Every last syllable was completely camped up in a way he only did in his other appearances when grandstanding. There's just no chance for any degree of threat when he's the villain especially when the plot and the implications are really sinister. I also don't think the character works well off The Third Doctor. It's just not a fit. Developing Dr. Kurdi more would have been something I'd like to have seen but with this reading of the Monk everything else suffered for room. Again, I liked Rufus in The Black Hole and Doom Coalition but he was much bigger here than in those stories. It's a big part and calls for theatricality but I think it went too far.
I liked the plot, I loved Jo (as always), Tim could do with stopping rolling his r's like he's playing McCoy rather than Pertwee (when did Jon do that? Tim does it all the time) but he was good too.
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Post by barnabaslives on Mar 27, 2018 21:38:49 GMT
Let's see... I thought this box set was absolutely amazing, with the performers all in such fine form and such good stories. Even with the great expectation that can be built up over (at loooooooooong last) a 3rd Doctor Cyberman story, there was nothing that disappointed whatsoever. Also, I hadn't worked up nearly as much excitement over there being a Monk story, but I should have, I was really impressed. As usual, I should know it's a great story just because it's Guy Adams. There was however one little thing that I'm not sure I liked about Rise of the New Humans, which concerns one of my pet peeves with fiction. The central idea is pretty weighty. Innocent people can be spared death and suffering, thanks to 'the Monk's' mustache - 'magnificent mustache' - twirling villain and his time-travel perversions. And yet to keep the web of time on the straight and narrow, the Doctor has to let these people suffer. It's a deceptively simple, and yet very emotive issue on which to hang a story I get the brilliance of this dramatically, but I still think it's a bit unnecessary and I just cannot get my head around the concept of people being denied medical care under ANY circumstances to prevent overpopulation or any other "noble" cause. So it was a little bit like the bad guys in Logan's Run had been swapped in for the good guys in Rise of The New Humans, and somehow that may just never ever seem quite right. Stunning boxset anyway, and well done to all.
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Post by number13 on Mar 28, 2018 12:04:57 GMT
I listened to the Cyberman story today and thoroughly enjoyed it. One question not sure if anyone can answer but where would you place this story in the Third Doctors timeline? 'The Conquest of Far' in Vol 3 specifically follows directly on from the end of TV Planet of the Daleks. So I'm imagining all subsequent Third Doctor / Jo stories as running in an unbroken sequence from then - until 'The Green Death' obviously. TV 'Planet of the Daleks' 3DA V3 'The Conquest of Far' 3DA V3 'Storm of the Horofax' 3DA V4 'Rise of the New Humans' 3DA V4 'The Tyrants of Logic' ... 3DA V5 V6 V7 V8 V9 Vhopefully TONS more ... TV 'The Green Death'
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Post by Deleted on Mar 28, 2018 14:45:27 GMT
Spoilers.
The Tyrants of Logic by Marc Platt.
I had to wait until I had a few uninterrupted hours before listening to this. Tim Treloar's Third Doctor, Jo, Marc Platt, Cybermen: you can't digest all that with any distractions. And I'm glad I waited, because this is an absolute gem. Utterly brilliant in every department.
When Marc P is on form, his work is unsurpassable (I think his recent two-parter for the 4DAs is my favourite story from that range). And here, he does it again, gradually building up the nuances and intricacies of a fascinating and unusual location before weaving an intriguing story over and around it. Fascinating characters, ghostly voices, a very visual landscape, some witty one-liners, eccentric horror, and of course some tremendous Cyber-cliffhangers.
The isolation is well conveyed, and it is very effective when the ... not 'peace' exactly, but the familiarity of that isolation is shattered. What follows is bombastic and genuinely exciting. There was a vague part of my mind that wondered about spacing the episodes out when listening, but that idea didn't last long.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 28, 2018 20:34:26 GMT
Tim Treloar is amazing! FACT.
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Post by theotherjosh on Apr 4, 2018 15:43:56 GMT
The Rise of the New Humans
Tom Baker was my first Doctor and I never really appreciated his predecessors until much later in life. Consequently, I never sought out any of the previous Third Doctor collections. But I couldn’t pass this one up. I’m a sucker for the Cybermen and Platt and Guy Adams are some of Big Finish’s top talent.
I really like the Monk as an adversary. (“Some of us have better things to do than shuffle a grudge around the universe in a suit smelling of Ogrons.”) Ian Atkins wrote a Short Trip with him (The Blame Game) and I really enjoyed that one. He reminds me of the character played by Alex McQueen in other ranges, but dialed down to a manageable level. (McQueen does a great job, but that level of energy exhausts me.) I’d pay good money for a Monk box set. Big Finish, are you listening?
The discredited idea that we only use 10% of our brains is a pet peeve of mine, and I was pleased beyond words when the Doctor corrected Jo about it.
I like a fallible Doctor. The Doctor is never foolish in this story, but he sometimes makes sub-optimal decisions based on incomplete information.
I liked Doctor Kurdi and the Doctor’s exchanges with her “You’re theorizing absurdly.” “I’m thinking the problem through.”
The dialogue was vintage Third Doctor: You have a world of apathetic immortals. Trust me. I know what that’s like and it’s not to be wished for.”
I don’t know Pertwee’s voice well enough to say definitively, but Treloar sure sounded like him to me.
I always enjoy the Audio extras, but this one was especially good, just because of the very clear affection and admiration Nick feels towards Guy Adams. Guy remarked that “It’s hard to know how the Monk views himself” and I appreciated that observation as well.
The Tyrants of Logic
I like the Cybermen and their goofy voices and I don’t care who knows. As Nick says in the extras: We [fans of Doctor Who] get excited about things about things that are perhaps a bit naff. He had some insight into the peculiarity of the voices as well, that because they’ve removed their emotions, they don’t understand where to play emphasis any more, and I like that explanation.
Speaking of things that are vaguely ridiculous, the story includes a Glitter gun! Huzzah!
Cyber fog was a clever and thematically appropriate addition to Cyberman mythology.
Not personally a big fan of animals in stories, but that’s something that I just happen to dislike rather than a “flaw”.
There’s always a richness to Marc’s scripts, but this one held an especially palpable fog of menace.
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Post by Ian McArdell on Apr 13, 2018 8:20:41 GMT
My take on these rather fab tales is now up at CultBox
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Post by relativetime on Apr 13, 2018 17:10:19 GMT
The Rise of the New Humans was my favorite of the set - I just absolutely love Rufus Hound's interpretation of the Monk (though, I had one very minor nitpick with the story still dancing around whether his Monk comes before or after the Eighth Doctor Adventures Monk, but that's a different rant entirely).
I'm still not sure what I think about The Tyrants of Logic - it hasn't really stuck with me yet. There's a lot I loved about it and there's a couple of moments that lost me. It's steeped in tropes and sounds from the Third Doctor's era, though - I got the same feeling I got from listening to The Conquest of Far, if that makes any sense - but there were a few things that I thought were a little unnecessary. I'm going to listen to this one again on my drive home later tonight and see what I think then.
What I will say for certain, though, is that the announcement of the fifth volume can't come soon enough.
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