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Post by Deleted on Apr 1, 2018 11:15:02 GMT
Additions to the Doctor Who mythos you don't like?
The TARDIS seemingly being indestructiable and the TARDIS being in a state of grace. Words can't express how happy I was with the retcon in Let's Kill Hitler! Mel's characterisation in Millenial Rites. I know he's well regarded in fandom but Hinton's take on Mel is just completely unprofessional and cringeworthy and completely unreconciable with the character onscreen. I'll never get the hate for TV Mel (yes, Big Finish Mel is fantastic, but a companion putting The Doctor through his paces after Peri is funny? No?), but to carry it over into an official novel is just cringeworthy.
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Post by thethirddoctor on Apr 1, 2018 11:30:26 GMT
Didn't like the TARDIS being able to take over a humanoid body as seen in The Doctors Wife. The TARDIS may have a "personality", but not one that can possess another.
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Post by mark687 on Apr 1, 2018 12:11:58 GMT
The big one obviously
The implication that the essence of the Great Intelligence in the Doctor's Timeline is responsible for every cliff-hanger up to The Name of the Doctor and Clara's essence kicking the GI's out resolves them.
The Ponds views on Parenting and Family
Being conceived in the TARDIS gives the child a Regeneration cycle.
Regards
mark687
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Post by Deleted on Apr 1, 2018 12:19:17 GMT
The Ponds views on Parenting and Family River was physically restrained and brainwashed into be assassin - her saying that her parents just shows how messed up she is. Amy never being able to provide a proper childhood for her daughter is shown to be one of her biggest regrets, given her childhood with Aunt Shannon. I never felt that. Always felt more like a time travel 'Everything is at stake' she-bang.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 1, 2018 12:36:09 GMT
I don't like Adric's death. I'm not AGASINT a companion dying and I'm glad Moffatt eventually reapproached the idea. But, killing off the child identification character in a family show is a terrible move and cynical (foreshadowing Saward's worst tendancies) and doesn't befit Doctor Who at all. Did Adric's death cement the return of the edge to the Doctor Who universe? Yes. But Tegan or Nyssa would have been a better option.
I hate the retcon that The Doctor and Sarah Jane were unrequited lovers. I love their platonic friendship, I love that The Doctor absousetly adores Sarah Jane, I love that Sarah Jane adores her friend just as equally, he's BONKERS and she loves it. They'll never meet each other in the middle, but they don't care. But no, they had to be looooooooovers, because platonic friendship isn't a thing or can't be deep or meaningful.
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Post by thethirddoctor on Apr 1, 2018 12:45:18 GMT
The big one obviously The implication that the essence of the Great Intelligence in the Doctor's Timeline is responsible for every cliff-hanger up to The Name of the Doctor and Clara's essence kicking the GI's out resolves them. The Ponds views on Parenting and Family Being conceived in the TARDIS gives the child the a Regeneration cycle.Regards mark687 That one is awful.
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Post by thethirddoctor on Apr 1, 2018 12:47:06 GMT
I don't like Adric's death. I'm not AGASINT a companion dying and I'm glad Moffatt eventually reapproached the idea. But, killing off the child identification character in a family show is a terrible move and cynical (foreshadowing Saward's worst tendancies) and doesn't befit Doctor Who at all. Did Adric's death cement the return of the edge to the Doctor Who universe? Yes. But Tegan or Nyssa would have been a better option. I hate the retcon that The Doctor and Sarah Jane were unrequited lovers. I love their platonic friendship, I love that The Doctor absousetly adores Sarah Jane, I love that Sarah Jane adores her friend just as equally, he's BONKERS and she loves it. They'll never meet each other in the middle, but they don't care. But no, they had to be looooooooovers, because platonic friendship isn't a thing or can't be deep or meaningful.At least Adric stayed dead, and no other companion dies in the remaining Classic episodes. So, ONE companion dying in 26 years is fairly good. Isn't it only some fans opinion that 4 and SJS were lovers? That's not to say it was on tv, I haven't seen every episode.
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Post by thethirddoctor on Apr 1, 2018 12:55:19 GMT
The big one obviously The implication that the essence of the Great Intelligence in the Doctor's Timeline is responsible for every cliff-hanger up to The Name of the Doctor and Clara's essence kicking the GI's out resolves them. The Ponds views on Parenting and FamilyBeing conceived in the TARDIS gives the child the a Regeneration cycle. Regards mark687 They didn't exactly go looking for her, did they?
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Post by mark687 on Apr 1, 2018 13:16:04 GMT
The Ponds views on Parenting and Family River was physically restrained and brainwashed into be assassin - her saying that her parents just shows how messed up she is. Amy never being able to provide a proper childhood for her daughter is shown to be one of her biggest regrets, given her childhood with Aunt Shannon. Sorry no don't buy it because the Aunt Shannon thing doesn't happen because of the Big Bang resolution,
In true continuity 2nd incarnation of Melody poses as Amy's best friend makes sure that she gets together with Rory. Amy resents her parents for putting her through therapy. She has major doubts about marrying Rory, treats him rubbish IMO, marries him anyway, gets pregnant kidnapped, cloned, gives birth in captivity, child gets kidnapped, is revealed as River, they go home, Lets Kill plays out,
From the end of Lets kill Hitler on their attitude to children is awful. No sympathy for kid or parents in Night Terrors only a couple of really crass remarks regarding discipline.
Then the final straw she can't have another biological child (for whatever reason !!!) and she decides the Marriage is over! No discussion on fostering or adoption and he still begs to be taken back!
Sorry for the Rant
Regards
mark687
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Post by thethirddoctor on Apr 1, 2018 13:20:04 GMT
River was physically restrained and brainwashed into be assassin - her saying that her parents just shows how messed up she is. Amy never being able to provide a proper childhood for her daughter is shown to be one of her biggest regrets, given her childhood with Aunt Shannon. Sorry no don't buy it because the Aunt Shannon thing doesn't happen because of the Big Bang resolution,
In true continuity 2nd incarnation of Melody poses as Amy's best friend makes sure that she gets together with Rory. Amy resents her parents for putting her through therapy. She has major doubts about marrying Rory, treats him rubbish IMO, marries him anyway, gets pregnant kidnapped, cloned, gives birth in captivity, child gets kidnapped, is revealed as River, they go home, Lets Kill plays out,
From the end of Lets kill Hitler on their attitude to children is awful. No sympathy for kid or parents in Night Terrors only a couple of really crass remarks regarding discipline.
Then the final straw she can't have another biological child (for whatever reason !!!) and she decides the Marriage is over! No discussion on fostering or adoption and he still begs to be taken back!
Sorry the Rant
Regards
mark687
Isn't this more about the quality of the writing, rather than the mythos of the show? Once Amy and Rory have left the show, these actions have no baring on future episodes, hardly mythos. The TARDIS consciousness taking over another body will be with the show for ever.
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Post by mark687 on Apr 1, 2018 13:25:46 GMT
Sorry no don't buy it because the Aunt Shannon thing doesn't happen because of the Big Bang resolution,
In true continuity 2nd incarnation of Melody poses as Amy's best friend makes sure that she gets together with Rory. Amy resents her parents for putting her through therapy. She has major doubts about marrying Rory, treats him rubbish IMO, marries him anyway, gets pregnant kidnapped, cloned, gives birth in captivity, child gets kidnapped, is revealed as River, they go home, Lets Kill plays out,
From the end of Lets kill Hitler on their attitude to children is awful. No sympathy for kid or parents in Night Terrors only a couple of really crass remarks regarding discipline.
Then the final straw she can't have another biological child (for whatever reason !!!) and she decides the Marriage is over! No discussion on fostering or adoption and he still begs to be taken back!
Sorry the Rant
Regards
mark687
Isn't this more about the quality of the writing, rather than the mythos of the show? Once Amy and Rory have left the show, these actions have no baring on future episodes, hardly mythos. The TARDIS consciousness taking over another body will be with the show for ever. Sorry your right I went a bit off point just really dislike Amy Pond.
Regards
mark687
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Post by thethirddoctor on Apr 1, 2018 13:29:21 GMT
Isn't this more about the quality of the writing, rather than the mythos of the show? Once Amy and Rory have left the show, these actions have no baring on future episodes, hardly mythos. The TARDIS consciousness taking over another body will be with the show for ever. Sorry your right I went a bit off point just really dislike Amy Pond.
Regards
mark687
That's fine. Seems to be a thin line between not liking something in general, and perceiving it as mythos.
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Post by iainmclaughlin on Apr 1, 2018 14:04:48 GMT
The half-human on his mother's side bit. I don't have a problem with it if it's going somewhere long-term but it came out of nowhere and didn't get a pay-off. I realise it was probably a holdover from the film being a series pilot and all the stuff about the Doctor's dad being Remses marries to an Earth woman... but in a one-off film it just came out of nowhere and went nowhere.
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Post by thethirddoctor on Apr 1, 2018 14:16:29 GMT
The half-human on his mother's side bit. I don't have a problem with it if it's going somewhere long-term but it came out of nowhere and didn't get a pay-off. I realise it was probably a holdover from the film being a series pilot and all the stuff about the Doctor's dad being Remses marries to an Earth woman... but in a one-off film it just came out of nowhere and went nowhere. Yep. Just wished the Hybrid was never created to suggest the half human Doctor had something to do with the destruction of Gallifrey. Even that wasn't made clear. AND, I suppose the Hybrid is now mythos. Are we stuck with that for the rest of DW history?
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Post by constonks on Apr 1, 2018 14:45:41 GMT
Honestly, the Big Finish First Master.
Dreyfus's performance is fine, but he's already the Master when we meet him, rather than the lovely decline into madness we see in The Dark Path. I do think making the Master already Delgado in that book is a misstep, but I like that we get to see the change rather than - in Destination Wars - finding out that the Doctor and Master already despised each other on Gallifrey. And so we'll never get any different Master stories. The Master is always the Master and has always acted exactly the same.
(Also I agree that the half-human thing and the Hybrid ultimately added nothing but confusion to the mythos.)
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Post by mrperson on Apr 1, 2018 17:04:11 GMT
Definitely the nonsense involved in and resulting from the Great Intelligence and Clara jumping into his "timeline" because apparently you can do that when a TARDIS rots. From Name on, every single episode we'd seen to date _also_ had GI and Clara battling it out, off-camera, with Clara winning all the time because Clara? That is the implication, both from the dialogue in the episode and from the CGI scenes of Clara appearing next to various incarnations without said incarnations noticing her. I tend to ignore that episode's existence.
Introduction of Doctor-Companion love interests, whether we are talking 10 <-> Rose, Martha -> 10, Amy -> 11, Clara/12 and the inverse "I'm not your boyfriend" thing. I have never seen much of a point in adding that to the series; it felt like it was done because someone decided that just needs to happen in every TV show. It doesn't make any sense, either. If The Doctor is head and shoulders above most other Timelords, and Timelords are incomparably more advanced than humans in mental capabilities, and if their lifespan gives them such an unimaginable amount of relative experience, then the idea of romantic love just doesn't make sense to me. It's like a 90 year old human genius falling in love with a three month old gibbon.
Introduction of killing a companion in a bid to land a cheap gut punch, then resurrecting them for a cheap happy ending.
I've also felt at times that we've got a few too many God-like creatures at this point. The old Gods, the light, the grace, the guardians, super-beings from "another universe", etc. They become a stand-in for "the audience is instructed to feel suspense at peril now".
The Hybrid garbage
The panto-villain nature of the Master, just about right from the get-go in the classic series. Someone like the Monk is a lot more interesting. The classic (and reboot) Master feels too much like a comic book supervillian to me: always a grandiose hare-brained scheme with a built-in fatal flaw, the only goal of which is to be evil because....because reasons. (And the reboot's decision to replace that with "because crazy, because Rassilon" wasn't much better).
"half-human on my mom's side"
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Post by Deleted on Apr 1, 2018 17:15:44 GMT
The whole thing about regenerating, stupid idea. They should have ended it after Hartnell.
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Post by thethirddoctor on Apr 1, 2018 17:44:24 GMT
The Doctor dying on Trenzalore. It's a "fixed" point in time, so we are stuck with it.
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Post by chrism1999 on Apr 1, 2018 18:20:02 GMT
I hate the retcon that The Doctor and Sarah Jane were unrequited lovers. I love their platonic friendship, I love that The Doctor absousetly adores Sarah Jane, I love that Sarah Jane adores her friend just as equally, he's BONKERS and she loves it. They'll never meet each other in the middle, but they don't care. But no, they had to be looooooooovers, because platonic friendship isn't a thing or can't be deep or meaningful. When has this ever actually happened though?
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Post by thethirddoctor on Apr 1, 2018 18:25:09 GMT
I hate the retcon that The Doctor and Sarah Jane were unrequited lovers. I love their platonic friendship, I love that The Doctor absousetly adores Sarah Jane, I love that Sarah Jane adores her friend just as equally, he's BONKERS and she loves it. They'll never meet each other in the middle, but they don't care. But no, they had to be looooooooovers, because platonic friendship isn't a thing or can't be deep or meaningful. When has this ever actually happened though? I read, once, that it was a fan/ group of fans interpretation of their relationship, during their run!!!
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