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Post by aussiedoctorwhofan on Nov 16, 2022 11:18:26 GMT
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Post by grinch on Nov 16, 2022 11:24:19 GMT
Pretty much what I expected to be honest.
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Post by shallacatop on Nov 16, 2022 12:27:56 GMT
This just seems like typical BF - they eventually do the right thing but it ends up feeling half arsed. There’s nothing on offer there that you can expect to appeal to a new fan. They’re releases they either need to shift out of the warehouse, aren’t cheap enough for someone to make the leap or just don’t really appeal at all. And Dark Eyes is dearer than it was when it first came out!
Is there really that much harm in reducing some genuinely appealing releases to some genuinely appealing prices? And throwing a few freebies out of the first story in the sets or series. The product should speak for itself, after all.
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Post by timleschild on Nov 16, 2022 13:58:24 GMT
Who is in charge of their social media accounts? Do they not know what hashtags are? It would help with engagement.
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Post by relativetime on Nov 16, 2022 17:43:19 GMT
This just seems like typical BF - they eventually do the right thing but it ends up feeling half arsed. There’s nothing on offer there that you can expect to appeal to a new fan. They’re releases they either need to shift out of the warehouse, aren’t cheap enough for someone to make the leap or just don’t really appeal at all. And Dark Eyes is dearer than it was when it first came out! Is there really that much harm in reducing some genuinely appealing releases to some genuinely appealing prices? And throwing a few freebies out of the first story in the sets or series. The product should speak for itself, after all. I don’t really follow this line of reasoning actually. Most of these releases, especially the Eighth Doctor stories, are fantastic places for new listeners to start and I think would at least appeal to new fans looking in. At least I personally would have included a lot of these stories on a list recommendation for new fans. I’m not defending Big Finish’s business practices in general or whatever, but the positives here for me seem to outweigh the negatives.
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Post by shallacatop on Nov 16, 2022 18:08:59 GMT
This just seems like typical BF - they eventually do the right thing but it ends up feeling half arsed. There’s nothing on offer there that you can expect to appeal to a new fan. They’re releases they either need to shift out of the warehouse, aren’t cheap enough for someone to make the leap or just don’t really appeal at all. And Dark Eyes is dearer than it was when it first came out! Is there really that much harm in reducing some genuinely appealing releases to some genuinely appealing prices? And throwing a few freebies out of the first story in the sets or series. The product should speak for itself, after all. I don’t really follow this line of reasoning actually. Most of these releases, especially the Eighth Doctor stories, are fantastic places for new listeners to start and I think would at least appeal to new fans looking in. At least I personally would have included a lot of these stories on a list recommendation for new fans. I’m not defending Big Finish’s business practices in general or whatever, but the positives here for me seem to outweigh the negatives. So you’d expect a new fan be prepared to spend £25 a set for Dark Eyes? Keeping in mind they could get a brand new Eighth Doctor release for that or have purchased for that price or less in their frequent sales of that series. Indeed, it’s actually priced higher than it cost when it was first out! Similarly it’s £30 for the first run of Lucie stories. Or a tenner to actually get the full first story. There’s a whole bit of difference between personally making a recommendation and then someone actually taking that recommendation on board and making the purchase. They may seem heavily discounted compared to what BF had them listed at, but that in itself doesn’t make them a deals. The prices here will not engage anyone new because they’re not attracrive enough.
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Post by timleschild on Nov 16, 2022 18:42:43 GMT
I don’t really follow this line of reasoning actually. Most of these releases, especially the Eighth Doctor stories, are fantastic places for new listeners to start and I think would at least appeal to new fans looking in. At least I personally would have included a lot of these stories on a list recommendation for new fans. I’m not defending Big Finish’s business practices in general or whatever, but the positives here for me seem to outweigh the negatives. So you’d expect a new fan be prepared to spend £25 a set for Dark Eyes? Keeping in mind they could get a brand new Eighth Doctor release for that or have purchased for that price or less in their frequent sales of that series. Indeed, it’s actually priced higher than it cost when it was first out! Similarly it’s £30 for the first run of Lucie stories. Or a tenner to actually get the full first story. There’s a whole bit of difference between personally making a recommendation and then someone actually taking that recommendation on board and making the purchase. They may seem heavily discounted compared to what BF had them listed at, but that in itself doesn’t make them a deals. The prices here will not engage anyone new because they’re not attracrive enough. Valid points. But how does the non BF fan even find out about this promotion?
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Post by thelonecenturion on Nov 16, 2022 23:09:52 GMT
I don’t really follow this line of reasoning actually. Most of these releases, especially the Eighth Doctor stories, are fantastic places for new listeners to start and I think would at least appeal to new fans looking in. At least I personally would have included a lot of these stories on a list recommendation for new fans. I’m not defending Big Finish’s business practices in general or whatever, but the positives here for me seem to outweigh the negatives. So you’d expect a new fan be prepared to spend £25 a set for Dark Eyes? Keeping in mind they could get a brand new Eighth Doctor release for that or have purchased for that price or less in their frequent sales of that series. Indeed, it’s actually priced higher than it cost when it was first out! Similarly it’s £30 for the first run of Lucie stories. Or a tenner to actually get the full first story. There’s a whole bit of difference between personally making a recommendation and then someone actually taking that recommendation on board and making the purchase. They may seem heavily discounted compared to what BF had them listed at, but that in itself doesn’t make them a deals. The prices here will not engage anyone new because they’re not attracrive enough. Sorry but I really disagree here. This has finally made the Eighth Doctor and Lucie stories accessible to me, and I'll be buying them later this month. Dark Eyes is now the same price as it was when it was released (i.e. the pre-order price), and that's especially significant when currently the £19.99/£24.99 model is applied to a boxset of three discs with one piece of cover art. Each Dark Eyes boxset is 5 discs with 5 pieces of artwork.
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Post by relativetime on Nov 17, 2022 0:39:18 GMT
I don’t really follow this line of reasoning actually. Most of these releases, especially the Eighth Doctor stories, are fantastic places for new listeners to start and I think would at least appeal to new fans looking in. At least I personally would have included a lot of these stories on a list recommendation for new fans. I’m not defending Big Finish’s business practices in general or whatever, but the positives here for me seem to outweigh the negatives. So you’d expect a new fan be prepared to spend £25 a set for Dark Eyes? Keeping in mind they could get a brand new Eighth Doctor release for that or have purchased for that price or less in their frequent sales of that series. Indeed, it’s actually priced higher than it cost when it was first out! Similarly it’s £30 for the first run of Lucie stories. Or a tenner to actually get the full first story. There’s a whole bit of difference between personally making a recommendation and then someone actually taking that recommendation on board and making the purchase. They may seem heavily discounted compared to what BF had them listed at, but that in itself doesn’t make them a deals. The prices here will not engage anyone new because they’re not attracrive enough. It's absolutely better than what it was before, which was over $40 where I'm at, and it's setting at about the same preorder price as Time War 5 and 6 individually, which are both four episodes long per set like Dark Eyes was. Sadly new customers where I come are going to have to pay more than what I originally paid for these stories because of the price changes for overseas customers across the whole library and that does truly, truly suck. But at least it's as fair as it's going to be for everyone who misses the preorder period for new box sets and at least unlike new releases it's permanently reduced. I also doubt any newcomer is going to pay for the entire first series of Lucie upfront when there's the possibility said newcomer won't actually like them. Paying a around $5 for an episode isn't that big of a commitment and if you like the rest, it's much easier to budget out than around $9 or whatever amount it was before. It's why I wish Big Finish would offer the ability to purchase episodes from boxsets separately if we so desired because it's more newcomer friendly and because it's not a big investment. THAT would be my solution, but that's neither here nor there. I'm not saying these are the best prices you could ask for ever, but it's a big help for people who maybe want to listen to stories outside of the permanently reduced Monthly Adventures stories.
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Post by shallacatop on Nov 17, 2022 8:51:29 GMT
So you’d expect a new fan be prepared to spend £25 a set for Dark Eyes? Keeping in mind they could get a brand new Eighth Doctor release for that or have purchased for that price or less in their frequent sales of that series. Indeed, it’s actually priced higher than it cost when it was first out! Similarly it’s £30 for the first run of Lucie stories. Or a tenner to actually get the full first story. There’s a whole bit of difference between personally making a recommendation and then someone actually taking that recommendation on board and making the purchase. They may seem heavily discounted compared to what BF had them listed at, but that in itself doesn’t make them a deals. The prices here will not engage anyone new because they’re not attracrive enough. Sorry but I really disagree here. This has finally made the Eighth Doctor and Lucie stories accessible to me, and I'll be buying them later this month. Dark Eyes is now the same price as it was when it was released (i.e. the pre-order price), and that's especially significant when currently the £19.99/£24.99 model is applied to a boxset of three discs with one piece of cover art. Each Dark Eyes boxset is 5 discs with 5 pieces of artwork. It's great that it's made them accessible for you, but you are an established Big Finish customer and very much have the buy-in with them. That isn't what the target for these reductions are and they are not significant enough for new customers to jump on board. It would be £10 to get the first story alone - nobody who's been on the fence with BF before will suddenly decide to buy them with that. These aren't far off prices in previous sales and there's nothing free on offer to get a potential customer to sample and get that buy-in. Dark Eyes isn't the same price as it was when it was released. It was £20 when it was first released and I believe that was the price maintained throughout the four sets; we only went to £23 with Doom Coalition, if memory servers. An accurate comparison would be Stranded or the Time War, which have four stories for the same price and content as Dark Eyes. Not your attempt at comparing with Ninth or Tenth Doctor releases. Where's the appeal for a new fan to want to jump on board with these permanent reductions if they didn't already? As for discs and artwork? Does that really matter? One disc has been lost and the behind the scenes have been added to the end of their respective stories. And the artwork you wouldn't have a clue about until you'd made the purchase; it's hardly an appealing factor. These are sets that have been out for coming up to 8 years or more. They've more than made their money back and aren't flying out of the warehouse currently. And the best Big Finish can do is reduce them to similar prices to their current output? And that's meant to be appealing? It's half arsed.
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Post by shallacatop on Nov 17, 2022 8:58:01 GMT
So you’d expect a new fan be prepared to spend £25 a set for Dark Eyes? Keeping in mind they could get a brand new Eighth Doctor release for that or have purchased for that price or less in their frequent sales of that series. Indeed, it’s actually priced higher than it cost when it was first out! Similarly it’s £30 for the first run of Lucie stories. Or a tenner to actually get the full first story. There’s a whole bit of difference between personally making a recommendation and then someone actually taking that recommendation on board and making the purchase. They may seem heavily discounted compared to what BF had them listed at, but that in itself doesn’t make them a deals. The prices here will not engage anyone new because they’re not attracrive enough. It's absolutely better than what it was before, which was over $40 where I'm at, and it's setting at about the same preorder price as Time War 5 and 6 individually, which are both four episodes long per set like Dark Eyes was. Sadly new customers where I come are going to have to pay more than what I originally paid for these stories because of the price changes for overseas customers across the whole library and that does truly, truly suck. But at least it's as fair as it's going to be for everyone who misses the preorder period for new box sets and at least unlike new releases it's permanently reduced. I also doubt any newcomer is going to pay for the entire first series of Lucie upfront when there's the possibility said newcomer won't actually like them. Paying a around $5 for an episode isn't that big of a commitment and if you like the rest, it's much easier to budget out than around $9 or whatever amount it was before. It's why I wish Big Finish would offer the ability to purchase episodes from boxsets separately if we so desired because it's more newcomer friendly and because it's not a big investment. THAT would be my solution, but that's neither here nor there. I'm not saying these are the best prices you could ask for ever, but it's a big help for people who maybe want to listen to stories outside of the permanently reduced Monthly Adventures stories. It isn't better than it was before unless you're directly looking at the markup price Big Finish do. That isn't the product price - the pre-order price is the product price and BF only increase the price further to be able to market substantial discounts. The price of Dark Eyes is dearer than it was on release and its allegedly discounted price is directly comparable with Stranded or the two upcoming Time War sets. So how is it meant to appeal to brand new customers when they're offering nothing new? $5 / £5 / whatever isn't much of a commitment, I agree. But we're talking about brand new customers here. And that first Lucie season to get the very first story you need to purchase two releases, so $10 / £10 / whatever in total. Why would a new customer find that appealing if they've never come on board for the other output they've got? If I want to get into Big Finish and am prepared to spend a tenner, then I'd have already been a fan by buying something like Out of Time, etc. I can't agree that these are a big help because I can't see how they would appeal to someone who wants to get into Big Finish. There's far better ways to do it and this ain't it.
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lidar2
Castellan
You know, now that you mention it, I actually do rather like Attack of the Cybermen ...
Likes: 5,819
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Post by lidar2 on Nov 17, 2022 10:44:55 GMT
Sorry but I really disagree here. This has finally made the Eighth Doctor and Lucie stories accessible to me, and I'll be buying them later this month. Dark Eyes is now the same price as it was when it was released (i.e. the pre-order price), and that's especially significant when currently the £19.99/£24.99 model is applied to a boxset of three discs with one piece of cover art. Each Dark Eyes boxset is 5 discs with 5 pieces of artwork. It's great that it's made them accessible for you, but you are an established Big Finish customer and very much have the buy-in with them. That isn't what the target for these reductions are and they are not significant enough for new customers to jump on board. It would be £10 to get the first story alone - nobody who's been on the fence with BF before will suddenly decide to buy them with that. These aren't far off prices in previous sales and there's nothing free on offer to get a potential customer to sample and get that buy-in. Dark Eyes isn't the same price as it was when it was released. It was £20 when it was first released and I believe that was the price maintained throughout the four sets; we only went to £23 with Doom Coalition, if memory servers. An accurate comparison would be Stranded or the Time War, which have four stories for the same price and content as Dark Eyes. Not your attempt at comparing with Ninth or Tenth Doctor releases. Where's the appeal for a new fan to want to jump on board with these permanent reductions if they didn't already? As for discs and artwork? Does that really matter? One disc has been lost and the behind the scenes have been added to the end of their respective stories. And the artwork you wouldn't have a clue about until you'd made the purchase; it's hardly an appealing factor. These are sets that have been out for coming up to 8 years or more. They've more than made their money back and aren't flying out of the warehouse currently. And the best Big Finish can do is reduce them to similar prices to their current output? And that's meant to be appealing? It's half arsed. All 4 Dark Eyes were definitely £20 each for pre-order, and even after release the bundle price was still effectively £20 each. It was the same price for DL or CD at that time. I think however the £20 was maintained for Doom Coalition, it was Ravenous when it increased to £23.
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lidar2
Castellan
You know, now that you mention it, I actually do rather like Attack of the Cybermen ...
Likes: 5,819
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Post by lidar2 on Nov 17, 2022 10:48:13 GMT
It's absolutely better than what it was before, which was over $40 where I'm at, and it's setting at about the same preorder price as Time War 5 and 6 individually, which are both four episodes long per set like Dark Eyes was. Sadly new customers where I come are going to have to pay more than what I originally paid for these stories because of the price changes for overseas customers across the whole library and that does truly, truly suck. But at least it's as fair as it's going to be for everyone who misses the preorder period for new box sets and at least unlike new releases it's permanently reduced. I also doubt any newcomer is going to pay for the entire first series of Lucie upfront when there's the possibility said newcomer won't actually like them. Paying a around $5 for an episode isn't that big of a commitment and if you like the rest, it's much easier to budget out than around $9 or whatever amount it was before. It's why I wish Big Finish would offer the ability to purchase episodes from boxsets separately if we so desired because it's more newcomer friendly and because it's not a big investment. THAT would be my solution, but that's neither here nor there. I'm not saying these are the best prices you could ask for ever, but it's a big help for people who maybe want to listen to stories outside of the permanently reduced Monthly Adventures stories. It isn't better than it was before unless you're directly looking at the markup price Big Finish do. That isn't the product price - the pre-order price is the product price and BF only increase the price further to be able to market substantial discounts. The price of Dark Eyes is dearer than it was on release and its allegedly discounted price is directly comparable with Stranded or the two upcoming Time War sets. So how is it meant to appeal to brand new customers when they're offering nothing new? $5 / £5 / whatever isn't much of a commitment, I agree. But we're talking about brand new customers here. And that first Lucie season to get the very first story you need to purchase two releases, so $10 / £10 / whatever in total. Why would a new customer find that appealing if they've never come on board for the other output they've got? If I want to get into Big Finish and am prepared to spend a tenner, then I'd have already been a fan by buying something like Out of Time, etc. I can't agree that these are a big help because I can't see how they would appeal to someone who wants to get into Big Finish. There's far better ways to do it and this ain't it. I wonder if, for something as old as Dark Eyes, BF would't be better abandoning the box set concept and just sell individual episodes, with perhaps a discount and the bonus extras disc for anyone who buys all 4 episodes as a bundle/box set?
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Post by timleschild on Nov 17, 2022 10:50:17 GMT
All these little sales, BF really need to do a big push next year (60th anniversary, Disney+ streaming) with their social media, advertising & attempts to tap into the huge fanbase the show has around the world. We've had redacted on BBC, podcasts are popular. C'mon Big Finish DO SOMETHING!
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Post by mark687 on Nov 17, 2022 11:19:31 GMT
All these little sales, BF really need to do a big push next year (60th anniversary, Disney+ streaming) with their social media, advertising & attempts to tap into the huge fanbase the show has around the world. We've had redacted on BBC, podcasts are popular. C'mon Big Finish DO SOMETHING! What More could They do. The terms of Advertainment/Promotion are in the Licence Deal and Would You Buy More if They did it?! Regards mark687
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Post by mark687 on Nov 17, 2022 11:29:28 GMT
It isn't better than it was before unless you're directly looking at the markup price Big Finish do. That isn't the product price - the pre-order price is the product price and BF only increase the price further to be able to market substantial discounts. The price of Dark Eyes is dearer than it was on release and its allegedly discounted price is directly comparable with Stranded or the two upcoming Time War sets. So how is it meant to appeal to brand new customers when they're offering nothing new? $5 / £5 / whatever isn't much of a commitment, I agree. But we're talking about brand new customers here. And that first Lucie season to get the very first story you need to purchase two releases, so $10 / £10 / whatever in total. Why would a new customer find that appealing if they've never come on board for the other output they've got? If I want to get into Big Finish and am prepared to spend a tenner, then I'd have already been a fan by buying something like Out of Time, etc. I can't agree that these are a big help because I can't see how they would appeal to someone who wants to get into Big Finish. There's far better ways to do it and this ain't it. I wonder if, for something as old as Dark Eyes, BF would't be better abandoning the box set concept and just sell individual episodes, with perhaps a discount and the bonus extras disc for anyone who buys all 4 episodes as a bundle/box set? The Boxset concept is still the most viable Production wise Group to the same Actors doubling up for 3 or 4 stories at a time. plus 4 Disc case manufacture has always somehow worked out cheaper then 1 Disc Case. Regards mark687
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lidar2
Castellan
You know, now that you mention it, I actually do rather like Attack of the Cybermen ...
Likes: 5,819
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Post by lidar2 on Nov 17, 2022 11:40:45 GMT
I wonder if, for something as old as Dark Eyes, BF would't be better abandoning the box set concept and just sell individual episodes, with perhaps a discount and the bonus extras disc for anyone who buys all 4 episodes as a bundle/box set? The Boxset concept is still the most viable Production wise Group to the same Actors doubling up for 3 or 4 stories at a time. plus 4 Disc case manufacture has always somehow worked out cheaper then 1 Disc Case. Regards mark687 I get that, but I'm talking about older stuff like Dark Eyes, where the costs have been covered long ago and all sales now and in the future are pure profit for BF other than P&P costs for CDs. The original rationale for the box set concept no longer exists at this point in that release's life cycle, and from BF's point of view it is just about maximising sales revenue for that release (a cash cow to use the jargon) and possibly using it as a gateway to encourage customers to buy other releases. I'm asking if offering the option of individual episodes for box sets that are, say, 5+ years old, and this would likely apply for DL but not CD, would actually generate more revenue for BF going forward than continuing to sell it as box set only? That is the way they have done it for the 4DAs since 2018
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Post by timleschild on Nov 17, 2022 11:43:22 GMT
All these little sales, BF really need to do a big push next year (60th anniversary, Disney+ streaming) with their social media, advertising & attempts to tap into the huge fanbase the show has around the world. We've had redacted on BBC, podcasts are popular. C'mon Big Finish DO SOMETHING! What More could They do. The terms of Advertainment/Promotion are in the Licence Deal and Would You Buy More if They did it?! Regards mark687 Its not about me buying more, as I said its about "attempts to tap into the huge fanbase the show has around the world". BF seem content to just accept their current customer base. Look at the engagement in terms of likes retweets etc on their social media platform. Then again I guess changing from "We love stories" to "For the love of stories" boosted sales!
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Post by mark687 on Nov 17, 2022 11:50:51 GMT
The Boxset concept is still the most viable Production wise Group to the same Actors doubling up for 3 or 4 stories at a time. plus 4 Disc case manufacture has always somehow worked out cheaper then 1 Disc Case. Regards mark687 I get that, but I'm talking about older stuff like Dark Eyes, where the costs have been covered long ago and all sales now and in the future are pure profit for BF other than P&P costs for CDs. The original rationale for the box set concept no longer exists at this point in that release's life cycle, and from BF's point of view it is just about maximising sales revenue for that release (a cash cow to use the jargon) and possibly using it as a gateway to encourage customers to buy other releases. I'm asking if selling it as individual episodes for box sets that are, say, 5+ years old, and this would likely apply for DL but not CD, would actually generate more revenue for BF going forward than continuing to sell it as box set only? That is the way they have done it for the 4DAs since 2018 Ok with you now and agreed, though BF haven't confirmed they're doing for 4DA'S Series 13 in 2024. Regards mark687
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Post by mark687 on Nov 19, 2022 13:51:30 GMT
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