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Post by barnabaslives on Sept 19, 2016 15:24:36 GMT
Seemed to me like if these new policies end up discouraging direct CD sales, the CDs will be lingering on the shelves a lot longer, but even now they seem to be encouraging people to buy them after they've already sat on the shelves for 6-12 months as a way to keep from getting clobbered on shipping?
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Post by muckypup on Sept 19, 2016 16:05:09 GMT
I know I have said it before, but it looks like losing cd sales for overseas, is not that big a deal to them as it sounds like they don't make a bean on it.
It's annoying for all you guys but I don't sea any changes coming anytime soon. Nick has addresses it pretty fully and been honest about all the reasons.
Business is business and it looks like they have realised that if they don't make anything there's no point. All the changes we are surgesting don't fit with their business model, and changing it is not really a viable option for them.
Looks like you guys will have to console yourselves that you still get the best deal on downloads
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Post by elkawho on Sept 19, 2016 17:44:09 GMT
This weeks podcast has a response and buying ideas for the overseas customer. Option 1 if you want the CDs wait till a 6 or 12 story run, or whole series is released then buy it in one go in a Bundle/Sub for reduced postage and avoid online spoilers. Option 2 Switch to DL Option 3 for the US Customer Buy CDs from Alien Entertainment because they're "friends" of BF Regards mark687 For option 1, you may get reduced postage, but you also miss out on the pre-order price reduction.
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Post by fuurei on Sept 19, 2016 19:36:37 GMT
I know I have said it before, but it looks like losing cd sales for overseas, is not that big a deal to them as it sounds like they don't make a bean on it. It's annoying for all you guys but I don't sea any changes coming anytime soon. Nick has addresses it pretty fully and been honest about all the reasons. Business is business and it looks like they have realised that if they don't make anything there's no point. All the changes we are surgesting don't fit with their business model, and changing it is not really a viable option for them. Looks like you guys will have to console yourselves that you still get the best deal on downloads It's true -- we do get quite a good deal on downloads.
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Post by Audio Watchdog on Sept 19, 2016 20:45:08 GMT
So after hearing a whole bunch of no change coming, sucks for you guys living overseas....I'm going to pre-order the box sets but for the 4th Doctor, I'll download the series via BF and purchase the discs via Book Depository...and save some money doing it. Which is totally absurd. I may dump the Main Range altogether. And I still find it difficult to believe DHL is their best shipping option.
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Post by Audio Watchdog on Sept 19, 2016 20:48:31 GMT
Seemed to me like if these new policies end up discouraging direct CD sales, the CDs will be lingering on the shelves a lot longer, but even now they seem to be encouraging people to buy them after they've already sat on the shelves for 6-12 months as a way to keep from getting clobbered on shipping? Yes. For a company that has always said funding for their productions comes in no small part from people pre-ordering the items, this strikes me as running counter to that business model.
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Post by Audio Watchdog on Sept 19, 2016 20:49:51 GMT
This weeks podcast has a response and buying ideas for the overseas customer. Option 1 if you want the CDs wait till a 6 or 12 story run, or whole series is released then buy it in one go in a Bundle/Sub for reduced postage and avoid online spoilers. Option 2 Switch to DL Option 3 for the US Customer Buy CDs from Alien Entertainment because they're "friends" of BF Regards mark687 For option 1, you may get reduced postage, but you also miss out on the pre-order price reduction. And for that reason, maybe its time for one price across the board.
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Post by kimalysong on Sept 19, 2016 21:16:46 GMT
Well to make things fairer I think it would be nice if digital customers could start getting things like the booklets that come in the CD in digital form.
For example I got the 10th Doctor limited edition digital only and didn't get the booklet that came with the hard copy. Now personally I was fine with this but with these increased costs and a lot of Int'l customers being forced to go digital it might be nice if supplementary material included with the CD is now also included with the digital release.
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Post by muckypup on Sept 19, 2016 21:23:56 GMT
Seemed to me like if these new policies end up discouraging direct CD sales, the CDs will be lingering on the shelves a lot longer, but even now they seem to be encouraging people to buy them after they've already sat on the shelves for 6-12 months as a way to keep from getting clobbered on shipping? Yes. For a company that has always said funding for their productions comes in no small part from people pre-ordering the items, this strikes me as running counter to that business model. i am sure BF would love to have your Pre-Order money but if it costs more to send those disks than they get from selling them, i makes no sense. how ever much they want your custom, they have to make sound business decisions. its the couriers we should really be mad with they are the ones who have hiked up the prices over the last 5 years. BF have tried to keep their price the same! someone always gets upset when policies have to change, i was livid when i found out that AUS downloads were almost 50% cheaper and US were were about 30% if you did a straight pounds to $ conversion. if they could I am sure they would give everyone the CD's for free because they are proud of them (& rightly so), but it's a fact that they only get made because we pay for them. there is no fat cat's taking a bite out of the profits, few staff but good will from all involved. what ever they do we always want more and cheaper. it's a crappy situation i know but unfortunately for now it's one we will have to live with.
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Post by muckypup on Sept 19, 2016 21:30:23 GMT
Well to make things fairer I think it would be nice if digital customers could start getting things like the booklets that come in the CD in digital form. For example I got the 10th Doctor limited edition digital only and didn't get the booklet that came with the hard copy. Now personally I was fine with this but with these increased costs and a lot of Int'l customers being forced to go digital it might be nice if supplementary material included with the CD is now also included with the digital release. agree when it's a special release i think you need a digital booklet..... i think with the main range with the writers notes being online it seems a bit redundant these days. and thank goodness they have finally listen to all the grumping and given us a square main cover for the boxsets.
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Post by Whovitt on Sept 19, 2016 21:32:02 GMT
This weeks podcast has a response and buying ideas for the overseas customer. Option 1 if you want the CDs wait till a 6 or 12 story run, or whole series is released then buy it in one go in a Bundle/Sub for reduced postage and avoid online spoilers. Option 2 Switch to DL Option 3 for the US Customer Buy CDs from Alien Entertainment because they're "friends" of BF Regards mark687 For option 1, you may get reduced postage, but you also miss out on the pre-order price reduction. When it comes to subs, you're better off waiting for the series to be released and then getting the bundle/retro sub, as the gargantuan drop in shipping makes the saving on the pre-order trivial (a saving you don't notice due to the massive shipping costs).
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Post by Audio Watchdog on Sept 19, 2016 21:54:14 GMT
Yes. For a company that has always said funding for their productions comes in no small part from people pre-ordering the items, this strikes me as running counter to that business model. i am sure BF would love to have your Pre-Order money but if it costs more to send those disks than they get from selling them, i makes no sense. how ever much they want your custom, they have to make sound business decisions. its the couriers we should really be mad with they are the ones who have hiked up the prices over the last 5 years. BF have tried to keep their price the same! someone always gets upset when policies have to change, i was livid when i found out that AUS downloads were almost 50% cheaper and US were were about 30% if you did a straight pounds to $ conversion. if they could they I am sure they would give everyone the CD's for free because they are proud of them (& rightly so), but it's a fact that they only get made because we pay for them. there is no fat cat's taking a bite out of the profits, few staff but good will from all involved. what ever they do we always want more and cheaper. it's a crappy situation i know but unfortunately for now it's one we will have to live with. I'm not asking for free. As I have stated several times, I understand BF has a business to run and they need to do things that keep that business healthy and profitable. I would also argue they need to do things which grow their business and not contract it as well as keeping an eye on costs, so that they are addressed when they occur and not three years after those costs increase, which in turn forces them to make changes all at once which rightly ticks off a lot of their international customer base. I make a sizable portion of my living in the arts. I know how tight the margins are and how small the room for error often is, so please don't think I live in some fantasyworld or that I think this is something that is personal. As is so often the case with BF it is the how things are communicated to the people who have subscribed and remained loyal customers. And how once that news is delivered, how they respond to the outcry from their customer base. It is ridiculous that I can purchase these items twice, download from BF and physical CD from another retailer, and pay less than buying it all from BF. As has also been noted a few times, BF is already one of the most expensive shipping options for those of us buying from Europe, there have to be other options out there. And it speaks to the devotion that I and other fans have that we want BF to see money directly. Anyway, I also know they are hamstrung by the web site they have. Granted this has been a problem since they rolled the current web site out a few years ago but that is another discussion. All it would take would be a word from BF that they are looking at and for alternatives. So yeah, lots of frustration. So I take it out here among friends. Maybe I should stop doing that.
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Post by muckypup on Sept 19, 2016 22:47:05 GMT
i am sure BF would love to have your Pre-Order money but if it costs more to send those disks than they get from selling them, i makes no sense. how ever much they want your custom, they have to make sound business decisions. its the couriers we should really be mad with they are the ones who have hiked up the prices over the last 5 years. BF have tried to keep their price the same! someone always gets upset when policies have to change, i was livid when i found out that AUS downloads were almost 50% cheaper and US were were about 30% if you did a straight pounds to $ conversion. if they could they I am sure they would give everyone the CD's for free because they are proud of them (& rightly so), but it's a fact that they only get made because we pay for them. there is no fat cat's taking a bite out of the profits, few staff but good will from all involved. what ever they do we always want more and cheaper. it's a crappy situation i know but unfortunately for now it's one we will have to live with. I'm not asking for free. As I have stated several times, I understand BF has a business to run and they need to do things that keep that business healthy and profitable. I would also argue they need to do things which grow their business and not contract it as well as keeping an eye on costs, so that they are addressed when they occur and not three years after those costs increase, which in turn forces them to make changes all at once which rightly ticks off a lot of their international customer base. I make a sizable portion of my living in the arts. I know how tight the margins are and how small the room for error often is, so please don't think I live in some fantasyworld or that I think this is something that is personal. As is so often the case with BF it is the how things are communicated to the people who have subscribed and remained loyal customers. And how once that news is delivered, how they respond to the outcry from their customer base. It is ridiculous that I can purchase these items twice, download from BF and physical CD from another retailer, and pay less than buying it all from BF. As has also been noted a few times, BF is already one of the most expensive shipping options for those of us buying from Europe, there have to be other options out there. And it speaks to the devotion that I and other fans have that we want BF to see money directly. Anyway, I also know they are hamstrung by the web site they have. Granted this has been a problem since they rolled the current web site out a few years ago but that is another discussion. All it would take would be a word from BF that they are looking at and for alternatives. So yeah, lots of frustration. So I take it out here among friends. Maybe I should stop doing that. You keep moaning, all views are good i understand how frustrating this is but to be honest reliable shipping overseas we are not falling over lots of companies, Royal Mail is over £10 to USA, most of the others won't give you rates without parcel dimensions etc, but a small 250 gram parcel tracked to USA was quoted £14 by dhl. but yes I agree that shipping to Europe is way to expensive, & am not sure why they have taken the dhl route for Europe as that's still quite inexpensive to use Royal Mail at least for single cd's. i still think this is a push for oversea to go digital, with all the uncertainty after brexit. i think it's a getting a bit messy & confusing with these rates best advice is stick to digital and think long and hard if you really need the physical, sometimes your money is too precious to waste. i have not regretted my change to digital, I never opened a cd since they gave a free download, all wrapped in boxes about 5 years worth....madness
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Post by Audio Watchdog on Sept 19, 2016 23:08:17 GMT
I'm not asking for free. As I have stated several times, I understand BF has a business to run and they need to do things that keep that business healthy and profitable. I would also argue they need to do things which grow their business and not contract it as well as keeping an eye on costs, so that they are addressed when they occur and not three years after those costs increase, which in turn forces them to make changes all at once which rightly ticks off a lot of their international customer base. I make a sizable portion of my living in the arts. I know how tight the margins are and how small the room for error often is, so please don't think I live in some fantasyworld or that I think this is something that is personal. As is so often the case with BF it is the how things are communicated to the people who have subscribed and remained loyal customers. And how once that news is delivered, how they respond to the outcry from their customer base. It is ridiculous that I can purchase these items twice, download from BF and physical CD from another retailer, and pay less than buying it all from BF. As has also been noted a few times, BF is already one of the most expensive shipping options for those of us buying from Europe, there have to be other options out there. And it speaks to the devotion that I and other fans have that we want BF to see money directly. Anyway, I also know they are hamstrung by the web site they have. Granted this has been a problem since they rolled the current web site out a few years ago but that is another discussion. All it would take would be a word from BF that they are looking at and for alternatives. So yeah, lots of frustration. So I take it out here among friends. Maybe I should stop doing that. You keep moaning, all views are good i understand how frustrating this is but to be honest reliable shipping overseas we are not falling over lots of companies, Royal Mail is over £10 to USA, most of the others won't give you rates without parcel dimensions etc, but a small 250 gram parcel tracked to USA was quoted £14 by dhl. but yes I agree that shipping to Europe is way to expensive, & am not sure why they have taken the dhl route for Europe as that's still quite inexpensive to use Royal Mail at least for single cd's. i still think this is a push for oversea to go digital, with all the uncertainty after brexit. i think it's a getting a bit messy & confusing with these rates best advice is stick to digital and think long and hard if you really need the physical, sometimes your money is too precious to waste. i have not regretted my change to digital, I never opened a cd since they gave a free download, all wrapped in boxes about 5 years worth....madness Yes, I am definitely moaning. No doubt about it. And I'm being told by people what I need to start doing. I've been collecting physical media of some form or fashion since I was five years old and I bought my first issue of the Fantastic Four at the drug store next to my doctor's office. I still have that issue by the way. So 47 years later, wanting to open a package, to hold something in my hand or file it on a shelf isn't something I'm going to give up easily or without a healthy amount of moaning. Fantastic Four #89
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Post by barnabaslives on Sept 20, 2016 2:30:41 GMT
it's a crappy situation i know but unfortunately for now it's one we will have to live with. And learn to make the best of I guess... I think there are still some ways of looking at things or arranging purchases to ease the hardship becoming apparent. I just need to stop letting it annoy me so much that we've all got saddled with something nobody wanted, and worry me so much that it's going to do more harm than good to BF. Hopefully they will roll with the punches alright too.
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Post by redsharkJason on Sept 20, 2016 4:25:34 GMT
Royal Mail 250g parcel shipping to Canada and USA: (without discount) It currently costs £5.00 for 1 subscription CD and £8.00 for 1 non-subscription CD to be internationally sent from Big Finish. It will be interesting to see, if Big Finish *actually* utilizes the more costly and weaker customer service DHL courier to deliver 1 CD in a jiffy bag! I'm guessing that it is in Big Finish's interest to make use of DHL only because of a large enough mailing discount given within an advantageous contract. If so, I'm certainly going to miss my monthly CD subscriptions being delivered into my mailbox by Canada Post. My "Big Finish" larger parcel experiences with DHL mostly haven't been pleasant. Amazon.co.uk, Book Depository, Galaxy 4, The Who Shop, Forbidden Planet, Reeltime Pictures, Bafflegab, Who One, Fantom Films, Candy Jar, Black Library and Spiteful Puppet definitely have not used DHL for small sized item orders to be sent to my humble address in Canada. US companies: Who North America, Alien Entertainment, Mike's Comics and GraphicAudio do not use DHL for small or large orders to be sent to Canada.
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Post by coffeeaddict on Sept 20, 2016 11:32:19 GMT
Well to make things fairer I think it would be nice if digital customers could start getting things like the booklets that come in the CD in digital form. For example I got the 10th Doctor limited edition digital only and didn't get the booklet that came with the hard copy. Now personally I was fine with this but with these increased costs and a lot of Int'l customers being forced to go digital it might be nice if supplementary material included with the CD is now also included with the digital release. agree when it's a special release i think you need a digital booklet..... i think with the main range with the writers notes being online it seems a bit redundant these days. and thank goodness they have finally listen to all the grumping and given us a square main cover for the boxsets. I have asked about this in the past and received a reply from Ian stating that this isn't done due to concerns about the material then being passed around for free.
While I agree that pirating is a concern, I found the response interesting when there isn't much stopping people from sharing the download or ripping the CD and passing it along to others free of charge.
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Post by muckypup on Sept 20, 2016 13:00:37 GMT
agree when it's a special release i think you need a digital booklet..... i think with the main range with the writers notes being online it seems a bit redundant these days. and thank goodness they have finally listen to all the grumping and given us a square main cover for the boxsets. I have asked about this in the past and received a reply from Ian stating that this isn't done due to concerns about the material then being passed around for free.
While I agree that pirating is a concern, I found the response interesting when there isn't much stopping people from sharing the download or ripping the CD and passing it along to others free of charge.
I agree piracy has been used as a reason for not giving cd booklets, since downloads first came about. not sure it holds much water these days, not sure it has ever stopped anyone downloading it because it has no booklet. hell i would even be happy if it was personally watermarked like the scripts....but when you do buy a special edition download, you don't get a reduction which compensates for not getting access to a large portion of the products value. The 10th Doc & Prisoner are prime examples. Download has often felt like 2nd class in the specials with no booklets, artwork that's not sized properly. even if you don't get a booklet for most of the ranges specials are somewhere it should be included
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Post by Audio Watchdog on Sept 20, 2016 18:20:48 GMT
Royal Mail 250g parcel shipping to Canada and USA: (without discount) It currently costs £5.00 for 1 subscription CD and £8.00 for 1 non-subscription CD to be internationally sent from Big Finish. It will be interesting to see, if Big Finish *actually* utilizes the more costly and weaker customer service DHL courier to deliver 1 CD in a jiffy bag! I'm guessing that it is in Big Finish's interest to make use of DHL only because of a large enough mailing discount given within an advantageous contract. If so, I'm certainly going to miss my monthly CD subscriptions being delivered into my mailbox by Canada Post. My "Big Finish" larger parcel experiences with DHL mostly haven't been pleasant. Amazon.co.uk, Book Depository, Galaxy 4, The Who Shop, Forbidden Planet, Reeltime Pictures, Bafflegab, Who One, Fantom Films, Candy Jar, Black Library and Spiteful Puppet definitely have not used DHL for small sized item orders to be sent to my humble address in Canada. US companies: Who North America, Alien Entertainment, Mike's Comics and GraphicAudio do not use DHL for small or large orders to be sent to Canada. Stop with the facts and sarcasm. You're just making me crankier.
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Post by Digi on Sept 20, 2016 20:47:26 GMT
Incidentally, in this week's podcast Nick specifically mentioned Alien Entertainment as a partner/friend of Big Finish.
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