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Post by muckypup on Jul 5, 2018 18:12:21 GMT
I am afraid this will go the way of the other big licences they have tried...…..one or two release then that's it.....cause everyone says they want them but no one buys them! Looking at responses to the news on Big Finish Twitter feed, lots of people reacting OTT as if Christmas has come early. It's gonna be a blockbuster if they are sincere people. For myself, Star Trek is anything with William Shatner and Leonard Nimoy in it, to be of interest. That leaves the Animated Series as the only significant gap on my shelf. I have tried so many times over the years, but all other tangents such as TNG & DS9 never strike me as any more than spin-off or 'license extension'. A bit like if we had got 'Son of Dr Who' instead of regeneration. Or replaced Doctor Who with a soapy saga set on Gallifrey with a few former companions & guest stars. Just like the reactions were for stargate, and highlander to some extent........also we can put the dr who novel adaptions in this too. but sadly sales were less than the reactions would have lead you to believe they would have been. but I hope it does get the sales, would be good for bf to have another big title range.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 5, 2018 18:27:20 GMT
I am afraid this will go the way of the other big licences they have tried...…..one or two release then that's it.....cause everyone says they want them but no one buys them! Maybe a bit unfair - Iit's not an issue of people not being interested in Trek and unwilling to buy, but of this tiny corner of it - straight readings of German novels. If they'd gotten the licence to do full cast Trek from Enterprise to post Nemesis, the keys to the Kingdom, then a lot of BF fandom would have gone nuts including a lot of us here. But this is like thinking you have the Doctor Who licence then it turns out it's only to adapt stories with John and Gillian from the First Doctor comics of the 60s. A niche of a niche.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 5, 2018 18:28:42 GMT
Looking at responses to the news on Big Finish Twitter feed, lots of people reacting OTT as if Christmas has come early. It's gonna be a blockbuster if they are sincere people. For myself, Star Trek is anything with William Shatner and Leonard Nimoy in it, to be of interest. That leaves the Animated Series as the only significant gap on my shelf. I have tried so many times over the years, but all other tangents such as TNG & DS9 never strike me as any more than spin-off or 'license extension'. A bit like if we had got 'Son of Dr Who' instead of regeneration. Or replaced Doctor Who with a soapy saga set on Gallifrey with a few former companions & guest stars. Just like the reactions were for stargate, and highlander to some extent........also we can put the dr who novel adaptions in this too. but sadly sales were less than the reactions would have lead you to believe they would have been. but I hope it does get the sales, would be good for bf to have another big title range. Well that's right - The Bernice Summerfield started BF off by demonstrating their chops to the BBC as a capable outfit. Perhaps there is a bigger licence coming up and this has been pushed through to ensure the company is considered for the job. Don't get me wrong - I don't consider the spin-offs of ST bad sci-fi, it's just that I see each as separate entity. Reading Jonny Morris' TNG Trek watch on twitter, it seems there were a lot of strictly average episodes to wade through to get the gems. Good drama with original cast members of any of the TV series would be a sure bet for Big Finish sales wise, as there is a big following of these. It is possible that this is a small investment towards that end.
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Post by Audio Watchdog on Jul 5, 2018 20:12:24 GMT
Well that's right - The Bernice Summerfield started BF off by demonstrating their chops to the BBC as a capable outfit. Perhaps there is a bigger licence coming up and this has been pushed through to ensure the company is considered for the job. Don't get me wrong - I don't consider the spin-offs of ST bad sci-fi, it's just that I see each as separate entity. Reading Jonny Morris' TNG Trek watch on twitter, it seems there were a lot of strictly average episodes to wade through to get the gems. Good drama with original cast members of any of the TV series would be a sure bet for Big Finish sales wise, as there is a big following of these. It is possible that this is a small investment towards that end. Anyone who thinks Star Trek: Deep Space Nine is a bad spin-off didn't make it past the first season. The show remains my gold standard for Trek TV series. Hell, for the movies as well. DS9 is king of the hill.
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Post by mark687 on Jul 5, 2018 20:25:22 GMT
Well that's right - The Bernice Summerfield started BF off by demonstrating their chops to the BBC as a capable outfit. Perhaps there is a bigger licence coming up and this has been pushed through to ensure the company is considered for the job. Don't get me wrong - I don't consider the spin-offs of ST bad sci-fi, it's just that I see each as separate entity. Reading Jonny Morris' TNG Trek watch on twitter, it seems there were a lot of strictly average episodes to wade through to get the gems. Good drama with original cast members of any of the TV series would be a sure bet for Big Finish sales wise, as there is a big following of these. It is possible that this is a small investment towards that end. Anyone who thinks Star Trek: Deep Space Nine is a bad spin-off didn't make it past the first season. The show remains my gold standard for Trek TV series. Hell, for the movies as well. DS9 is king of the hill. I'd go further once you past Storyteller even season 1 is strong.
Regards
mark687
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Post by barnabaslives on Jul 5, 2018 20:29:09 GMT
Not that anything may come of it, but just maybe it could be the start of something for Big Finish (like Bernice) and it might be good for them to have it on their resume just in case?
I'm still trying to figure out if I want in on it, though - I've pretty much washed my hands of the franchise quite some time ago. I thought the casting and characters for TNG were great but the show pulled some lame moves and turned out some real klinker stories IMHO (and the apparent joke attempt -?- of Bones > Crusher just gets more trite with each passing year). I had some good times with TNG but not very sure I'd want to revisit it unless there's new and consistently higher quality material.
I might even like DS9 better than TNG (awful stock wormhole visual aside), I was actually thinking recently of trying to pick up where I left off (I moved out into the countryside and lost the TV signal - remember those, with the antenna, coathanger and tinfoil? - right about when Sisko was becoming some sort of religious figure) after being reminded by BF that Chase Masterson was in it, but I don't know if I'll ever be able to connect well with Voyager or Enterprise. I don't really need to reconnect with the OS (I could probably just watch that from memory if I wanted, having seen repeats x 20) but it also occurred to me recently that there's probably some enjoyment left for me in rewatching the OS/TNG movies.
I'm still toying with the idea of the Prometheus audiobooks just because it's something different and it's Alec Newman (who's awesome in Dark Shadows and who even played My Hero Barnabas in an uncirculated remake pilot), but to be perfectly honest I'm waiting in part for the price to figure out what it is - it looks like 25 for the bundle on the news page but 30 on the bundle page? Silly to haggle over a fiver, but that's about my level of enthusiasm at the moment that for 25 I might think about it and for 30 I might rather forget it, at least for now.
(I'm also so on the fence about it that just the trailer starting off with a cosmology lecture was almost a sticking point in itself, it must be near the pinnacle of human arrogance to think we can measure creation with our puny little tape measures and I'm of the fervent opinion that science and arrogance mix like drinking and driving. I actually had to stop the trailer right there - but I think I can figure out how to work fast forward if I squint?)
Sorry to be so short on excitement (I do hope I'm in the minority with that). I'm trying to be thrilled about this because it really is Big News in its own way, but idle curiosity and half an open mind seems to be about all the Trekkie I can muster so far.
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Post by Audio Watchdog on Jul 5, 2018 20:30:16 GMT
Anyone who thinks Star Trek: Deep Space Nine is a bad spin-off didn't make it past the first season. The show remains my gold standard for Trek TV series. Hell, for the movies as well. DS9 is king of the hill. I'd go further once you past Storyteller even season is strong.
Regards
mark687
I'm in the midst of a complete series rewatch and just got past Move Along Home and by past, I mean I fast forwarded through it. Still, the pilot episode is outstanding. The Emissary is the first time I can remember a TV show diving so deeply into PTSD as subject matter. And of course, The Nagus is the show's first classic episode.
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Post by mark687 on Jul 5, 2018 20:41:51 GMT
I'd go further once you past Storyteller even season is strong.
Regards
mark687
I'm in the midst of a complete series rewatch and just got past Move Along Home and by past, I mean I fast forwarded through it. Still, the pilot episode is outstanding. The Emissary is the first time I can remember a TV show diving so deeply into PTSD as subject matter. And of course, The Nagus is the show's first classic episode. Snap in regards to The Negus and then later you've got the brilliant "Duet" a brilliant character study for Kira (who for me was the least interesting character up till then.)
Regards
mark687
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Post by Audio Watchdog on Jul 5, 2018 20:48:57 GMT
Love Duet. Harris Yullin is so good in it. If you have never read it, or seen it, I would recommend tracking down The Man in the Glass Booth by Robert Shaw as it was clearly a Star Trek version of that play.
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Post by randomjc on Jul 5, 2018 21:03:43 GMT
*grumbles at putting DS9 above TNG*
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Post by Deleted on Jul 5, 2018 21:40:10 GMT
*grumbles at putting DS9 above TNG* DS9 above TNG? Each to their own of course, but I'd agree with your grumble. We say No, Nay, Never, to that sort of thing here!
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Post by x2magneto on Jul 5, 2018 21:40:24 GMT
Love Duet. Harris Yullin is so good in it. If you have never read it, or seen it, I would recommend tracking down The Man in the Glass Booth by Robert Shaw as it was clearly a Star Trek version of that play. Duet remains, I think, the finest hour of Star Trek to date. It's an interesting piece of derivative fiction too, in that it inverts the man central to the Glass Booth story to tell a tale just as heart wrenching...not to spoiler too much for anybody.
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Post by Audio Watchdog on Jul 5, 2018 21:49:04 GMT
*grumbles at putting DS9 above TNG* I don’t think it is even close. DS9 is a show that is morally complex and nuanced in a way that Next Gen never came close to approaching. And I say this as someone who was there every week for an episode of Next Gen.
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Post by randomjc on Jul 5, 2018 21:54:11 GMT
*grumbles at putting DS9 above TNG* I don’t think it is even close. DS9 is a show that is morally complex and nuanced in a way that Next Gen never came close to approaching. And I say this as someone who was there every week for an episode of Next Gen. While I can agree that DS9 was the darker and certainly explored far more morally complex themes than TNG, I don't think that makes it a better show. I think the highs of Star Trek are in TNG. I also think the lows are in TNG as well. But push comes to shove, I'd rather watch a random episode of TNG than most of DS9.
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Post by Audio Watchdog on Jul 5, 2018 22:16:04 GMT
I don’t think it is even close. DS9 is a show that is morally complex and nuanced in a way that Next Gen never came close to approaching. And I say this as someone who was there every week for an episode of Next Gen. While I can agree that DS9 was the darker and certainly explored far more morally complex themes than TNG, I don't think that makes it a better show. I think the highs of Star Trek are in TNG. I also think the lows are in TNG as well. But push comes to shove, I'd rather watch a random episode of TNG than most of DS9. I respect that and I will gladly acknowledge that I view both shows through the eyes of a director/actor/writer. Something I have always preached about are the consequences of actions and the dramatic through line. I would make the case that DS9 is, at its heart, a show about consequences. Next Gen & DS9 really are the products of two very different schools of breaking & telling a story. DS9 is a much more modern show that builds on the actions taken buy its cast & character dynamics. I think there are a lot of joys to be found in various episodes of Next Gen but I return to DS9 because, taken as a whole, it feels more like a cohesive story.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 5, 2018 22:25:31 GMT
I'm with Audio - DS9 all the way. I LOVE TNG but DS9 was, to me, just better drama that had lasting consequences and development. TNG could have a gorgeous ep like The Inner Light or Tapestry and then never touch on the character growth in them again. A product of a more episodic age, sure but DS9's characters learned and evolved far more than in TNG.
I mean it took them 7 years to invite Picard to a Poker game as every ep essentially soft-rebooted to the detached-authoritarian Captain regardless of what happened the week before. And the complete lack of development of the Crusher-Picard and Riker-Troi relationships was really testament to how much TNG - maybe understandably as a show made for syndication - wasn't as interested in growth. Look what Picard endured in Best Of Both Worlds, they gave him an episode (Family) to recover then he was just Jean-Luc again. Wheras when Sisko goes through In The Pale Moonlight or For The Uniform changes the character.
Bluntly, DS9 could have done an Inner Light, Darmok or Chain Of Command but TNG could never have done half of the Dominion War or Prophet stories.
Though, honestly, some of my all time fave Trek is in TNG. It did crazy, oddball stuff like Remember Me, Clues, Cause And Effect, A Matter Of Time, Schisms, Rascals, Phantasms and Parallels that I just love. And Darmok might be my fave Trek ep ever.
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Post by randomjc on Jul 5, 2018 22:31:45 GMT
While I can agree that DS9 was the darker and certainly explored far more morally complex themes than TNG, I don't think that makes it a better show. I think the highs of Star Trek are in TNG. I also think the lows are in TNG as well. But push comes to shove, I'd rather watch a random episode of TNG than most of DS9. I respect that and I will gladly acknowledge that I view both shows through the eyes of a director/actor/writer. Something I have always preached about are the consequences of actions and the dramatic through line. I would make the case that DS9 is, at its heart, a show about consequences. Next Gen & DS9 really are the products of two very different schools of breaking & telling a story. DS9 is a much more modern show that builds on the actions taken buy its cast & character dynamics. I think there are a lot of joys to be found in various episodes of Next Gen but I return to DS9 because, taken as a whole, it feels more like a cohesive story. I couldn't agree more that DS9 is very much a modern show, and that's the root of why I don't enjoy it as much. I don't feel as comfortable just watching an episode because it's a show with that through line and it feels like I need to watch multiple episodes to enjoy it. Like picking up a long running novel series, the first few are relatively stand alone, but the more that's written, the more it's weighed down by it's own continuity. I like TNG more because I don't have to view the whole, but just enjoy the episode. Because while I like those series long stories and over arching plots. I can only do them once. Shows that are more episodic than serial I just enjoy more. Just my style. I feel I should clarify that the grumble was meant to be humorous rather than any serious condemnation of anyone's favorite Star Trek. I'm just glad no one is arguing in favor of Enterprise. That was a joke, I liked Enterprise and Voyager well enough. Strangely I like TOS the least, having not seen TAS, or Discovery. But totally looking forward to whatever this rumored ST with Patrick Stewert is.
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Post by Audio Watchdog on Jul 5, 2018 22:32:17 GMT
Though, honestly, some of my all time fave Trek is in TNG. It did crazy, oddball stuff like Remember Me, Clues, Cause And Effect, A Matter Of Time, Schisms, Rascals, Phantasms and Parallels that I just love. And Darmok might be my fave Trek ep ever. If I want to watch a Next Gen episode, I'll pop in a disc and just watch something specific. If I want to watch DS9, it means I need to set aside viewing for a couple of weeks at least because it is like reading a book. I start at the beginning and watch until the end. Both have their pleasures but I find DS9 the more satisfying experience.
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Post by Digi on Jul 5, 2018 22:33:19 GMT
While I can agree that DS9 was the darker and certainly explored far more morally complex themes than TNG, I don't think that makes it a better show. I think the highs of Star Trek are in TNG. I also think the lows are in TNG as well. But push comes to shove, I'd rather watch a random episode of TNG than most of DS9. Next Gen & DS9 really are the products of two very different schools of breaking & telling a story. DS9 is a much more modern show that builds on the actions taken buy its cast & character dynamics. I think there are a lot of joys to be found in various episodes of Next Gen but I return to DS9 because, taken as a whole, it feels more like a cohesive story. Spot-on.
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Post by Audio Watchdog on Jul 5, 2018 22:35:43 GMT
I like TNG more because I don't have to view the whole, but just enjoy the episode. Because while I like those series long stories and over arching plots. I can only do them once. Shows that are more episodic than serial I just enjoy more. Just my style. I feel I should clarify that the grumble was meant to be humorous rather than any serious condemnation of anyone's favorite Star Trek. I'm just glad no one is arguing in favor of Enterprise. That was a joke, I liked Enterprise and Voyager well enough. Strangely I like TOS the least, having not seen TAS, or Discovery. But totally looking forward to whatever this rumored ST with Patrick Stewert is. I lost interest in both Voyager and Enterprise. I think there are a couple of the animated shows that stand with the very best of Trek although most if it is kind of rubbish. I've yet to see any of Discovery and that has more to do with my resistance to subscribing to the CBS streaming service rather than any Trek related reason. I hope for an eventual blu-ray release.
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