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Post by dalekbuster523finish on May 28, 2017 10:30:18 GMT
i really have a problem with the "president" stuff, It seems to go against everything the doctor is. The doctor has always been the man in the background working it all out, not the president! It feels a lazy shortcut to get the doctor to the problem with out having a credible story to get him there. The Doctor wasn't made President of Earth by choice. He was told that he was in a throwaway comment in Dark Water/Death In Heaven. That's entirely what I would expect worldwide governments to do also, forcing him into the position rather than asking someone who would likely decline. I'm totally convinced. I thought his speech in The Zygon Invasion/Inversion for example was one of the strongest scenes in the show's history, and that was entirely down to Peter Capaldi's acting. I also disagree that he has had some of the worst stories. Listen, Dark Water/Death In Heaven and Knock Knock are among some of the show's best. It's all just individual opinions of course but I really don't know how anyone couldn't possibly like Peter Capaldi or say that he has been hampered with poor stories.
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Post by kimalysong on May 28, 2017 12:46:19 GMT
It was an enjoyable episode but the whole world ending plot/ dangerous Bacteria entering the world ended up being pretty pointless. The whole storyline of this episode was really just to get the Doctor to a situation where his blindness would leave him helpless and Bill would then have to make a deal with the Monks. The ending was powerful but I am not sure if the lead up to it really was for me. Maybe if the episode was more intimate from the start t might have been stronger for it. The Monks are interesting villains though. I like the idea that you need the give consent to them for them to have power over you. I do like moral condundrums like that. In what situation would you be so hopeless that you might consider doing this? On a side note there were some good lines mostly from Nardole. But I did like that they got in a line about the Orange President .
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Post by muckypup on May 28, 2017 15:04:13 GMT
i really have a problem with the "president" stuff, It seems to go against everything the doctor is. The doctor has always been the man in the background working it all out, not the president! It feels a lazy shortcut to get the doctor to the problem with out having a credible story to get him there. The Doctor wasn't made President of Earth by choice. He was told that he was in a throwaway comment in Dark Water/Death In Heaven. That's entirely what I would expect worldwide governments to do also, forcing him into the position rather than asking someone who would likely decline. I'm totally convinced. I thought his speech in The Zygon Invasion/Inversion for example was one of the strongest scenes in the show's history, and that was entirely down to Peter Capaldi's acting. I also disagree that he has had some of the worst stories. Listen, Dark Water/Death In Heaven and Knock Knock are among some of the show's best. It's all just individual opinions of course but I really don't know how anyone couldn't possibly like Peter Capaldi or say that he has been hampered with poor stories. The zygon speech was one of capald's moments of greatness.....so we can agree on that i loved, Face the Raven another moment of greatness but it then went on to spoil all the good work with two of my most arhhhhh episodes. dark water, death in heaven (they are the missy & cybermen stories?) were certainly not a highlight for me in fact I am not keen on any missy episodes but the dead turning into cybermen not good for me!
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Post by fingersmash on May 28, 2017 15:52:40 GMT
I really enjoyed it. I like this slowly paced 3 part thriller so far. Extremis was the set up, this was the plan, and next week we get to see how the plan fails.
Bill and Missy teaming up is going to be quite fun as well.
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Post by Tim Bradley on May 28, 2017 17:38:24 GMT
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Post by dalekbuster523finish on May 28, 2017 19:23:49 GMT
I really enjoyed it. I like this slowly paced 3 part thriller so far. Extremis was the set up, this was the plan, and next week we get to see how the plan fails. Bill and Missy teaming up is going to be quite fun as well. Bill will probably be quite naive given she doesn't really know anything about Missy, and Missy will use that to her advantage. Maybe Missy manipulates her into shooting The Doctor, similar to how Malcolm Merlyn on Arrow had his daughter Thea take a mind-altering drug and kill Sara Lance ?
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aztec
Chancellery Guard
Likes: 2,849
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Post by aztec on May 28, 2017 20:46:38 GMT
Hello again. Just spotted this from Morgan Jeffery's review on Digital Spy. "...while the Pyramid gimmick is attention-grabbing, it never really goes anywhere. (The Monks' craft could have been disguised as a Waitrose for all the difference it'd make to the plot.)" The Waitrose at the End of the World? If there was a Waitrose at the end of the World it would actually give them an excuse to justify their insane prices...
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Post by number13 on May 28, 2017 22:45:23 GMT
Feeling rather ambivalent about this one; there was a great central story with some very good characters, but other elements which did not convince me. On the plus side: The Doctor, Bill and Nardole - I'm liking them even more as a team every week, great rapport and characterisations. (But the series clock is now at seven episodes to midnight and I don't want Peter Capaldi to go. ) The chain of random events accidentally leading to the end of the world, slowly, inexorably unfolding, though ultimately it was a plot device to put the Doctor's life in danger. The Doctor working with temporary 'companion' Erica in the lab - wouldn't she make a great TARDIS companion? The Monks - an enemy that wants you to willingly and selflessly submit to them; an excellent idea. And finally, Bill surrendering the world to save the Doctor's life against his will. A gripping climax and she convinced the Monks, but it wasn't quite selfless was it? Bill gives up the world to save the Doctor in the hope and expectation that he will then save the world. Her faith in him means she feels able to risk the world for his sake, a brilliant twist! So all that made for a great story and (classic-series fan that I am) I liked the slower pace that comes from having a three part story. BUT... How would the U.N. know where Bill was and that she was connected to the Doctor without also knowing where he was. And if they want her help, why burst into her flat pointing guns at her? For pointless dramatic effect presumably. Why is the Monks' ship disguised as a pyramid? To impress humans? Maybe, but a huge alien ship would have been impressive enough I'd have thought. Whatever happened to UNIT? Kate Stewart & co. should have been all over an event like that in nanoseconds. Can we drop the 'President of Earth' stuff please? The Doctor wouldn't take such an office and doesn't need it - he is highly capable of barging in and taking charge on any world that need his help, any time. The three armies. Again, what about UNIT and the cooperating Earth of other stories? Finally, I was very disappointed that the daring and moving storyline of the Doctor being blind was resolved as a mere practical problem (can't read some vital numbers) and was fixed by - there is no other word for it - magic. Which has no place in 'Doctor Who'. The same goes for 'I have made all the world's secret documents searchable' after three taps on two screens. Unless... unless they are still in the Monks' simulated world, where anything would be possible... I'd like to think that was the explanation of the 'magic moments', but I'm not holding out much hope.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 28, 2017 23:02:18 GMT
Oh, Bill, WHAT THE HELL HAVE YOU DONE?
And so painfully understandable given her arc, but still. HOW THE HELL IS SHE GOING TO COME BACK FROM THIS? While they will be inevitably be some sort of reset, Bill's going to have to live with messing up the entire world and people dying. Gruff comments from Twelve or not, this is going to change our girl forever.
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Post by agentten on May 29, 2017 4:23:16 GMT
It kept nagging at me this whole episode that UNIT wasn't involved on screen. I'm sure they were up to something somewhere, but this episode is exactly UNIT's wheelhouse and it felt a little off for them not to be there.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 29, 2017 4:31:27 GMT
It kept nagging at me this whole episode that UNIT wasn't involved on screen. I'm sure they were up to something somewhere, but this episode is exactly UNIT's wheelhouse and it felt a little off for them not to be there.
Maybe we'll see them next week?
I can understand why they they might not be included. Moffatt has wanted this season to be approchable and a jumping on point for new and casual viewers, and UNIT would be a whole lot of extra baggage. It's possible, we might see them in the finale, though.
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Post by dalekbuster523finish on May 29, 2017 10:12:44 GMT
How would the U.N. know where Bill was and that she was connected to the Doctor without also knowing where he was? Presumably UNIT probably have records on Bill and they gave the U.N. access. Pyramids are a symbol of power? The governments didn't want to get UNIT involved as they wanted a peace-keeping force rather than treating the group behind the mysterious pyramid as antagonistic. Speak for yourself. I like the President of Earth idea.
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Post by sherlock on May 29, 2017 10:23:27 GMT
How would the U.N. know where Bill was and that she was connected to the Doctor without also knowing where he was? Presumably UNIT probably have records on Bill and they have the U.N. access. But if they have records of Bill they'll surely know where the Doctor is, so why not go directly to him? In the simulation the Pope managed to do that.
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Post by dalekbuster523finish on May 29, 2017 10:26:06 GMT
Presumably UNIT probably have records on Bill and they have the U.N. access. But if they have records of Bill they'll surely know where the Doctor is, so why not go directly to him? In the simulation the Pope managed to do that. Maybe they did but neither The Doctor or TARDIS was in his university office?
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Post by omega on May 29, 2017 10:41:22 GMT
When the next episode comes out I'll be in a better position to judge this one.
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Post by omega on May 29, 2017 10:44:51 GMT
Oh, and Bill has good taste in who not to vote for. I don't trust orange either. No, that's not specieists.
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Post by acousticwolf on May 29, 2017 11:18:55 GMT
... Finally, I was very disappointed that the daring and moving storyline of the Doctor being blind was resolved as a mere practical problem (can't read some vital numbers) and was fixed by - there is no other word for it - magic. Which has no place in 'Doctor Who' . The same goes for 'I have made all the world's secret documents searchable' after three taps on two screens. Unless... unless they are still in the Monks' simulated world, where anything would be possible... I'd like to think that was the explanation of the 'magic moments', but I'm not holding out much hope. Exactly! Cheers Tony
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 29, 2017 11:19:47 GMT
It kept nagging at me this whole episode that UNIT wasn't involved on screen. I'm sure they were up to something somewhere, but this episode is exactly UNIT's wheelhouse and it felt a little off for them not to be there.
Maybe we'll see them next week?
I can understand why they might not be included. Moffatt has wanted this season to be approachable and a jumping on point for new and casual viewers, and UNIT would be a whole lot of extra baggage. It's possible, we might see them in the finale, though.
I dunno... Again, it's one of those situations where a couple lines would work.
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Post by J.A. Prentice on May 30, 2017 4:40:00 GMT
I liked this episode overall, but it had a few plot holes, especially in the lab scenes and with the Doctor's blindness at the end. There's a lot I'm reserving judgment on until next week, since we don't know anything about the Monks. I think there's a lot of pressure on Lie of the Land to pull this all off. (OTOH, it looks great from the trailer, so there might be nothing to worry about.) Discussion with my friend, in case anyone cares.
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Post by mrperson on May 30, 2017 23:36:17 GMT
I don't like the "President of Earth" stuff, but I suppose the Time Lords don't really have any place saying a word about interfering with history these days....
I liked it quite a bit overall, but I do hope he manages to stick a landing this time, as I really did love the build-up.At least, I think this season has been a vast improvement in consistent quality for me over the last two (though, again, there were a few episodes from each I've loved and others I've liked).
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