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Post by sherlock on May 7, 2021 11:17:04 GMT
Good work by The Guardian. After the last set of allegations, its not surprising that Clarke was doing this on Doctor Who set but no less disgusting. It paints the behind the scenes of the RTD era in a very bad light. Does raise the question of who of Clarke’s colleagues knew about this, it’s surely impossible for literally no-one to have known.
As for Barrowman, his statement isn’t a very well-worded apology and whilst no-one alleges his behaviour was malicious it’s certainly crossed a line. The fact that it was made light of in that song (which is publicly available I believe, it pops up on my YouTube recommendations occasionally though I’ve never watched it) after his reparimand is disturbing. Puts Big Finish in an awkward situation to say the least.
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Post by johnhurtdoctor on May 7, 2021 14:56:26 GMT
Well that makes for interesting reading & a pretty damning verdict on the RTD era. In fact his words are very carefully chosen, he says he never saw Barrowman expose himself, which is different to saying he never knew it was going on. Of course he knew it was going on given that Barrowman's sordid antics were referenced & made light of in the celebratory end of an era song Ballad of Russell & Julie. The only one who comes out of this vile episode with any integrity is Christopher Eccleston. I hope Barrowman is excised from any future appearances in the show & he fades into obscurity along with Noel Clarke. |
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Post by pawntake on May 7, 2021 20:44:38 GMT
Happy Jack wasn't old, but he was a man
He lived in the sand at the Isle of Man
The kids would all sing, he would take the wrong key
So they rode on his head on their furry donkey
The kids couldn't hurt Jack
They tried and tried and tried
They dropped things on his back
And lied and lied and lied and lied and lied
But they couldn't stop Jack, or the waters lapping
And they couldn't prevent Jack from feeling happy
But they couldn't stop Jack, or the waters lapping
And they couldn't prevent Jack from feeling happy
The kids couldn't hurt Jack
They tried and tried and tried
They dropped things on his back
And lied and lied and lied and lied and lied
But they couldn't stop Jack, or the waters lapping
And they couldn't prevent Jack from feeling happy
I saw ya!
Altogether now! One more time! This thread needs cheering up! Or deleting!One of the two!
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Post by saxty on May 7, 2021 20:47:04 GMT
John should have known better and if he's still doing that in any working environment he needs reprimanding again or firing.
Saying that I'll still listen to audios he's in unless new information comes out. Noel however sounds like an absolute creature.
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Post by johnhurtdoctor on May 7, 2021 20:56:36 GMT
Happy Jack wasn't old, but he was a man He lived in the sand at the Isle of Man The kids would all sing, he would take the wrong key So they rode on his head on their furry donkey The kids couldn't hurt Jack They tried and tried and tried They dropped things on his back And lied and lied and lied and lied and lied But they couldn't stop Jack, or the waters lapping And they couldn't prevent Jack from feeling happy But they couldn't stop Jack, or the waters lapping And they couldn't prevent Jack from feeling happy The kids couldn't hurt Jack They tried and tried and tried They dropped things on his back And lied and lied and lied and lied and lied But they couldn't stop Jack, or the waters lapping And they couldn't prevent Jack from feeling happy I saw ya! Altogether now! One more time! This thread needs cheering up! Or deleting!One of the two! Wtf? The only thing that needs deleting is the sick John Barrowman. |
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Post by grinch on May 7, 2021 21:06:03 GMT
Happy Jack wasn't old, but he was a man He lived in the sand at the Isle of Man The kids would all sing, he would take the wrong key So they rode on his head on their furry donkey The kids couldn't hurt Jack They tried and tried and tried They dropped things on his back And lied and lied and lied and lied and lied But they couldn't stop Jack, or the waters lapping And they couldn't prevent Jack from feeling happy But they couldn't stop Jack, or the waters lapping And they couldn't prevent Jack from feeling happy The kids couldn't hurt Jack They tried and tried and tried They dropped things on his back And lied and lied and lied and lied and lied But they couldn't stop Jack, or the waters lapping And they couldn't prevent Jack from feeling happy I saw ya! Altogether now! One more time! This thread needs cheering up! Or deleting!One of the two! I didn’t know the Scorchies had started commenting on current affairs. |
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Post by theillusiveman on May 8, 2021 3:25:01 GMT
I hope Barrowman is excised from any future appearances in the show & he fades into obscurity along with Noel Clarke.
Firstly Considering that he has recorded his appearance in The Time Fracture Interactive with David Bradley they either have to re-record with another actor which will mean more delays and money which wont help the BBC and the fact that Barrowman has been on set for Series 13 so either they release the episodes they recorded with him or they have to reshoot the entire episode(s) rewriting the script for a new character which will delay the release of series 13, cost the BBC hundreds of dollars and such to avoid generating negative publicity even though the episodes of Series 12 generated more views with Jack appearing
a Real Catch 22
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Post by Sir Wearer of Hats on May 8, 2021 3:58:59 GMT
Hmm. Having a go at a gay icon is homophobia, cancelling a heterosexual is obligatory. That's the vibe I'm picking up from various sources. It shouldn't be like that. There is a historical dimension to gay men getting cancelled as perverts while heterosexual men doing much the same thing getting called “boys being boys” or “just being a lad”. However... there is also the evidence of John doing those things but lacking the aspect of offence being taken. it’s a complex situation that is seemingly complicating a more straightforward situation of actually offence taken conduct by NC. |
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Post by Sir Wearer of Hats on May 8, 2021 4:20:12 GMT
I do not envy BF’s executives and publicity team right now.
They’re riding high off of a Guinness World Record, lots of positive chatter on the Interwebs in relation to the return of Eccelston, the award nominations and so forth.
And now they have to navigate a minefield. Do they offer a Pat “we at BF categorically oppose sexual violence and misconduct” which leaves them open for questions over why they employed JB knowing “what he was like” etc. do they say nothing? Do they say that due to allegations against JB they’re not going to employ him in the future but leave them open to accusations of homophobia and potential litigation if JB is ever cleared of such allegations. Do they say due to allegations against NC they’re not going to employ him to the same result with added racism accusations upon the removal of homophobia ones?
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Post by johnhurtdoctor on May 8, 2021 7:31:19 GMT
I do not envy BF’s executives and publicity team right now. They’re riding high off of a Guinness World Record, lots of positive chatter on the Interwebs in relation to the return of Eccelston, the award nominations and so forth. And now they have to navigate a minefield. Do they offer a Pat “we at BF categorically oppose sexual violence and misconduct” which leaves them open for questions over why they employed JB knowing “what he was like” etc. do they say nothing? Do they say that due to allegations against JB they’re not going to employ him in the future but leave them open to accusations of homophobia and potential litigation if JB is ever cleared of such allegations. Do they say due to allegations against NC they’re not going to employ him to the same result with added racism accusations upon the removal of homophobia ones? Have BF ever suggested that they would employ NC again? If not there is no need for them to comment about him is there?! As for JB it is difficult for anyone to come out if this well given that everyone knew about what he got up to & laughed it off in public. Maybe BF should just admit they got it wrong & actually take a moral stance on the issue. Not sure if he will be cleared of allegations, he exposed himself to co-workers that is a fact. There is so much evidence to corroborate it he could only be cleared if this goes through the court I guess which I doubt it will. As for accusations of homophobia & racism not sure that could be used as any way to attack BF. |
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Post by johnhurtdoctor on May 8, 2021 7:34:47 GMT
Hmm. Having a go at a gay icon is homophobia, cancelling a heterosexual is obligatory. That's the vibe I'm picking up from various sources. It shouldn't be like that. There is a historical dimension to gay men getting cancelled as perverts while heterosexual men doing much the same thing getting called “boys being boys” or “just being a lad”. However... there is also the evidence of John doing those things but lacking the aspect of offence being taken. it’s a complex situation that is seemingly complicating a more straightforward situation of actually offence taken conduct by NC. Maybe historically but I am not sure that if a heterosexual man had continually exposed himself to female co-workers (for some reason it seems to be women that Barrowman targeted) that it would be joked about at conventions for years & be part of a comedy song. |
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Post by pawntake on May 8, 2021 7:35:04 GMT
Happy Jack wasn't old, but he was a man He lived in the sand at the Isle of Man The kids would all sing, he would take the wrong key So they rode on his head on their furry donkey The kids couldn't hurt Jack They tried and tried and tried They dropped things on his back And lied and lied and lied and lied and lied But they couldn't stop Jack, or the waters lapping And they couldn't prevent Jack from feeling happy But they couldn't stop Jack, or the waters lapping And they couldn't prevent Jack from feeling happy The kids couldn't hurt Jack They tried and tried and tried They dropped things on his back And lied and lied and lied and lied and lied But they couldn't stop Jack, or the waters lapping And they couldn't prevent Jack from feeling happy I saw ya! Altogether now! One more time! This thread needs cheering up! Or deleting!One of the two! I didn’t know the Scorchies had started commenting on current affairs. Its a song by the Who  |
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Post by johnhurtdoctor on May 8, 2021 7:41:41 GMT
I didn’t know the Scorchies had started commenting on current affairs. Its a song by the Who A band which had a member who was put on the sex offenders register. Guess that means they fit right in with some of the conversation on this thread. |
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Post by sherlock on May 8, 2021 8:01:15 GMT
I hope Barrowman is excised from any future appearances in the show & he fades into obscurity along with Noel Clarke.
Firstly Considering that he has recorded his appearance in The Time Fracture Interactive with David Bradley they either have to re-record with another actor which will mean more delays and money which wont help the BBC and the fact that Barrowman has been on set for Series 13 so either they release the episodes they recorded with him or they have to reshoot the entire episode(s) rewriting the script for a new character which will delay the release of series 13, cost the BBC hundreds of dollars and such to avoid generating negative publicity even though the episodes of Series 12 generated more views with Jack appearing
a Real Catch 22
What’s the evidence for him having been on set for Series 13? The only sources I’ve seen for that speculation was just people leaping to conclusions on the back of a graphic novel tie-in, not any actual sighting of him on set. Honestly if Barrowman’s apology was better it would seem easier for him to stay in the fold, but him claiming it was just “tomfoolery” kinda runs against his case that he’s learnt from his mistakes. And the literally “wink wink” mention in the video undercuts any notion that his reprimand was taken seriously at the time. |
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Post by thelonecenturion on May 8, 2021 8:45:54 GMT
Gareth David-Lloyd speaks about Barrowman's behaviour on setHonestly, from this, and from what Barrowman and Julie Gardner said recently, unless anyone wants to specifically allege sexual harassment/assault against Barrowman, I'm struggling to see why any of it should affect his career going forward. He's admitted to making mistakes, he's said that he stopped doing any of it after Gardner asked him to, and it didn't affect any of the people involved negatively. I think as long as BF puts out a statement that clarifies their position on behaviour like this, and Barrowman doesn't do it ever again in future, and no one alleges Barrowman with a criminal offence, he should be able to continue playing Jack.
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Post by Sir Wearer of Hats on May 8, 2021 8:47:36 GMT
As for accusations of homophobia & racism not sure that could be used as any way to attack BF. you must be new to the Internet  |
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Post by pawntake on May 8, 2021 9:08:24 GMT
Gareth David-Lloyd speaks about Barrowman's behaviour on setHonestly, from this, and from what Barrowman and Julie Gardner said recently, unless anyone wants to specifically allege sexual harassment/assault against Barrowman, I'm struggling to see why any of it should affect his career going forward. He's admitted to making mistakes, he's said that he stopped doing any of it after Gardner asked him to, and it didn't affect any of the people involved negatively. I think as long as BF puts out a statement that clarifies their position on behaviour like this, and Barrowman doesn't do it ever again in future, and no one alleges Barrowman with a criminal offence, he should be able to continue playing Jack. At last the voice of reason!Someone with a sane and sensible comment giving this situation a sense of a proper perspective!  |
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Post by johnhurtdoctor on May 8, 2021 9:22:22 GMT
Gareth David-Lloyd speaks about Barrowman's behaviour on setHonestly, from this, and from what Barrowman and Julie Gardner said recently, unless anyone wants to specifically allege sexual harassment/assault against Barrowman, I'm struggling to see why any of it should affect his career going forward. He's admitted to making mistakes, he's said that he stopped doing any of it after Gardner asked him to, and it didn't affect any of the people involved negatively. I think as long as BF puts out a statement that clarifies their position on behaviour like this, and Barrowman doesn't do it ever again in future, and no one alleges Barrowman with a criminal offence, he should be able to continue playing Jack. At last the voice of reason!Someone with a sane and sensible comment giving this situation a sense of a proper perspective! So people who have a different opinion are not speaking reasonably or sanely? We can have different opinions on this without our opinion being negated like this. As for perspective some of us also think differently. Gardner apparently addressed the issues with Barrowman but then it was also the subject of a comedy song & continued to be used as hilarious annecdotes at conventions. There have also been mention of his behaviour on the set of Arrow which was later than 2008. I guess we will see what happens here & if the general public will still warm to him or want him on their tv. |
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Post by johnhurtdoctor on May 8, 2021 9:28:30 GMT
Gareth David-Lloyd speaks about Barrowman's behaviour on setHonestly, from this, and from what Barrowman and Julie Gardner said recently, unless anyone wants to specifically allege sexual harassment/assault against Barrowman, I'm struggling to see why any of it should affect his career going forward. He's admitted to making mistakes, he's said that he stopped doing any of it after Gardner asked him to, and it didn't affect any of the people involved negatively. I think as long as BF puts out a statement that clarifies their position on behaviour like this, and Barrowman doesn't do it ever again in future, and no one alleges Barrowman with a criminal offence, he should be able to continue playing Jack. It didn't affect any of the people involved negatively? I don't think that claim can be made tbh. Barrowman has belatedly admitted that his behaviour upset colleagues. & some that witnessed it said they felt uncomfortable. Also if his co-workers were all fine with it why have none of them who had his genitals placed on their body like Camille Coduri, come out to defend him? |
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Post by Deleted on May 8, 2021 9:38:29 GMT
At last the voice of reason!Someone with a sane and sensible comment giving this situation a sense of a proper perspective! So people who have a different opinion are not speaking reasonably or sanely? We can have different opinions on this without our opinion being negated like this. As for perspective some of us also think differently. Gardner apparently addressed the issues with Barrowman but then it was also the subject of a comedy song & continued to be used as hilarious annecdotes at conventions. There have also been mention of his behaviour on the set of Arrow which was later than 2008. I guess we will see what happens here & if the general public will still warm to him or want him on their tv. Give it a rest. Given the amount of time you spend here attacking others with opinions or views not aligned with your own, it's a bit rich to take personal objection to something which is more of a general observation of the wider context. Too many threads and discussions become dominated by the same routine. Time to let it go. |
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