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Post by Deleted on May 13, 2017 7:14:00 GMT
They both have good villains, but in general public consensus (which is probably more important, in terms of ratings) they're probably on par. Do you have any evidence behind that supposition? I find it extremely unlikely, if nothing else the production valies are miles apart. In Colins era it was embarrassing to be a Doctor Who fan. These days it's still an okay thing to be.
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Post by Deleted on May 13, 2017 8:58:36 GMT
They both have good villains, but in general public consensus (which is probably more important, in terms of ratings) they're probably on par. In Colins era it was embarrassing to be a Doctor Who fan. These days it's still an okay thing to be. I'd disagree with that.
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Post by Deleted on May 13, 2017 9:09:10 GMT
In Colins era it was embarrassing to be a Doctor Who fan. These days it's still an okay thing to be. I'd disagree with that. Which of the two clauses?
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Post by Deleted on May 13, 2017 9:29:37 GMT
Which of the two clauses? Latter
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Post by kimalysong on May 13, 2017 10:02:27 GMT
I certainly not embarrassed to be a Doctor Who fan and I don't know anyone else who is.
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Post by Deleted on May 13, 2017 10:24:38 GMT
I certainly not embarrassed to be a Doctor Who fan and I don't know anyone else who is. Well, you do now.
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Post by kimalysong on May 13, 2017 10:34:12 GMT
I certainly not embarrassed to be a Doctor Who fan and I don't know anyone else who is. Well, you do now. Well that's a shame for you. But it's certainly not a common thing.
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Post by Deleted on May 13, 2017 11:04:28 GMT
Let's not forget Sil, Shockeye, the Rani, and the Valeyard -- some of the very best Who villains. Yes, credit where it's due, Colin's very short tenure of the show had some of the best supporting characters of the 1980s. From Quillam to Orcini, from sadistic villains to grey galactic bystanders. There are some stunning actors and actresses that pop up in those stories. What hurt it more than anything else was that we only got two stories that didn't feature a returning component of the series, only one of which stood up particularly well to scrutiny -- Vengeance on Varos. The Capaldi era has had a few good villains, but not many great villainous characters. The Landlord might be one of the first behind Missy (who based on the strength of Gomez's performance, probably didn't need to be the Master in the first place). Well that's a shame for you. But it's certainly not a common thing. That's a really odd thing I've seen show up from time to time in fandoms and I cannot understand why that's the case. Shame's an emotion elicited in response to an awareness of guilt or inadequacy. Surely if you're a fan of something you enjoy what it's trying to do, even if it does stumble?
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aztec
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Post by aztec on May 13, 2017 14:56:51 GMT
I've listened to 20-30 of Colin audios and he's great in them but I've only seen a few random clips and scenes from his TV serials...but even from the brief bits of seen it seems to me his Audio persona was less of a slow mellowing over many years, and more a page one rewrite to make his Doctor more cuddly from the outset (which arguably isn't really an issue as most of the audios are set post trial) even in the fantastic run of 6th Dr Lost Stories it seems BF deliberately inserted the BF Doctor into 80's storylines rather trying to capture the bluster and arrogance of the TV 6th Doctor...I think Baker was so stung by criticism of his Doctor that he asked BF to take his Doctor in a completely new direction, he's a fantastic actor and his audio Doctor is really likeable...but perhaps a little too mellow and generic these days, I'm not asking for the 6th Doctor to go around strangling anyone again but it would be nice to hear a bit more of the bluster and anger of his earlier days (and likewise for the 8th Doctor, a return to the scatterbrained joy of the Charley/Mary era)
I found the 12th Doctor's Dickish behavior in Series 8 very refreshing as I generally find the Doctor a more interesting and likeable character when he isn't acting so human he is an alien after all.
Speaking personally, the Capaldi era is easily my favourite of the revival series.
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Post by Deleted on May 13, 2017 15:42:36 GMT
I too love the 'darker' side to The Doctor but, unless you are very lucky, if you have a Doctor who is written as being unlikeable, then people aren't going to like him! I absolutely love Peter Capaldi in the role and am truly dreading the moment he leaves. I love Colin in the audios and occasionally on television. I admire the powers that be for doing something different. But to my mind, you can have a difficult, irrascible Doctor appealing very much to a few, or a likeable attractive young Doctor (possibly superficially) appealing to the majority - and hence, higher ratings. I'm of the increasing opinion you can't really have both.
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Post by escalus5 on May 13, 2017 18:17:48 GMT
In Colins era it was embarrassing to be a Doctor Who fan. These days it's still an okay thing to be. I find this viewpoint really odd, probably because I don't normally worry about how my opinion of a television show is perceived by others. I'm reminded of Colin's own words to fans at a recent convention: "Get a grip."
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Post by Deleted on May 13, 2017 19:40:20 GMT
In Colins era it was embarrassing to be a Doctor Who fan. These days it's still an okay thing to be. I find this viewpoint really odd, probably because I don't normally worry about how my opinion of a television show is perceived by others. I'm reminded of Colin's own words to fans at a recent convention: "Get a grip." Haha! Sixie speaks! What brought about that response?
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Post by Timelord007 on May 14, 2017 8:49:10 GMT
I lovr Doctor Who & been criticised & had the p..s taken out of me for loving it & you know what i couldn't give two hoots, I'm a fan & proud, my life wouldn't been half as good without Doctor Who in it.
Those 30 mile trips to the nearest John McKenzies to buy the latest NA/MA novels, going into Woolworths & seeing the latest Doctor Who video releases, i remember getting particularly excited when i chanced upon The Paradise Of Death double cassette in Woolworths, people must of thought I'd won the lottery.
My take is lifes to short to worry about other people's opinions, never hide your passions & be true to yourself, my ex - girlfriend stupidly asked once who would i choose her or my entire Who collection?... the clue to my choice is here somewhere.
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Post by Deleted on May 14, 2017 9:44:12 GMT
3.57 million for Oxygen. 3rd Lowest Overnight Figure. Of all of Doctor Who.
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Post by doctorkernow on May 14, 2017 10:38:21 GMT
Hello again.
Oh dear this is not good. The programmes either side of Who did better including a dreadful quiz? This means that people watched Pointless, went and did something else, and then watched Eurovision or BGT.
It is such a shame, as Season 10 has been very watchable. It seems the casual viewer is not that interested in Who at present. The BBC have promoted it better than last year. Capaldi, Mackie and Lucas are a great TARDIS team. The direction, design and music are really good.
The public seem to be more interested in who will be Who than the present incumbent who I am really enjoying this year. It seems the long break while improving the quality of the show has lead to people forgetting about it. It is no longer a must see.
There is no show like it on TV. Let's hope it survives...
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Post by Deleted on May 14, 2017 11:08:49 GMT
Hello again. Oh dear this is not good. The programmes either side of Who did better including a dreadful quiz? This means that people watched Pointless, went and did something else, and then watched Eurovision or BGT. It is such a shame, as Season 10 has been very watchable. It seems the casual viewer is not that interested in Who at present. The BBC have promoted it better than last year. Capaldi, Mackie and Lucas are a great TARDIS team. The direction, design and music are really good. The public seem to be more interested in who will be Who than the present incumbent who I am really enjoying this year. It seems the long break while improving the quality of the show has lead to people forgetting about it. It is no longer a must see. There is no show like it on TV. Let's hope it survives... I think that the audiences don't like Capaldi so have been progressively dropping of.
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Post by Deleted on May 14, 2017 11:34:34 GMT
In Colins era it was embarrassing to be a Doctor Who fan. These days it's still an okay thing to be. I find this viewpoint really odd, probably because I don't normally worry about how my opinion of a television show is perceived by others. I'm reminded of Colin's own words to fans at a recent convention: "Get a grip." As a teenager it was hard not to care about how others view you for liking a show when they're beating you up because of it. Now my son is the teenager and while lots of other schoolkids might not be fans, there seems to be an acceptance that it's an okay thing for others to like.
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Post by Deleted on May 14, 2017 11:36:42 GMT
I find this viewpoint really odd, probably because I don't normally worry about how my opinion of a television show is perceived by others. I'm reminded of Colin's own words to fans at a recent convention: "Get a grip." As a teenager it was hard not to care about how others view you for liking a show when they're beating you up because of it. Now my son is the teenager and while lots of other schoolkids might not be fans, there seems to be an acceptance that it's an okay thing for others to like. He must go to a different school from me, then...
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Post by acousticwolf on May 14, 2017 11:43:14 GMT
I find this viewpoint really odd, probably because I don't normally worry about how my opinion of a television show is perceived by others. I'm reminded of Colin's own words to fans at a recent convention: "Get a grip." As a teenager it was hard not to care about how others view you for liking a show when they're beating you up because of it. Now my son is the teenager and while lots of other schoolkids might not be fans, there seems to be an acceptance that it's an okay thing for others to like. And as we get older perhaps we care less what people think. I know people at work think I'm eccentric or "a little odd" but they do like the fact I wear bow ties, even if they don't necessarily make the connection. Cheers Tony
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aztec
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Post by aztec on May 14, 2017 11:49:43 GMT
I don't think New Who will ever hit the very heights of the Tennant years (8-10 million on a couple of occasions) again, after 13 years and well over 100 stories how much more can they do to reboot the show and keep it fresh for new viewers?
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